transsexuality

[DeafF2M]

I'm just opening up this forum to discuss transgenderism and transsexuality. I'm a female to male transsexual (FTM), who is also bisexual.

I've often found that people who have not had exposure to TG/TS issues are confused about what that really means, so I wanted to offer my expertise, such that it is.

I transitioned 5 years ago. The gist of it is... I lived for 32 years in a body that just didn't work for me... trying to be a "woman" that I was not. After years of denial and finally exploring my true gender identity, I began to seek out therapy and ultimately, to transition.

I started taking testosterone 5 years ago and had chest surgery in my first year. If you look at my profile, you will see a picture of me.. I'm unmistakebly masculine in appearance and if you know me, you will see my behavior and mannerisms are also masculine. I have not had lower surgery (adding a dick to me)

As this relates to my bisexuality, FTMs are often challenged with finding understanding partners who have no problems seeing them as male, regardless of whatever genitals they may have. We are often seen as freaks, or as "the best of both worlds"... but, we just want to be seen as the men we are. MTFs just want to be the women they know themselves to be.

Would love to see a world that wasn't so hung up on what's between my legs and how I present myself to the world. I'm dreaming, of course.

Anyway, if you folks have questions about TS folks, feel free to ask them here. I can help, to the best of my ability.

Alex

[Snafu]

Hi Alex. I will take you up on the offer to ask questions.

First of all, I checked out your picture, and you are quite cute!

I recently hired someone who initially set off my gaydar as lesbian, but then everyone else whom I can speak to these things with at work registered him as a gay male or effeminate male. And I thought he was (still is) about the cutest thing in the world. I really don't know (and of course it isn't my business) if he is trans or intersexed or what but I find it so odd my reaction to him. My reaction isn't the same as with people born male and it is more like with a really butch lesbian, minus the intimidation I generally feel. So my first question is...when one is attracted to a trans person, is normal to be confused about how you respond to them? I don't know if that makes any sence. And I guess I wasn't really aware that when I feel attracted to a man, that it is different than with a woman until that experience.

Do you find that people who desire to go out with trans people tend to consider themselves straight, bisexual, or gay? Or is it all over the place, like with so many things regarding sexuality and gender?

Also, here is a some what related question that you might be able to answer. Is it considered "gender" when people talk about butch and femme? Or would that be considered the expression of ones gender? And do questions about being butch and femme extend into questions about gender?

Also, how long does it take, taking hormones, to get to the point where you grow of facial hair? Does it look weird at first and normal after a longer time? Does ones hair growth or loss pattern on ones head change? Are there other changes that one wouldn't expect?

If you are with a trans person and you have sex (I am sure everyone is different...but your thoughts?) do you think most F to M s like to be touched like a woman and do things that two women (assuming the other person is female) or would it be more like heterosexual sex. Again, I am sure there is no one answer, but if you can shed some light on this, that would be cool.

As an added note, I have been thinking lately (since the person I hired) about how our dress code is different for men and women and the more I think about it, it doesn't seem right that a person would have to even decide or know or be a particular gender or the other to decide what they should wear to work. What if a person were gender neutral, and felt that way, what right to does a work place have to say that their genitals or what it it says on their drivers license dictates their gender and there fore which dress code they wear. Thank you for offering to answer questions about this! Gen

[Sex in Words]

Thank you for starting this thread, I'll be reading intently.
When Drew started the site up and I began cruising around it, when I noticed that he had included trans identification, I gave out an audible "Hell ya!" So few glb sites include trans people and I hope you continue to offer your insight and perspective.
jon

[mike9753]

i have been fascinated by this ever since I became aware that there were TVs, TSs, CD, etc. By fascinated I mean sexually aroused by the image of a feminine man, dressed as a woman, in sexy lingerie, with a functional cock. I have experimented with lingerie and found it to be intensely erotic and satisfying. I have a slightly submissive side but I don't think it is a feminine one. I still love women and I am married to a fantastic woman who I am deeply in love with, but I can't help fantasizing about dressing and being with a man or another CD.

