Article re: circumcision

[Long Duck Dong]

do me a favour..... when you go on about being mutilated, bear in mind that there are people in the site that you are calling mutilated..... and that is something that can be really fucking insulting...

sure I was circumcised.... but look that the shit that is being posted.... about non cut males are better than me cos I am mutilated and I can not * perform * according to stats and fiqures....

as my partner can tell you, I am larger than average, I can maintain a erection for a few hours.... I have been known to go more than 9 times in one 24 for hour period... but that doesn't matter, all I am seeing is people constantly referring to cut people as mutilated.....

we have a surgical procedure done.... so does that make all people that have had surgery and parts removed * mutilated * too....
are they too some how less than * good enuf * now....

ok circumcision may not be a needed surgical procedure for babies, but in some people that are older, they have no option.... and they are getting labelled as mutilated too..... rather fucking insulting to say that about people that had no fucking chance....

there is a difference between people that * mutilate * their bodies with extreme body modding and cut parts off.... and people like me that are getting insulted cos we have NO FUCKING SAY in it

am I angry with my parents, NO.... were they wrong, NO... did they wreck my life NO... should I blame the doctors yadda yadda NO

what happened, has happened, I am a cut male.... but my partners have been more than satisfied with me, as I am more than a cut cock.. I make love with them using my body and that makes up for any issues with my cut cock

so if you wanna call us mutilated, go for it..... just remember that you are applying the label to any body like cut males, that had a surgical procedure to have parts removed..... and that can include ladies with breast removal and rebuilding surgery.... cos they are like the males that work to rebuild their foreskin

[rissababynta]

That's funny Long Duck you admit that male and female circumcision is mutilation here and describe how your penis has scar tissue from being cut and how you would describe your penis as being mutilated and so would your doctor since you do not have feelings in some areas of it due to being cut.

It's funny that that whole big thing was all one sentence...

[Long Duck Dong]

That's funny Long Duck you admit that male and female circumcision is mutilation here and describe how your penis has scar tissue from being cut and how you would describe your penis as being mutilated and so would your doctor since you do not have feelings in some areas of it due to being cut.

yeah and your point is ???.... you are taking my remarks about how circumcision can be viewed as mutilation, and comparing them to the way I am talking about how being called mutilated can be rather insulting .....there are two different aspects there.....

now where in that post you quoted, did I call myself a mutilated person ?

its a lil like talking about saying you post like a troll, and calling you a troll.... big difference, one is personal and one is not... btw I am not calling you a troll, in case you misread that statement....

ok the doctor that called it mutilation was anti circumcision.... I am not anti circumcision cos I know at times it can be medically needed....

my issue with scarring is a benefit and a curse, sure I have limited feeling, but fucking a partner for 14 hours in one day, is something I think is quite good.... for ANY person, so I do use the scarring to my advantage and yes I can use vit E cream on my penis to make it more sensitive.... but my partner did enjoy sucking a cock that would make a horse cry... and the taste of vit E cream is not as tasty as a mouth full of cum....


now just do me a favour and bear in mind that calling a surgical procedure a mutilation is not the same as saying that people are mutilated and some how not good enuf any more.... cos my partner for one can tell you that I am anything but average for a cut male

[shybipinay]

We can't believe this guy has nothing better to do with his life than be a crusader for uncut cock. What a pathetic waste considering the billions who go hungry every day.

We decided it was time to use the "iggy" button. 3x just over this thread.

[TwylaTwobits]

What I find odd, Iwannna, is that you have no problem pulling up other people's past posts and twisting them to suit your own purposes. Now why don't you tell us your past names so we can look at your former words, ooops sorry can't I believe Drew deletes when he bans. Now please, really you keep coming back and you keep causing crap. Is this how you get your jollies? Don't misunderstand me, I am calling you a troll. You are using same words and phrases as some who have recently been removed from this site. Either change the way you post or grow up, either way. Ignored.

[jem_is_bi]

I see how it is, Twyla is all for male genital mutilation as she let her sons' penises be mutilated for vain aesthetic reasons and conformity that's useless, so now Long Duck is claiming that circumcision is somehow not genital mutilation at all even though his penis is fucked up from a circumcision and he and a medical professional have talked about how it is severly scarred and has nerve damage to it where there is not any feeling at all.

Or perhaps Long Duck is trying to over compensate for his own mutilated penis (described as mutilated in his own words) and start an internet dick sizing contest online on this post like Pasadena did in the thread about Christianity to lots of people who are against hate crimes?

