In search of some advice please

[Alice]

Hi all

I'm a str8 woman married to a bi (possibly gay) man, although he won't open up and discuss his sexuality with me. We've been together 5 years and married 2 years ago. 3 months after the marriage I discovered he was emailing men and agreeing to meet up for sex. It didn't matter how much proof I had he always denied it. Until about 3 weeks ago I found so much proof he owned up and told me he had been emailing men, agreeing to meet but had never gone through with it. He said he was doing this to understand why he had had oral sex with another guy when he was young (late childhood/early teens).

He won't talk about it with me and refuses for us to go to counselling. I have been a member of this site for a long time to enable to me learn more and accept whatever situation may come my way and I would support him if he was bi and I have told him this. I love him to bits and he knows this too. He says he is straight but to be honest I think he may actually be gay. I don't like myself for doubting him but it's hard to believe him as he's being so secretive. I've tried every approach I can think of and feel that I need to know the truth.

My reasons for thinking he may be gay are that sex is always initiated by me and he shows barely any interest in me whatsoever. Sex is normally only once a week (initiated by me!) I'm feeling very unwanted right now.

Do any of you guys think I could be right? I'd love to hear your views on this. I think the site and the people are great.

Alice x

[CountryLover]

Blessings on you honey. Living/loving a man who can't figure out how to come out even to himself is a very very hard thing to do. Often times, they're the last ones to "know" and accept their alternative sexuality.

You don't mention how old he is, or his background? That can play a big part in how he will handle this. He's probably dealing with a lot of guilt, towards loving you and wanting to do right by you, according to societal standards - when his needs are drawing him a different direction.

Blessings on you for your love and patience,
Sara

[Tx46M]

My ex and the ladies I dated previous to her were all a bit bi or at least curious and all three fantasized about 2 or more guys "playing." I never really thought about it prior to age 30 when my girlfriend suggested it. Only acted on it once and most likely will never do it again. I hope it becomes something you can either work out or accept. Great relationships are all built somewhat on compromise. There are many women here in circumstances very similar to yours and I am sure you have found a great place to seek advice! Good luck & god bless!

:male: :2cents:

[Alice]

Thank you for your reply Countrylover. I really appreciate your kind words. He's 39, didn't have many girlfriends when growing up. I'm his 2nd wife and he has 3 children from his 1st marriage and I have 2 children from my 1st marriage. My first husband left me for another woman and had a baby with her whilst we were married so i've already had a traumatic divorce to deal with. I love my husband and I want us to be happy but I don't know how.

[Alice]

Thanks Tx46M. It's great to have your views on this. It means so much to me.

[WillowTree]

I just wanted to point out that his seemingly lack of interest sexually sounds more like guilt and confusion rather than sexual identity. I think that is probably why he will not consider counseling as well. I'm sure you've done alot of talking but that is the only suggestion I have. Keep talking and try to get him to agree to counseling with you. If you can offer no judgement, do so and stand by it. Tell him how you feel and how much you want to save your marriage. I'm sorry it's so tough right now. Good luck.

[costablanca]

The key to a good relationship is to talk, to LISTEN and honesty. Sometimes you are to embarrest or in total denial. You have to reach a certain mental age to start a different kind of thinking. It is around 40 give or take 5 years. You question old values and discarge some of them. You are only able to help you significant other as much as they permit. I know from own experience that this can be a verry hard piece of work and can take ages, but persistence, love and understanding leads mostly to your goal.

[rupertbare]

Well hi Alice!! You joined this site just before me but we've never met - so a big "hello" to you!!

I am giving no actual advice.

But will point you to three other regular site users that will be of an enormous help - I think it's an informal collective of str8 wives here on site.

crsakate; Mrs.F; 2fer's wife.

They all three wonderful woman and if you PM them and introduce yourself they will be more than happy to help because they have been there, are still there and are very caring.

With love and peace to you and yours

Rupe, London, UK :)

[PeterH]

Hi Alice,

I'm not really an expert in any of these things, and can't offer much in the way of advice, but I do know a few things, so here's my :2cents:

It is quite common for boys to have some sexual interaction with other boys when they're teens, and it doesn't mean they're gay.
Also, it's not uncommon for men to have a reduced sex for a prolonged period of time. This is often related to stress factors

So let's just assume your husband told you the truth:
He is really confused about it all, esp about his own sexual identity. it also seems that he is very embarrassed about that and that's why he won't talk to you about it. If you then went to counselling, this would mean (in his eyes) that he has to open up to you about some things he hasn't worked out for himself. I think that's hard for men to do. I always find it very hard to tell others that I feel uncertain about something. Perhaps it's a man's thing.