So I guess my question has to do with the differences between a person who feels or for that matter who knows that they were born into the wrong body and wants to have reassignment surgery to correct a biological error and for those of us who feel ok in our own male or female bodies, but are aroused and attracted to the notion of dressing, at least for erotic play as in the clothing of the opposite sex. I am not sure if I am being clear but would love to hear others react to my stumbling through this thought.
m

[DeafF2M]

WOW... lots of questions...I'll answer them to the best of my ability... My responses are below your questions..

<snip>First of all, I checked out your picture, and you are quite cute!<snip>

THANKS! :bigrin:

<snip>So my first question is...when one is attracted to a trans person, is normal to be confused about how you respond to them? I don't know if that makes any sence. And I guess I wasn't really aware that when I feel attracted to a man, that it is different than with a woman until that experience. <snip>

It varies... I've been around people that knew I was trans but didn't show an attraction to me that was any different from any other man they were attracted to. Then again, I've been around people attracted to me, but didn't know what to make of it.

A lot of it is your own comfort levels with gender and sexuality. I firmly believe both are quite fluid. I don't necessarily believe in 100% heterosexuality, nor 100% homosexuality... I believe it is ALWAYS possible to be attracted to someone different at least once in your life.

Now, because I'm a man, now... if I were with another man, I'd be in a gay relationship. With a woman, a straight relationship. Even so, there is always the queer element, in the fact that I am trans.

<snip>Do you find that people who desire to go out with trans people tend to consider themselves straight, bisexual, or gay? Or is it all over the place, like with so many things regarding sexuality and gender? <snip>

Yes, it varies. I've known femme women who identify as lesbian, but they are attracted to FTMs, too. I've known bisexuals and I've known straights who are attracted to me. It's all over the map.

<snip>Also, here is a some what related question that you might be able to answer. Is it considered "gender" when people talk about butch and femme? Or would that be considered the expression of ones gender? And do questions about being butch and femme extend into questions about gender? <snip>

Butch and femme, in my mind, is about gender expression. However, that said, often FTMs have lived as butch dykes before transitioning, so it could be said that it IS a gender issue -- being butch was a starting point for them, allowing them the comfort of being in a masculine role.

At the same time, I know several butches who are very proud of their womanhood, but are masculine by nature. It varies, just like anything else.

<snip>Also, how long does it take, taking hormones, to get to the point where you grow of facial hair? Does it look weird at first and normal after a longer time? Does ones hair growth or loss pattern on ones head change? Are there other changes that one wouldn't expect? <snip>

Testosterone affects FTMs in various ways. Here are some things we expect to happen with "T". Body fat redistribution, muscle gain, hair growth, skin changes, changes in smell and appearance, and yes, male pattern baldness.

As to how fast it works... it varies. The average transition is about 5 to 7 years... usually within the first year or two, you are passing fully as male. I've seen some guys who transitioned very quickly -- beards and sideburns within 6 to 8 months.

For me, it took me two years and a half to get a decent goatee going. After 5 years, I still do not have a full beard and I have no chest hair, but some growth on my back and tummy, legs. I'm a late bloomer, I guess, or I will just be one of those smooth dudes.

So, it varies -- the human body experiences change on a very individual basis.

<snip>If you are with a trans person and you have sex (I am sure everyone is different...but your thoughts?) do you think most F to M s like to be touched like a woman and do things that two women (assuming the other person is female) or would it be more like heterosexual sex. Again, I am sure there is no one answer, but if you can shed some light on this, that would be cool.<snip>

No FTM I know likes to be thought of as a woman. So being touched as if we were women, would be offensive. Some of us like having our genitals touched, but I think the way you approach it is what's important. You treat the man as a MAN. You make love to him the way you would any other man.