Don't call all types of circumcision mutilation and completely useless in one post long duck and then claim how it's simply not mutilation at all in another since this is hypocritical, does not even make any sense, and it's circular logic.

Then, this must be mutilation logic.
Although it seems to me to be "I am so superior to you rage"

[Long Duck Dong]

I see how it is, Twyla is all for male genital mutilation as she let her sons' penises be mutilated for vain aesthetic reasons and conformity that's useless, so now Long Duck is claiming that circumcision is somehow not genital mutilation at all even though his penis is fucked up from a circumcision and he and a medical professional have talked about how it is severly scarred and has nerve damage to it where there is not any feeling at all.

Or perhaps Long Duck is trying to over compensate for his own mutilated penis (described as mutilated in his own words) and start an internet dick sizing contest online on this post like Pasadena did in the thread about Christianity to lots of people who are against hate crimes?

Don't call all types of circumcision mutilation and completely useless in one post long duck and then claim how it's simply not mutilation at all in another since this is hypocritical, does not even make any sense, and it's circular logic.

can you please hold up a second....

I am not saying that circumcision is not a form of mutilation, I have said that in a lot of aspects it can be....
but I am being clear between a surgical produce that is done with good reason and a surgical produce that results in issues that could have been avoid

you tend to think that anybody circumcised is mutilated.... now I have a 27 year old friend that developed issues with the foreskin tightening excessively, and ended up having the foreskin removed....
so tell me, was he in hospital getting a surgical procedure to enhance his sex life and other aspects or in hospital being mutilated with no real benefits....

as I have also pointed out, there are pros and cons to my circumcision, I am sitting on the fence about it as I have no proof that being uncut is better as I can not compare the differences in my body..... and yeah it would be the same with uncut males, how would they know that they are better off being uncut than cut ......
simple answer is they do not.... they just copy and paste what others say, mutilate the posts into something that is more twisted than a cock with scar tissue.... and totally fail to understand that there is something called the middle ground....
the middle ground is me sitting here saying while in some cases circumcision is not needed, there are also cases where it is needed....
but your stance is a cut man is a mutilated male and that its cruel and unusual treatment of a penis.......
my friend that had to be circumcised at 27.... as a different opinion.... he had a surgical procedure that was medically needed.....
should he have been prevented from having it cos circumcisions should be banned ??????


if you say no, there you are supporting circumcision and penile mutilation... and therefore being a hypocrite

if you say yes, you are forcing a person to suffer cos you think you know whats best for everybody

if you say the middle ground that while you do not agree with circumcisions, that yes they are sometimes medically needed.... you are standing beside me....

thats the advantage to having a open mind...I can stand in the middle ground and look at a issue from multiple sides....
as for a cock sizing contest, you have me beaten hands down...
I may be a dick with a prick, but you are a prick with a dick.... and well, 6 ft pricks will win any day

[darkeyes]

Iwanna hun..there are ways and ways of saying the same thing.. so much I agree with in your posts but not the way they are written. There is so much information that people would study it more if your posts were better considered. Sit down take 5 and think it through. Sometimes I too get carried away and rant. Invariably I regret it and have calmed down a lot in the last year or two. You can have the passion without the flame getting out of control..

[bicurcple]

We totally agree with bicurcple but wondering why you're still posting after claiming you won't waste time with these pathetic people.





Thank-you TwylaTwobits

You are correct, I said I would not waste my time with it anymore, but looking at these idiot assholes telling me I was mutilated and telling me I molested my sons by having them circumcised really pissed me off.
The subject is dead to me and I will not be back, but believe me, if I ever meet someone on the street and listen to them tell me I molested my sons.............I will be spending time in the local jail for assault.

[tenni]

"Doctors and nurses do frequently tell lies about circumcision to the parents such as "Oh he slept through the entire thing!" or "He didn't cry at all!" which is all total bullshit since infants are strapped down and even with anesthesia they do feel lots of pain since a very sensitive part of their penis is being cut off. They actually do pass out from the pain or stay awake and fully conscious and then go into shock from it. "

This section of Iwanna's post may need further clarification. As I understand it that the baby is strapped down because he is a baby and they use a local anesthesia. Babies may move a lot whether they are being operated on under a local or just lying there. Even though he may feel no pain, he may feel the touch of the instruments near the edge of the freezing boundary. I refer to any dental work being done while under a local anesthesia as a reference.

