What's Happened Here?

[Bisexual Explorer]

Folks,
It used to be that jokes, sex, and shared positive experiences were the usual forum topics. Now the topics are almost all negative or whinney. What's happened? Can we go back to the way it was?
g

[Long Duck Dong]

what happened...... mmm people posted.....

forums are like the seasons, you have good seasons and bad seasons...... we just had a bad season......

[FalconAngel]

We have periods of naught but funny and periods of heavy seriousness. Most of the time it has been a mix of both.

The pendulum swings and things change, like the seasons.

Get used to it, for it is not just the site, it is all things.

[12voltman59]

I know that people do need some diversions in life and maybe this site is that for some---but it is a community of sorts, so we do want to discuss some real world things too and sadly to say---there are a lot of "heavy things" going on in the world right now so that is going to spill in here.

We aren't all about "tales of woe" on here--like take a look at The Campfire thread---we do try to lighten it up on that thread----and as far as sex topics are concerned--feel free to start up a thread of your own or better yet----take some time to go through the backlog of posts---I am sure you can find a thread that deals with some sexual or other topic you might want to talk about-----post up something on it and we will talk about that too!!

I know that I am "guilty" of posting some heavy stuff--but then again--I post up on threads like "mythical creatures" sexual ones and on The Campfire too---so I have lots of interests and its all not heavy, make ya think too deeply stuff too!!

[bigbadmax]

I agree 12V.

many of the postings recently are not to provoke thought but to score points against other members, and possibly incite hate.

Life is harsh..but cant we play more?

keep smiling

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

We're workin on it, Darlin. :} That's why I've determined that we "Retake" our site and return it to some fun and laughter again. Life it too short for all of the doom and gloom bullsiht. If a person wants to be a degrading, insensitve, ignorant bully, then they can go do it elsewhere.
Enough is enough, and we've had up to here with their brand of Idjetness...lol
So please, feel free to add something fun and light-hearted, post something of interest to you, a concern, a question, ect. And by all means please join us at the Cmpfire..bring goodies and a sense of whacky imagination, we'd love to have you. :}
Cat, Camp Mischief-maker ;):bigrin::male::female:

[johnnyeasy]

what we need are more jokes......

ergo....

what is between a OLD womens breasts that is NOT between a young girls breasts?



Her belly button!!!

tee hee tee hee

[csrakate]

what we need are more jokes......

ergo....

what is between a OLD womens breasts that is NOT between a young girls breasts?



Her belly button!!!

tee hee tee hee

You never learn, Johnny...Didn't you learn ANYTHING that night I kicked your ass for this in chat????? LOL!!!! Don't say I didn't warn you...hehe.....

Seriously, I think all sites go through times where the atmosphere seems negative...and we've just had one of those times. Overall I think we do a pretty good job being a supportive site. It's just that sometimes personalities clash and things get heated....and of course, the old troll comes back to incite more mischief....

I think that since the OP has brought this up, we should all make an effort to lighten up....and I promise NOT to kick johnnyeasy's ass once more for that joke as an effort to start things off in a positive way! LOL!

[dafydd]

Folks,
It used to be that jokes, sex, and shared positive experiences were the usual forum topics. Now the topics are almost all negative or whinney. What's happened? Can we go back to the way it was?
g


Aren't you whining too?
Why don't you start the positivity my friend?
Reminds me of that Monty Python sketch: I'd like to complain about people who complain.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfzLyPqko8w

d

[bigbadmax]

just for you flange lovers lol


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beCYGm1vMJ0

phil

[tenni]

"Aren't you whining too?"

Very good point daffy:bigrin:

I personally enjoy the more debate style and thought provoking threads while others may find them negative...I don't see them that way. Some may value the nuturing support of some threads. Some may want to talk about their pets or post jokes threads in the sense of keeping it light and silly. Why someone believes that they have the "right" to take the site back is perhaps one of the problems? The site will be what the participants make it.

As someone posted if you don't like a thread, start your own thread. Don't go on the thread that you don't like and complain or try to negate in a dismissive way what is being discussed. Some like to discuss and debate seriously and what one person may see as negative is not seen that way by another. Someone going into that thread and making light of things to "break the tension" may just be as disturbingly rude as how some others see that thread's content itself.

Name calling on the other hand........ well not something to aim for. I agree on that.;)

[bimyself4now]

What did the gay :rolleyes: gynecologist say? "I just hate my job!" :bigrin:

[rdy2go]

If a cardiologist gets a heart shaped tomb, and a gynecoligist gets a vagina shaped tomb after they pass on.... What shape tomb does a proctologist get?

[Canticle]

"Aren't you whining too?"

Very good point daffy:bigrin:

I personally enjoy the more debate style and thought provoking threads while others may find them negative...I don't see them that way. Some may value the nuturing support of some threads. Some may want to talk about their pets or post jokes threads in the sense of keeping it light and silly. Why someone believes that they have the "right" to take the site back is perhaps one of the problems? The site will be what the participants make it.

As someone posted if you don't like a thread, start your own thread. Don't go on the thread that you don't like and complain or try to negate in a dismissive way what is being discussed. Some like to discuss and debate seriously and what one person may see as negative is not seen that way by another. Someone going into that thread and making light of things to "break the tension" may just be as disturbingly rude as how some others see that thread's content itself.

Name calling on the other hand........ well not something to aim for. I agree on that.;)

I agree with you here tenni...100%. I had prepared a post of my own....but on second thoughts, decided that it would not be wise to post it. You've sort of said what I was going to say......though not as long as mine.

But, spot on.

[Canticle]

If a cardiologist gets a heart shaped tomb, and a gynecoligist gets a vagina shaped tomb after they pass on.... What shape tomb does a proctologist get?

Heck...what is a proctologist?????

[Canticle]

What did the gay :rolleyes: gynecologist say? "I just hate my job!" :bigrin:


Hmmmmm.......baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad....lol!

[Miehm]

How many emo kids does it take to screw in a light bulb?

None. They just sit in the dark and cry.

How many bondage fetishists does it take to screw in a light bulb?

Just two, but it takes a really big lightbulb, three tubes of KY, and about twenty pounds of leather. And somebody still gets spanked for being bad...

[Miehm]

Heck...what is a proctologist?????

Pretty sure it's the poop-chute doctor.

[dafydd]

"Aren't you whining too?"

Very good point daffy:bigrin:

I personally enjoy the more debate style and thought provoking threads while others may find them negative...I don't see them that way. Some may value the nuturing support of some threads. Some may want to talk about their pets or post jokes threads in the sense of keeping it light and silly. Why someone believes that they have the "right" to take the site back is perhaps one of the problems? The site will be what the participants make it.

As someone posted if you don't like a thread, start your own thread. Don't go on the thread that you don't like and complain or try to negate in a dismissive way what is being discussed. Some like to discuss and debate seriously and what one person may see as negative is not seen that way by another. Someone going into that thread and making light of things to "break the tension" may just be as disturbingly rude as how some others see that thread's content itself.

Name calling on the other hand........ well not something to aim for. I agree on that.;)

yeah and personally i'd rather share problems to get advice here as it is such a supportive community with a lot of kindness. I prefer those posts too another "Do you like to swallow semen and snort it through your nose?" type polls/threads.
Trolls go hand in hand with the online forum experience. just ignore 'em.

d:bigrin: a smiley cos i feel better today and move tomorrow to my new flat! pictures soon

[darkeyes]

yeah and personally i'd rather share problems to get advice here as it is such a supportive community with a lot of kindness. I prefer those posts too another "Do you like to swallow semen and snort it through your nose?" type polls/threads.
Trolls go hand in hand with the online forum experience. just ignore 'em.

d:bigrin: a smiley cos i feel better today and move tomorrow to my new flat! pictures soon

aahhh.. the sukkin n fukkin threads daffy.. doncha jus luff 'em?? Threads wich tell us nowt, help or tell ne 1 bout wot bisexuality, or homosexuality is.. dus say a lot 'bout the posters tho.. an thats hardly encouragin..:(

..sum 1 1ce called me a snob bout me attitude ther.. thats ok.. don mind.. propa sex threads r 1 thing.. dross an trivia summat else.. but jus prefer 2 hav discussions bout summat wich is important, ratha than gettin peeps off...

[tenni]

Yep, you're a snob darkeyes but the sweetest one and so that seems ok with me:bigrin:

Daffy
"Trolls go hand in hand with the online forum experience. just ignore 'em."

I agree with the part about "ignore them" but not about the part of labelling (posting) someone a "troll" because they want to discuss something that you do not. I've seen such labelling posts on this site far more than any other site....of course I've not been on a lot of sites though. It may be a fine line distinguishing a differing view from insulting others for holding a differing view.... a very fine line at times and not always clear. Lately, I have found my own attenae go up when I read someone's post. There was something that made me suspect that the new poster might be ...well you know lol I've waited until they posted more often. I suppose a lot of us may do that? I think that they just have a differing view. I feel really wierd when someone who has agreed with me then gets booted. :eek: Does that mean that I'm a troll?...gee...hmmm....ya tenni must be a troll if X poster got booted and the two of them seem to agree on a point. (hypothetical comment of course....) Of course, as an artist, I'm accustomed to having differing views from the mainstream.

[csrakate]

Tenni,
Most of us label someone a "troll" when they post threads insulting others...there have been many threads when this individual has denounced members of this site with words like "fat, obese, redneck, closeted, fag hag"..just to name a few and I am sorry...this isn't a matter of differing opinions...this is just an out and out blatant display of disrespect for another member. It has NOTHING to do with political views or religious outlooks or a difference of opinion...it's name calling and an effort to malign another individual.

[tenni]

Well, I know Kate that is the way that it should be. Name calling is not good and against the rules. I'm just not sure that it means troll though. I"ve seen some "well known" posters name call and we all ignore it because well..we may agree with them on the point where they lose their manners. I'm not denying that there may be "someone" who keeps coming on this site to personally attack a "regular" or all bisexuals in some cases. I believe that some are too quick drawish. I catch it happening to me. Then of course I feel like crap when some new poster agrees with me on a topic only to get booted. It is really strange..lol I think that at times that it is a myth that this site is supportive. At times,it seems to me that if you present yourself as submissive and needy that you get support. It is selectively supportive. There is pressure to conform to the "way that this site should be" attitude.

[darkeyes]

You're kidding right? Let me borrow those rose coloured glasses so I can see what you see.

Thanks, tenni for putting things so well.

Sweetie.. you wouldn't know whether this site is supportive or not.. so whether Tenni put it well or not is something you wouldnt be able to discern... just an observation hun, since so far all youve done is snipe and never made to my knowledge one decent and constructive contribution yet... and as a sniper your aim isn't very good.. the army wouldn't have you.. 'cos you haven't got near the target yet.. even allowing for being an awful sniper, by the law of averages you should have managed to get within 50' of the barn door long before now...

[csrakate]

Tenni,

I am sure some have been labeled that shouldn't be...it happens...but when you've got a situation where the same person comes back and continually targets the same people, it tends to make one rather antsy. This person (or persons for that matter...who knows) makes attempts to cause controversy by bringing up touchy subjects over and over again...KNOWING full well what it will start off and they also private message the same people letting know that they have returned...so yeah...we do at times jump on the troll bandwagon...guess we're gun shy and skittish after so many recent attacks.

BUT...while we're at it...let me address something in this same area that you have commented on in regards to diverting topics of a thread. I explained to you what happened during this most recent mess....it had nothing to do with a difference of opinion...it had to do with hurt feelings that resulted in a lashing out against a group that differed with the opinion of another. Because this person couldn't find support for her accusations against another, because some of us denounced her methods of accusing this person, she found it necessary to start a thread that claimed that we were anti equal rights.....and yes....this thread turned into a "party" mentality....in an effort to diffuse the ridiculous accusation and to not give credence to such an absurd proclamation. All you seem to focus on is the fact that the subject of said thread was diverted to a party...you seem to forget that this new thread was started in the first place because Drew LOCKED the original thread....thereby making it difficult for this individual to continue their tirade. The "party" was not an effort to take "control" of this site....it was simply an effort to lighten the mood and it was a play on words. I must say I don't particularly agree with this method...but knowing the people involved, I understand why they did it. In the meantime, one of this disgruntled member's "supporters" has deemed it necessary to continue on with the accusations against her target by posting swipes at LDD in threads that have nothing to do with him or his opinions....and THAT is an example of posting in a thread that diverts it from a most important topic...(please see the thread regarding the "another black trans death")

I know we won't all agree...I know there will be topics that will get heated...but it is NEVER OK to name call and it is NEVER OK to make statements about people that are untrue and unfounded.

[tenni]

Thanks Kate. I am still a bit confused about that situation and don't really want to re open that. I do see your point but...

".it was simply an effort to lighten the mood and it was a play on words. I must say I don't particularly agree with this method...but knowing the people involved, I understand why they did it. In the meantime, one of this disgruntled member's "supporters" has deemed it necessary to continue on with the accusations against her target by posting swipes"

I believe that no one has the "right" to be placed in a "judge" situation as to when a thread needs to lighten up. As I pointed out, when someone does that in a thread, I find it offensive and in particular if I am in what I consider an interesting debate..even if our wheels fall off for a wee bit:( Personally, I don't go into a thread (so I've learned to do) if I think that it is a silly, having fun, thread. I might read a "joke" thread though (for the person who posted once that I have a stick up my ass..lol). It would be no more proper for me to go into a "joke" or "light silliness thead" and begin to complain about them being idiots and fools as it is for another poster to enter a debate thread that is getting hot and offering them a drink to calm them down. I'm not sure about the disgruntled member "supporters" scenario. I'm way out in right field in not being able to comprehend it. The only thing is determining if a statement is unfounded or untrue versus opinion. I guess if someone posts something as a "fact" rather than "my opinion" ...dunno. Accusations are bad...sometimes?

[darkeyes]

Yep, you're a snob darkeyes but the sweetest one and so that seems ok with me:bigrin:



*scowls*

*breaks in2 hoots a laffter*

Cheeky sod!!

*blows kissie*

[csrakate]

I believe that no one has the "right" to be placed in a "judge" situation as to when a thread needs to lighten up. As I pointed out, when someone does that in a thread, I find it offensive and in particular if I am in what I consider an interesting debate..even if our wheels fall off for a wee bit
But Tenni....there was NOTHING to debate in that thread...a group of us were being accused of something that was so ridiculous and so unfounded and sooo out in left field...What was to be discussed???? And I must point out that the levity was started by some of the "accused"...so if that is how they wished to defend themselves, so be it. When someone starts a thread that maligns a group of people, there is no debate...it is THEIR opinion....Not to mention that the OP of that thread herself said..."i'm not looking for replies to this so do not bother as i will not respond to them." Was that an invitation to debate...I think not...she herself had declared a verdict and no debate was necessary in her mind.

I hope you understand where I am coming from, Tenni...this was not a case of squashing a debate as there never was an invitation to debate...it was just a soap box to accuse a group of people of something...a group, I might add, who could no more agree on a single topic if they tried, much less find a way to be a united front to undermine the equal rights of others LOL!

And yes...I think accusations are bad..especially when they are not supported by facts. Having an opinion is one thing, but having an opinion about another person, especially a person on this site and stating that opinion as fact, is wrong. That is not what the forum is meant to support.

[tenni]

Sweet Kate
When I write that no one has the "right" to act as a judge to post unrelated comments to lighten up a debate, I am not referring to the thread that you mentioned. This type of behaviour was used by more than one poster on more than one thread.

[csrakate]

Sweet Kate
When I write that no one has the "right" to act as a judge to post unrelated comments to lighten up a debate, I am not referring to the thread that you mentioned. This type of behaviour was used by more than one poster on more than one thread.

You are right, Tenni..it does happen....and I see now that you were not necessarily referring to that thread.

[Canticle]

But Tenni....there was NOTHING to debate in that thread...a group of us were being accused of something that was so ridiculous and so unfounded and sooo out in left field...What was to be discussed???? And I must point out that the levity was started by some of the "accused"...so if that is how they wished to defend themselves, so be it. When someone starts a thread that maligns a group of people, there is no debate...it is THEIR opinion....Not to mention that the OP of that thread herself said..."i'm not looking for replies to this so do not bother as i will not respond to them." Was that an invitation to debate...I think not...she herself had declared a verdict and no debate was necessary in her mind.

I hope you understand where I am coming from, Tenni...this was not a case of squashing a debate as there never was an invitation to debate...it was just a soap box to accuse a group of people of something...a group, I might add, who could no more agree on a single topic if they tried, much less find a way to be a united front to undermine the equal rights of others LOL!

And yes...I think accusations are bad..especially when they are not supported by facts. Having an opinion is one thing, but having an opinion about another person, especially a person on this site and stating that opinion as fact, is wrong. That is not what the forum is meant to support.

You are an intelligent lady Kate and I respect that. There are times, when I will agree with what you say, but more often, than not, time when I will not agree. No matter, for this is how things should be, We do not live in a ''cosy by the fireside,'' world and if people did not disagree......on occasion, have major arguments, humankind would never have/ will never move(d) forward, in any manner.