Would it be an alternative, if he went to some counselling himself, to find out what his sexual identity is, and come to terms with that?
It must be very hard for you to have to take the initiative everytime. If he took some counselling for himself and comes to terms with who he is, it might be easier for him to open up to you as well. Once you get talking, you can work on a solution for both of you.
Of course this whole thing is made more complicated by the emotions involved: his uncertainty about himself, your uncertainty about his feelings towards you, etc, etc. That makes talking about it extra hard.

I sincerely hope that you and your husband can work something out. And I also think Rupert's idea was very good: to talk to some women who've been through something similar themselves, and found ways of coping with it. I have talked with csraKate (crsaKate ??) and Mrs F myself, and can assure you that they are both really nice.
I wish you the very, very best,

, PeterH

[meteast chick]

I don't have any real advice for you Alice. I have been married for nearly 6 years and just recently told my husband it was probably a bigger issue for me than I had lead him to believe. I never thought I was lying or misleading him, but I felt horribly guilty when it came to light. I will tell you, having guilt, confusion or depression can also lead to not wanting sex. It seems you have tried and tried without any luck. All you can really do at this point is tell him how much you love him and so badly want him to be able to talk to you. Have you thought about how you'd respond if he said he was bi...or gay? If you have, and it's positive, tell him about it. He doesn't have to talk, but it could give him the initiative if he knew how you'd take it. Mrs F, csrakate and 2fer's wife would be great contacts regarding this issue. Mrs F's hubby is also on this site, so you really can get a wealth of information if you look for it.

I just want you to know that we all feel for you, Alice.
Good luck to you and your husband.
I hope it works out for both of you.

luv and kisses,
meteast

[2fer'swife]

(((((((((((Alice)))))))))))

Please feel free to come find me to discuss this at any time, I will PM you some links that may be useful. It isn't an easy road and the self-esteem questions are only one aspect. My husband and I will be married for eleven years as of Apr. 15th. I've known him to be bi for about nine years. I'll answer any questions you may have as best as I can.
Most of all welcome to this site! I came here, like you, for my husband, but I am here now for me.

P.

[Mrs.F]

(((((((((((((((((Alice))))))))))))))))))))

I think everything you have been doing is all you can do. Keep telling him you love him and will love him forever whether he is gay or bisexual. I think alot of what has been said to you already on here is true. He may be in total denial about the whole thing, very confused, feels guilty for feeling the way he does and possibly hurting you and it's leading to depression. It's a heavy load to carry around. I do think that HE needs to seek counseling before you seek it together. He needs to figure out his own feelings about himself before he can decide what his relationship is with you. Even though your married and have been together for some time...he needs time to figure things out for himself.

You are a wonderful person for trying to understand him and standing by him. I hope that things will turn around and he will open up to you. Good luck to you and your husband.

Contact me or hubby (Flounder1967) anytime.
Mrs.F :)

[DarkwaterUK]

Hi Alice xxxx

I'm new so please feel free to disregard what I am about to suggest, as may all of the readers here. Is it possible that your husband is dealing with or trying to deal with some past issues that may involve sexual abuse as a child?

Okay, I've held my finger over the 'submit reply' button for far too long.

Doug

[ambi53mm]

Hi Alice,

I think his actions could be interpreted in many different ways, but I wouldn’t necessarily come to the conclusion that he’s gay based on the information you’ve given.
Mid life is a time when many of us seem to go through many changes on many different levels. What a person says or does is all the information we ever have in trying to understand what’s going on inside but in reality, it’s only the tip of the iceberg.
The internet is changing our lives. It allows many men / women a safe way to discover and bring fantasies a small step closer to real life. I have received numerous letters from men wanting to meet and for the majority it goes no further than that. The fantasies fueled by a letter to some anonymous male creates a real enough situation because of it’s potential of bringing itself into reality. Cyber rooms aren’t much different in that respect. It could be that he really is exploring his sexuality because of childhood experiences that he’s carried throughout his life. They excite him and perhaps even confuse him. He may be trying to understand why.
For some men sexual drive begins to manifest itself in other ways than just sexual expression. It’s a powerful energy in all of us and sometimes we’ll channel it into other areas of our lives when needed. I try to find the balance between channeling my sexual energy into my work because I work in a very competitive and demanding field and in my marriage. You always hear about the coach telling his players not to engage in sex before the big game, or the boxer not to engage in sex before of the big fight. They want that energy channeled into the task at hand. For some of us..we work hard and we play hard…for others it’s work, work, work.
Thank God for vitamin V (Viagra) in my case I have no erectile dysfunction but it sure does give me the energy to work and play harder.
If he’s a good husband and provider in all other respects. Give him the opportunity to work his way through this phase of his life. My wife usually initiates the sex in our marriage and glad she does LOL...It’s not that I don’t enjoy initiating once in a while myself it’s just that unless she does, half the time it totally slips my mind. At 53 sometimes I’ve got sexual senility I forget how much I enjoy it until she reminds that I do :bigrin: .
Feeling wanted and feeling accepted sometimes go hand in hand. It seems ironic that sometimes it is easier to realize how much we really want someone when they are no longer there…and how little we pay attention to those around us because we assume they will always be there. I can sympathize with those feelings of loneliness and pray that they pass quickly for you. I believe Love is a pretty powerful energy in it’s own right and to Love unconditionally is the highest level of Love that any of us can hope to attain.

