You could try something else, being honest. No matter what the consequences.
You could try something else, being honest. No matter what the consequences.
My wife has suggested that I find a partner for sex if I want to but has no idea that it might be another man, I doubt if she even suspects bi-sexuality.
I don't know exactly what to do about it, I have a fairly easy going sex drive now at 47, but it might be nice to try it while I am still reasonably attractive and virile.
My husband recently (well, a year or so ago) told me he is bisexual but that he's never cheated on me. I believe him. I think he sublimated the feelings for years before he met me and I'm thinking that's probably the main reason he didn't stay married to the other wives. I think he married a woman. Not THE woman. Just A woman to keep from acting on his bisexual urges. I don't think he actually admitted them to himself for years. When we met we both knew that was it. He was the one for me, I was the one for him. I don't know how I would've reacted had he confided in me years ago. Maybe it took maturing to be able to just see it for what it is. He's the very same person I married over twenty years ago. Did he have to change to be married to me? Yep. He can't run after the women any more. He can't start chasing the men. Why? Because we are committed to being faithful to each other. Does he have an urge to run after either of those? Probably. But I was pretty darned popular with the men myself. Do I ever wish to re-experience the thrill of the chase and the intensity of the first encounters? Sometimes. We all have to change when we are in a monogamous relationship. Well, that is, we change if we've ever actually had multiple people we dated at one time. But nothing is ever free. You always give up some things to have other things. I give up $1500 a month to have a nice home. I could rent one for half that, but it wouldn't be MINE. Sometimes giving up temporary things (including blow jobs in the bookstore) is the price you pay for having something better. People who tell you they have it both ways are probably lying. In fact, I suspect they don't have it either way as often as they'd like you to believe. I am glad he finally told me. For us it opened a door to greater honesty and closeness. I think gay porn is cool. I think bisexual sneaking around and lying to your wife is sleazy. And for the people who think that men should just say "marriage be damned" think of this: No matter what you ever do in your life and that can include finding a cure for cancer when they close that coffin over your face and put you in the ground the main thing you will be remembered for is that your wife left you and took the kids because she found out you were sneaking around having sex with men. If you're ok with that, have at it.
It all comes down to this: Every marriage is different; none of us have a right to tell another closet bi how to conduct the marriage or his or her life. We each (and I am an intensely, deeply, behind-the-wallpaper-on-the-back-wall closeted, carefully active bi) have to find our own best way. Mine began by total surprise a decade into a very good marriage and I'm trying to follow the narrow path between psychologically and physically healthy (and healthily limited) active bisexuality and protecting my wife from the agony she'd experience by finding out. That is more dominant than my fear of the economic and emotional consequences to me of a ruined marriage. When in doubt, I don't -- to protect her. Now unless somebody has walked my exact path in my exact shoes, don't tell me what I ought to do otherwise.
I played bi before getting married. I suppose I thought the desire would fade, but eventually I found myself meeting couples and playing MFM to fulfill the need. I did come out to the wife after being married, and she wasn't terribly happy about it. She did learn to accept it, and we've been together now approaching 30 years. I have not shared that I've played during the marriage (no, I personally don't think of MM or MFM as cheating, but no moral preaching here folks), however we have openly started discussing the possibility of "the right guy under the right circumstances" joining us. It's progress, albeit when we've been drinking and she gets mentally and physically more loose. We have shared the stories of men who can come onto me in spas or steamrooms on vacation, and how tempted I was, but didn't play (which I really didn't !). It was tempting, and she knows that, it gets her hot and wet, so maybe at some point.......I do play totally safe, and discrete. I have too much to lose in life with money, my kids and family, and my partnership with her.
Issues much?Originally Posted by Mickie
No Mickie sweetheart! That won't stop your hubby from cheating. Neither will a diet of gay porn and lectures about how monogamy is far more important than life itself until he's dead or divorced, will persuade one cheating bi male to 'come clean' to his wife.
That's pretty much a great incentive to keep schtum about non- monogamous activity when with a monogamy worshipping partner.