I think that you are wrong about a certain thread. Just because the OP was not intent on entering into any form of debate, it does not mean that there was no debate to take place. One person's comment, can begin a fascinating and intellectually rewarding discussion.

I cannot see how the OP formed the views she had, but nevertheless, she did. Certainly, as you have said, these accusations, were not based upon any concrete fact. The way people post, can make the message come over as clear, or fuzzy. This is why one should try to construct a post, very carefully, so that it can be understood.

I would always defend a person, if I thought that they were being insulted, called names etc. That is my way. The way I was raised. Insults are not good. Yet, I have, at times, been insulted and the person doing the insulting, has received the support, not I. This worries me not....but it makes me concerned for others, the people who do not come to the defence of another. Maybe that is because I am the kind of person, who would give my life to see that people live, worship, etc how they want to...even if I, personally, may have resrvations, about certain things.

I think I may have gone off at a slight tangent....I apologise....but I think I said what I wanted to say.

I'm now going to post the post I was composing, but then decided not to post, for fear that I may end up suffering the same fate as others. The post has been written, from a mainly neutral standpoint, so I would ask people not to clamour to the defence of any one person, for the post is meant for the ''many,'' not the ''few.'' Unless one takes an on line ''friendship,'' away from the computer screen and makes it as three dimensional as possible (and I speak as a person, who has always corresponded with people), then a line of type, a profile and an on line persona, is what the other person remains. This being no insult to individuals, but how I, as a seasoned correspondent, see things. And, Yes......it's a long post......I'm a wordy person...by nature.

[Canticle]

We're workin on it, Darlin. :} That's why I've determined that we "Retake" our site and return it to some fun and laughter again. Life it too short for all of the doom and gloom bullsiht. If a person wants to be a degrading, insensitve, ignorant bully, then they can go do it elsewhere.
Enough is enough, and we've had up to here with their brand of Idjetness...lol
So please, feel free to add something fun and light-hearted, post something of interest to you, a concern, a question, ect. And by all means please join us at the Cmpfire..bring goodies and a sense of whacky imagination, we'd love to have you. :}
Cat, Camp Mischief-maker ;):bigrin::male::female:


‘’We're workin on it, Darlin. :}’’

One could ask, who, are the ‘’we,’’ for in the campsite thread, which you opened, it seems to have been the same people posting over and over again. Now, there is nothing at all wrong with that, but if those people are the ‘’we,’’ then they represent a small percentage of the total membership, of this site, even though, they may be some of the people who post, in the forum, on a regular basis. It has to be remembered that any member, may suddenly decide to post in a thread. So, if there is a ‘’we,’’ then it cannot be said to represent the entire membership of the site.

‘’That’s why I've determined that we "Retake" our site’’

Did someone appoint you to some leadership post? Were you elected by a free and democratic vote? Surely it is no more your place, to return a site, to how it may once have been, than it is the place, of any other member. I would suggest that all members are equal. No one person, more important than any another. If some members were paying a membership fee, this might be quite different, but as this is a free site, all should be equal. No one person has the right to say that the ‘’we,’’ are going to ‘’Retake’’ our site.’’

‘’return it to some fun and laughter again.’’

I would have thought, there were plenty of ‘’fun and laughter,’’ threads being opened, without it being needful, to frown upon any slightly more serious discussions and any intellectual discourse. After all, if one doesn’t like a thread, one does not have to read it, or comment upon it.

‘’Life it too short for all of the doom and gloom bullsiht.’’

What is all the doom and gloom and why is it bullshit? Is this your personal opinion? The opinion of just a few regular contributors to the forum, or has the entire site membership, been consulted, their views upon the matter, asked, the information collated, percentages worked out, as to who thinks this, who thinks that and who has no opinion, either way, tables and graphs produced?

What may be doom and gloom bullshit to you, because it does not interest you, may be of great interest and importance to others.

By the way, life is also too short, to have no intellectual discussion and/or banter and interests in the finer things in life, such as art, history, politics, religion, spirituality etc, etc, etc. Our interests are what make us who we are, as individuals.

‘’If a person wants to be a degrading, insensitve, ignorant bully, then they can go do it elsewhere.’’

Who would these people be? Those people, who do not agree with you, or others and do not post in a certain manner? Would these people be the many ‘’trolls,’’ that the site goes so crazy about every few weeks? I have stated my personal opinion, before. I will never call a person, a ‘’troll.’’ If someone makes a valid comment and it deserves a reply, in the positive, or the negative, I shall make such a reply. If not, I will ignore them.

Why do you have to be so defensive and then point the finger…the collective finger and shout ‘’troll.’’ It has been my experience, in life that very often, those who cause us problems and do so anonymously, can be found much closer to home, than one might think. People, who we would never imagine, could say or do hurtful things and at different times, we can all be capable of behaving badly.

BretLA disappears, his profile still intact, but all his posts erased, making a mockery of any posts, made by other members and addressed to him. He may have said things that certain people did not like, but he made many valid points, many very intelligent points. I most certainly did not like everything, which he posted……but he has been eradicated. That is not right, or fair.

A certain member upset a lot of people by saying that certain individuals, were anti the equal rights of LGBT persons. Now, that member obviously had her reasons, and I do not know if any of her views were correct, or not. She saw things from her perspective and it did seem a view that could not be penetrated and a discussion started…..that she had a force field protecting it, but they were her views, nonetheless.

I am not sure why you decided to open a thread about the private message exchange between you and that person. On most chat sites/forums, there is an unwritten rule, of the privacy of pm, unless something extremely insulting/threatening is posted. People send private messages, for the privacy and sanctuary, of that communication. You chose snippets of those messages and posted them in a thread and garnered sympathy.

Later the other correspondent posted what, she said, were the full messages, which gave a very different tone to the communication. None of the people, who has tut-tuttered and sympathised with you, about the snippets you posted, made any comment at all, about what the other person claimed, was the full message from you.

I ask them…..Why not??? For if those were indeed, your messages, then they were not at all nice and that was not the first time you have used the receipt of a private message, for the excuse to open a thread. Thankfully, this particular thread, died a death.

I will add, that rudeness and insults are wrong and totally unnecessary, although it sometimes seems to work on a one way system. Also, what some may call rudeness or an insult, others may cal ''telling the truth.''

‘’Enough is enough, and we've had up to here with their brand of Idjetness...lol’’

You refer to some other people as degrading, insensitive, ignorant bullies….and yet, time after time; you will call people idiots, morons, assholes, troublemakers etc. In one thread you had the temerity to say, that the posts were too long and you commented on a post I made, not long ago, by saying that the ‘’three personas,’’ were there to seen, in one post. What is that, if it is not insulting? I asked you to explain what you meant by three personae, but you did not come back with any answer. That told me, you did not have one.

I have asked you who the morons, idiots, assholes and troublemakers were, on another occasion, but again, no answer was forthcoming. Why say something, if you cannot give a reason for the comment.

‘’So please, feel free to add something fun and light-hearted, post something of interest to you, a concern, a question, etc.’’

Here, I do believe you contradict yourself. Why else would someone open a thread….unless it was to post something they felt, was fun and light hearted, of interest, or concern to them, as an individual, or to ask a question….or, on the negative side, of things, to open a thread, which that person knows, will stir up strong feelings and possibly lead, to insults and accusations being thrown about. No one can know what is going on within another’s mind, or how different things inspire, amuse, insult or offend an individual.

As I have stated before, freedom of speech and freedom of expression, of our hopes, thoughts, dreams and personal opinions, are paramount. If we do not have those freedoms, we have nothing at all. Therefore, as I see it, nothing is gained by erasing a person’s posts, except to make sure others cannot read views, which ‘some,’’ may not like. Shut people up and it says nothing about the rest of society, which is why so many people, have fought for freedom, in many different ways.

There are many good people upon this site…that’s why I come here now…to chat to them, or make some form of contribution to the forum. I don’t come to talk to people, because of their sexuality, but because they are good people.

What you call doom and gloom, is not bullshit. It’s real life. Real life means what is going on in the world, whether that is happy or sad, triumph or disaster, just or unjust, fun or misery. It’s life.

Nothing has gone wrong with this site. It’s changing, evolving and that happens with everything, on line, or off.



Love and light. C

[Canticle]

The OP and other's views were formed by the very content of LDD's posts and Twyla's defence of LDD. The proof is readable in his posts if one has the comprehension level to figure it out. They were based on concrete fact as each word of LDD's posts was the pouring of that concrete. Read his posts, figure out what he is REALLY saying and you will see he is duplicitious on the subject of the Miss. school board and equal rights. As the OP was not the only one to see this, (include falconangel, tenni and myself in this group) there is some basis of fact to what we are claiming.

Gee.....I must be dumb, then, because I have never seen any such outpourings.

[Hephaestion]

In biology, the stomadeum is the mouth and the proctodeum is the bumhole or arsehole

A proctologist is an arsehole doctor
A local estate agent is called Proctor. I wonder why that came to be?

.

[Canticle]

In biology, the stomadeum is the mouth and the proctodeum is the bumhole or arsehole

A proctologist is an arsehole doctor
A local estate agent is called Proctor. I wonder why that came to be?

.

Thank you Heph......I could have looked it up......I just couldn't be arsed....lol.

PS. Rectum and anus would have done just as well.....even anal fissure and the surrounding area of the perineum.....:bigrin:

Estate agents.....too many of those about.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

Tenni stated: When I write that no one has the "right" to act as a judge to post unrelated comments to lighten up a debate, I am not referring to the thread that you mentioned. This type of behaviour was used by more than one poster on more than one thread.

Then doesnt this give you a clue BiCD4u, that people are tired of all of the negitivity and doom and gllom all of the time? Normal, respectable debate is a healty thing, and a good venue..but what certain individuals are/were doing was going overboard on the subjects. Its as simple as that. It happened, its done and over with. One to bigger, brighter, and better things. :} And that light hearted approach doesnt appeal to you, then bless yer lil heart and have a nice day..:}
Making nice Cat.

[Long Duck Dong]

The OP and other's views were formed by the very content of LDD's posts and Twyla's defence of LDD. The proof is readable in his posts if one has the comprehension level to figure it out. They were based on concrete fact as each word of LDD's posts was the pouring of that concrete. Read his posts, figure out what he is REALLY saying and you will see he is duplicitious on the subject of the Miss. school board and equal rights. As the OP was not the only one to see this, (include falconangel, tenni and myself in this group) there is some basis of fact to what we are claiming.

ok, generally, I just ignore people that are really doing nothing other than making themselves looking bad..... but just for you bicd4u..... I will make a compromise

my views are multi sided, not one...... I look at all sides of a issue as best as possible and present all sides.....not just my own....I also present sides I do not agree with.......
if that makes me wrong, GOOD..... I would rather be wrong and look at all sides, than right for being blind to anything other than my own point of view....

btw, ..... I said you are acting like a ass.......... and unless things have changed drastically.... I am still living in a country that has given the LGBT full rights...... and if I was so anti lgbt like is claimed, don't you think I would have moved to the US ????? instead of enjoying a free country.....???

now I will offer a open apology to the people of the usa, as many of them are fighting for the same rights, I enjoy in nz.... and as i have stated a number of times, I am praying like hell, they get to enjoy those rights too.....
and bicd4u.... you are a canadian citizen .... so yes... the same applies to you, you deserve rights too......

but I have a lil suggestion for you.... and that is that you sit back and realise that going after me in a forum is not helping advance the lgbt rights in your country and its not really doing you any favours either.....
people are more than capable of pulling me up when I get out of hand, in the same way they are going after a few others for making remarks and statements that are really uncalled for..........and people are more than capable of deciding for themselves, who is doing what.....

you, my dear sir.... are still acting like a ass and fighting with members of the lgbt and I am still not gonna be one sided or blinded to all sides of a issue and I will continue to fight for the rights of the lgbt in the usa as best I can....
so i would say that we have reached a impasse..... you think I am wrong... I am happy to be wrong in your eyes....

now if you will excuse me, I need to ring a couple of my happily married lgbt friends to make arrangements for the anzac day on sunday as we are meeting a couple of german and us vets for the anzac ceremonies...... god bless their souls and hearts, the serving and the fallen.....

lest we forget those that died so we have the freedom we have today....

[TwylaTwobits]

You know where I come from if it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, swims like a duck, it's a duck and more than likely dinner :) So I guess the same could apply to an ass......braying is all I hear.

I was accused of being antiLGBT because omg I remember there are other people on this planet other than LGBT. There are threads on this board right now that prove certain points. It's better to have equal rights for all than to have a part of society that is set apart. Look at the softball team thread... a gay softball team kicking off bi members for not being gay enough. Everyone pushes for equal rights but then demands to be kept apart......something that just doesn't work. We are one race: Human. I believe we should all have the right to marry and divorce whoever we choose. I do not believe that anyone should be treated as special or be given certain things that are not available to all people. And I further believe that sometimes you can call a bi man who crossdresses an ass and have it be about his attitude and behaviour and not about his sexual preferences at all.

[Canticle]

Twyla and LDD......sensible words.

[dafydd]

I'm trying desperately to follow this thread but have no clue what anyone is talking about. I'll just park this one.

d

[Bluebiyou]

Folks,
It used to be that jokes, sex, and shared positive experiences were the usual forum topics. Now the topics are almost all negative or whinney. What's happened? Can we go back to the way it was?
g
:) GSP, it looks like you've been here a little less than a year.
There are those who've only just begun the road to self discovery of bisexuality and what it means for others and themselves. The self discovery threads are full of the appropriate support.
There are folks trying to and frustrated with hooking up on this site.
There have been times where nearly every thread was filled with two or more people who really disliked each other and each post was a savage defense/counterattack.
Other posts where people not just flamed others (sometimes happens to the best of us) but felt so strongly as to threaten to break wrists.

You've got it all here.
If you don't like the fighting in a particular topic, don't read the topic.
Some things aren't worth fighting about, some things are.
I don't think this site caters exclusively to any one, in any singular position.

I'm trying desperately to follow this thread but have no clue what anyone is talking about. I'll just park this one.

d
dafydd, I think some of this is regarding Jeannie's recent thread. Other's are residual from other hot topix.
There are all sorts of folks making the same mistake - that this site is a great place to come vent their spleen (express abusive anger); which it really isn't.
Having done that a bit too much myself, I should not point fingers.

[darkeyes]

I just find it totally pathetic that a community that calls itself so supportive of others and claims to allow everyone free speech, contains some long standing members who are quick to tell others not to speak or how they should speak. It is totally hypocritical but surely proves everything jeannie was arguing about in her posts. They don't want name calling, but they themselves do the name calling, and in some cases, they even started the name calling. They don't want to be mocked, but they feel perfectly comfortable mocking others and even blatantly claim the right to do so.

Yup, equal rights for all so long as ya'll agree to go along with "the clique's" idea of equal rights. If you disagree with them, be prepared to be ostrasized.

Ho hum.. u say whatya like.. but ya dus go on so, an snipe away wivout eva sayin a word wich means owt.. no is tryin 2 stopya.. we jus ask thatya think summat sensible to say instead a gripin bout things all the time.. an 2 think in Oz they call Brits "Whingin Poms".. we hav nowt on u babes...

Wotya havta realise..wenya slag peeps off an talk shite..expect 2 get shite heaped back onya from gr8 height... its the way a the world babes... :)

[MarieDelta]

I just find it totally pathetic that a community that calls itself so supportive of others and claims to allow everyone free speech, contains some long standing members who are quick to tell others not to speak or how they should speak. It is totally hypocritical but surely proves everything jeannie was arguing about in her posts. They don't want name calling, but they themselves do the name calling, and in some cases, they even started the name calling. They don't want to be mocked, but they feel perfectly comfortable mocking others and even blatantly claim the right to do so.

Yup, equal rights for all so long as ya'll agree to go along with "the clique's" idea of equal rights. If you disagree with them, be prepared to be ostrasized.

1. We arent the only Bi website.

2. "Its a wild world baby, it's hard to get by just upon a smile." - Cat Stevens

3. If we are so horrible, why do you continue to hang around us? Obviously you dont hope to convert us, but only to castigate us.

4. This site is run only by people , with all of our human foibles, we try to do our best. However when somene attacks, we are more than likely to attack back.

5. Misunderstandings happen to the best of friends, sometimes, and it's best, to give folks the bennefit of the doubt.

6. To see a conspiracy here, requires great immagination, if you know us. Something which, amongst the posters who are leveling that accusation don't/didn't take time to do.

7. Assumptions make us all look like fools. Jumping to a conclusion is the only excercise some folks get.


Just all my own opinion , of course.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

BiCD4u..Bless yer lil heart Hon. HAND..have a nice day. :}
Cat

[darkeyes]

BiCD4u..Bless yer lil heart Hon. HAND..have a nice day. :}
Cat

Hahahahahahahaha... thats brill Cat.... will havta memba that 1 for summa the cheeky lesser sods me hasta put up wiv ova 'ere!!!