If a baby were to pass out from the pain, then would the anesthesia not have taken effect yet or some other anesthesia problem? If it is an anesthesia problem, what might be done to determine that the anesthesia has taken effect? Again, in an adult, you simply ask them if they can feel anything but not with a newborn. I would expect a doctor or nurse would do something to test if the anesthesia has taken effect. The bottom line though is how does Iwanna know that this crying and passing out from shock has happened? Is Iwanna a doctor who has performed circumcision or a nurse who has actually witnessed these operations? If not, what credibility does Iwanna have to make such statements as fact rather than opinion or even hearsay?

[CuddlyKate]

I don't wish to pour oil on already inflamed waters, but several years ago Channel 4 televised a documentary on male child circumcision in the US. The babies were plainly awake and strapped down on something resembling a metal food dish such as the military or schools may use in food halls, contoured to a baby shape. This may not be the case in all American hospitals, but it is certainly the case in some.

[MarieDelta]

And lest we forget the story of David Reimer

David Reimer was born as a male identical twin in Winnipeg, Manitoba. His birth name was Bruce; his twin brother was named Brian. At the age of 6 months, after concern was raised about how both twins urinated, both boys were diagnosed with phimosis. They were referred for circumcision at the age of 8 months. On April 27, 1966, a Urologist performed the operation using the unconventional method of cauterization. The procedure did not go as doctors had planned, and David Reimer's penis was burned beyond surgical repair.[1]

BTW: His brothers urinary issues resolved themselves on their own.

Accidents do happen.

[tenni]

"We also have a neato word that disguises the nastiness of what we do - circumcision ( round cut); rather than the descriptive "mutilating an innocent baby's penis".

The decision as to whether to refer to this operation as a "circumcision" or "mutilation" is done for a personal and political reason. Many operations may be said to leave the body "mutilated". Posters here are chosing to use this word, "mutilated" for shock impact. That is all.

They wish to stop circumcision it appears. If you are realistic, you will know that will not happen in North America any day soon. It may evolve that the operation will be done fewer and fewer times. Circumcision in North America is a cultural act: plain and simple. It may be true that it reduces the sensitivity in the penis. For some young men, they may be happy about that but not even know that is why they suffer less frequently from pre mature ejaculation... Unless they lose all sensitivity they will still have a pleasant orgasm. So what is the big deal?

[rissababynta]

"Doctors and nurses do frequently tell lies about circumcision to the parents such as "Oh he slept through the entire thing!" or "He didn't cry at all!" which is all total bullshit since infants are strapped down and even with anesthesia they do feel lots of pain since a very sensitive part of their penis is being cut off. They actually do pass out from the pain or stay awake and fully conscious and then go into shock from it. "

This section of Iwanna's post may need further clarification. As I understand it that the baby is strapped down because he is a baby and they use a local anesthesia. Babies may move a lot whether they are being operated on under a local or just lying there. Even though he may feel no pain, he may feel the touch of the instruments near the edge of the freezing boundary. I refer to any dental work being done while under a local anesthesia as a reference.

If a baby were to pass out from the pain, then would the anesthesia not have taken effect yet or some other anesthesia problem? If it is an anesthesia problem, what might be done to determine that the anesthesia has taken effect? Again, in an adult, you simply ask them if they can feel anything but not with a newborn. I would expect a doctor or nurse would do something to test if the anesthesia has taken effect. The bottom line though is how does Iwanna know that this crying and passing out from shock has happened? Is Iwanna a doctor who has performed circumcision or a nurse who has actually witnessed these operations? If not, what credibility does Iwanna have to make such statements as fact rather than opinion or even hearsay?

It's because Iwanna is full of crap tenni. In a lot of cases a parent can be present when it is happening if they ask and they have a good doctor. A friend of mine and myself stood in for our sons, and with her son, he was awake the whole time, never passed out or flinched from any pain...and with my son he was asleep when they brought us to the room, they did what they had to do without him flinching or acting as though he was being touched, and he was still asleep until we got to the room when I woke him up for a bottle. It's funny that he can sit there and bitch about how nurses and doctors lie about this when parents themselves can see it He's just another troll dear, please take anything he has to say with a grain of salt...

[tenni]

Do you have any credentials to give yourself credibility or is this hearsay?
I had understood that newborns were not given anesthesia but someone else has posted that they believe that local anesthesia is used?

tenni
there is no anesthesia. Anesthesia is avoided because of potentially further seriously harming the child.
How would you know the difference between a baby crying in fear lapsing into shock as opposed to a regular persistent newborn cry. You wouldn't.
Doctors routinely lie about pain and anesthesia.
The baby does sometimes pass out from the pain.
Every study ever attempted at evaluating pain of newborn circumcision or evaluating a baby's reaction to pain (using circumcision) has been abandoned before completion. This is because each study exceeded moral boundaries of scientific medicine (no Josef Mengele type experimentation).
Typical metrics for these studies involve heart rate, frequency of cries, and shallowness of breath (among other criteria).