I'm sure you're right. But from a wife's point of view, at least if he continues to do what he's doing you've done everything and been straight up about what will happen if he continues to do it. No wishy washy, well, maybe I can handle it crap. And he'll get caught. We always pay for what we do, we just have to figure out if it's worth it. I'm way older than you, Gearbox. I remember the swinging swap parties of the 70's. I had friends who actually did that - including man to man and woman to woman sex. I don't know one single couple who stayed together. I do know one couple that tried to work through it and even re-married. For a minute. But, that's what cheaters do, I guess. They cheat.
Issues much?
No Mickie sweetheart! That won't stop your hubby from cheating. Neither will a diet of gay porn and lectures about how monogamy is far more important than life itself until he's dead or divorced, will persuade one cheating bi male to 'come clean' to his wife.
That's pretty much a great incentive to keep schtum about non- monogamous activity when with a monogamy worshipping partner.
Yes Mickie they marry, and they cheat. The No1 reason for that is (in my experience of cheaters) they fear that they wouldn't be allowed extramarital sex by their partners, and can't do without it.
They don't divorce their wives, nor leave them. They still love them and their children. So they protect her/him and self with deceit. That way everybody is happy until caught.
The deceit itself cause the harm, and not the sex. But it's a catch 22 situation in a monogamous relationship. Some can not be honest with their partners. It's not productive! They have better odds at a 'happy marriage' by being deceitful than being honest. It's a sad messy situation! One which is not uncommon in any partnership of any sexuality.
It has nothing to do with love, and ALL to do with acceptance.
What many many people seem unable to accept is that we are only here for a very short time, and we can not guarantee spending that time with the same person. Nor should we demand that we do, or fear that we don't.
Your hubby most probably has no intention of leaving you. If he did, there'd be nothing you could do to keep him. Same goes for cheating.
A wise lady told me that once. We are never in control of partners, so no point worrying about it. Will only give you ulcers.LOL. She's dead right!
Relax and just concern yourself with love.
Mickie
I notice that you still have not started your own thread about your personal questions and issues? Why is that?
Do you understand how much society condemns male bisexuals more than female bisexuals? Societal condemnation of bimen is great. It is great that your marriage has grown in strength due to his disclosure finally about his bisexuality. It must have been a difficult struggle for him to admit it to himself and then feel comfortable enough to disclose to you.
Do you understand that there are probably several forms of bisexuality? The sexual urges for same sex activity vary in bimen. Some bisexual men can remain faithful to their wife and it doesn't bother them too much. It is quite different than a married man wanting another woman imo. For other bisexual men who are sexual, the urge and need is great for same sex activity. If he is a man who "needs" sex with other men, he (bisexual man) may not be happy within himself being monogamous.
Do you know for sure if he is one of the bi men that can be happy being monogamous just with his wife? If so, great! If not, think about these questions.
1/ Do you understand and accept that his (bi man) need for physical sex with a man has nothing to do with his love for you, his wife? He may not have any emotional attachment to the man. Discuss this with him if you have not.
2/ Which is more important to you, your husband being happy within himself or that he be monogamous to you?
3/ What is love is for you? (monogamy and sacrifice to the point of unhappiness with self for a bisexual man)
Are there rules that would permit you to accept him having sex with another man that you might be comfortable with?
Is it only monogamy or divorce for you? No compromising so that he may be happy within himself as a bisexual man.
Last edited by tenni; Jul 2, 2012 at 5:26 PM.
I haven't started my own thread, Tenni, cause I'm soooo enjoying everybody else's. I do, indeed, understand there are many aspects in every kind of sexuality. I'm sure there are many women who can accept the non-monogamous aspect just fine. Good for them. I actually think kindness is more important. And I think that if both people are on the same page and are happy with whatever they work out between the two of them that's exactly what they need to do. It's the anger and the barely disguised dislike of women/wives that bother me. If a man (or woman) is in a marriage and can sincerely say they're going to have sex with whomever/whatever they want no matter what it does to the other partner then you are dead on in your remarks. They should say "damn the marriage", man up and let the woman find somebody who shares her values. Are you married now or have you ever been married? Were you happy? Were you faithful? Are you still married to the same woman, if you have, indeed ever been married? I actually think you make good points in a lot of your postings. Maybe not the points you intended to make, but they are food for thought. It's obvious you have given this lots of thought.
