I was outed!

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Originally Posted by Cherry88

i know this wasnt directed to me but i do have to say im almost 50 years old and somehow ive gotten to this point without ever cheating, or ever snooping..../// on -anyone-, ever....

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If I make it to 50 without cheating or snooping, I'm going to have it written in the LGBT Times.:tongue: Not long left now, if we can only resist it for a few more years, there'll be parades and everything.
I'm willing to share the front page if you are?lol

It is a bit tragic that we have to point that out as if it's against the 'norm', but I have to do just that more often than I should. Maybe once or twice with women, but every single time with men.
Reason being - I didn't tell any women that I was bi. Didn't need to. That's prob dishonest in a way, but it had no effect on them so why bother? That's my excuse.
It's a damn good excuse, I found out much later when telling gay men that I'm bi. Suddenly, not a word that comes out of my mouth can be taken for what it is.lol Somehow my sexuality is like Dextor's 'dark passenger', hiding in the background waiting to pounce, and I'm just as much a victim of it as them.:eek2: I expect that I've been snooped on, but don't mind really. Like you, I'd just tell them anyway if there was a prob. I'd like to see them try shutting my gob about it!:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

If I make it to 50 without cheating or snooping, I'm going to have it written in the LGBT Times.:tongue: Not long left now, if we can only resist it for a few more years, there'll be parades and everything.
I'm willing to share the front page if you are?lol

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haha! i really didnt want to let this go without answering. i -really- love parades ^^

so yeah im totally into that but only if we can have a huge naked tea party with a whole bunch of cheaters which will usher in a new era of world peace between the nations..... @@ it'll be a historic day... *wiping away tear*


but i mean i know you were joking but the thing is i mean i kind of wanted to clarify that at least in my case its never been a case of resisting...... i mean honestly ive been in several very long term very committed relationships..... ive never once been in a casual relationship..... i dont even really date...// i just dont have any interest in that at all. im a committed person and get off sexually on trust and commitment and depth of emotional connection, rather than variety.... so even though in relationships im often sexually turned on by a variety of people, and fully expect my partner to be, and think thats super normal, ive honestly never even ONE TIME wanted to take it further than that...... especially if my partner wasnt involved. like several times ive been open to threesomes or whatever but that was because my partner was inviolved.. i really cant fathom the concept of -wanting- to be with someone sexually besides the person im with at the time.. ive just never even remotely wanted it. so ive never been in a position to need to resist, its always been not only easy for me, but a total non issue. its slightly harder to resist snooping at times but not really. so neither of those things has ever really been even remotely a struggle for me, i guess i am just lucky??

so i mean, i think whether or not thats the case has a lot to do with what a pereson values sexually. if a person gets off on variety or enjoys many casual relatoinships they will want lots of partners. if a person gets off more on the emotional connection and wants just a few very committed partners, they will be less inclined to want lots of partners.... thats just a guess. im also one of those that tends to have a very small number of very loyal friends as well..... not a huge bunch of loose aquaintances.. i value that in all my relationships. i think its just a personal preference. so i see both approaches as totally valid for different people depending what they value in their life..... im not sure why some people prefer one or the other if its nature or nature or a combination im sure its all that stuff. but sometimes i think its just a true preference, its not always societal conditioning.... i would definitely like to see a world where there was more acceptance of the wide variety of human experience so that nobody felt they had to hide and so that nobody felt what they wanted wasnt an option... :>>

my daughters world is like that... im happy to see it. in her world there is no such thing as 'straight or gay' thats seen as ridiculously limiting. her friends are a wide range of pansexual, asexual, multisexual, transexual, non monagamous, committed but platonic, poly open, poly fidelitous, etc etc etc.... in her world you can sort of make it up as you go. i think thats just perfect. the one constant is, they all value honesty. in a world like that theres no need to be dishonest.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

It is a bit tragic that we have to point that out as if it's against the 'norm', but I have to do just that more often than I should. Maybe once or twice with women, but every single time with men.
Reason being - I didn't tell any women that I was bi. Didn't need to. That's prob dishonest in a way, but it had no effect on them so why bother? That's my excuse.