[TwylaTwobits]

http://www.medicinenet.com/circumcis...ns/article.htm

Pros and cons as listed by actual medical people, you know the ones with licenses that went to school to help humanity have a better life.

[tenni]

Thanks Rissa for your in person observations. That is proof. Do you know if they used a local anesthesia? (not that it will change me personally because I don't believe that I was anesthestised).

A funny side note is that my mother was a great horder of bills. We found the bill for my circumcision as we were cleaning up her house. By today's standards, it was cheap. I think that I might still have that bill hanging around somewhere. So, in one respect, I still have a memento of my circumcision of my former foreskin.

[rissababynta]

Thanks Rissa for your in person observations. That is proof. Do you know if they used a local anesthesia? (not that it will change me personally because I don't believe that I was anesthestised).

A funny side note is that my mother was a great horder of bills. We found the bill for my circumcision as we were cleaning up her house. By today's standards, it was cheap. I think that I might still have that bill hanging around somewhere. So, in one respect, I still have a memento of my circumcision.

They used a little numbing ointment and then I believe they injected a small amount of anesthesia into the foreskin if I remember correctly. I was more focused on my sons face than anything else so I didn't watch step by step what they did with the whole numbing department. He told me what he was doing too, but I wasn't focused on him lol. In some cases, they use a sugar water solution on the baby. It's bizarre, but because their pain receptors aren't properly developed as an infant, the solution almost mimicks the effects of a narcotic for a few minutes. I thought that was interesting when I first learned that years ago...I wonder if today they use it more often.

They used to not do this because doctors a long time ago believed that babies brains weren't developed enough to be able to feel pain, so they felt it was unnecessary, but now the majority of doctors in the world would never dream about doing any kind of procedure on an adult or child without some form of anesthesia.

I would also like to add for all of the people going off about how the baby is in OBVIOUS pain because they are crying and screaming...umm...yeah. Ya know how that happens? The second they are strapped onto the table, they start carrying on, because babies generally like being swaddled and held tightly like in the womb. The second you have them in that position with their arms and legs strapped out of the way...they get annoyed by it. Some babies don't care, like my son who preferred not to be swaddled right after he popped out of me haha. But the ones who do, tend to be the ones who get annoyed the second they are strapped onto the table.

[tenni]

Thanks Rissa
Everything that you wrote makes sense to me. I had heard about the question about how well developed the neurological system is in newborns. Sugar as a drug...lol I was feed commercial baby food that had sugar in it. The argument was so that the parent who might taste it would think that it was good. Now you tell me that I was being drugged....lol I always thought that is how I developed a sweet tooth.

[tenni]

"these people are referred to in psychological fields as cowards."

LOL...get fuck'n real. "Coward" is not a term used in psychological journals as a descriptor for any condition or theory that I have read.....

[rissababynta]

I'm sorry to challenge you again, Rissa
But exactly how can the nervous system of a newborn feel hunger from the stomach, feel 'wet' and 'poopy' to cry when so, feel tickling of the toes and spanking at birth to start breathing, and yet have the nervous system shut off during the mutilation?

In adults, we call this shock, where you don't feel any pain, at the moment.

"Only blind are those who will not see"

Then I guess it's pointless for anyone to ever get anesthesia since apparently, according to you, there is no way for anyone to not feel pain.

[rissababynta]

Thanks Rissa
Everything that you wrote makes sense to me. I had heard about the question about how well developed the neurological system is in newborns. Sugar as a drug...lol I was feed commercial baby food that had sugar in it. The argument was so that the parent who might taste it would think that it was good. Now you tell me that I was being drugged....lol I always thought that is how I developed a sweet tooth.

LMFAO well, it mainly only works in babies 3 months and under...and that's a bit too young for babyfood...so I wouldn't go thinking that you were drugged just yet haha.

[tenni]

*puts away the "victim card".
Searches through desk for another explanation for my sweet tooth

LMFAO well, it mainly only works in babies 3 months and under...and that's a bit too young for babyfood...so I wouldn't go thinking that you were drugged just yet haha.