And, Tenni, in answer to your question "is that what love is to me"? No, it's not. If living with me in a monogamous relationship makes that person miserable with himself, he needs to go away. "Don't go away mad, just go away". I can find someone else who shares my values or I can make a perfectly happy life by myself. I'm fully growed. I seriously do not have him locked in my dungeon. But I do love myself enough and am selfish enough to do what I feel comfortable doing. At this point, I'm doing just that. I believe he is also. Will that be the way it is forever? Who knows. But I do know this - if he choses another path I won't curl up and die. Although, we're getting pretty deep into middle age. We might both just fall over.
I've never been married . . even before I discovered my bi side. I have this silly idea that marriage vows are supposed to be taken seriously and until I meet a woman to whom I can say them to with sincerity I really don't see the point in being a hypocrite by saying them to someone else and not mean it.
My wife knew I was curious when we first met 8 years ago, but it's only been the last 2 years that I've considered myself truely bisexual. I came out to her first though, so I'm lucky that I have a relationship where my greatest confidant is also my spouse.
The two of us are deeply entrenched in the local kink community and that has made it easier for us. We've also recently become polyamorous, so my freedom to explore is realized exponentially. What now restricts me the most is that I refuse to be sexual with someone who is hiding from another partner.
My gut reaction, like many people here, is to say "come out to your spouse/lover. It will be better in the long run," and while I believe that, I fully recognise that some people are not in situations where such openess would be benificial. Sometimes the love or need to stay with a partner is stronger than the desire to be open. Some people are more comfortable with the fantasy than they are with the reality. Some have taken great measures and made significant sacrifices in order to get where they are now and value that more than the freedom we'd all like to enjoy. Some are just not ready.
Although my co-workers and family back home would accept me if I told them I was a kinky polyamorous bisexual, there's just no reason for them to know. If they ask, I will divulge, but only then. I'm lucky enough to be out to my wife and closest friends, but that's as far as it goes.
Although I'm not comfortable sleeping with someone who isn't open to their spouse or partner, I fully recognize their need to be descrete. I'm not in their head. I can't make their decisions. I refuse to sleep with them...
...but I refuse to judge them as well.
Mickie
Yes, I was married and monogamous during that marriage. I did not even know about the word bisexual at that time let alone its meaning. I have been cheated on by a female lover and so I know the pain caused by cheating.
Some people see love as wanting their partner(s) to be happy and do what they can to help them be happy. Their self esteem is strong and they are not threatened by their bisexual partner having sex with a same gendered person. They consider it caring and kindness on their part to give their partner the freedom to explore their sexuality regardless of mainstream taboo against it. The bisexual may love you and want to be with you but have needs that you are not able to fulfill. It doesn't mean that you are a failure for not meeting their needs. I believe that no one person can meet every need of another person.
Are you really here to learn about your bisexual mate and open to learning and expanding your boundaries? Are you here to re affirm your belief about what a marriage is ..a monogamous relationship that bisexuals must fit into? Based on what you have written and how you have acted on this site, I suspect that it is the latter? Good luck you and your spouse. Do continue talking to him. Try to be open to his thoughts. Invite him to this site if he is not already here.(or sites just for bimen if he would be more comfortable there) May you both find happiness.
Last edited by tenni; Jul 2, 2012 at 10:58 PM.