Many of us also prefer to make love to a woman, as a heterosexual man, meaning, we will have intercourse, either with a dildo, with a penis that we've had surgically created. A caveat, many FTMs have not had lower surgery, due to cost and well, it ain't the most effective surgery yet... some of us are holding out til they are better able to perfect the surgery.

Bottom line, with any good sexual experience, communication is the key. You have to ask the guy what he prefers. Some guys are not comfortable being touched. Others are. Some have had lower surgery and others have not. And just like gay culture.. some guys are tops and some are bottoms.

To top it off, FTMs come in a wide range of sexual preferences. Some are straight, (preferring women), others are gay, and still others are bisexual. Some are very Vanilla, while others are into BDSM and leather (like myself).

<snip>As an added note, I have been thinking lately (since the person I hired) about how our dress code is different for men and women and the more I think about it, it doesn't seem right that a person would have to even decide or know or be a particular gender or the other to decide what they should wear to work. What if a person were gender neutral, and felt that way, what right to does a work place have to say that their genitals or what it it says on their drivers license dictates their gender and there fore which dress code they wear. Thank you for offering to answer questions about this! <snip>

I'm Deaf and I'm bisexual, coming from a very queer experience (11 years as a dyke).... I'm against discrimination in any form. People come from all walks of life. Accept it and move on. You don't have to walk in his shoes, just let him be.

Alex

P.S.... you're welcome! :flag1:

[DeafF2M]

Thank you for starting this thread, I'll be reading intently.
When Drew started the site up and I began cruising around it, when I noticed that he had included trans identification, I gave out an audible "Hell ya!" So few glb sites include trans people and I hope you continue to offer your insight and perspective.
jon


Thanks, Jon... the only thing is... the icon is wrong... I'm not a woman, but the icon is ... LOL Maybe I can convince them to find an FTM icon.

Alex

[DeafF2M]

i have been fascinated by this ever since I became aware that there were TVs, TSs, CD, etc. By fascinated I mean sexually aroused by the image of a feminine man, dressed as a woman, in sexy lingerie, with a functional cock. I have experimented with lingerie and found it to be intensely erotic and satisfying. I have a slightly submissive side but I don't think it is a feminine one. I still love women and I am married to a fantastic woman who I am deeply in love with, but I can't help fantasizing about dressing and being with a man or another CD.

So I guess my question has to do with the differences between a person who feels or for that matter who knows that they were born into the wrong body and wants to have reassignment surgery to correct a biological error and for those of us who feel ok in our own male or female bodies, but are aroused and attracted to the notion of dressing, at least for erotic play as in the clothing of the opposite sex. I am not sure if I am being clear but would love to hear others react to my stumbling through this thought.
m


Most cross dressers (men dressing as women) are actually married, heterosexual males, based on research I've read on the subject. While many dress simply because they enjoy the clothing and the opportunity to explore their feminine side, others do it because it arouses them.

Transsexuals ... we are NOT in it for sexual reasons. I didn't transition because it was a sexual thing for me. I transitioned because I knew I was male and needed to look male, to complete who I am.

That said... often transsexuals, when they begin their transitions, they dress in the clothing of the gender they identify as... sometimes for the first time. This is often before hormones. So, often they are misread as CDs, TVs, what have you... they are women, who are waiting to get on hormones. For transsexuals, "cross-dressing" is simply a beginning to our transition... it's not for sexual purposes.

It's always important that when you encounter a transgendered person or a cross dresser that you ask them how they prefer to be known... "he" "she"...

Alex

[Snafu]

Thank you Alex, for answering all of our questions! Very interesting and good to know!

G :)

[shastab24]

Well, I was hoping there would be a thread, at least, on this topic. Personally, I'm a male to female that is still in the early stages of transition. Heck, all I do is dress, but that will change after a while, when I get medical insurace and then see a counsellor. Man, I can't wait to get on hormones, but I also can't wait until I get my voice to become feminine (so many tips on this over the web that I am a little overwhelmed).