[Canticle]

It's so wonderful to see someone actually stand up to Cat with such a poignant and valid rebuttle. I just had to quote it in its entirety. Well done canticle, this is exactly what jeannie and I and a few others have been trying to point out. Your eloquence is brilliant. It is a long post worth the read!

Thank you for the compliment. I do try to use the Queen's English, to the best of my ability.

However, please do not align me, with any particular faction. I am not favouring either side, for I have absolutely no doubts, from what I have read, that LDD is for and would, fight for the equal rights of all human beings. Equal rights for all...every person upon the planet, not ignoring one section of humanity, in preference over another.

To me, it does not matter who has made any particular post, names not being the most important thing. I will answer any post, as I see fit, and I will answer the content, referring, if necessary, to other points the same poster, may have made.....but for what has been posted, NOT for whom the person posting, may be.

So please do not see this post of mine, as a chance to take another swipe at people. I defend where I feel defence is required and attack, in a defensive manner, when that is also needed. I would defend anyone upon this site, if I felt there was a need and it would not matter, what disagreements, likes or dislikes I might have. That is me. That is how I was made. I'm not perfect and would never claim to be, but I am a good friend and never desert anyone I may care about and I always keep a confidence.

Just do not make the mistake of seeing me as an ally, in the area you feel disgruntled about. This Lioness does not take kindly, to being used.

If I post something, which ever point of view, I may favour, any ideas and views, will be my own. I am not known for running with the flock...never have been. I guess that is how I was raised. One should fight for right, even if one may not agree with individuals, or groups.

I'm an individual, my thoughts not influenced by others, but by what I observe around me, which some may say, means I am influenced by others. I would disagree.

[tenni]

Canticle
I think that you wrote an extremely well written piece. I agree with some of the things that you wrote but somehow I was left with a bit of tenseness in my stomach. I have a few things going on this week and I know that may also be partially connected. I love debate and well expressed intelligent thoughts. This may seem strange but I like peaceful times on here as well. I know that some of us post way more than others. We can set a tone one way or the other. I'm left a bit confused as I already posted when I agree with some posters that others are disparaging. I can also see that each side may go overboard at times. Just because you present yourself as a sweetie doesn't mean that you should be able to get away with nastiness covered in sugar. It still is shit underneath. Yet, some people have that skill to do just that. Others are more truthsayers without the varnish to give a thought a gleaming surface of propriety. Maybe, some of us need to remember the Golden Rule a bit more..the varnish and sugar...well...not sure that it really helps the communication all the time.

[TwylaTwobits]

Tenni, I agree with the point of your post. You can take the finest manure, place it on the oven fresh bun, add your favorite condiment, lettuce and tomatoes and onions and whatever else your heart desires. Put it all together and it looks great but at the end...it's still a shit sandwich. At some point in time people on here may agree with someone or disagree but debate it intelligently rather than running off slamming people and then slamming others for daring not to agree with your slamming of them. (By the "your and you at any point after my first sentence I mean collectively every poster on this board myself included). And further there is a time for letting go, it does no good to nurse a grudge especially one grounded in nothing more than the wild accusations of someone else.

Personally, I'd rather debate on an intellectual level than be sucked into the religious minefield that crops up every once in a while on this board. The history posts were pure genius to me as well as a chance to see what parts of history we never were taught here in the States.

[Canticle]

Ho hum.. u say whatya like.. but ya dus go on so, an snipe away wivout eva sayin a word wich means owt.. no is tryin 2 stopya.. we jus ask thatya think summat sensible to say instead a gripin bout things all the time.. an 2 think in Oz they call Brits "Whingin Poms".. we hav nowt on u babes...

Wotya havta realise..wenya slag peeps off an talk shite..expect 2 get shite heaped back onya from gr8 height... its the way a the world babes... :)

Guess what Fran...being my own particular brand of Socialist....I have to disagree with you........

Actually, your post surprises me, having read so many of your posts over the past couple of years.

''u say whatya like.. but ya dus go on so, an snipe away wivout eva sayin a word wich means owt''

Indeed the person to whom you are replying must indeed say what they like, as long as it is not insulting or threatenig, for this is a public site and remarks made, cannot be viewed in the same manner as private angst.

Going on so, is very often necessary, to get one's point across. if these view expressed are seen as sniping, by the other party/parties, so be it, for as individuals, we must express ourselves, as we see fit.

You can't say that someone is spewing forth, that which means nothing. If the spewing are the opinion of an individual and are heartfelt or deeply believed in, then they mean something. They mean a lot.

It doesn't mean that one has to agree with them

''no is tryin 2 stopya..''

Sometimes, individuals feel quite the opposite and think that their views are unwanted. I've been told that. I've been told that my posts add nothing to a thread. If the vibes are being felt, then they are hanging around in the ether. That is why erasing posts, making someone non-existent, is unfair.

''we jus ask thatya think summat sensible to say instead a gripin bout things all the time.. ''

I would ask. once more......who decides what is sensible and what is acceptable. If people feel deeply about a matter, then they have every right to gripe on about it.....barring insults and threatening words. They may be right, they may be wrong.....but what is their right....is to express their view. Take them to task, if needs be, but always realise that the freedom to express what we think and feel, is very important.

''Wotya havta realise..wenya slag peeps off an talk shite..expect 2 get shite heaped back onya from gr8 height...''

True.........but I would argue that the great height is a little over the top. :eek: We shat on one another, all of the time, in this world......so the shatting is equal......and not bound by different levels of shattability. :tong:

[Canticle]

Canticle
I think that you wrote an extremely well written piece. I agree with some of the things that you wrote but somehow I was left with a bit of tenseness in my stomach. I have a few things going on this week and I know that may also be partially connected. I love debate and well expressed intelligent thoughts. This may seem strange but I like peaceful times on here as well. I know that some of us post way more than others. We can set a tone one way or the other. I'm left a bit confused as I already posted when I agree with some posters that others are disparaging. I can also see that each side may go overboard at times. Just because you present yourself as a sweetie doesn't mean that you should be able to get away with nastiness covered in sugar. It still is shit underneath. Yet, some people have that skill to do just that. Others are more truthsayers without the varnish to give a thought a gleaming surface of propriety. Maybe, some of us need to remember the Golden Rule a bit more..the varnish and sugar...well...not sure that it really helps the communication all the time.

Gee....did you ever read me wrong and what I post. Me...a Sweetie!!!!. May the god I don't believe in forbid. I deal in actualities....realities...truth and honesty...and I don't go by the Golden Rule, so often mentioned by people from another part of the world. I go by the moral beliefs I have.

I guess, I could argue that you are telling me how I should and should not post........but I would never accuse you of that. If my Queen's English (used to the best of my ability), is either not liked, or in not understood, that is not my problem. I read threads where what is being communicated has to be deciphered.....but never would I comment on how another posts.

No Sweetie here...just an honest, truthful person, who says it like it is and can politely reply to another post. How ridiculous to call it shit underneath the sugar coating, or varnish.

I don't lie (I know a few liars. It always amazes me, that so many are taken in by them), and I most certainly did no insulting in my post. There was no nastiness in my post.....just intelligent dialogue. And yes, it was a well written piece......no swollen head there..... it's that I just spent quite a few hours on it and had originally been planning, not to post it.

[tenni]

Sorry Canticle
I've made that mistake before when I start addressing my thoughts to one person and then go off tangent with more generalized thoughts with no connection to the person. I meant to compliment your writing. If anything, I see you more of a direct to the point communicator.

[Canticle]

Tenni, I agree with the point of your post. You can take the finest manure, place it on the oven fresh bun, add your favorite condiment, lettuce and tomatoes and onions and whatever else your heart desires. Put it all together and it looks great but at the end...it's still a shit sandwich. At some point in time people on here may agree with someone or disagree but debate it intelligently rather than running off slamming people and then slamming others for daring not to agree with your slamming of them. (By the "your and you at any point after my first sentence I mean collectively every poster on this board myself included). And further there is a time for letting go, it does no good to nurse a grudge especially one grounded in nothing more than the wild accusations of someone else.

Personally, I'd rather debate on an intellectual level than be sucked into the religious minefield that crops up every once in a while on this board. The history posts were pure genius to me as well as a chance to see what parts of history we never were taught here in the States.

I've seen a lot of shit on toast, too. Is the shit on toast more healthy than the shit in a bun, or vice versa. Who is to know. Intelligent debate is always the way things should be, whether the subject be light-hearted, or of a more serious nature.

Certain types of post, most certainly do not ''do it,'' for me. I am always more inclined to read longer posts. Sometimes these have been well thought out, other times rambling. No matter. To me, a post can never be too long.

What is being read, are thoughts, ideas, sometimes hopes and dreams. Occasionally, there will be posts, which defy all explanation. Some of these are the long ones, but I find that mostly, these occur in short pieces.

''Personally, I'd rather debate on an intellectual level than be sucked into the religious minefield that crops up every once in a while on this board. The history posts were pure genius to me as well as a chance to see what parts of history we never were taught here in the States.''

The problem with religious debate, is that people end up discussing, not religion itself, but the various factions. Religion, as a subject is fascinating and this is where history is important.

Seeing religion...any religion and it's place in history, is most important. At least, it is for me. I have 4 main interests, religion, history, art, politics and I am always telling people that I do not like to separate the subjects...they are part of one another.

Look at a painting by Leonardo da Vinci....you have the art.....the religious background of that period of history and what else was going on in the world, socially, politically and in terms of exploration...of the world and of science. Inseparable.

When it comes to composing a post....sometimes one needs to take ones time. other times, an answer will flow from the mind, along the arm and to the fingers typing the reply.

All is relevant. All is important.

[darkeyes]

Guess what Fran...being my own particular brand of Socialist....I have to disagree with you........

Actually, your post surprises me, having read so many of your posts over the past couple of years.

''u say whatya like.. but ya dus go on so, an snipe away wivout eva sayin a word wich means owt''

Indeed the person to whom you are replying must indeed say what they like, as long as it is not insulting or threatenig, for this is a public site and remarks made, cannot be viewed in the same manner as private angst.

Going on so, is very often necessary, to get one's point across. if these view expressed are seen as sniping, by the other party/parties, so be it, for as individuals, we must express ourselves, as we see fit.

You can't say that someone is spewing forth, that which means nothing. If the spewing are the opinion of an individual and are heartfelt or deeply believed in, then they mean something. They mean a lot.

It doesn't mean that one has to agree with them

''no is tryin 2 stopya..''

Sometimes, individuals feel quite the opposite and think that their views are unwanted. I've been told that. I've been told that my posts add nothing to a thread. If the vibes are being felt, then they are hanging around in the ether. That is why erasing posts, making someone non-existent, is unfair.

''we jus ask thatya think summat sensible to say instead a gripin bout things all the time.. ''

I would ask. once more......who decides what is sensible and what is acceptable. If people feel deeply about a matter, then they have every right to gripe on about it.....barring insults and threatening words. They may be right, they may be wrong.....but what is their right....is to express their view. Take them to task, if needs be, but always realise that the freedom to express what we think and feel, is very important.

''Wotya havta realise..wenya slag peeps off an talk shite..expect 2 get shite heaped back onya from gr8 height...''

True.........but I would argue that the great height is a little over the top. :eek: We shat on one another, all of the time, in this world......so the shatting is equal......and not bound by different levels of shattability. :tong:

Well..I neva.. had me hands an face well slapped ther:eek:... 'scuse me wile me nips off 2 kitchen 2 splash sum cold wata over it 2 cool me poor lil face down..

.. wont take up much of ya time Canticle.. but I decide wen I think sum 1 is gripin.. don ask ne 1 2 agree.. otha peeps read an c things differently an that me luffly, is fine.. an if me thinks sum 1 says nuthin of value..then its my judgement.. not ne 1 elses.. am not tryin 2 shut ne 1 up..nor stop em sayin wot they want.. AM tryin 2 get them 2 put ther brain in gear fore they say it.. an put forward a considered view justifyin ther claims or a summat important instead a pursuin his/her campaign gainst Duckie or the so called "clique" weneva an wereva an in woteva thread 'e/she feels fit....it mite b of value 2 the poster.. but if me dusn think its a much value 2 ne 1 else then its my right 2 say so.. but in end..howeva the posts cum thats fine.. wudn dream a interferin wiv 'is (that over-used if important cliche) "freedom of speech"..

..an u kno as well as me dus the poopin phrase is a commonly used phrase.. an wot it expresses is the likelihood that..howeva much poops our lil darlin' posts..ther is much more will head 'is/'er way.. so ther wos no need for it.. in fact hun..ther wos no need for much a wotya sed.. am not annoyed wivya honest.. u believe it an thats fine.. ya shudn b that suprised tho at summa the things me sez.. don suffer fools that well.. an don like witchhunts wen ther is no justification for 'em.. an that me darlin' is 1ce gain.. my judgement.. othas will agree.. or not.. gr8 thing 'bout opinions an beliefs.. ther is always sum 1 who will take issue wivya.. an that me darlin' is the gr8 thing bout bein human..

[Canticle]

Sorry Canticle
I've made that mistake before when I start addressing my thoughts to one person and then go off tangent with more generalized thoughts with no connection to the person. I meant to compliment your writing. If anything, I see you more of a direct to the point communicator.

Merci beaucoup, Monsieur Tenni. Yes, your last sentence is correct.

[Canticle]

Well..I neva.. had me hands an face well slapped ther:eek:... 'scuse me wile me nips off 2 kitchen 2 splash sum cold wata over it 2 cool me poor lil face down..

.. wont take up much of ya time Canticle.. but I decide wen I think sum 1 is gripin.. don ask ne 1 2 agree.. otha peeps read an c things differently an that me luffly, is fine.. an if me thinks sum 1 says nuthin of value..then its my judgement.. not ne 1 elses.. am not tryin 2 shut ne 1 up..nor stop em sayin wot they want.. AM tryin 2 get them 2 put ther brain in gear fore they say it.. an put forward a considered view justifyin ther claims or a summat important instead a pursuin his/her campaign gainst Duckie or the so called "clique" weneva an wereva an in woteva thread 'e/she feels fit....it mite b of value 2 the poster.. but if me dusn think its a much value 2 ne 1 else then its my right 2 say so.. but in end..howeva the posts cum thats fine.. wudn dream a interferin wiv 'is (that over-used if important cliche) "freedom of speech"..

..an u kno as well as me dus the poopin phrase is a commonly used phrase.. an wot it expresses is the likelihood that..howeva much poops our lil darlin' posts..ther is much more will head 'is/'er way.. so ther wos no need for it.. in fact hun..ther wos no need for much a wotya sed.. am not annoyed wivya honest.. u believe it an thats fine.. ya shudn b that suprised tho at summa the things me sez.. don suffer fools that well.. an don like witchhunts wen ther is no justification for 'em.. an that me darlin' is 1ce gain.. my judgement.. othas will agree.. or not.. gr8 thing 'bout opinions an beliefs.. ther is always sum 1 who will take issue wivya.. an that me darlin' is the gr8 thing bout bein human..

Oh. my dear Fran, we are more alike , than we are unalike......and I think you know that I agree with.....most of what you post.....i don't need to tell you that. There are a few things, I'd disagree with you about, however, I would never deem to raise such matters in public. That is how slanging matches begin.

By the way, do you think anyone, on the other side of the pond, knows what a ''slanging match,'' or a ''wazzock,'' is? It's a bit like confusing people with the word ''ockered,'' or when someone has done something daft, calling the a ''crate egg.'' (do ask your mother about that one....my father used to say it and I do believe it is a Lancastrian saying).

PS. As many times as I read your delightful ''Franspeak,'' I cannot get a Scottish accent into my head. It comes out as very North West London...or even West Indies speak......Sorry about that.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

Sigh...you see my loves, this is exactly what the OP was refering to. We cant have a decent thread or conversation here without the same old worn out fatalism and nastiness. Some people need to eat more fibre....:rolleyes:
Cat

[darkeyes]

Oh. my dear Fran, we are more alike , than we are unalike......and I think you know that I agree with.....most of what you post.....i don't need to tell you that. There are a few things, I'd disagree with you about, however, I would never deem to raise such matters in public. That is how slanging matches begin.

By the way, do you think anyone, on the other side of the pond, knows what a ''slanging match,'' or a ''wazzock,'' is? It's a bit like confusing people with the word ''ockered,'' or when someone has done something daft, calling the a ''crate egg.'' (do ask your mother about that one....my father used to say it and I do believe it is a Lancastrian saying).

PS. As many times as I read your delightful ''Franspeak,'' I cannot get a Scottish accent into my head. It comes out as very North West London...or even West Indies speak......Sorry about that.

Who cares if ne 1 knos wot a wazzock is.. me mum calls us it all the time.. its jus a brill word 2 describe a.. well.. a wazzock.. tee hee. But do think 'mericans kno wot a slangin match is.. they not that daft..