Tenni, I'm way more sympathetic than you think. I just have to gather my facts first. I just call a spade a spade. If a guy (or woman) wants to stay married and have sex with other people and they aren't married to me, they have that right. But there is a price to pay for everything we do. I see such unrealistic expectations voiced it hurts my heart for them. It is so easy to sit with a laptop in one's lap and give opinions that may be construed to be advice. I just read the most hurtful "book" (and I use that term loosely, manifesto would be more appropriate) about how awful/sinful/spawns of the devil bisexual or gay men that marry women are. And this from a so called counselor. She needs a really good hair pulling. I think there must be a middle ground somewhere. And thank you for being so sweet. I think underneath that prickly exterior you actually DO have a big ol heart in there.
He does.. he is just such a bloody awkward sod.... but fun to take issue wiv and slap down hey tenni babes???
Do not think so little of me as to grant me your tolerance. Allow me your acceptance and understanding of who and what I am with the love, respect and dignity with which I do you.
Hey Mickie,
When I joined this site seven years ago, I thought a great deal like you....I was a staunch, dried in the wool believer in complete and total monogamy and I refused to see things any differently. I also thought I had accepted my husband's sexuality during our marriage but I soon realized I hadn't been accepting, nor had I been understanding....I was neither. My husband had told me he was bi before we married and since he promised monogamy, I thought nothing more about his sexuality. In other words....I ignored it...totally and completely. He still hid from me whenever he looked at gay porn and in the event I did run across him doing so, I also did so with a bit of shock, a great deal of fear and a nice dose of anger. Thanks to the people of this site, I have come to not only accept his sexuality, but I have embraced it. Does that mean that I believe in cheating? No....far from it....but I no longer condemn people who find themselves in situations where they feel they can not be true to their spouses or themselves and find that they must choose to step silently away from their marriage in order to explore themselves. No one is asking you to allow your husband to cheat. But please allow yourself to open your mind just a bit to perhaps see the issues that other bisexuals face in their situations and not condemn them across the board just because they are doing something you don't want for your marriage. I can already tell that you are very open minded about sexuality and I applaud you for that. You must conduct your marriage to YOUR satisfaction and to the satisfaction of your spouse so I would never presume to tell you otherwise. I am simply asking you to take the time to listen....to read the forums with a bit more of an open mind. You will find that many will frustrate you...even anger you....but before you react....simply realize that to them, there may be no alternative. And for every frustrating, anger inducing thread that you read, there are just as many that will inspire you and touch your heart. All I am asking is that you give us a bit of time....let us share what we have learned with you and we will certainly look forward to learning things FROM you as well.
I wish you and your husband all the luck in the world. Your husband is very lucky that he has you to talk to and now, if you wish....you have US to talk to. Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions that you prefer not to ask in the public forum. Welcome to this site and I look forward to hearing more from you in the future.
Hugs,
Kate
PS...You are right about tenni....he does have a big 'ol heart! I speak from experience as I used to butt heads with him over the very same topic that you and he have exchanged posts over. I used to get frustrated and angry....but then I decided to actually listen to him and in doing so, I gained a better insight as to what the bisexual man faces...the daily dilemmas of trying to be true to themselves vs. being true to another. Toss in a judgmental society and a not so understanding spouse and you have a recipe for marital disaster. Tenni put things into perspective for me and showed me that things aren't always rosy in a marriage such as ours and it certainly isn't black and white. I don't always agree with him, but I do allow him his opinion and sometimes he is right.....Damn it! LOL! Hate to have to admit that LOL! BUT....in the very same vein, tenni has also started to listen to me....and while he may not always agree with me, he respects me and that is something I'd rather have. I'd much rather be respected than right!
Last edited by csrakate; Jul 3, 2012 at 10:31 AM.
Friendship is born at that moment when one person says to another: "What! You too? I thought I was the only one."