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hmmm ok well i spent a lot of time thinking about this stuf.. i can understand this and to a point agree that it doestn affect other people.. up to a point. in casual dating, in a short term relationship maybe it -doesnt- affect them but you agree that after a point it begins to, right? i mean if she is with you for a couple years and she is getting serious about you and making long term plans and stuff dont you think it would affect her at that point? im ont saying it has to, im jsut curious. it jsut seems to me, in my mind, the more your life gets intwined with someone elses the more that stuff -does- begin to affect the other person.... i guess thats totally open to debate and everyone draws that line in a different place... i certainly hope that future guys tell me if theyre bi... cause if they dont we'll be missing out on some great sex :<<

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

It's a damn good excuse, I found out much later when telling gay men that I'm bi. Suddenly, not a word that comes out of my mouth can be taken for what it is.lol Somehow my sexuality is like Dextor's 'dark passenger', hiding in the background waiting to pounce, and I'm just as much a victim of it as them.:eek2:

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i actually googled dexters dark passenger so i could understand what you were referring to here. :>> i really gave this a huge amount of thought tryign to understand this. i guess what you are saying is that gay men trust you more if they think youre gay? and straight women trust you more if they dont know one way or the other? but when people find out you are bi suddenly its a big mysterious thing they dont trust or understand and are very suspicious of????

that really sucks that gay men seem prejudiced against bi people ??? wow. it also makes me sad how little many women seem to appreciate how awsome being bi can be??? its a shame. but i guess i understand it its like being biracial maybe, you are kind of betwen worlds, its harder to get accepted in either world. its really a shame if thast the case and that isnt right.

like i said i really hope that by the time my daughter is (well damn.. i was gonna say by the tme shes an adult, then i forgot shes in her 3rd year of college, DURRRFRR) honestly though when my daughters generation is in charge of stuff (and yours too) i am quite sure there will be a whole lot more acceptance of the wide amazing gorgeous variety of human experience and how beautiful and nifty it is and how awesome it is and how great it is and that people have a billoin choices and we can find partners who are like us and want us for what we are..... just like people dont care about interracial marriage anymore.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

I expect that I've been snooped on, but don't mind really. Like you, I'd just tell them anyway if there was a prob. I'd like to see them try shutting my gob about it!:rolleyes:

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HAHA damn straight. // ok well im really looking forward to that parade i hope everyone will be there for the massive naked tea party and subsequent sex party im super looking forward to it <3 <3 <3

@ Cherry- Even though neither of us put any effort into getting the awards, damn right we can still get up there and claim it.:tongue: I already practice the naked tea party bit in groups of two, but I'll keep at it to prepare myself for 100's.lol
I think that we both swing to non-complications, and that's how we've managed it all these years. We just can't be bothered with a big fuss. I've spent most of my time trying to keep things simple. Now THAT is a big effort coz not many things come pre-packed in 'simple' .:bigrin: It's def a fight against the tide very often.
Like you, I enjoy long term relationships and not really need sex outside them. The more your with a person, the more emotionally and sexually connected you get and it makes everything even better. But when single, I am promiscuous and have a great time getting intimate with complete strangers too. I still prefer fuckbuds though, coz you carry on where you left off.lol

I never told any female partners about me being bi coz it really didn't effect them. I hadn't had sex with a male since puberty, an although I never lost the desire to, those desires were not something I needed to act on. I was perfectly fine with just women. That was prob due to suppression but I really don't know. I'm 50/50 and classed my attraction to other men the same as I classed my attraction to other women. So I didn't point out either attractions to female partners.:bigrin:
BUT if I had a dire urge to go have sex with men pop up, I HOPE I would have told them. I think I was just lucky that I wasn't in a relationship when it did.
For those who were in relationships when that happens, I can completely understand how stressful that can be.

That 'dark passenger' thing isn't far off the mark IMO, so I can kinda understand why gays & straights have trouble with bi's on that level. As you can see, I was bi all the time in m-f relationships but ok with living as hetero. Today I'm having sex with men and not seeking m-f relationships, living as gay but am still the same bi as I was before. That's still a bit of a turnaround isn't it?:rolleyes:
To many gays & straights it looks like I don't have a clue about what's going on myself and my WHOLE sex & love life is a big mess of gay & straight. It also looks like I've had no control over it.
That is a fair point IMO! So even though I will claim that I am NOT confused and won't turn straight or gay at any moment due to factors beyond my control, they are prob thinking "You poor soul! You just can't help yourself can you?".:tongue:
I've had a Good Samaritan bloke come to my aid and swear that he'll do all he can to wash away my liking of women. That he'd make it easier for me to love him etc.:rolleyes: Then I get thinking that it's not ME who's confused. I loved women despite liking men.lol
BUT I can see how it gets confusing. I don't like it, but there yu go.