Ambi :)

[Mimi]

wow, you're in a really tough spot. it sounds like your husband is going through a lot of denial and confusion, and this must be incredibly draining and confusing for you. whether or not he's gay or bi, there are a lot of "unknowns" because he doesn't seem willing to face the truth. it also seems like he isn't willing to go to counseling, but there may be other ways you can "nudge" him. i know of a couple books which you might find helpful and which maybe you could "accidentally" leave laying around the house? ;)

Bi Men: Coming Out Every Which Way
Edited by Ron Jackson Suresha and Pete Chvany

Bisexuality in the Lives of Men: Facts and Fictions
Edited by Brett Beemyn and Erich W. Steinman

Coming Out Every Day : A Gay, Bisexual, and Questioning Man's Guide
by Bret K. Johnson, Ph.D.

i would also think about your own emotional and sexual needs in this situation. you also need to take care of yourself and not just focus on his issues. speaking as a therapist, i think perhaps you might want to consider counseling for yourself in order to cope with your marital issues.

i wish you the best of luck. :angel:

mimi :flag1:

[Alice]

(((((((( Thank you!!)))))))))))

Thank you all so very much. I really couldn't have coped without you all. I've been logging on to this site for a year now and been pretty quiet, just trying to broaden my mind to try and understand what's happening in my marriage and I discovered this wonderful community spirit and warmth that you all have for each other. It truly is wonderful and I can't thank you all enough for taking the time to reply to me and give me the insight that I need.

I'm really looking forward to getting to know you all better.

Love
Alice xxx

[Nisse]

Hello.

Gay or not gay... I only know that I was always afraid I might be gay, and was in denial of what I felt. So after every gay fantasy, I unknowingly-knowingly forgot all about them, until I had another, and another. So... the more i repressed the truth of my fantasies, the less hetero-fantasies I had, so I started getting really afraid I might be gay, so I started confronting my feelings. And after I came out to myself, and accepted what I was feeling, the hetero-fantasies started becoming more and more popular in my mind.
So, yes, this all happened in my mind, and I never really lived out my fantasies. But anyway, you could have it as an option, to tell him about my experience and say ,,you could reduce your'e gay longings if you accept them". That per se isn't such a good philosophy, but it could be a start.

Hope it helped.

Nisse.

[bipaganwriter]

i dont have any inspiring advise but i can say seeing a consoler helped me in so many areas of my life, you might sugest he see a consoler if he has had a lot of extera stress. some time having some one to talk to that you know wont pass judgment helps. you might ask him to sit down with you and look over this site WITH you, show him not just with words but by your actions that you love him no matter what.

i hope this helps
je

[pmg_ams01]

Alice,

Sorry you're having such a tough time at the moment - you know you're in the same position as many women who visit this site, I thought I'd share a few of my feelings as they may (or may not) give more of an insight into your husband's situation (as I'm in a fairly similar situation to him, married to a wife who's straight).

Clamming up...
Earlier on in this thread, the possibility of previous abuse was mentioned. I'm not discounting that, but for me it's much simpler - there's no easy way to say to someone you love that things are not right between you. For example, I have a recurring dream of seeing naked men in a shower room. That's the very last thing my wife wants to hear, so such things are not discussed. It could simply be in your case that your husband is not discussing things in order not to hurt you (in spite of the opposite effect his actions are having). Never underestimate the toughness (aka stupidity) of a male ego - the thought of counselling could be seen as an admission of weakness or he may not think it's warranted. It's also emotionally difficult for a man who has acted and lived a straight life to find an open and comfortable way of expressing any bi or gay tendencies. I have openly gay friends who are wonderful, but I do not identify with their lifestyle and culture (I feel very uncomfortable in gay bars and do not find myself attracted to a male displaying effeminite behaviour). That though leaves an awful chasm, where do I fit?? (and it's something I'm still struggling with).