C. S. Lewis
Dare I put in my two cents? Of course, why not. I have been married for nearly 7 years. Our sex life went from a few times a week to once a year for the past couple. I love my wiife but I will not be in a sexless marriage. Since I had a few M2M experiences in High school I have been thinking about a fwb situation. I don't want to leave my wife but I can't go on spending the rest of my life masturbating. I want the touch and feel of another body next to me, in me, making love to me. And me doing the same in return. I want my cake and eat it too. I have no intention of telling my wife about the attraction to guys. Some of you will agree, some will not. I know there are many here among us that are in the same or similar boat. You have to do what you think is right, not what someone tells you is right. My coming out is not an option. I have to much going for me and to tell her I want the company of men as well as women, would be like lighting a fuse under everything I have worked for. So I sit here in the closet, looking for my FWB, and we will see how it goes. What the wife doesn't know won't hurt her. As long as nothing is brought home.
This is my opinion, and like assholes, everyone has one. Most of them stink. For those who have come out to a understanding wife, I applaude you. For the others that are married and not out, and are meeting on the side, I applaude you as well. Life is short and you need to do what makes you happy.
I know women who are so stingy with their affection if I was married to them I'd be strolling the streets. And hateful? whoooo eeeee.
So tired of the stereotypes. It is 100% possible to be bisexual, and have a monogamous relationship with just one person and be satisfied. Just because you love both genders and are equally sexually attracted to both doesn't mean you have to have multiple partners to be fulfilled.
You don't give a damn about your wife. I have tried to reason with bi men and understand and ignore the labels,but if any woman ever comes to me for advice on bi men,I'll point her to this and say this sums it up. Why marry her? You're using her as a cover up. WOOOOW just wow. You don't know what you can bring home. She didn't choose to marry a bi male nor have a cheating dog. Just leave the poor woman alone because if you get sloppy and bring something home,she has full right to do a number on you.
After reading this thread, I'm surprised that no one has brought up the real issue here; "Fidelity." To quote from this article by Hugo Schwyzer about BiFidelity;
In more than a quarter-century of thinking, writing, and eventually teaching about male bisexuality, I’ve become convinced that the inability to accept the reality of bisexuality in men is linked to fears about fidelity. The myth that men are naturally promiscuous while women are naturally monogamous endures. So we assume that a bisexual woman can make a commitment to either a man or a woman, and that she’ll be able to stay faithful. But we already think straight men have a hard enough time remaining true—the expectation that a bisexual man will invariably cheat is high.
…I can’t speak for every man who has dealt with a lifetime of sexual attraction to both men and women. But I can speak from my own experience, which is that monogamy is no harder for bisexuals than it is for straight or gay folks. Even if you’re only sexually attracted to females, there’s no way your wife or girlfriend can possibly embody everything that draws you to women. http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2011/05/10/bi-fidelity/
Infidelity is something that crosses all human barriers. Both genders do it and all orientations do it. There are no quick and easy answers.
As with most problems involving human dynamics, you have to know yourself first then be honest with yourself. I have never been married partly because I see the sheer agony and bitter pain people have gone through after finding out their partner has been unfaithful. I've been party to such things. I will not commit myself by vow or oath to a relationship where I feel there is even a slight chance I will violate it.
Mistakes are one thing. Us humans are weak. But before I require my mate to consummate their life to me alone, I want to make sure I have the certitude that I can do it myself.
To thine own self, be true.
opentoitiguess? In a pigs ass. How can you call yourself "open to it I guess" when you don't seem at the least open to it? Of course you will side with the woman. When we got married, it was to be forever. But within a year of marriage and sex dropped to hardly nothing, that was not in the plan and if I mention she see a doctor to find out why she thinks sex once a year is good she tells me I should see a doctor to find out why at 45 I want sex 3 times a week. She wanted me to go to the doctor to see if he could give me something to make me fine with once a year sex. FUCK HER! I am the healthy normal one. I know women older then she is who want sex once a day. As far as bringing something home, I am out looking for a fwb, who is in the same situation as I am and we will be able to fulfill our M2M desires and that it will only be us two so we don't bring anything home to our spouses. Of course, with my wife wanting sex once a year, I shouldn't have much to worry about.
I am married and NOT sneaking around. Came out to the wife 4 yrs ago. It took time and patience and a few rules we set to deal with it, but being able to be myself was life saving. I could go out with bisexual groups in Chicago and even gay groups not having to worry if she was going to panic that I was out having anonymous sex all the time. I took her with me to show her that they didn't have horns, pus dripping from their ears, or psychiatric conditions unknown to medicine.