Too bad the result will not be functional. I would love to be able to get pregnant, but it is not to be.

[DeafF2M]

Well, I was hoping there would be a thread, at least, on this topic. Personally, I'm a male to female that is still in the early stages of transition. Heck, all I do is dress, but that will change after a while, when I get medical insurace and then see a counsellor. Man, I can't wait to get on hormones, but I also can't wait until I get my voice to become feminine (so many tips on this over the web that I am a little overwhelmed).

Too bad the result will not be functional. I would love to be able to get pregnant, but it is not to be.


I know the feeling. When I was in my early stages, I could not WAIT to get on hormones.

I should warn you though, most medical insurances do not cover transition related expenses. they MIGHT cover your therapy, but I wouldn't count on much else. It's a very frustrating part of the transition, having to pay for a lot of this out of pocket.

Of all the MTFs I know, most still have a fairly deep voice. Takes a lot of training and a lot of patience to be able to speak in a more feminine manner. I've met several transwomen who did quite well, though.

As for getting pregnant.. yeah... with me, I wish I could have a fully functional penis. I'd love to be able to squirt cum.... but, alas, I live with what I have. It isn't all bad. LOL

I wish you the best of luck! If you ever want to chat, you can find me on Yahoo messenger. Deaff2m

See ya'll

[tscraver]

Bimwm here who is into TS/TV/CDs. I like to dress and have this contant fantasy to meet and enjoy the pleasures that a "shemale" has to offer. That's not to say that a CD can't please or be pleased. Have been with a Cd and enjoyed the various thrills. Also have been with a couple where the wife wanted to see at least one of us "dressed".
I think most of us do not understand the transgendered. I'm sure there is constant internal turmoil to deal with their feelings. At my place of work we recently had to deal with the fact that a co-worker would be coming to work the next day dressed as a woman and awaiting the surgery. To discriminate would be to order up some heavy human rights issues and discipline.
I'm still looking for that thrill of being with a hot TS/TV.
Best to you all

[gayle]

Thanks for your openness Alex! & all!
My ex-husband was a cross-dresser. I found this out after we got married. It was quite the shock. I came home from work earlier than expected and found him sitting in the front room wearing a beautiful dress, hose, shoes, makeup and lingerie. I have no idea when he got the dress. I was so shocked at first that the only immediate reaction I could come up with was that HIS dress was far nicer than ANY of the clothing I owned. Well, from there, I discovered that he wanted me to pretend he was a woman when we were in bed. Talk about really shocking me! I'd never been around a CD, much less WITH one. I'm still not able to figure out what to make of the fact that he wanted me to pretend that he WAS a woman. We did, obviously, divorce but not over this issue. (We divorced because he was physically abusive to me and I feared that he would eventually kill me if I didn't get out of the marriage. . .)

I know it won't make a difference now (it won't change the past), but I'm just wondering what I should make of his behavior? The crossdressing and wanting me to pretend he was a woman when we had sex. Will it further confuse matters to reveal that after we separated, he had a homosexual relationship? He was a virgin when we met. (I did a little cradle robbing, marrying someone 9 years younger than myself.) I still hear from his family (but not him) occasionally and hear he is now married to a woman. I'm also told he suffers some form of mental illness but am not aware of the details of the illness and don't know if it impacted his cross dressing and sex life or not.

Ironic, but I waited 8 years after him to get involved with someone --- and then I get involved with a man who is bi. Naturally, I didn't know that he was bi until we'd been together for a few months. At this point, I'm ready to conclude that I am truly clueless about gender and sexuality issues!

Gayle

[DeafF2M]

Thanks for your openness Alex! & all!