Is he gay or bi? and the effect on your sexual relationship...
I find the sight of a male body arousing, more so sometimes than a female body (so that orientates me more towards gay), but I still dearly love my wife and wish that we could have a fulfilling sex life together as we have had in the past (so I must also be hetero - hence my eventual recognition of the "bi" label). I love the intimacy and bonding with her, but over the past few years sex between us just hasn't worked. This has started a vicious cycle of her feeling she doesn't stimulate me, in turn I feel rejected, and this spirals ever downwards. I can only think that you might need to explore his fantasies and urges more - that's the approach I'm hoping my wife will take. There could be other factors mentioned already - stress, financial worries, a whole host of things can turn a man off sex. Just make sure there's not an over-riding concern that is taking his thoughts and energies off his love-life with you, because unless they are resolved (or at least a start made), everything else could be an uphill battle.

Whether this "baring of my soul" (or rambling) has in any way helped, or given any insight into your/his situation, I've really no way of knowing. However, I know that other people having expressed their emotions and having explained their background to me through this site, it has been a great help. If you want to PM me, please feel free to do so.

Wishing you all the best,
Pete

[Driver 8]

Lots of people here are saying "your husband isn't necessarily gay," and they're right - but I would say he isn't necessarily bi, either. His disinterest in having sex with you is certainly typical of gay men who - for whatever reason - marry women.

I think his excuse that he's looking through the men-seeking-men personals - and quite possibly meeting guys for sex - so that he can understand something that happened many years ago is plain and simple bullshit. People who want to understand their past keep journals, or write poetry, or go to therapy.

There are certainly plenty of married bisexuals here, and women married to bi men - but, in general, I think the people you'll meet here are genuinely interested in their same-sex partners and want their marriages to work. I don't want to read too much into your post, but it doesn't sound like this describes your husband, at least not right now.

So in addition to whatever support you get here, I'd suggest that you look for some advice from women married to gay and bisexual men; you'll probably find some of them have experiences that differs from what people here have had.

I wish you every bit of luck with working things out.

[CountryLover]

A tough read...but you also might want to pick up a copy of

The Other Side of the Closet

I don't have it in front of me now, but it's compiled and edited by a psychologist who found herself dealing with inexplicable behavior in her husband who turned out to be bisexual. It's full of stories from women in your position.

It's a painful read. I'm not going to sugarcoat it for you. Trying to understand a man who is dealing with his own internal confusion and guilt, bucking societal norms and worrying about his marital and professional future...well, it's a tough place to be.

Please don't misunderstand me. I have spent the past 10 years in close friendship with a circle of bi married men. I've listened to them, held them when they cried, and done my best when asked to talk with the wives. I love my guys wholeheartedly. But I know that their wives, who are operating mostly in the dark, are in a lot of pain too.

I really admire you for your love and loyalty for your husband. I hope he comes to realize what a treasure that is.

Sara

[red_riding_hood_27]

Alice,
If you want to talk with me look me up anytime on Yahoo. My story is close to yours. My husband is the same as for as the sex goes. And is still is. I think on the scale he leans more toward the other side of the fense (sp). It has took him 6 months after admitting to me the Bi side that he is more attracted to men then women. For now we have left the door open for him if he wants to explore. As for me I am not feeling bad about myself anymore. Becuase it has nothing to do with me. I just don't have the body part he wants (lol). Also we have decided to give our marriage a try til one of us needs more. Honey, I wish there was a easy answer but there is not. Just be there for him and let him know you don't judge him. It takes awhile for you to get where you both can be open with each other.

Email me anytime.

Angela

[Newmexicanman]

Hi Alice!

I am a bisexual guy who is also has a degree in social work. I have a great deal of experience in assessment and in advocacy, as well as brokering for services for people.

First of all: The comments from people questioning your feeling that your husband may be gay are on the money. Being bisexual - and 'fessing up to it - is no easy mission. The feelings of guilt that come with it are enormous and profound. And, yes, those feelings of guilt can have an adverse affect on your sex life...

Your husband is difficult anough... He is going through whatever he is going through, but he is not really wanting to tell! That does not make it easy on you. BUT!!!! YOU are looking for answers, to the extent that you joined a bisexual site to learn more about it. Kudos to you!! So, the questions I would be asking first, would be questions of yourself, and from that you should find the necessary strategies you will need to get to the bottom (so to speak) of what your husband is going through. This will help you to find the right words and questions you need to gently pry him open.

Others in this forum can be of support, but advice is dependant upon relevance to your particular situation. Yes, counseling would be of benefit, but you may consider it for yourself at this stage, not for your husband. Counseling for you will help you sort out and prioritize your own feelings and needs. Counseling is not a good idea for anyone who is really resistant. Take it from me!!! I work with a lot of people who are undergoing court-ordered services, and they are NOT easy to work with!

All I can say is, I have a massive amount of respect for you and women and men like you, who stand by the women/men through this kind of thing. It asks a great deal of you in that it asks you to understand conceptes that are truly alien to you.

All the best...