Eventually she gave me the go ahead to find a boyfriend. After a lot of hunting, I found one. We are both happy.
Count me in as one. Not sure why but I just like both a woman and a guy. Wife has no clue tho and would never understand. Closet it is for me.
If she doesn't like it tough shit? Wow, if you are involved with a woman, I feel sorry for her. As long as you are happy, you will stomp over her feelings at will. Whether one is hetero, gay, bi, etc. doesn't give anyone the right to be an insensitive asshole. If you are incapable of considering others, relationships aren't for you.
JP
That is great! I am happy for you. It is helpful for all of us to read more successful stories.
For those who are turning this thread into a biman bash, read the section in JP where he states that it was "life saving". Many mistakes may be made on both sides. I thought that this thread was a group self disclosure thread without judgement?
OP's premise of this thread
"HEY GUYS IF YOU ARE MARRIED AND HIDING YOUR BISEXUALITY FROM YOUR WIFE, HOW DO YOU DO IT AND ARE ANY OF YOU ACTUALLY SEEING ANYONE ON THE SIDE. I AM MARRIED AND BI BUT MY WIFE FOUND MY SECRET EMAIL ACCOUNT AND GOT THE PASSWORD SO I AM PAYING HELL RIGHT NOW."
Last edited by tenni; Jul 12, 2012 at 9:57 AM.
Exactly. I agree with a 110%.But that message always falls on deaf ears.
Which post number has "If she doesn't like it tough shit?" other than Vuillardgr's post?
This thread started in 2007.
Thanks. I have read some of your posts and I am in agreement with you on certain issues. I've been reading several MMF romance/erotic ebooks. I must admit, in a way I believe it would be extremely intriguing to have a bisexual boyfriend. At the same time, I'm not sure how realistic that would be for me. I would never want to hold anyone back from what they need or wanted. I'd never ask someone to ignore an important part of themselves. That being said, it would hurt like hell. I read an MMF ebook called "Heart and Soul" by Ashley Ladd, it's a short read.. just over 100 pages. Anyway, the woman, Mischa is engaged to Steve whom she has known for a year. They are happy and in love and have extremely explosive sex. Then one evening he takes her to this club downtown she has never been to. He informs her that he wants him to meet his best friend Vin. When they get inside the club, he spots Vin and he goes up to him and they have a passionate kiss and embrace. So she is just standing there, utterly shocked. She had no idea . Oh and Vin is married and his wife is pregnant. and she knows about Vin and Steve. Those guys have been lovers for 3 years before he met Mischa. So she runs out of the club and he follows her. He is upset with her because she hurt Vin's feelings. He tells her he is overreacting because he isn't cheating on her because Vin is a man. I couldn't believe what I was reading! This guy's logic was unreal to me. If you are involved with someone else without your partner knowing, that is fucking cheating...no matter if it's same or opposite sex.
I won't ruin the whole thing for you in case you want to read it, but Mischa reacted like many would. That doesn't make her biphobic or insensitive. She had to work out things in a way that was right for her.
If a guy tells his woman he is bisexual, I think understanding and tact is in order on both sides. But I am a realist, most women may have to take a step back and decide if this is something they can truly accept. It's not about being cruel or hateful. i believe women should go out of their way not to say anything mean or hurtful. Unless he has cheated and lie. Then you should blast his ass for that, but never for him actually being bisexual.
I don't know if I can just sit and wait for him to come home after romancing and being intimate with someone else. What if I am going through some really difficult times and I really need my guy and I can't have him because he's with his man and it's not my turn? But what can I say if I have agreed to it? Maybe it's true that him being with someone else doesn't diminish his feelings for you. That the heart is multifaceted. But when your love isn't there for you because he has another love in his life, that would be a difficult mantra to recite to yourself in a cold bed.
Just a few of my thoughts.....
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