I know it won't make a difference now (it won't change the past), but I'm just wondering what I should make of his behavior? The crossdressing and wanting me to pretend he was a woman when we had sex. Will it further confuse matters to reveal that after we separated, he had a homosexual relationship? He was a virgin when we met. I still hear from his family (but not him) occasionally and hear he is now married to a woman. I'm also told he suffers some form of mental illness but am not aware of the details of the illness and don't know if it impacted his cross dressing and sex life or not.

Ironic, but I waited 8 years after him to get involved with someone --- and then I get involved with a man who is bi. Naturally, I didn't know that he was bi until we'd been together for a few months. At this point, I'm ready to conclude that I am truly clueless about gender and sexuality issues!

Gayle

Wow, sounds like you've come across a whole caboodle of different things. The cross-dressing thing... it SOUNDS like, for your ex, it was primarily a sexual thing for him. He got off on pretending to be a woman. However, not knowing him, I could be way off base. Maybe it was an initial effort to explore who he really was, gender wise. I make no assumptions, except to say from what you've described, his cross-dressing appears to be sexual in nature.

There's basically two types of cross-dressers and you can actually be both, I would think... one is to dress in order to satisfy sexual fantasies, the other to dress in preparation for transition, or to explore gender identities.

As for the abusive relationship, I'm glad you had the guts to leave him. No one should ever be treated that way.

I am living proof that gender and sexuality can be quite fluid. I am MALE in every way, except for my genitals. At some point when I'm rich and famous and when surgeries are perfected, I'll be able to fix that minor infraction... but, my sexual preferences are all over the map. I'm bisexual, actually PANsexual.. I am also attracted to other transpeople.

Hope that helps. If you ever want to talk more about it, feel free to contact me.

Alex

[BiFtM4SexyFun]

Hi Alex, and everyone else.......I'm Eugene and I'm a transman too, so I thought I'd pop in this little tidbit that a Professor and I have talked about many times. Her theory, and mine as well, is that gender is on a continuum, or scale, like the Kinsey Scale for sexuality. Part of what that means, to me, is that rarely is anyone on the extreme end either way. Many of the very young trans-folk here are fighting the fight to just BE, and not have to choose one over the other.
One issue that I run across on the internet ALL the time is that when folks see the word transexual, they automatically think male-to-female. It has not occurred to many folks that there are some of us going the "other" way. Also, since we are lumped together with the LGB community, more than a few people believe that being trans is about sexuality, which it is not, as Alex has pointed out. Being bisexual and trans just seems logical to me, but plenty of other trans-folk ID as gay, lesbian, or str8.
As in almost all cases, whatever issue is being discussed, there is rarely EVER strictly black-and-white. There will always be shades of gray.
Thanks to Alex for starting this, and thanks to other members for your desire to be educated.
Sincerely,
Eugene

[DeafF2M]

Hi Alex, and everyone else.......I'm Eugene and I'm a transman too, so I thought I'd pop in this little tidbit that a Professor and I have talked about many times. Her theory, and mine as well, is that gender is on a continuum, or scale, like the Kinsey Scale for sexuality. Part of what that means, to me, is that rarely is anyone on the extreme end either way. Many of the very young trans-folk here are fighting the fight to just BE, and not have to choose one over the other.
One issue that I run across on the internet ALL the time is that when folks see the word transexual, they automatically think male-to-female. It has not occurred to many folks that there are some of us going the "other" way. Also, since we are lumped together with the LGB community, more than a few people believe that being trans is about sexuality, which it is not, as Alex has pointed out. Being bisexual and trans just seems logical to me, but plenty of other trans-folk ID as gay, lesbian, or str8.
As in almost all cases, whatever issue is being discussed, there is rarely EVER strictly black-and-white. There will always be shades of gray.
Thanks to Alex for starting this, and thanks to other members for your desire to be educated.
Sincerely,
Eugene

WHAHOO..... wondered if another transguy would ever join us! LOL Glad you're here, Eugene. Now maybe you and I can talk to Drew (the webmaster) about that icon for "T"... it's a female shape. We need one for the other way around.

Alex