this is one of the reasons, i will always tell my partner i am bisexual, i would rather let it end there early in the relationship then to live in a lie taking a chance of falling in love and end with broken hearts. this just happened recently and didn't hurt as much as it would have if i didn't say anything. with all that said, the trust has been broken and it's up to you to try and repair the damage if she will let you. if she will understand and take you as you are.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

@ Cherry- Even though neither of us put any effort into getting the awards, damn right we can still get up there and claim it.:tongue: I already practice the naked tea party bit in groups of two, but I'll keep at it to prepare myself for 100's.lol
I think that we both swing to non-complications, and that's how we've managed it all these years. We just can't be bothered with a big fuss. I've spent most of my time trying to keep things simple. Now THAT is a big effort coz not many things come pre-packed in 'simple' .:bigrin: It's def a fight against the tide very often.

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ha! i think you are right about this.. love can be very complicated but on other levels, really a lot of people just totally overthink stuff.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

BUT if I had a dire urge to go have sex with men pop up, I HOPE I would have told them. I think I was just lucky that I wasn't in a relationship when it did.
For those who were in relationships when that happens, I can completely understand how stressful that can be.

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well it just raises a lot of questions... i mean.. -do- bisexual people get the urge to be with others while in relationships, more often than non-bisexual people, really?? or not?? its kind of an interesting question. i mean if you look at each human being as an individual, then every human being on the planet can give a person soemthing their partner cannot...... i mean the idea that one sex provides something the other cannot, doesnt necessarily follow that thats somethign that -needs- to be acted on in a relationship.... its interesting to think about.

if a person can be with one woman and not 'need' another woman, surely they can be with a woman and not 'need' to be with a man right???? people are peopel right? we all have somethign different to offer dont we? or is that too simplistic?? i think some people are just non monagamous..... indpendent of their sexuality. while some people are monagamous, independent of their sexuality...

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

That 'dark passenger' thing isn't far off the mark IMO, so I can kinda understand why gays & straights have trouble with bi's on that level. As you can see, I was bi all the time in m-f relationships but ok with living as hetero. Today I'm having sex with men and not seeking m-f relationships, living as gay but am still the same bi as I was before. That's still a bit of a turnaround isn't it?:rolleyes:
To many gays & straights it looks like I don't have a clue about what's going on myself and my WHOLE sex & love life is a big mess of gay & straight. It also looks like I've had no control over it.
That is a fair point IMO! So even though I will claim that I am NOT confused and won't turn straight or gay at any moment due to factors beyond my control, they are prob thinking "You poor soul! You just can't help yourself can you?".:tongue:
I've had a Good Samaritan bloke come to my aid and swear that he'll do all he can to wash away my liking of women. That he'd make it easier for me to love him etc.:rolleyes: Then I get thinking that it's not ME who's confused. I loved women despite liking men.lol
BUT I can see how it gets confusing. I don't like it, but there yu go.

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you know.. i admit. i find it harder to 'trust' my bf now that i know he is not monagamous. and it -is- a 'dark passenger' thing. its something i really dont understand, i dont get the motivation behind it, its a big mystery to me and as such it seems like something huge, scary, unpredictable, and alien to me....

the interesting thing is, while we were just talking about it, i -didnt- find it big or scary or weird at all...... or feel he was less trustworthy becuase of it.. only after soemthign happened (an action outside our relatoinship agreement) that -was- hugely terifying and difficult for me to understand, and really was severely outside the bounds of ethics in my mind, that made me feel he -didint- really seem to be in control at all........ then yes, it began to sort of look like that to me.. this 'thing' that apparenlty motivates him that i have absolutely no understaning of, and which seems very extremely likely to 'make' him do stuf that is very hurtful and painful which he -doesnt- seem to have a lot of control over..... so i think its a very interesting analogy.

so yeah it looks a littile scary from the outside and -does- honestly make me trust him a little less, than someone who isnt likely to do stuff like that... its sad to admit that, but its true. im not sure hes really inherently any less trust worthy as a person. its just cause i dont totally udnerstand the motivation behind it. // its interesting that a gay guy would be more concerned about you leaving him for a woman, than just another guy....... // you know? both seem equally likely to happen or not happen. the difference probalby is just that he is less familiar with the motoivations that make one desire a woman.

however the more i udnerstand waht motivates him the more trust i regain. like anything stuff is scarier when you dont understand it of course.

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Originally Posted by Cherry88

you know.. i admit. i find it harder to 'trust' my bf now that i know he is not monagamous. and it -is- a 'dark passenger' thing. its something i really dont understand, i dont get the motivation behind it, its a big mystery to me and as such it seems like something huge, scary, unpredictable, and alien to me....