Franspeak..or 2 giv it its propa name.. bootgirlspeak.. is how me an me m8s speak 2 each otha on the net.. we all hav our own version of it..but jus as u pick it up..an othas.. we kno who is speakin jus by how bootgirl is used.. it is NOT Scottish..am fed up tellin peeps that.. its origin is in txtspeak.. so its origin is English.. a language wich in fact me speaks pretty well..

U can disagree wiv me allya like..in public..or private.. tis up 2 u me darlin'.. don usually take offence.. mite if ya sed me wosn a tart, or wos a hibee.. or worse.. wos a Tory bitch.. lil things like that.. tee hee. Peeps hav ther opinion a me an thats ther right.. mite argue an hava rite set 2.. but don often take things personally.. so don worry ya pretty lil head canticle me luffly (not that ya r.. tee hee).. Fran is fair game for slaggin jus like ne 1 else.. course ya'd b rong.. jus like everybody else..tee hee:bigrin:

[by~his~side]

It's sad and sickening.
For the life of me I don't understand why some of you push so hard to have your opinion be considered 'right'. Isn't it exhausting already??

Take a look around. If you don't see enough room in this world for any other opinion than your own, then you are contributing to the ugly vibe everyone is feeling. Your entire life probably reflects that. And you know it.

Just my opinion. Feel free to have your own.
~D~

[Canticle]

Who cares if ne 1 knos wot a wazzock is.. me mum calls us it all the time.. its jus a brill word 2 describe a.. well.. a wazzock.. tee hee. But do think 'mericans kno wot a slangin match is.. they not that daft..

Franspeak..or 2 giv it its propa name.. bootgirlspeak.. is how me an me m8s speak 2 each otha on the net.. we all hav our own version of it..but jus as u pick it up..an othas.. we kno who is speakin jus by how bootgirl is used.. it is NOT Scottish..am fed up tellin peeps that.. its origin is in txtspeak.. so its origin is English.. a language wich in fact me speaks pretty well..

U can disagree wiv me allya like..in public..or private.. tis up 2 u me darlin'.. don usually take offence.. mite if ya sed me wosn a tart, or wos a hibee.. or worse.. wos a Tory bitch.. lil things like that.. tee hee. Peeps hav ther opinion a me an thats ther right.. mite argue an hava rite set 2.. but don often take things personally.. so don worry ya pretty lil head canticle me luffly (not that ya r.. tee hee).. Fran is fair game for slaggin jus like ne 1 else.. course ya'd b rong.. jus like everybody else..tee hee:bigrin:


Tart!....Oh I could never call you that....unless you expand upon the subject, a little.....is it jam (of varying types), lemon curd, marmalade, treacle, the spongey ones my Mum used to make, with any leftover pastry (jam at the bottom, sponge mixture, flavoured with almond essence, on top...topped off with a twisty sorta cross), custard?.......but never Bakewell.....Bakewell is a Pudding, not a tart.....damn that Mr Kipling.....although he does make exceedingly good cakes!

Hibee?.....could that be a Hibernian lass......could it not? Oh, I'd never call you that. Perish the thought.

Tries to imagine Fran in hobnail boots......and I thought it was only the pigeons, on the flat roof, above me....who wore those!!!!!!!! LOL

[MarieDelta]

Ok I have to ask , cause I dont know...What is a bootgirl? Is that like a Riotgrrl?


Riot grrrl was an underground feminist punk movement that started in the early 1990s, and it is often associated with third-wave feminism (it is sometimes seen as its starting point). However, riot grrrl's emphasis on universal female identity often appears more closely allied with second-wave feminism than with the third wave.[1] Riot grrrl bands often address issues such as rape, domestic abuse, sexuality, and female empowerment. Some bands associated with the movement are Fifth Column, Bikini Kill, Bratmobile, Jack Off Jill, Excuse 17, Heavens to Betsy, Huggy Bear, Adickdid, The Third Sex, Sleater-Kinney, and also lesbian queercore like Team Dresch.[2] In addition to a music scene, riot grrrl is also a subculture; zines, the DIY ethic, art, political action, and activism are part of the movement. Riot grrrls hold meetings, start chapters, and support and organize women in music.[3]

[Canticle]

It's sad and sickening.
For the life of me I don't understand why some of you push so hard to have your opinion be considered 'right'. Isn't it exhausting already??

Take a look around. If you don't see enough room in this world for any other opinion than your own, then you are contributing to the ugly vibe everyone is feeling. Your entire life probably reflects that. And you know it.

Just my opinion. Feel free to have your own.
~D~

Methinks you are missing the point...or misreading some things. Freedom of thought, ideas, expression and speech are very important, for everyone to experience. There is enough room in this world for all opinions and so, they should all be expressed...good, or bad....right, or wrong....funny, or sad...silly, or sensible.

Why is expressing an opinion, pushing for it to be considered right? Free thinking people will chew upon the contents, cogitate...and either digest and take on board the ideas etc of others, or regurgitate them and spit out the mess.

What vibes are we all meant to be feeling.....warm and cosy by the fireside vibes, because if that is all we are meant to feel, then that's not reality. There is beauty and ugliness everywhere we go. It's what we make of it.

As has been said before, people do not have to read certain threads, if they do not wish to. You obviously chose to read this one.

Your opinion is very important and never allow anyone to say it is not.....too many people just shut up.....in this big world of ours...on line/off line. All views should be welcomed, even if we don't like them.

And I don't know about you, but I have a big world around me with plenty of people to discuss matters with, on line or off. I reckon it's the same for most people...not all...but most.

[dafydd]

Oh. my dear Fran, we are more alike , than we are unalike......and I think you know that I agree with.....most of what you post.....i don't need to tell you that. There are a few things, I'd disagree with you about, however, I would never deem to raise such matters in public. That is how slanging matches begin.

By the way, do you think anyone, on the other side of the pond, knows what a ''slanging match,'' or a ''wazzock,'' is? It's a bit like confusing people with the word ''ockered,'' or when someone has done something daft, calling the a ''crate egg.'' (do ask your mother about that one....my father used to say it and I do believe it is a Lancastrian saying).

PS. As many times as I read your delightful ''Franspeak,'' I cannot get a Scottish accent into my head. It comes out as very North West London...or even West Indies speak......Sorry about that.

North West London..? What accent is that? I live in NW London..

d

[dafydd]

It's sad and sickening.
For the life of me I don't understand why some of you push so hard to have your opinion be considered 'right'. Isn't it exhausting already??

Take a look around. If you don't see enough room in this world for any other opinion than your own, then you are contributing to the ugly vibe everyone is feeling. Your entire life probably reflects that. And you know it.

Just my opinion. Feel free to have your own.
~D~

I think it's difficult when you argue/disagree online because there is a certain powerlessness to expressing an opinion using only text, and having to wait sometimes a day for a response. I guess people feel that they have to pack their posts tightly and express their point of view as powerfully as possible because internet forum conversations don't have the same flow as natural speech. It's really frustrating to convince someone of where you're coming from through type. At the moment I'm trying to cancel my subscription to a shit website (gay-parship), for legit logical reasons and after back and forth emails have finally demanded a phone number. I just can't get them to empathise with my situation by typing it. Also I feel that typing takes away facial expressions and tone of voice and therefore makes opinions sound really indignant and rude e.g. you always read a disagreeing opinion that is typed by another user in your own voice. Your brain makes the words sound harsher perhaps (as your already feeling defensive) than it would if spoken by the real person.

d

[darkeyes]

Ok I have to ask , cause I dont know...What is a bootgirl? Is that like a Riotgrrl?

It is a play Marie on an old chant which used to ring out round Tynecastle Park.. (Me luffly Jambos home ground) "We are the Gorgie.. boot boys..".. pretty macho stuff..

Bein nice an charmin an ratha innocent.. me m8s an me called our lil group.. the Gorgie Boot Girls.. denotin that we wer all gud Jam Tarts (Hearts fans).. not wearin hob nail boots likeya mite expect guys 2 wear Marie.. but luffly sexy heeled boots, thigh length or woteva.. but sexy.. we hav honorary membas who r not Jambos.. Kate is 1... an we even a cupple who r Hibees (an Canticle is rite.. a Hibee is Hibernian Football Club.. Edinburgh's otha "team") an a cupple who don even like football.. we also hav wot in Scottish football parlance is referred 2 as a Hun an a Tim tart in membaship these days.. God how we hav lowered standards:eek:.. tee hee;)..as time went on.. the name Gorgie wos dropped since we wer no longa exclusively Jambos..

Dus that help? Its no biggie babes.. jus a bitta fun by a buncha yummie tartie m8s...:)

[Canticle]

I think it's difficult when you argue/disagree online because there is a certain powerlessness to expressing an opinion using only text, and having to wait sometimes a day for a response. I guess people feel that they have to pack their posts tightly and express their point of view as powerfully as possible because internet forum conversations don't have the same flow as natural speech. It's really frustrating to convince someone of where you're coming from through type. At the moment I'm trying to cancel my subscription to a shit website (gay-parship), for legit logical reasons and after back and forth emails have finally demanded a phone number. I just can't get them to empathise with my situation by typing it. Also I feel that typing takes away facial expressions and tone of voice and therefore makes opinions sound really indignant and rude e.g. you always read a disagreeing opinion that is typed by another user in your own voice. Your brain makes the words sound harsher perhaps (as your already feeling defensive) than it would if spoken by the real person.

d



Hi, handsome...:)

To deal with your post to me. Takes a deep breath (close your eyes, to get the visuals....maybe not).....Neasden.....Yes, I said it....Neasden.

I don't have the accent and neither did my sister, brother or mother, but my three uncles did. Twiggy lived and grew up, nearby and attended my primary school, my mother knowing the family and when Twiggy was still at Grammar School, waiting at the same bus stop as Twigs....who had the nickname from childhood.

So there you have it, Neasden, with that ghastly monstrosity of a new Wembley Stadium, not a stones throw away. However 92 years ago, the big N was a very different place, Daffyd, with the North Circular Road being a country lane, farms in the vicinity and fields all the way to Kingsbury, but even then, things were changing.

When I was a child, it was still a nice place to live, but time marches on.....and progress...well it's destroyed what was once a pleasant area. So how Twiggy used to speak, is the local accent, I knew, though not the way I speak. OK!

This second post...spot on. I'm always telling people, how difficult it can be, to express oneself in type...it's not like the hand written word and most definitely not at all like discussing things face to face. You got it right. ^5!

[Canticle]

Sigh...you see my loves, this is exactly what the OP was refering to. We cant have a decent thread or conversation here without the same old worn out fatalism and nastiness. Some people need to eat more fibre....:rolleyes:
Cat


And the OP has been told, by different people, in different ways, that a site, any site will have it's ups and downs, it's highs and lows. Evolution is a good thing. Stagnation bad for us all.

''We cant have a decent thread or conversation here without the same old worn out fatalism and nastiness.''

Who says this is not a decent thread? Who says that there has been no decent conversation, exchanging of views; there has even been a little levity.

It would be very nice if you could point out just what is ''the same old worn out fatalism and nastiness.'' How can it be fatalistic to believe that a site evolves....changes and that all views should be seen....whatever the subject matter. How can it be nasty to point out things to others, put over a view, idea etc, correct someone, ask questions etc. What would you have people do.....curb their intellectual reasoning and thought processes.

Telling the thread that some people need more fibre, or in other threads, handing out cookies, may appear humorous to you. Others may see it quite the other way.

What you still have not addressed and replied to, are the points made to you. What is the doom and gloom bullshit and who decides what is and isn't this or that? Who are the morons, idiots, assholes, troublemakers etc, as you see and call them. And, on a personal note, what three personae did you detect, in one post, made by myself?

If other people are expected, by you, to behave in a certain manner, perhaps it would be nice, if you could answer points, put to you, because I find it most frustrating, to see you go on about others and what they may say and yet, not give explanations for what you say.

It works both ways. That way, people understand where the other person is coming from Perhaps this was the problem with what someone said about LDD, Twyla and others. No particular reason was given for her doubts and conclusions. It seemed to be, just what she thought....or so it came across.

If it's not right to suggest, what was said about LDD, Twyla and other people, then it is not right to call people morons, idiots, assholes and trouble makers and comment that the three personae can be seen in one post, without backing up, what one says. It doesn't matter who the poster is, or what the subject matter may be, the same questions are valid, but do not get answered.

My long post, earlier in this thread, took a long time to compose, because I wanted to get it just right, not perfect, but as right as I could make it and thereby, not be insulting or appear impolite. Yet, at the same time, put over how I felt about your post and things you have posted before and how it was not the right of any one person, or any small group of forum contributors (and I am not talking about cliques), to decide that the site needed rescuing, when that person had also made comments, never explained, which could be construed as insulting.

Respectfully

C

[Long Duck Dong]

canticle, rule 2 is the answer to a lot of it

2. Be polite - flame the idea if you feel you must, but not the person.

a lot of us have no issue with the debating and opposing arguments..... its the flaming and offensive behievour that is not needed.....

its possible to disagree and rebut a opinion.... but it gets a lil tedious when you have people turning debates into personal degrading statements, made to belittle and humiliate people....

I am often on the receiving end of such remarks by people that want to be seen as mature and rational adults, capable of debating and discussing issues and subjects..... but who resort to personal attacks such as implying I am of low level education and off my meds etc..... and yes I left school at 14 and yes I suffer from depression.... but that doesn't affect my ability to debate and discussion issue.... ( and the fact I have owned / run 7 business and run / managed a lot of work places, point to the fact, that I sucked at school, but I was hardly a fool )

now I could had replied to the poster and said that pencil pushing desk jockeys are the best experts on lost memo's in the military... and their biggest fear during war time would be spilling ink on their pants..... but there is no point.... why continue to reason with people like that.... or discuss issues with them.....

the key to working out what is flaming and what is not... is simple.... if its about the subject.. its not about the other posters..... if its about the other posters and fuck all to do with the subject... its either complimentary or flaming.... and if its not a compliment.... its flaming.....

but its got a lot to do with the win / loss mentality in some people... they have to win at all costs, and be right.... and when they can not win in a intelligent way, they resort to the personal attacks

wars are the same, they are won with strategy and planning and intelligence..... not the biggest bombs or the most bullets... cos then everybody loses

[mrplayfuluk]

This topic started positive and now everyone is bickering. Nothing new then....

Ok I've had enough of this misapprehension that there are no true trolls coming here.

When we were being viciously attacked by the now infamous troll, Azrael and his numerous aliases last year, I did a little research back then and for those who don't remember him, take a look at this link, scroll to the bottom and read for yourself how he chose to attack our site.

http://www.infoterror.com/

Since last year may of us have seen him return time and time again as someone different but the tone is the same and he pops up all over the place on other site forums using the same tactics. So when an individual arrives and acts like Azrael there is a degree of defensiveness where the name calling begins. Don't ask me to explain why hobby trolls do it but it must give them a thrill to be nihilistic.

So if people have been name called as troll lately at least now you can see for yourself why there is a degree of paranoia in the place......

[Pasadenacpl2]

I saw the post referenced in your link. I did not understand the aspie aspect. I work with aspies, so now I'm curious.

Pasa

[tenni]

Thank you Canticle for expressing this situation so articulately. ( "Telling the thread that some people need more fibre, or in other threads, handing out cookies, may appear humorous to you. Others may see it quite the other way." )

I don't understand how someone has the gaul to post as if they are wanting positive and accepting warm etc. environment but then acts in what I can only think of as passive aggressive manner. The term "bless your heart" is understood to be this type of "I'm nice but I'm insulting you like a lady should". The "fibre "statement was enough for me to put this person on block again. I don't want to read her nasty insults. What is happening on this site has also to do with some posters "control" issues and wanting to think that this is a sweet fantasy site but they get to insult and degrade other posters.


And the OP has been told, by different people, in different ways, that a site, any site will have it's ups and downs, it's highs and lows. Evolution is a good thing. Stagnation bad for us all.

''We cant have a decent thread or conversation here without the same old worn out fatalism and nastiness.''

Who says this is not a decent thread? Who says that there has been no decent conversation, exchanging of views; there has even been a little levity.

It would be very nice if you could point out just what is ''the same old worn out fatalism and nastiness.'' How can it be fatalistic to believe that a site evolves....changes and that all views should be seen....whatever the subject matter. How can it be nasty to point out things to others, put over a view, idea etc, correct someone, ask questions etc. What would you have people do.....curb their intellectual reasoning and thought processes.

Telling the thread that some people need more fibre, or in other threads, handing out cookies, may appear humorous to you. Others may see it quite the other way.

What you still have not addressed and replied to, are the points made to you. What is the doom and gloom bullshit and who decides what is and isn't this or that? Who are the morons, idiots, assholes, troublemakers etc, as you see and call them. And, on a personal note, what three personae did you detect, in one post, made by myself?

If other people are expected, by you, to behave in a certain manner, perhaps it would be nice, if you could answer points, put to you, because I find it most frustrating, to see you go on about others and what they may say and yet, not give explanations for what you say.