[shybipinay]

*puts away the "victim card".
Searches through desk for another explanation for my sweet tooth

I wouldn't put that card away just yet. There are those that believe refined sugar is a drug. Or at least a form of one. Like caffiene is also considered a drug. Refined sugar can be highly addictive and could certainly explain the high incidence of diabetes as we get older. Although studies are now claiming that aspects of Hep B vaccinations may also be large factors in creating diabetes in older people.

It makes sense from a corporate point of view to somehow keep us addicted to certain foods and adding refined sugar is one way to ensure we will keep stufffing ourselves. Bottom line = profit margin not our good health and well being. Now, that's what we should be debating, not whether circumcision is necessary or a mutilating evil.

[shybipinay]

Thanks Rissa for your in person observations. That is proof. Do you know if they used a local anesthesia? (not that it will change me personally because I don't believe that I was anesthestised).

A funny side note is that my mother was a great horder of bills. We found the bill for my circumcision as we were cleaning up her house. By today's standards, it was cheap. I think that I might still have that bill hanging around somewhere. So, in one respect, I still have a memento of my circumcision of my former foreskin.

We also have our son's receipt. $199.00, which is a couple hundred lower than it was a few years earlier with the same doctor.

Once again FYI:

http://www.pollockclinics.com/circum...on-before.html


This clearly details the step by step process including pain killers and anesthesia. We were present and witnessed the entire procedure, in fact, the Doctor makes quite a point of thoroughly describing the step by step and walking all the parents through the process. He does the operation in groups. I think 5 per group.

Note, this process (web link) is not the most common procedure. Most of you are probably familiar with the "Plasti-bell" procedure which is not as safe, or pain free as the mogen-clamp method.

As for parents not being able to interpret a baby's cry and what it means - get fucking real!!! The person who said this obviously is not a parent. I could go on, but I have other more important things in life than to argue with blind idiots who can only call others blind. There's nothing worse than someone forcing their agenda on another because they believe they are so almighty and righteous.

[rissababynta]

Wow, groups of 5 or so. God! That sounds so much like doctors of the 1930s and 1940s lobotomizing so many patients at a time! And they were so flamboyantly doing the world a favor... remember?


Sorry Shybipinay, you bypassed the main issue with *yawn* so predictably... so old and worn out and worthless argument...

Shybipinay, do something invigorating... challenging... new...
Grab your wife, tie her to a board, slip her some date rape drug so there is no pain remembered, and give her a good old fashioned female circumcision!
Then let's hear her sing the joyous chords of harmony to mutilation!
Circumcision for men!
Circumcision for women!
All are equal and good (as by all moral standards)
Yea!

I suspect that even though her pain cannot be an issue, suddenly the pro mutilation folks will spaz and overreact... kind of like the
DO NO HARM, anti mutilation, anti molestation folks sound.
Wow.
Shocking.
Like I said. Do something new. Or say something (anything) that has validity.
You could be honest and say "I was wrong". THAT WOULD BE SHOCKING AND NEW FROM A PRO MUTILATION PERSON.
But honesty is not allowed in neurotic denial. Carry on the twisted path!
You had to be right!
You couldn't be wrong!
If one argument for neurotic denial fails - RUN TO ANOTHER!
Jesus f****** Christ...
People are so...
unable to rise above the very bottom...
bottom feeders...
LOL Adolph Hitler made several observations about you people...
...and by working you people... put him at the top... for a while.
Yet you have no self recognition, no self examination.

Damn...where are the lobotomy doctors when you need them

[darkeyes]

Damn...where are the lobotomy doctors when you need them

Tee hee.. u r awful sumtimes u r!!!

[MarieDelta]

Then, when every last cent of their money was spent,
The Fix-It-Up Chappie packed up. And he went.
And he laughed as he drove In his car up the beach,
“They never will learn. No. You can’t Teach a Sneetch!”

.............

[snakkie]

just to say, that i'm circumcised and also have problems with lack of sensibility.
i notice that since me and my friends started masturbating and i could see that i needed a lot more time to cum.
Now that i have had some sex experiences, i can confirm that, it takes a lot of time to cum and it's frustrating sometimes.
It's also nearly impossible to me to cum by oral sex.

[shybipinay]

Damn...where are the lobotomy doctors when you need them

Touche!!! However, please do not repost the quote as we have this troll on our iggy list and quoting him then allows us to see his posts. It's obvious from this person's drivel that it's not worth reading, quoting or re-posting thru the quote process whatever he thinks is important to say.

Howcome we're not hearing from the other 2 personae of this troll?