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The best way I can describe the compulsion for a bi to venture into their bisexuality (get same gender sex) is to compare it with a females compulsion to have a baby.:tongue:
Some women go through life perfectly happy without a child even though at the back of her mind she wants one. She puts it off and it's not that much of a big deal coz she's happy enough being childless and it gets suppressed. BUT sometimes the ticking clock comes along and it tells her that stuff needs to be dealt with before it's too late. It's always there, but the ticking gets DEAFENING!
That is what I mean by 'dark passenger'. The instincts that our bodies and minds will only tolerate to be kept in the dark for so long before it demands an airing.

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well it just raises a lot of questions... i mean.. -do- bisexual people get the urge to be with others while in relationships, more often than non-bisexual people, really?? or not?? its kind of an interesting question. i mean if you look at each human being as an individual, then every human being on the planet can give a person soemthing their partner cannot...... i mean the idea that one sex provides something the other cannot, doesnt necessarily follow that thats somethign that -needs- to be acted on in a relationship.... its interesting to think about.

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If you consider that the act of same gender sex for SOME bi's is more to do with who he/she is than just the act itself, you may understand the urge for it?
No that doesn't mean that bisexuality is promiscuous in nature, but it can have strings to self expression and it's sating of. It's not just extra sex they are after, but also (in many cases) mutual acceptance of a natural part of their ID, IMO. For many, failing to accomplish that can lead to depression. It seems that we have drastically different levels in that regards to reach a point of self discovery that we are happy with, but that is pretty foggy at the mo as far as I can tell.

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the interesting thing is, while we were just talking about it, i -didnt- find it big or scary or weird at all...... or feel he was less trustworthy becuase of it.. only after soemthign happened (an action outside our relatoinship agreement) that -was- hugely terifying and difficult for me to understand, and really was severely outside the bounds of ethics in my mind, that made me feel he -didint- really seem to be in control at all........ then yes, it began to sort of look like that to me.. this 'thing' that apparenlty motivates him that i have absolutely no understaning of, and which seems very extremely likely to 'make' him do stuf that is very hurtful and painful which he -doesnt- seem to have a lot of control over..... so i think its a very interesting analogy.

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He was daft to go outside the boundaries that he agreed to! But at least you appreciate that it wasn't to hurt you or damage the relationship.:)
It seems like while he's out discovering what makes him tick, you are taking the opportunity to see what makes you tick too. That IMO is partly what relationships are for. You have already stretched your comfort level by relaxing some boundaries and THAT is no small task, as you know. You are treating your partner as a person to be explored and that is how we get past fears etc.
When we cease fearing the unknown and uncontrolled, we can just get on with the love.:bowdown:

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so yeah it looks a littile scary from the outside and -does- honestly make me trust him a little less, than someone who isnt likely to do stuff like that... its sad to admit that, but its true. im not sure hes really inherently any less trust worthy as a person. its just cause i dont totally udnerstand the motivation behind it. // its interesting that a gay guy would be more concerned about you leaving him for a woman, than just another guy....... // you know? both seem equally likely to happen or not happen. the difference probalby is just that he is less familiar with the motoivations that make one desire a woman.

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I'm 'different', so was hard to relate to for the gay bloke. I prob didn't understand him either, but that doesn't scare me. And that lack of vulnerability/fear gives no guarantee that I'd have responsibility for his fears. I don't share them, but do consider them. He thought that he needed a hold on me so he could love without fear IMO. That is what I notice about many of the monogamous. That's why rules are in place to keep the fear at bay and give love a breathing space. But the more rules in place, the more like fine china they become. The more like fine china they become, the more out of control their fears get.
I hope you will come to a point where NOTHING scares you and you realize that your not some antique porcelain doll, but a woman who takes on something that puts her in jeopardy willingly. I know what fear is, believe me, so can appreciate how extreme even a tiny step can be. I CAN guarantee that it's well worth every effort.:)

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

The best way I can describe the compulsion for a bi to venture into their bisexuality (get same gender sex) is to compare it with a females compulsion to have a baby.:tongue:
Some women go through life perfectly happy without a child even though at the back of her mind she wants one. She puts it off and it's not that much of a big deal coz she's happy enough being childless and it gets suppressed. BUT sometimes the ticking clock comes along and it tells her that stuff needs to be dealt with before it's too late. It's always there, but the ticking gets DEAFENING!
That is what I mean by 'dark passenger'. The instincts that our bodies and minds will only tolerate to be kept in the dark for so long before it demands an airing.