It works both ways. That way, people understand where the other person is coming from Perhaps this was the problem with what someone said about LDD, Twyla and others. No particular reason was given for her doubts and conclusions. It seemed to be, just what she thought....or so it came across.

If it's not right to suggest, what was said about LDD, Twyla and other people, then it is not right to call people morons, idiots, assholes and trouble makers and comment that the three personae can be seen in one post, without backing up, what one says. It doesn't matter who the poster is, or what the subject matter may be, the same questions are valid, but do not get answered.

My long post, earlier in this thread, took a long time to compose, because I wanted to get it just right, not perfect, but as right as I could make it and thereby, not be insulting or appear impolite. Yet, at the same time, put over how I felt about your post and things you have posted before and how it was not the right of any one person, or any small group of forum contributors (and I am not talking about cliques), to decide that the site needed rescuing, when that person had also made comments, never explained, which could be construed as insulting.

Respectfully

C

[mrplayfuluk]

I saw the post referenced in your link. I did not understand the aspie aspect. I work with aspies, so now I'm curious.

Pasa


Azrael used to say that he had Aspergers as an excuse for his bad behaviour but it quickly became apparent in his postings that it was fake and he tried to use it to win sympathy or at least see if he could. In other places he suggested using it to 'infiltrate' forums.

he had a myspace too and it quickly became apparent that he was a young 'goth' outsider at school and was obsessed with vampires etc. He's not stupid but he's not that bright either and has been flushed out in the past under other aliases as he clearly has no sense of humour.

[TwylaTwobits]

This thread started out as an honest question.....it has pretty much degenerated into another slamfest. Can we all not agree that everyone has a right to their opinions and move on?

[tenni]

Twyla
That would be nice...but would it work? Can we move on without understanding each other perspectives? Does pretending to be nice while insulting with snide comments make it nice?

[TwylaTwobits]

Nope but then Tenni, ignore is a wonderful tool. I have had my share of disagreements on issues but not on a personal level, the ones that try to get personal very quickly make my ignore list. I'm not a child and I don't believe in childish actions, which the cynical snipes hidden under civility are imo. Debate about issues, hell even flame the issue, but as the rules here state don't flame the person. I have even put people on ignore before I was tempted to go after them in a personal way. Commenting on actions on a board is one thing...commenting on a person's life is another. I have tried not to do that, but I know I've had my share of comebacks on a few that persist in personal attacks. I'm human, but I'm also adult enough to move on. Is anyone else?

[Canticle]

''canticle, rule 2 is the answer to a lot of it

2. Be polite - flame the idea if you feel you must, but not the person.

a lot of us have no issue with the debating and opposing arguments..... its the flaming and offensive behievour that is not needed.....

its possible to disagree and rebut a opinion.... but it gets a lil tedious when you have people turning debates into personal degrading statements, made to belittle and humiliate people....''

Thank you, for your reply LDD. As you will note, I am, as usual, polite. I say, as usual, for this is something I always set out to be. These days, I take my time over posts. It pays one dividends, to do so.

The word ''flaming,'' was not something I had encountered, until visiting this site. I have since, noticed the term being used, on other forums. Most of these forums/web sites are being owned/run, across the other side of the pond, from the UK, so I have realised, that this must be a term used in the Northern Americas.

It's a bit like people in the Americas referring to ''hot flashes.'' when the term ''hot flushes,'' is used in the UK.....something else I know nothing about. (That, by the way, was humour..a few words, but conveying a lucky condition, which makes other women rather peeved with one).

Perhaps I have the fortune (or misfortune), of having been born with a Northern English heritage, one half of it being a people, well known for being ''ockered.'' Meaning, that we will debate, discuss, argue, until the cows come home and never think it insulting, rude, etc, to do so.

We call a spade a spade (think Geoff Boycott, there), and we like to get to the truth of any matter. Family gatherings, where the Yorkshire blood, got fired up, could be most interesting. However I was never one of the great and almost fire breathing communicators....not then and even now, I do it better....or worse...depending upon the situation (and situations can be many and varied), when I use the ''written,'' word.

So the concept of ''flaming,'' the idea, not the person, is a confusing one, to me. If there was no person, then the idea would not exist. I see the two, not as separate entities, but both belonging to the same whole. One cannot address the point being argued about, without including the person making the point and therefore, causing any discussion to be person/s to person/s....maybe resulting in harsh words being used.

However, as you so rightly infer, there is a fine line to be drawn, between argument and 'mildly harsh,' words being used and an out and out personal attack, as you, Twyla and others, felt they were on the receiving end of.

I found it ludicrous, that it should be suggested that any of those people mentioned, could ever be called anti the rights of LGBT people. Throw me in there with the others, for I, like you, believe in the rights and freedom of all humans.....even those I may disagree with vehemently. That is my way.

However, I feel you sometimes see this ''flaming.'' where I do not (I do not refer to the recent incident, which caused so much trouble). Please refer to my previous post and also, the one I took so long over, if you are wondering what I mean. So very often, those who think, that they are being 'flamed,' or point the finger and say ''flamer,'' are just as guilty of this ''mis-demeanour.''

I am afraid to say, that at times, it does seem as if there is one rule for some, another rule for others. I do not talk of cliques (perish the thought that I should mention such a thing), but people being supported by their on line ''friends,'' when they too, are saying things, quite out of order. Saying things, which I would call ''flaming,'' if I was ever to use such a term.

Indeed, I am now doing what certain people disapprove of....I am being too wordy, I am typing a post which is far too long and I am going over the top, upon a subject. Not in my eyes. I always go into great depth. On another thread I was told not to ''read so deep,'' into what others posted. How odd! Why make a comment at all, if it not to be looked at, read, and thought about, in an extremely deep manner.

I would add, that what you, or others may find offensive, will not be regarded as such, by fellow members of the site, who may, in fact find offensive, that which you, or others deem inoffensive. And this goes back and forth and around and around.

''I am often on the receiving end of such remarks by people that want to be seen as mature and rational adults, capable of debating and discussing issues and subjects..... but who resort to personal attacks such as implying I am of low level education and off my meds etc..... and yes I left school at 14 and yes I suffer from depression.... but that doesn't affect my ability to debate and discussion issue.... ( and the fact I have owned / run 7 business and run / managed a lot of work places, point to the fact, that I sucked at school, but I was hardly a fool )''

I was raised to believe, that it was the height of ignorance, to remark upon another adult's English, their usage of the language, or their grammar. One should be accepting of what is said, even if it is not ''up to scratch,'' with ones own use of the language. I have said, I use the Queen's English, to the best of my ability, but it is not perfect. My ''husband,'' who has a degree in english literature, taken at Oxford, would pull my posts to pieces. Indeed, when I began to write prose, I showed him one piece. His words were not of encouragement, but to tell me, that there were many mistakes. That is like telling a child...''forget about learning the alphabet, you'll never amount to much.''

There is a big difference between schooling and education. Many people, who did not have a good schooling, go on to educate themselves, without the need for degrees, perfect English.....or the like. How anyone could ever deem, by reading your posts, that you are a fool, is beyond me. You are, one highly intelligent, intuitive and also spiritual person.

''Taking meds,'' or ''off meds again,'' is also something never encountered by myself, until I began talking to people from the other side of the pond. It IS highly offensive to say such things. People take medication, for many reasons and drugs which are presctibed for serious, or life threatening conditions, are no joke. I know that, for a fact, as will many people upon this site, and those we know and love in our every day life.

When someone describes one, to others, as a drug addict, not nowing what the hell they are on about, any medical understanding of a condition etc.....that's one of the biggest insults one could be paid. People say things like ''off their meds,'' and do so light-heartedly, not realising that for many, coming off their ''meds,'' would probably result in the individual's death.

LDD...people with depression raise children, run successful businesses and even lead the governmet of a country, at a crucial time in it's history. For that leader, read Sir Winston Churchill. His black moods, making him the person he was.

''now I could had replied to the poster and said that pencil pushing desk jockeys are the best experts on lost memo's in the military... and their biggest fear during war time would be spilling ink on their pants..... but there is no point.... why continue to reason with people like that.... or discuss issues with them.....''

Why continue?.....because that, as humans, is what we do. Hopefully, we strive for right, offer to lay down our life for our principles and beliefs and defend those under attack....whoever those people may be.

''the key to working out what is flaming and what is not... is simple.... if its about the subject.. its not about the other posters..... if its about the other posters and fuck all to do with the subject... its either complimentary or flaming.... and if its not a compliment.... its flaming.....''

Once again, I would state, without the individual, there is no idea or opinion...the two being inseparable....at least they are...in my eyes.

Personal insults, or threats...of course, these are unnecessary, which is why posts should be thought about carefully and then a reply made.

One cannot compliment everyone, all of the time. This would be a most false approach, to one's dealings with other members of the human race. Therefore, I think you are wrong, in stating that ''its either complimentary or flaming.... and if its not a compliment.... its flaming.....''

Compliments, flying thick and fast, would not be reality and for me, a forum, to discuss different subjects, is reality....not fantasy.

''but its got a lot to do with the win / loss mentality in some people... they have to win at all costs, and be right.... and when they can not win in a intelligent way, they resort to the personal attacks''

Quite true...up to a point! There are some who believe that others should post in a certain manner, use a certain kind of language, show themselves to be what they are not and this would result in someone not being true unto his/herself, parading a false image, before society.

I am reminded of a person, to whom I am, at this point, legally joined, who would/will ask the same question, over and over again, until the answer is worded the way, that person wishes to hear it worded. That is a mind game. I don't play mind games.

''wars are the same, they are won with strategy and planning and intelligence..... not the biggest bombs or the most bullets... cos then everybody loses''

True....we win the war...but lose the peace, but I would not consider it comparable to what goes on within the confines of a forum.

I would ask you, LDD to read my previous posts and then, perhaps realise, that disagreement comes in, on many different levels and one liners, or comments, not backed up by any further discourse, can be just as bad, as what you and others, will call ''flaming.''

Respectfully

C

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

Freedom of speech is a beautiful thing. How do you know I was being insulting? I could've been just sending a blessing, nothing more. But take it as you Perceive it..:} And did I mention Your name at any point? No. So the fiber remark wasnt leveled at You, so dont worry about it.
Have a nice day.
Cat

[Canticle]

This topic started positive and now everyone is bickering. Nothing new then....

Ok I've had enough of this misapprehension that there are no true trolls coming here.

When we were being viciously attacked by the now infamous troll, Azrael and his numerous aliases last year, I did a little research back then and for those who don't remember him, take a look at this link, scroll to the bottom and read for yourself how he chose to attack our site.

http://www.infoterror.com/

Since last year may of us have seen him return time and time again as someone different but the tone is the same and he pops up all over the place on other site forums using the same tactics. So when an individual arrives and acts like Azrael there is a degree of defensiveness where the name calling begins. Don't ask me to explain why hobby trolls do it but it must give them a thrill to be nihilistic.

So if people have been name called as troll lately at least now you can see for yourself why there is a degree of paranoia in the place......


How terribly sad, that people have nothing better to do than plan to disrupt a site. I doubt that Azrael has been the first to come to this site, or visit others, with that intent. In fact a chat room, which I visit, has been ruined by not one, but a whole group of people who want the place for themselves.

They consider others to be morons and think it clever to look up personal information and post it in the chat room. This is why, I will never fill in a complete profile here. On another site, my profile was lifted and posted in the chat room, to be laughed at, by these highly intelligent people....and intelligent, the majority are. That is the sadness of it all.

I've been told, that I should die the same death as Jack the Ripper's last victim, Mary Kelly and other appalling things have been said. We can all be guilty, in our private communications, of becoming too angry and going over the top, though we are usually pushed that far, by others. Not so, these self-diagnosed intellectuals. They enjoy what they do. They enjoy using, abusing and hurting people.

Yet, I would not call these people ''trolls.'' for they are also capable of intelligent, intellectual comunication. I know this, by experience. Seems to me, that Azrael thought he was far more clever, than he was. I know at least one, maybe two people like that....but I would never call them trolls.....although I can think of a lot of other names for them.

[Canticle]

Thank you Canticle for expressing this situation so articulately. ( "Telling the thread that some people need more fibre, or in other threads, handing out cookies, may appear humorous to you. Others may see it quite the other way." )

I don't understand how someone has the gaul to post as if they are wanting positive and accepting warm etc. environment but then acts in what I can only think of as passive aggressive manner. The term "bless your heart" is understood to be this type of "I'm nice but I'm insulting you like a lady should". The "fibre "statement was enough for me to put this person on block again. I don't want to read her nasty insults. What is happening on this site has also to do with some posters "control" issues and wanting to think that this is a sweet fantasy site but they get to insult and degrade other posters.

Tenni, you must decide for yourself, what is meant or not meant by other posters. I will not be drawn into agreeing or disagreeing with you.

[wtrmoccasin]

Folks,
It used to be that jokes, sex, and shared positive experiences were the usual forum topics. Now the topics are almost all negative or whinney. What's happened? Can we go back to the way it was?
g

Sure friend. drop your linin and start your grinin..:)

[Canticle]

Freedom of speech is a beautiful thing. How do you know I was being insulting? I could've been just sending a blessing, nothing more. But take it as you Perceive it..:} And did I mention Your name at any point? No. So the fiber remark wasnt leveled at You, so dont worry about it.
Have a nice day.
Cat

Again, difficult to separate the poster, from the comments, ideas, views held. Freedom of speech is a wonderful and beautiful thing. or, at least, it should be.

Unfortunately, this post goes off, in so many directions,, it becomes confusing.

It doesn't even appear to be posted, to anyone in particular.

[12voltman59]

This topic started positive and now everyone is bickering. Nothing new then....

Ok I've had enough of this misapprehension that there are no true trolls coming here.

When we were being viciously attacked by the now infamous troll, Azrael and his numerous aliases last year, I did a little research back then and for those who don't remember him, take a look at this link, scroll to the bottom and read for yourself how he chose to attack our site.

http://www.infoterror.com/

Since last year may of us have seen him return time and time again as someone different but the tone is the same and he pops up all over the place on other site forums using the same tactics. So when an individual arrives and acts like Azrael there is a degree of defensiveness where the name calling begins. Don't ask me to explain why hobby trolls do it but it must give them a thrill to be nihilistic.

So if people have been name called as troll lately at least now you can see for yourself why there is a degree of paranoia in the place......

Very interesting item the link goes to-----it does seem the sight has been and continues to be a victim of this sort of systematic troll attacks outlined in the post---but we do seem to have weathered them pretty welll, all things considered----we do need to be aware that there are people out there who employ such tactics against websites and be on the lookout for those tactics being used against us in the future when they will inevitably happen yet again.

To go off topic of that a bit----I do have to disagree with some of the things the guy went on to say about government being all to blame for taking our rights----while it is no doubt that the government has played a role in undermining rights----it is really the unholy alliance of big government with big business that has done the most to take our rights and together are the biggest threat to our freedoms heading out into the future----not this bulllshit "Barack Obama" is a socialist crap, that is just pure idiocy of the first degree--Barack Obama is a corporatist as are most of our political figures---on the right or left--Republican and Democrat--they are pretty much all bought and paid for by some contingent of big money interests--each "side" just has their constituencies that they tend favor one over another----at least this guy wasn't a big fan of the neocons, though!!! Those assholes sure got us in some deep shit!!! Hopefully we are going to reject in totality, the agenda of the neocon types. Its not America's role to be the Big Boss Man and Cop on the Block of the entire world!!!

As far as Azrael being a troll---there were others and I think a main one--as I have said before was a guy that I first came to know as "Bisexualinsocal" a few years back. I think that he comes back from time to time--but for the most part is thankfully finally giving up bothering us. We can only hope that is the case with both of them and any other "trolls" that might feel compelled to bother us, but I know that is probably not the case---it could be the fact that we do have a pretty strong sense of community that makes it fun for some of those malcontents to try to bust us up---and I know I have at times wanted to throw in the towel---thanks to others on here--I stayed and hung it out and so did the rest of us---so for that I am thankful we have, do and will continue to suffer their arrows of outrageous fortune--but beat them down!!

High Fives and Fist Bumps for that, ya'all!!!!!!

[darkeyes]

This is definitely worth repeating as some people aren't getting the message.
Thanks canticle and tenni for expressing the issues so eloquently and articulately. No troll here. Just taking my stance having been insulted and name called for my views.

Views? As best I can tell you have 2.. 1 that Duckie is anti lgbt.. and 2 that this site has a clique which rules the roost.. thats fine.. but surely you have something of import other than that 2 impart.. I would love to embrace you as a kindred spirit but you do nothing to help your cause..no need to lose sight of those causes which are so obviously dear to you, but try involving youself in the mainstream and tell us what you think of the world and how best we can make things for people like us.. there are far far more important things when it comes to lgbt matters than the two causes you have taken up however much importance you attach to them.. in the greater scheme of things they aren't more than a single flea on an elephant..:)

[Canticle]

Nope but then Tenni, ignore is a wonderful tool. I have had my share of disagreements on issues but not on a personal level, the ones that try to get personal very quickly make my ignore list. I'm not a child and I don't believe in childish actions, which the cynical snipes hidden under civility are imo. Debate about issues, hell even flame the issue, but as the rules here state don't flame the person. I have even put people on ignore before I was tempted to go after them in a personal way. Commenting on actions on a board is one thing...commenting on a person's life is another. I have tried not to do that, but I know I've had my share of comebacks on a few that persist in personal attacks. I'm human, but I'm also adult enough to move on. Is anyone else?

But Twyla...there are some people, who do not seem to think that they are flaming ''the person,'' or ''persons,'' whilst, at the same time, castigating them.

It wasn't right for you, LDD and others to be insulted, ''flamed,'' but certain people will call others, in a very general way, all manner of names, or suggest things about them, but somehow it is not thought appropriate for those people to be criticised.

If I have ever taken anyone to task, I've been telling the truth and know what it is like, to be on the receiving end of real life bullshit, as do we all. For me to post something on a thread and reply post to say, the three personae are there to be seen in one post, is, to me, as untrue as what was said about you, LDD and others.

It works both ways.

[Pasadenacpl2]

Sometimes, Canticle, one must call a spade a spade.

What you are proposing is moral equivalency, and there is none to be had in this situation. Sorry, but sometimes a douchebag needs to be told he's a douchebag. Doesn't make me wrong for doing so, just makes me observant and willing to vocalize it.

Pasa

[Canticle]

Sometimes, Canticle, one must call a spade a spade.

What you are proposing is moral equivalency, and there is none to be had in this situation. Sorry, but sometimes a douchebag needs to be told he's a douchebag. Doesn't make me wrong for doing so, just makes me observant and willing to vocalize it.

Pasa


Well....on the moral equivalency......I have to disagree....but you knew I would Situations can be slightly different, but they can all be judged by the same moral equialency....and please remember which kind of ''judging,'' I mean.

You've lost me......who is the douchebag? Surely you haven't called anyone a douchebag! Would that not be 'flaming' the person and not the subject??

Smiles sweetly....:)

[Canticle]

Sometimes, Canticle, one must call a spade a spade.

What you are proposing is moral equivalency, and there is none to be had in this situation. Sorry, but sometimes a douchebag needs to be told he's a douchebag. Doesn't make me wrong for doing so, just makes me observant and willing to vocalize it.

Pasa


Well....on the moral equivalency......I have to disagree....but you knew I would Situations can be slightly different, but they can all be judged by the same moral equialency....and please bear in mind, which kind of ''judging,'' I mean.

You've lost me......who is the douchebag? Surely you haven't called anyone a douchebag! Would't be 'flaming' the person and not the subject??

Smiles sweetly....:)

[Pasadenacpl2]

When the person becomes the subject by their actions, then yes I have.

Example: When Jeannie decided to accuse others of being antiGLBT, I told her up front she was acting like a bitch. She was. When the person is no longer rational, attempting rational debate is futile.

Sometimes you can either be truthful, or polite. Sometimes it is mutually exclusive. And when a person has overstepped their bounds and rages at everyone around them, it is obvious that being polite has failed and the time for truth is at hand.

Being polite is the hope and the ideal. It is not, however, the only tool one should use if one wishes to be effective.

Pasa

[Canticle]

When the person becomes the subject by their actions, then yes I have.

Example: When Jeannie decided to accuse others of being antiGLBT, I told her up front she was acting like a bitch. She was. When the person is no longer rational, attempting rational debate is futile.

Sometimes you can either be truthful, or polite. Sometimes it is mutually exclusive. And when a person has overstepped their bounds and rages at everyone around them, it is obvious that being polite has failed and the time for truth is at hand.

Being polite is the hope and the ideal. It is not, however, the only tool one should use if one wishes to be effective.

Pasa

How does one rationalise the calling someone a douchebag, whether those were the exact words, or not, with the rule of only flaming the subject?

I fully agree that there are times when staying, falsely polite, is unreal. I'll not repeat what I posted to LDD, you'll have read it. Methinks, that perhaps the people who received the wrath of a certain person, were not those whom the anger, was actually directed. Who knows.

I believe in taking people to task, when they lie, behave in a manner which is not fitting or right, hurting those who may care about them. I do indeed agree, that one can be pushed too far and things get said, which need to be said and are said out of distress, frustration and anger. I know that, only too well. I know what regret feels like and yet, one has to feel no regret, when one realises nothing has been lost, not by oneself.

So, we have an agreement and a disagreement, of sorts. Would we agree that what goes for one, should go for all? I wonder!

[brutal_priestess]

Best thread I've ever seen here since I joined.

And ya know why? It's fucking real. Guess what, sometimes a community isn't one big circle jerk. Sometimes we fight; sometimes one of us wants to talk about something others don't care for.

I think this thread could be the kick in the ass this comm needs.


Since last year may of us have seen him return time and time again as someone different but the tone is the same and he pops up all over the place on other site forums using the same tactics. So when an individual arrives and acts like Azrael there is a degree of defensiveness where the name calling begins. Don't ask me to explain why hobby trolls do it but it must give them a thrill to be nihilistic.


We just couldn't have a forum brawl without bringing up Azreal/Quintus, huh?

Geez man, you're one of the few people I kinda like on this forum. I wish you'd leave the situation alone when you know nothing about it.

[Canticle]

Hmmmmmmm, very interesting.

[brutal_priestess]

Who me? Nah just playing devil's advocate and defending someone who can't defend himself. He was banned from the forums last year and every time he makes a new account he gets banned, even though he's really not doing anything wrong other than rattling a few cages and saying unpopular things. It's old news, but he always gets brought up when people start doing the troll finger-point game.

[mrplayfuluk]

Who me? Nah just playing devil's advocate and defending someone who can't defend himself. He was banned from the forums last year and every time he makes a new account he gets banned, even though he's really not doing anything wrong other than rattling a few cages and saying unpopular things. It's old news, but he always gets brought up when people start doing the troll finger-point game.

I know you're not Azrael, although I once saw you in his friendlist on his Myspace a while back. However I was referencing him as part of the reason why this site's members get paranoid when someone arrives then gets out of hand and gets personal and people name call them trolls. I have always enjoyed your posts too, but as you can see... your comments alone have made someone twitchy already.

Mind you Princess, Azrael did a lot more than just rattle the cages..... so he forgoes his rights IMO.

[brutal_priestess]

*arches eyebrows*

He was far from his right mind at the time, you realize?

Eh, it doesn't matter. *shrugs* Listen I know the score. The real honest-to-god score, and I guess I get a little twitchy myself because I know Tom's a good man. It's just a shame he's not getting the chance to even apologize properly. Well, at least not personally, since I'm the one delivering the message for keeps.

I can't stay objective when it comes to him. For good and obvious reasons, of course.

[Pasadenacpl2]

Is this person the same person as GayAZN, HornedUpMyRam, and others of that ilk?

Pasa

[brutal_priestess]

Is this person the same person as GayAZN, HornedUpMyRam, and others of that ilk?

Pasa

No. Please see my thread posted earlier today entitled "Don't Shoot the Messenger".

[Canticle]

A psychic is a person who professes an ability to perceive information hidden from the normal senses through extrasensory perception, are you looking for a perfect psychic astrology, psychic palm readings and a psychic healing powers, you can call us at 877-763-3431 or visit our site http://psychicsourcecenter.com/fat/.

Talk about off topic....LOL

....and one could argue about the text and exactly how correct it is.....however, this card carrying Spiritualist, will not...cos it's off topic...way off. I will add one thing....there is nothing psychic about healing...it's a natural energy and we all possess the ability to heal......and no one should ever pay for for healing. It should be gifted and in the UK, a registered healer cannot charge.

Love and light

[TwylaTwobits]

A psychic is a person who professes an ability to perceive information hidden from the normal senses through extrasensory perception, are you looking for a perfect psychic astrology, psychic palm readings and a psychic healing powers, you can call us at 877-763-3431 or visit our site http://psychicsourcecenter.com/fat/.

ROFLMAO My very own senses tell me the minute Drew sees this post your advertising hiney will be hitting the banned door. Have a nice day until what you didn't see in your crystal ball happens :)

[MarieDelta]

How come all psychics arent wealthy?

[TwylaTwobits]

How come all psychics arent wealthy?

Actually, if they really have anything it's kinda against the "rules" to use it for their own gain. The old with "great power comes great responsibility" thing. I'd really love to dream up the lotto numbers but alas all I see are things I'd rather not see (Ie car wrecks, sister dying, droughts, disasters) not exactly money making opportunities.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

And how come they arent smart enough to see that Bots and spam gets deleted when the owners see them? lol
Cat

[Canticle]

Actually, if they really have anything it's kinda against the "rules" to use it for their own gain. The old with "great power comes great responsibility" thing. I'd really love to dream up the lotto numbers but alas all I see are things I'd rather not see (Ie car wrecks, sister dying, droughts, disasters) not exactly money making opportunities.

Actually, if they really have anything it's kinda against the "rules" to use it for their own gain. The old with "great power comes great responsibility"

You are absolutely correct Twyla. I'm not gonna open the subject up, though.

[TwylaTwobits]

No need to, Canticle....Drew already took care of the problem :)

[Canticle]

No need to, Canticle....Drew already took care of the problem :)

LOL...I actually meant the whole subject, because being a Spiritualist, once started,,,, you can't stop me.....maybe one day in the chat room.

[TwylaTwobits]

Well LDD hates talking on the phone but we spent 10k minutes in 3 weeks so I guess I'm a bit hard to stop at times too LOL

[Long Duck Dong]

to me spirituality is a path and a journey.... a adventure... with many paths to walk and places to explore......

there is no right or wrong ways, only those that seek to control spirituality and impose their own views....... but that is the same as christianity,... you will have the people that follow the paths that god guides them on.... and those that seek to control christianity

what does make me laugh, honestly.... is the way many people will sit in judgment of spirituality, but actually have no idea about it......so they make wild and unfounded accusations and assumptions about spirituality...... and the people that walk the paths

[Pasadenacpl2]

Actually, if they really have anything it's kinda against the "rules" to use it for their own gain. The old with "great power comes great responsibility" thing. I'd really love to dream up the lotto numbers but alas all I see are things I'd rather not see (Ie car wrecks, sister dying, droughts, disasters) not exactly money making opportunities.

Car wrecks are incredibly good money making opportunities

http://content.internetvideoarchive.com/content/photos/174/007327_22.jpg

as are disasters. A friend of mine is an insurance adjuster. He cleared 200k from Ike, and then another 100k from a hail storm in Denver.

Pasa

[TwylaTwobits]

Sigh, Pasa, I'm not going there. I follow a path that tells me if I should make money off of something like that then I may as well give it all away cause I'd guarantee I'd have to spend it for life's little emergencies soon after.

My needs are met, my wants are for me to fulfill.

[Pasadenacpl2]

I wasn't saying you should. Just noting that they are, indeed, very profitable if you are in the right line of work.

I will say this. During Ike, I was incredibly thankful for my insurance adjuster. Unlike the ambulance chasers, they are there to provide a great service to people who have their lives in terrible upheaval. Their jobs are dangerous (hence well paid), and very technical (again, well paid) but they are also speeding along the ability for people to get their homes and lives back on track to normalcy. If public education continues in the path it is headed, I am considering leaving teaching to become an adjuster.

Pasa

[Canticle]

Car wrecks are incredibly good money making opportunities

http://content.internetvideoarchive.com/content/photos/174/007327_22.jpg

as are disasters. A friend of mine is an insurance adjuster. He cleared 200k from Ike, and then another 100k from a hail storm in Denver.

Pasa

Mediumship is not about fortune telling! Mediumship carries with it, a great responsibility and that is the difference between so called psychics and mediums, who have sat in an awareness circle and ''developed,'' their spiritual awareness and mediumship skills over a great length of time. Mediums do not foretell the future. If they do...they are charlatans.

And whereas not every true psychic will have Mediumistic skills, a medium will always be psychic. I'm a Spiritualist. My Great Grandmother was a Medium. I belong to a Christian Spiritulist Church, where the accent is very much on spirituality and love and tolerance. People are not just ''let loose,'' on a congregation. It takes a good leader of open and closed circles, an exsperienced Medium, to decide who is ready to be called a fledgling Medium and allowed to work, under supervision, with members of the congregation.

A Medium is a channel....that is what the word means. If a person does wish to consult a Medium, they would be advised to stay away from people who advertise and seek out a Spiritualist Church...where they will be met by very ordinary and normal people...and they will find those people to be some of the best one could meet.

And I said, that i was not going to post anything.....grrrr.

[Long Duck Dong]

Mediumship is not about fortune telling! Mediumship carries with it, a great responsibility and that is the difference between so called psychics and mediums, who have sat in an awareness circle and ''developed,'' their spiritual awareness and mediumship skills over a great length of time. Mediums do not foretell the future. If they do...they are charlatans.

And whereas not every true psychic will have Mediumistic skills, a medium will always be psychic. I'm a Spiritualist. My Great Grandmother was a Medium. I belong to a Christian Spiritulist Church, where the accent is very much on spirituality and love and tolerance. People are not just ''let loose,'' on a congregation. It takes a good leader of open and closed circles, an exsperienced Medium, to decide who is ready to be called a fledgling Medium and allowed to work, under supervision, with members of the congregation.

A Medium is a channel....that is what the word means. If a person does wish to consult a Medium, they would be advised to stay away from people who advertise and seek out a Spiritualist Church...where they will be met by very ordinary and normal people...and they will find those people to be some of the best one could meet.

And I said, that i was not going to post anything.....grrrr.

and we start to see the *control * aspect emerging.......

control over who is deemed * right * to share info......and where the *right source of info * will come from......

[Canticle]

and we start to see the *control * aspect emerging.......

control over who is deemed * right * to share info......and where the *right source of info * will come from......

Not at all LDD. No ''control'' of any kind. We are all capable of awareness, as you well know. Not everyone get pointed in the right direction and knows how to seek out an awareness circle. Not everyone wants to use any spiritual skills, which it is obvious to them, that they have.

There has to be supervision, because, a church is responsible and cannot risk allowing people to take up, what is almost a kind od ministering, and in the name of Spiritualism. people who are sincere and interested in doing things properly, for the good of the general public, the church's good reutation and also of theirself, will want to follow the rules of any particular awareness circle leader and their guidance.

It is the same for healers and in the UK, healers have to be registered and insured and make no financial gain from being a healer. This is all for the protection of those being ministered to.

This does not stop people going off and doing exactly what they want and many do.....but their has to be a code of practice....just as with anything else.

I can give healing, but I would not be allowed to give healing to members of the church congregation. I can give healing to other church members and if I wish, to my friends.....but I am not a registered and insured healer. A healer actually has to prove that they know a fair amount about the workings og the body. I'm sure that you know that.

So, No....not control.....just being sensible.....in the world we live in, today.

[Long Duck Dong]

ok I will term it another way, canticle..... does your church allow for free range of messages, or use the spirituality * rule * of messages that are positive, uplifting, light filled yadda yadda......

control is a form of structure that *guides * people within a set direction or scope of learning, using guidelines..... or a code of practice......

based around that code of practice for your church, i already know what is taught in your church..and what controls are used and how its structured.....and yes.. you lot use the *preferred messages * approach....

another part of what tells me that, is your style of posting....

I will ask one thing.... does god give others the power to decide what messages are shared or do others take on that mantle of power for themselves, and in doing so, prevent messages being shared, that need to be shared.....

and before you even post, I can tell you that while you may not defend the church, you will support the way things are done, you will look over the merits of the awareness groups and support their way of doing things.... and justify their reasoning for filtering out messages or whom shares them...... and refer to gods guidance in such matters....
but you will not be able to really justify the way that people decide what is shared by who... and you will use the stance that the right people are chosen to share the right messages to the right person..... and ignore the aspect that the right people can be chosen to share the right messages to the right people, but the church doesn't allow that to happen... they prefer their way of doing things....and that can cause people not to hear what is meant for their ears cos its not shared cos of the churches stance.....



and that, canticle, is why you can not see in the forum, what many people do see..

[brutal_priestess]

So...uh, We've gone from mud-slinging and bitch-slapping each other to getting into a religious debate?

Oh dear.

This doesn't bode well.