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urrghghghg its kind of hard to hear and think about but i get it.... this is just how my bf describes it. i get the feeling it is something he would feel regret, if he were not able to do at the times it comes up. // or, that he was not doing what he was 'supposed' to be doing with his life... // yup. makes a lot of sense thank you.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

If you consider that the act of same gender sex for SOME bi's is more to do with who he/she is than just the act itself, you may understand the urge for it?
No that doesn't mean that bisexuality is promiscuous in nature, but it can have strings to self expression and it's sating of. It's not just extra sex they are after, but also (in many cases) mutual acceptance of a natural part of their ID, IMO. For many, failing to accomplish that can lead to depression.

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this also makes sense to me.... this also is the way my bf describes it. he describes the important parts of it in terms of getting to know himself, 'growing up' etc etc he is very clear the actual act was not the important part of it for him. the important part of it was beign himself and expressing his real self. he has said many times the actual event was not that important and totally was nowhere near worth risking our relationship as it did...... however he feels (and i really understand this) it -was- very very important that he did something that he felt was part of expressing his real self. to him that was the important part of it.

that actually kind of helped me cause origianlly what pissed me off so bad was the idea that he was so willign to throw away our relatoinship over something (In my eyes) totaly meaningless like 5 mins of sex. it actually helped me realize that the actual reason for doing it was -deeply- important to him.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

He was daft to go outside the boundaries that he agreed to! But at least you appreciate that it wasn't to hurt you or damage the relationship.:)
It seems like while he's out discovering what makes him tick, you are taking the opportunity to see what makes you tick too. That IMO is partly what relationships are for. You have already stretched your comfort level by relaxing some boundaries and THAT is no small task, as you know. You are treating your partner as a person to be explored and that is how we get past fears etc.
When we cease fearing the unknown and uncontrolled, we can just get on with the love.:bowdown:

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my bf has acted with a lot of integrity the whole time ive known him. i share a lot of his motivations and reasons for doing the stuff we do as adults... we just express some of it in different ways... the credit goes to him for being trustworthy and really putting a lot of effort into that. he has acted in a trustworthy way and he has done a lot to help me udnerstand him and trust him. a lot of that credit goes to him. he has worked really hard this whole past year and we still go to therapy every week and he participates in every way. hes made a lot of effort to meet me halfway and show me that he values this relationship and doesnt want to hurt me, and that has helped me stretch for him.

this is somethign that people who feel they need to be dishonest, could learn from. its really tough to act with integrity and it takes being strong and it takes self denial at times however in the long run, it is the way to -realy- get what you want. my bf could have taken the easy way to get what he wants, do it behind my back and hope i dont find out, or he could put in the effort to get what he wants, and cultivate a relatoinship in which he is really supported and understood in getting what he wants... the second way takes a LOT more work.. a lot more patience and a bit of sacrifice.. however i think that this work will pay off for him, becuase he wil lhave what he -realy- wants which is a good strong relatoinship in which he can -also- really be himself openly, and feel good about it. he is smart enough to realize this and also ballsy enough to do the work to make that hapen and the credit for that definitely goes to him. at this point i honestly feel terrible for putting him through what i have now that i understand more what he was tryign to do. thats a big turnaround from last year. if more partners would put in the kind of effort maybe more would get that kind of response from -their- partners. (dunno)

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

I'm 'different', so was hard to relate to for the gay bloke. I prob didn't understand him either, but that doesn't scare me. And that lack of vulnerability/fear gives no guarantee that I'd have responsibility for his fears. I don't share them, but do consider them. He thought that he needed a hold on me so he could love without fear IMO. That is what I notice about many of the monogamous. That's why rules are in place to keep the fear at bay and give love a breathing space. But the more rules in place, the more like fine china they become. The more like fine china they become, the more out of control their fears get.
I hope you will come to a point where NOTHING scares you and you realize that your not some antique porcelain doll, but a woman who takes on something that puts her in jeopardy willingly. I know what fear is, believe me, so can appreciate how extreme even a tiny step can be. I CAN guarantee that it's well worth every effort.

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Originally Posted by Gearbox

:)

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i agree. with love especially sometimes the harder you work for something sometimes the sweeter it is... and i -hope- i would get to a point where nothing scares me!

perfect love casteth out fear but boy that is so hard to achieve sometimes. the credit goes to my bf for being a very ethical person with a lot of integrity and faith in himself and willingness to do hard work and be patient. if more people could do that a bit more maybe they could get more understanding from thier partners at these times.