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb150/TOTO-LERO/gifs/2irukv5jpg.gif

[Long Duck Dong]

lol. nope not religion..... its a aspect of human interaction..... people will try to live their life in a set way according to their beliefs and reconcile their beliefs with their opinions.... and when human nature and beliefs / opinions, clash.... then we end up with the * church * effect....

what that is, is simply the trying to be polite, light filled and understanding of all people and things, and denying the other side of things..... spirituality is full of the *positive / light filled / use your energy to change the world * teachings.... and it fails more times than giving viagra to a eunuch

the same effect is found in christianity when christians try to reconcile the old testament laws with the teachings of jesus..... they contradict each other.... so you have christians preaching * love thou neighbour * while preaching that god hates homosexuals .....

it amuses me how humankind constantly does it.... aims for the PC / postive thinking / enlightened, image..... when what we should be doing is going for the * contented and neutral * aspect.....

the understanding that we are one person in a diverse world
the knowledge that the world is diverse so we can define ourselves in it
the wisdom to realise that things will change over time, and that will change us....
and the intelligence to realise that we spend 5% of our time fighting for change in the world and 95% of our time, bitching about how the world is not right according to our view point....

me, I am just content to allow the world to implode as I watch everybody else fighting for their beliefs, only to find that so is everybody else in the world and nobody will win in the long run, cos 99% of the world can not agree on anything....

[Canticle]

''ok I will term it another way, canticle..... does your church allow for free range of messages, or use the spirituality * rule * of messages that are positive, uplifting, light filled yadda yadda......''

It is very difficult to understand exactly what you mean by this. I am a Spiritualist and the Church (and only church I have ever attended), which I call ''home,'' is a Christian Spiritualist Church. I have moved on, spiritually, in leaps and bounds, over the last four years and I no longer consider mself to be a ''Christian.'' However, having had my own brand of Christianity for 40 years, I still consider myself as basically Christian, for the words of the One are the most important part of that belief...for me.

I know many Mediums and have seen even more on the Rostrum, visiting Mediums from other Spiritualist Churches, be they Christian Spiritualist or the Spiritualist National Union. I have watched Mediums work in front of a congregation and I have also had private, one to one readings. I also give readings...but I am NOT a Medium, who has sat in an awareness circle.

When a visiting Medium, stands up, at the end of a Sunday service, or a mid-week service, he/she will be facing a congregation. This is not the same as using the same channelling skills in a one to one reading.

Of course Mediums give out more than what you call ''messages that are positive, uplifting, light filled yadda yadda......'' However, in a communal setting, a Medium will never ''open up'' what is being received, to be give tio another (I do hate the word messages), in open settings, such as the body of the church. Indeed, in such situations, the Medium, will only receive information, which when passed on to the recipient, it will be understood.

Private readings are very different, yet, even so, a Medium has to be professional and try to interpret the information received, in a very careful manner. Any Medium who was to tell a person, that they were going to die, or be seriously ill, would never darken the door of my church, again. What is said has to be given in a very careful manner and that is where the professionalism comes into mediumship and why sitting in an awareness circle, is very important and the guidance of a good circle leader needed.

Even the most experienced Medium, should still sit in the awareness circle. I don't want to sit in circle, even though Mediums say that I should, but, only when I am ready. Maybe it's because I already know what will happen and I do not wish to go that far.

What a lot of people seem to forget is, that Mediums are not fortune tellers, they are not soothsayers, there to predict the future. A Medium is a channel.

So Yes, Mediums in my church and others I have visited, give out more than happy clappy stuff, in front of a congregation, but things are worded carefully and this is the mark of a skilled medium.

''control is a form of structure that *guides * people within a set direction or scope of learning, using guidelines..... or a code of practice......''

How a circle is led, will depend upon whom is leading it. As individuals and being ordinary mortals, all circle leaders will, obviously, work differently.

Every church has to have rules and regulations, however informal. This is to protect all, the congregation and wider public attending, the Healers and the Mediums.

''based around that code of practice for your church, i already know what is taught in your church..and what controls are used and how its structured.....and yes.. you lot use the *preferred messages * approach.... ''

Balderdash and Poppycock.....you have no idea what happens in my church (a church founded by the minister, who bought the chairs before he bought the building), and sorry to disappoint you, but you are way out on this one.....totally incorrect.

''another part of what tells me that, is your style of posting....''

What has my style of posting got to do with my beliefs? What on earth has it got to do with how my chuch may, or may not work? I have been attending the church since 2002......I have been writing....in much the same manner....on various subjects.....for 30-40 years. Sheesh......how weird, to say that. I thought my posting style was due to the fact that, I try to use the Queen's English, to the best of my ability, I'm reasonably intelligent, and was educated fairly Ok and was brought up with a mother who had the same kind of English usage.

''I will ask one thing.... does god give others the power to decide what messages are shared or do others take on that mantle of power for themselves, and in doing so, prevent messages being shared, that need to be shared.....''

I think I have already covered this...apart from the god bit! Guess what...I don't believe in God!

''and before you even post,''
Gosh!

''I can tell you that while you may not defend the church, you will support the way things are done, you will look over the merits of the awareness groups and support their way of doing things.... and justify their reasoning for filtering out messages or whom shares them...... and refer to gods guidance in such matters.... ''

Not so.......I am not known for supporting anyone or anything, just because he/she/it may mean a lot to me.

I neither support, nor condemn the way different spiritual people work. That is the beauty of Spiritualism.....we tend to accept that people will worship, believe, disbelieve what they want and we bless them for having views.....even if we...as individuals.....disagree.

I don't stay with my church, because it is a Spiritualist church, but because of the people...some of the best I have ever met and we all look at things in different ways and when they welcomed me. with open arms...they knew what I was.....an individual with some ideas which they could not fathom....but they are my ideas and beliefs and sacred to me, therefore to be respected.

''but you will not be able to really justify the way that people decide what is shared by who...''

Bull.....Mediums all work differently. Some will give more in open than others.....but they are still careful to interpret things correctly and wisely.

''and you will use the stance that the right people are chosen to share the right messages to the right person.....''

LOLOLOL.....Oh don't be silly LDD. I have seen mediums struggle to even ''tune in,'' and I have seen people, say ''No,'' after ''No,'' to the Medium, sometimes causing the medium to pull away and move on, or about five minutes later, the person who said ''No,'' to everything, will suddenly say...''Oh, yeah.'' Some people will even block a Medium, I know I do and I can do it quite deliberately.

''and ignore the aspect that the right people can be chosen to share the right messages to the right people, but the church doesn't allow that to happen... they prefer their way of doing things....and that can cause people not to hear what is meant for their ears cos its not shared cos of the churches stance.....''

Oh, ! never ignore anything and if I thought that happened....I'd say so. I'm known for speaking my mind. My Church doesn't have a 'stance'....not the kind you infer.....it doesn't happen like that at all.

You are so, so wrong. I can only think, that you are going by personal experience.

''and that, canticle, is why you can not see in the forum, what many people do see..''

Well, LDD, what Spiritulism has got to do...and I mean this discussion, with the forum and what one may or may not see, is beyond me...but then, you said it would be.

I think I am as capable of seeing, within this forum, just as much as others can see. maybe I see things, that you do not notice, or that others choose to ignore. We all view things in different ways. Very different ways.

Love and light

C

[Canticle]

''So...uh, We've gone from mud-slinging and bitch-slapping each other to getting into a religious debate?

Oh dear.

This doesn't bode well.''


Never was any of that.

[Canticle]

lol. nope not religion..... its a aspect of human interaction..... people will try to live their life in a set way according to their beliefs and reconcile their beliefs with their opinions.... and when human nature and beliefs / opinions, clash.... then we end up with the * church * effect....

what that is, is simply the trying to be polite, light filled and understanding of all people and things, and denying the other side of things..... spirituality is full of the *positive / light filled / use your energy to change the world * teachings.... and it fails more times than giving viagra to a eunuch

the same effect is found in christianity when christians try to reconcile the old testament laws with the teachings of jesus..... they contradict each other.... so you have christians preaching * love thou neighbour * while preaching that god hates homosexuals .....

it amuses me how humankind constantly does it.... aims for the PC / postive thinking / enlightened, image..... when what we should be doing is going for the * contented and neutral * aspect.....

the understanding that we are one person in a diverse world
the knowledge that the world is diverse so we can define ourselves in it
the wisdom to realise that things will change over time, and that will change us....
and the intelligence to realise that we spend 5% of our time fighting for change in the world and 95% of our time, bitching about how the world is not right according to our view point....

me, I am just content to allow the world to implode as I watch everybody else fighting for their beliefs, only to find that so is everybody else in the world and nobody will win in the long run, cos 99% of the world can not agree on anything....

LOLOLOL and all this was triggered by that charlatan's advert. The Spirit moves in wondrous ways, it's marvels to perform.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

Wait wait wait! There was bitch-slapping and I missed it??? lol
Come on People..just breathe and dont get roped into explosive discussions..:}
Cat

[Canticle]

I do so wish, that my signal would not cut out, when I want to edit a post. So annoying.

''How boring life would be, without indepth, serious discussion. Intelligent discussion tends to become explosive, at times. Other times, it folows that an interesting subject will be used, as a platform for ideas, information and views, to be exchanged....or knowledge imparted. Serious discussion allows for growth and learning.

Serious discussion, whatever the subject matter, is a little like the Ambrosia and Nectar, fed to the gods on Mount Olympus. It nourishes and sustains and sometimes brings great joy and satisfaction''

[darkeyes]

I do so wish, that my signal would not cut out, when I want to edit a post. So annoying.

''How boring life would be, without indepth, serious discussion. Intelligent discussion tends to become explosive, at times. Other times, it folows that an interesting subject will be used, as a platform for ideas, information and views, to be exchanged....or knowledge imparted. Serious discussion allows for growth and learning.

Serious discussion, whatever the subject matter, is a little like the Ambrosia and Nectar, fed to the gods on Mount Olympus. It nourishes and sustains and sometimes brings great joy and satisfaction''

..an wenya hav a gud rant or even a considered post.. an ya find ya havta sign bak in.. an then ya signal goes..an for 1 reason or totha ya cant recova wotyas ritten..that reelly gets on the tits...:eek: ..an 2cd time round is nev as gud as 1st.. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Canticle]

..an wenya hav a gud rant or even a considered post.. an ya find ya havta sign bak in.. an then ya signal goes..an for 1 reason or totha ya cant recova wotyas ritten..that reelly gets on the tits...:eek: ..an 2cd time round is nev as gud as 1st.. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Fran, you are so, so right. I've had that happen to me. One can never recover the 'moment.' (Had to be a little flowery......dramatic hand gestures there...and NOOO...not a one or two finger ''up yours'' to the Internet.....the theatrical kind). You come back to type the post again and you just can't.

My problem is...I'm in what is actually my son's room and the signal is naff. I wasn't well and his bedroom, being downstairs and me not being able to walk well....it seemed logical. I'm fine now....but have sort of settled here for awhile. Sonny boy is living with his girlfriend, so all is well, there.....but the signal......

If I am wanting to post anything...anywhere...of any length....I have now taken to typing it on word first...saving it and then posting.....but there is always that spur of the moment, ten page tome, which has to be constructed...and if the signal goes...well...you're up the Khyber Pass without a Recon Unit......I think....LOL

[darkeyes]

Fran, you are so, so right. I've had that happen to me. One can never recover the 'moment.' (Had to be a little flowery......dramatic hand gestures there...and NOOO...not a one or two finger ''up yours'' to the Internet.....the theatrical kind). You come back to type the post again and you just can't.

My problem is...I'm in what is actually my son's room and the signal is naff. I wasn't well and his bedroom, being downstairs and me not being able to walk well....it seemed logical. I'm fine now....but have sort of settled here for awhile. Sonny boy is living with his girlfriend, so all is well, there.....but the signal......

If I am wanting to post anything...anywhere...of any length....I have now taken to typing it on word first...saving it and then posting.....but there is always that spur of the moment, ten page tome, which has to be constructed...and if the signal goes...well...you're up the Khyber Pass without a Recon Unit......I think....LOL

Dus the Word thing an all .. saves hassle..but sumtimes on spur a the mo..me jus wades in.. an thats wer probs start... sumtimes me wishes me didn hav me tempa... o well..

[Canticle]

Dus the Word thing an all .. saves hassle..but sumtimes on spur a the mo..me jus wades in.. an thats wer probs start... sumtimes me wishes me didn hav me tempa... o well..

you....a temper...nah....i can't believe that...lol :bigrin:

[brutal_priestess]

Wait wait wait! There was bitch-slapping and I missed it??? lol
Come on People..just breathe and dont get roped into explosive discussions..:}
Cat

Oh poo. Where's the fun in that? Little bit o' friction goes a long way. ;)

[shybipinay]

Originally Posted by Cherokee_Mountaincat
Wait wait wait! There was bitch-slapping and I missed it??? lol
Come on People..just breathe and dont get roped into explosive discussions..:}
Cat

Isn't this one of the control issues canticle was speaking about?

[Canticle]

Isn't this one of the control issues canticle was speaking about?

I will have to re=read my posts, but I'm quite sure I didn't talk about anyone controlling anything. The word ''control'' was mentioned in a few posts by LDD and myself, but about quite a different subject.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

Isn't this one of the control issues canticle was speaking about?

No Shybi..I am not about control at all, just trying to get folks to lighten up a bit. The OP was asking a serious question, and its gone completely off topic, and is getting very close to being exactly what he's talking about.
Hve a nice evening. :}
Cat

[Canticle]

Isn't this one of the control issues canticle was speaking about?

I was right. I only mentioned the word control in reply to posts, from LDD to me, about Spiritualism.

[tenni]

Denial is not a river in Egypt.

I've written about control issues on this site. It has been written by several posters that what has happened is that various posters want to have threads of a variety of formats and some are serious. Accept it and read the ones that you want. Follow rule 2 and that includes avoiding vague negative insults that are generalized to "some people". That flames every poster on that thread. Not nice.

[TwylaTwobits]

Denial is not a river in Egypt.

I've written about control issues on this site. It has been written by several posters that what has happened is that various posters want to have threads of a variety of formats and some are serious. Accept it and read the ones that you want. Follow rule 2 and that includes avoiding vague negative insults that are generalized to "some people". That flames every poster on that thread. Not nice.

Exactly, Tenni :)

[Canticle]

Isn't this one of the control issues canticle was speaking about?

No Shybi..I am not about control at all, just trying to get folks to lighten up a bit. The OP was asking a serious question, and its gone completely off topic, and is getting very close to being exactly what he's talking about.
Hve a nice evening. :}
Cat

The OP asked a question....or made a statement, which ever way you wish to look at it. The item has been discussed, other questions raised, answers not received. The conversation moved on, taking in other areas, also.

The thread went slightly off topic and yet not and returned to serious discussion. Someone places an advert on the thread, so this becomes part of the conversation. The conversation moves on.

This is showing the OP, that things change, evolve, grow and yet, return to the beginning. Questions still asked, answers not received, posters being told not to think that agreement in one area means an ally in all other areas.

It is called communication. It is called intelligent, intellectual conversation. It is interesting. It is informative and it is also very revealing. All is as it should be.

I think you have enough threads for people to do the 'lightening up,' you are so desperate for them to do. It should not trouble you that others wish to discuss matters in another manner.

[Long Duck Dong]

thanks, canticle, you just proved what I was pointing out......

control is not what we seek to have in a forum.... its what we seek to have in ourselves, when things happen that reveal the issues in ourselves that we do not want to admit to or deal with.......
I deliberately use posts and wording in a way that can reveal peoples own issues and inabilities to settle and remain stable..... for me its childs play, using energy within the words....

there is no intelligent discussion..... merely a exchange of energy within words.... when we talk about intelligent discussion, we are only referring to posts that are on the level we like to communicate, at

90% of the reason we have see a lot of issues and * heavy * posts in the site, is simply cos its been so easy for me to get people to get worked up and post their opinions, then when they be worked up and post..... they realise that what they express as a opinion and what they really think.... are very different.... so they react aggressively to me.... not cos of any name calling or abuse, but cos I have revealed themselves to themselves....and they do not like their own reflections.....

jeannie is a example..... she didn't do anything wrong... all she did was reveal to herself, issues that she was not facing or coping with..... but rather than simply face her own issues.... she went after me, for revealing them to her.....

another one is the person that was happy to refer to me as of low level education for not seeing things on their level..... yet, they ended up acting like a child in a sand pit cos they could not own all of the toys and dictate what was done with the sand.....

its not abusive attacks or name calling etc.... its a simple observation ....

there is nobody trying to control the forum.... merely people not wanting the forum to become something that they do not life or feel comfortable with.....
so they are pointing at cats willingness to smile and laugh.... as a desire to control the forum..... when infact, cat just loves to smile and laugh with many of the others on the site that smile and laugh too.......
btw smiling and laughing is a aspect of being human and human nature....

[Canticle]

''thanks, canticle, you just proved what I was pointing out...... ''

Don't thank me LDD, for I fear you are very wrong. I have not not proven what you were pointing out. Not on any level

''control is not what we seek to have in a forum.... its what we seek to have in ourselves, when things happen that reveal the issues in ourselves that we do not want to admit to or deal with.......''

Now the only time the word ''control'' was used until very recently, on this thread, was in the posts we exchanged...about Spiritualism.

I really do not understand what you are trying to say here. It is fairly obvious, that no one should wish to see anyone trying to control a forum. A forum is about free speech and the exchange of ideas etc....or it should be.

However, as we are but mere mortals, none of us are perfect and there will be times, when events, such as happened with Jeannie's comments, will occur. Such is life.

In what way do we seek to have control in ourselves. Do you mean self control and self discipline?

''when things happen that reveal the issues in ourselves that we do not want to admit to or deal with.......''

To what do you allude by this remark and of whom do you speak.....the members as a whole.....or individuals? What are the issues. that people do not want to admit to, or deal with?

''I deliberately use posts and wording in a way that can reveal peoples own issues and inabilities to settle and remain stable..... for me its childs play, using energy within the words....''

Really, is this what you really do? Are you honestly trying to say that you are such a deft hand at wordmanship, that you can get people to ''reveal peoples own issues and their inabilities to settle and remain stable.''

What exactly do you mean by this? Who have revealed their issues and their inability to settle and remain stable and in what way?

It's seems a rather strange and disturbing thing, to see you post that.. ''for me its childs play, using energy within the words....'' It comes across as mildly sinister.....although I am sure you did not mean it to appear that way.

''there is no intelligent discussion..... merely a exchange of energy within words.... when we talk about intelligent discussion, we are only referring to posts that are on the level we like to communicate, at''

I disagree, there is much intelligent discussion and for there to be a discussion, there obviously has to be an exchange of words....this is a forum...not a face to face conversation. If there is any energy in words, then it should be, of the kind, that allows for those ideas, beliefs, views, to be expressed in a clear and simple manner.

Most people would agree with you, for we tend to communicate much better, with people of a similar intellect.....but this is not always the case and it would be far too elitist to claim that people of different intellects cannot communicate with one another, upon the same subject. It would also, be extremely ignorant, to have that view.

So, I'll say this. I believe you to be wrong.

''90% of the reason we have see a lot of issues and * heavy * posts in the site, is simply cos its been so easy for me to get people to get worked up and post their opinions,''

Are you claiming that you are responsible for people posting at great length upon this thread and are you claiming that you deliberately try to goad people into lengthy and passionate replies? If so, why?

Somehow, I think that you are being a little over confident, in that area.

''then when they be worked up and post..... they realise that what they express as a opinion and what they really think.... are very different.... so they react aggressively to me.... not cos of any name calling or abuse, but cos I have revealed themselves to themselves....and they do not like their own reflections.....''

So you are here talking about 90% of the posts of any great length and you are claiming that the energy of your words, causes people to get worked up and express an opinion about something, when they don't really believe what they are typing. Are you for real? Do you really believe that you have that power?

''they react aggressively to me.... not cos of any name calling or abuse, but cos I have revealed themselves to themselves....and they do not like their own reflections.....''

So, you are here to get people to reveal themselves to themselves and make them look in the mirror and not like what they see. Why would you want to do that? This post reads to me, as you being almost over pleased with yourself, for the ability, you think you may have. I'm seeing a very different side of LDD and it doesn't come over as very nice.

''jeannie is a example..... she didn't do anything wrong... all she did was reveal to herself, issues that she was not facing or coping with..... but rather than simply face her own issues.... she went after me, for revealing them to her.....''

How is Jeannie such an example, if you think you can do this with others? Who are you, to claim that you made her reveal things to herself. I thought it was more than one person she attacked.

''another one is the person that was happy to refer to me as of low level education for not seeing things on their level..... yet, they ended up acting like a child in a sand pit cos they could not own all of the toys and dictate what was done with the sand.....''

My goodness, you are pleased with yourself. Why even be bothered that someone should think you uneducated. You obviously know that schooling and education are two very different things. Life itself, is an education.

''its not abusive attacks or name calling etc.... its a simple observation ....''

I think that you are trying to say a little more than that.

''there is nobody trying to control the forum.... merely people not wanting the forum to become something that they do not life or feel comfortable with.....''

Once again it is you, who mentions the word control. You seem to forget that other people may want the forum to be many other things. As people are always saying, one does not have to read the threads one does not like.

There is no site to ''take back,'' for there are many different people upon this site and they all have differing views. Those who may not agree with some others are not assholes, morons, idiots ot troublemakers. They just have a different outlook. Troublemakers will insult all.

To refer to people that one does not agree with as assholes, morons, idiots and troublemakers, is in itself, an insult.

''so they are pointing at cats willingness to smile and laugh.... as a desire to control the forum..... when infact, cat just loves to smile and laugh with many of the others on the site that smile and laugh too.......''

I don't think this is the case at all. If you will read my very long post at the beginning of this thread, maybe you will understand what I mean. You will certainly not goad me, into saying anything that you can come back and attack me for saying.

Cat is one member, as are you, as am I, as is each individual member and as what should be free spirits, we should have the right to express ourselves how we like, without being told that posts are too long...or too short....without being insulted...or do any insulting....without anyone being referred to as an asshole, a moron, an idiot or a trouble maker, and without someone commenting that the three personae can be seen in the one post.

People should also be free to open silly threads, humorous threads, sad threads, threads that ask questions, threads to share poems, stories, life events. If it is OK to be jovial, then it is Ok to be serious. Those who wish to be more serious, on occasion, don't require telling, to get less serious, for many will already be posting on threads with lighter content.

''btw smiling and laughing is a aspect of being human and human nature....''

LDD, I am so glad that you recognise that fact. I think the majority of people do. We don't need telling...it comes as something natural to people who love and care about their fellow human beings. Don't you think.

And now for some words with a lot of power and energy.....

Love and light

C

[Long Duck Dong]

lol ok
I never said what I was referring to.....so its a lil hard to say that you have proven me wrong.... without knowing what you have proven....

what I actually said was very simple.....

we fear revealing ourselves as we truly are, so we present a image of how we want to be seen...... and deny the truth about ourselves.... while pointing out the faults with others....

or the * church effect *.... we do not truly believe in what we say and think, so we only walk paths that do not reveal that fact to others.....

now when I referred to you and the church.... I already knew what was going on within the church..... and with you..... simply by the way you were posting..... thats why I referred to god in regards to the guidance in the church..... and watched you state that you do not believe in god.....

that proved me right.....


btw.... I have no issues with what people post, how they post, or the way they post.... I just find it amusing, how little people actually believe in what they say.....

now its no great hidden skill or ability that I have.... its a simple understanding of human nature and the way people interrelate.... and no I do not post to goad people into fights..... all i do is post in a forum and watch people try to batter me down with words and statements, in a attempt to prove themselves right.... and when they realise that what they think, doesn't match what they preach.... they back pedal... and change tact then post using abusive or flaming statements.... or simple just over complicate things.....

[mrplayfuluk]

if this had been a face to face debate I'd have left ages ago... LDD makes a long statement to Canticle and she breaks it down into bits in reply to the point that anyone else joining in just gets brushed aside as they wade into each other with long tracts disagreeing with each other. Maybe you two should start your own posting and we can leave you to it, or maybe you should both get on Skype and have a chat. I'm all for briefer commentary and lots of different opinions... banter; as Daffyd said earlier ( I think. it was a while ago) I'm getting lost so I'm gonna park this one.

Hey Brutal how have you been?

[darkeyes]

[QUOTE=mrplayfuluk;165936]if this had been a face to face debate I'd have left ages ago... LDD makes a long statement to Canticle and she breaks it down into bits in reply to the point that anyone else joining in just gets brushed aside as they wade into each other with long tracts disagreeing with each other. QUOTE]

Not jus LDD an Canticle do that hun.. it happens a lot in otha threads.. huge yappie punch up.. sumtimes its fun an iunterestin sumtimes it is rite dull an pointless.. Duckie don haff get involved in a lotta them tho... Falcie, Pasa, Tenni an othas..an hav dun it mesel.. nowt like a gud argy bargy.. :tong:

[littlerayofsunshine]

..an wenya hav a gud rant or even a considered post.. an ya find ya havta sign bak in.. an then ya signal goes..an for 1 reason or totha ya cant recova wotyas ritten..that reelly gets on the tits...:eek: ..an 2cd time round is nev as gud as 1st.. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Fran my sweets,

One way to stifle the frustration of poor server connection, is to highlight, right click and copy everything you wrote before pressing send. I trick I frequently use, for that just in case it gets killed moment.

*fluffs your luffly tidgies*

[Canticle]

''lol ok''

Ain't laughing in the Northern Hemisphere...being serious!

''I never said what I was referring to.....so its a lil hard to say that you have proven me wrong.... without knowing what you have proven....''

I think it was fairly obvious to what you were referring.

''what I actually said was very simple.....''

If it was that simple, then you sure put a lot of words of energy, into the ''referring to.''

''we fear revealing ourselves as we truly are, so we present a image of how we want to be seen...... and deny the truth about ourselves.... while pointing out the faults with others....''

Why should one fear revealing oneself as one truly is? I don't!! I never present an image to the world of ''how I want to be seen.'' There would be no point in that. What you see, is what you get, with me.

There is never any need to deny the truth about ourselves. I would agree that plenty of people do and in doing do, do present that false image to the world, lying through their teeth and not giving a damn who they hurt.

These are also the people who cannot bear, generally speaking, to have their faults pointed out. There is nothing wrong in pointing out another's faults, as long as it is done, in the form of constructive criticism and not base language, unnecessary insults and cruel words.

Unfortunately, the people that deliberately mislead, tend to make others angry and then the angry, or the wronged, slip into handing back, what was given out and they may do it, far better than the wrongdoer.

''or the * church effect *.... we do not truly believe in what we say and think, so we only walk paths that do not reveal that fact to others.....''

Hate to disappoint you but this tigger doesn't suffer from this *church effect,* of which you speak.

I'm going to say....''hogwash,'' here! I cannot speak for you, or others, but I most certainly, truly believe what I say. ''think and walk paths that do not reveal that fact to others''...LIKE HELL!! Why on earth would anyone want to pretend that they believe and think something, if they do not?

I guess I must be different. You really are one very confused person, if you believe that all people behave in such a manner.

''now when I referred to you and the church.... I already knew what was going on within the church.....''

OK, Sunshine, you tell me exactly what is going on within my Spiritualist Church, because you don't know what the heck you are talking about.

''and with you..... simply by the way you were posting.....''

Please enlighten me LDD. This is fascinating. What is going on with or within me. Please tell me.

''thats why I referred to god in regards to the guidance in the church..... and watched you state that you do not believe in god.....''

The church is actually the congregation and a Christian Spiritulist Church, isn't all that different from any other Christian Church.....it is full of people and where you get people, you will get differing ideas, confrontation and dogma.

Happily, in the Spiritualist church this does tend to get kept to a minimum and Spiritualists are, on the whole loving, tolerant, kind, caring people, but being human beings, they are no more perfect than any others upon this planet.

Do you know the difference between the Christian Spiritualist Churches and the Spiritualist National Union? If you don't, allow me to enlighten you.

Christian Spiritualist Churches are just that...Christian. The Spiritualist National Union Churches, will have only pure Spirit mentioned, and not teachings of other religions, their prophets, or their messiahs. Pure Spirit.

I'm not sure that they even refer to this as God....but then god is just a word.

But I don't believe in God, a god, a creator god. Why would I say that I didn't, if the truth were opposite to the statement? I don't believe in God, in the same way as I never ever believed that Jesus was the son of any god, that there was no virgin birth, no betrayal by a man called Judas.

If I state something about what I believe, or disbelieve, it will be the truth. It will be what people at my church will have heard and what my friends will have heard, in conversations, with me. I always say what I think!

However, this does not mean I am an atheist. Perish the thought. But if I say, I don't believe in God, by hell, I mean it.

''that proved me right.....''

What were you proven correct about? You haven't answered that one. Reminds me, a little, of the creationists, who never answer my questions. However, I will not bore you, with commentary about such discussions, or singing to a music hating Muslim. How can one not like ''Singin' in the rain''?

''btw.... I have no issues with what people post, how they post, or the way they post....''

LDD, that is so good to hear....or read......but, I'm not convinced by that statement. And if you are very spiritually aware......and I mean aware.....you will know and understand why I am not convinced, because, beneath what I am calling ''hogwash.'' You know....what I have just commented upon, you will understand that I am very spiritually aware.....incredibly so.

''I just find it amusing, how little people actually believe in what they say.....''

How quaint, to find amusement, in what you either are, or may well be, totally incorrect about. Like I have already said, I most certainly believe what I say and if others say things and do not believe what they are posting, thinking, saying......that is their problem....but I can't understand why people should do that.

''now its no great hidden skill or ability that I have....''

True, very true.

''its a simple understanding of human nature and the way people interrelate....''

Are you unique, in this ability?

''and no I do not post to goad people into fights.....''

That's not how your previous post came across.

''all i do is post in a forum and watch people try to batter me down with words and statements, in a attempt to prove themselves right....''

I doubt that you are the only one to get battered down. Are we all not cogs in the same wheel?

''and when they realise that what they think, doesn't match what they preach.... they back pedal... and change tact then post using abusive or flaming statements.... or simple just over complicate things.....''

Once again, I disagree with you, for there is no point posting what is not truly in ones heart and is not what one believes. If people back pedal, then their whole point, in the first place, must have been to cause tensions, arguments, thus giving them the opportunity to become abusive....or that annoying word ''flaming.''

What you call over complicating things, is your personal opinion and maybe the opinion of others. It can also be the opinion that we all have.....in certain situations. Perhaps some people find insulting, those things which you may wish to dismiss. Please refer to my previous post. I think you will catch my drift.

Respectfully

C

[darkeyes]

Fran my sweets,

One way to stifle the frustration of poor server connection, is to highlight, right click and copy everything you wrote before pressing send. I trick I frequently use, for that just in case it gets killed moment.

*fluffs your luffly tidgies*

OMG!!!! Rayyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!! Jeez...me tidgies hav missed that..they fully restored 2 full health now... ty darlin' Ray.. wot wud me do wivoutya??

..an ta for the advice..nev thotta that.. brain dead tart at times me.. now don u dare stay way so long.. tidgies cry out for regular fluffin...an no1 fluffs quite like me lil ray a sunshine..:bigrin:

[Canticle]

''if this had been a face to face debate I'd have left ages ago... LDD makes a long statement to Canticle and she breaks it down into bits in reply to the point that anyone else joining in just gets brushed aside as they wade into each other with long tracts disagreeing with each other. Maybe you two should start your own posting and we can leave you to it, or maybe you should both get on Skype and have a chat. I'm all for briefer commentary and lots of different opinions... banter; as Daffyd said earlier ( I think. it was a while ago) I'm getting lost so I'm gonna park this one.

Hey Brutal how have you been?''

One will keep this as brief as possible. Debate is good and if a face to face debate, the ned to use as many words, is not always necessary. I answered a post made to me and I did it my way. There is no reaso for anyone else to feel brushed aside. One just joins in, using as many, or as few words, as one wishes. Actually this ''breaking down,'' as you call it, was tame. I have been known to reply to emails, taking it sentence by sentence. I don't think I ever got to word by word. I have had four long years, in which to get used to answering emails, in such a fashion and because it was necessary, not because it was enjoyable.

There can still be lots of opinions...there can sill be banter....no matter how long, or short the posts may be. Skype...no thanks! I wasted too much of my life, communicating with someone on MSN.....as the song goes ''We w(d)on't get fooled again''

There would be no point in having a separate thread. It would be meaningless if taken away from this one.

''Not jus LDD an Canticle do that hun.. it happens a lot in otha threads.. huge yappie punch up.. sumtimes its fun an iunterestin sumtimes it is rite dull an pointless.. Duckie don haff get involved in a lotta them tho... Falcie, Pasa, Tenni an othas..an hav dun it mesel.. nowt like a gud argy bargy..''

Moi.....get involved in a yappie punch up....Oh, No.....I'm too much of a lady (depending upon the person involved and if the moon is full....Yikes...it is!!!). Never a punch up, tho'.......more a flicking ink blots affair (not that I ever did that).

You know me by now Fran, fights like a she cat for what she believes in (and loves), defends anyone being attacked and takes to task, anyone not being truthful. Also tends to ask questions, until I get an answer and if there is no answer forthcoming, then it tells me that someone didn't have a lot to say about a matter, in the first place. And free speech...paramount.

[tenni]

"Not jus LDD an Canticle do that hun.. it happens a lot in otha threads.. huge yappie punch up.. sumtimes its fun an iunterestin sumtimes it is rite dull an pointless.. Duckie don haff get involved in a lotta them tho... Falcie, Pasa, Tenni an othas..an hav dun it mesel.. nowt like a gud argy bargy.."

Well, I never....:eek: oh yes I do:rolleyes: We have our different styles though.

hmm..... If we translated franspeak into complete sentences might they also fit the criteria.....sometimes? :bigrin:

[Canticle]

''Well, I never....:eek: oh yes I do:rolleyes: We have our different styles though.

hmm..... If we translated franspeak into complete sentences might they also fit the criteria.....sometimes? :bigrin:''

I'll tell you what, tenni, franspeak is a darn sight easier to understand than guinea piguese, at times and I speak cavyspeak, fluently! ;)

[mrplayfuluk]

whatever....