"Is Your Baby Gay?"

[bohemian69]

I just read a rather disturbing article in the paper today. (by David Crary of the Associated Press)
It talked about the president of the leading Southern Baptist seminary
(R. Albert Mohler Jr.) who suggested that a biological basis for homosexuality may be proven and that prenatal treatment to reverse gay orientation would be 'biblically justified'. :eek:
He said that he had "...written the article intending to start a conversation....", but goes onto say that such proof would not alter the Bible's condemnation of homosexuality.

quote from the article : Mohler said he would strongly oppose any move to encourage abortion or genetic manipulation on fetuses on grounds of sexual orientation, but he would endorse prenatal treatment, if such technology were developed, to reverse homosexuality. He said this would be no different, in moral terms, to using technology that would restore vision to a blind fetus.
Backing him up is a prominent Roman Catholic thinker, the Rev. Joseph Fessio, provost of Ave Maria University in Naples, Fla.

Says the good Rev. : "Same sex activity is considered disordered. If there are ways to detecting disease or disorders of children in the womb, and a way of treating them that respected the dignity of the child and mother, it would be a wonderful advancement of science."
I would really like to know if anyone else gets chills down their spine whe nthey read stuff like this.
Be Afraid - Be Very Afraid........... :flag3:

[Tommy2020]

Oh God.... I can just see it now.....
SCENE ONE - The OB/GYN's OFFICE:
Expectant mother: Oh doctor, am I pregnant with a homosexual child?
Doctor: Mrs. / Ms. / Miss Jones, I have the pregnancy police in the outer office and they will watch me as I check for homosexual tendencies in your unborn.
Expectant mother: The pregnancy police? Oh oh, what are you doing..?? Why are you doing..??
Pregnancy police: Just lay quietly mam, we just want the facts, just the facts mam.
Doctor: Officer, you have your elbow in my eye.there... can you move please.
Pregnancy police: Sorry bout' that.
Expectant mother: What are you finding?
Doctor: Well, mam... looks like a normal boy except he is waving a multi-colored flag in there. There may be a problem.
Pregnancy police: Sorry mam, we will have to take you and the unblrn child to the quarantine station and treat this serious situation before he is born.
Expectant mother: But I have four more children at home I have to take care of.
Pregnancy police: We will turn them over to the state for safe keeping since we don't want them exposed to this homosexual malady whick is contagious.
Doctor: Mam, do you have insurance coverage for my services. No insurance will cover the quarantine and subsequent treatment of an unborn homosexual boy once you leave my office.
Expectant mother: Well.... uh....

Tune in next week for the further adventures of the PREGNANCY POLICE on PATROL....

(music.....)
Expectant mother:

[domill]

"...and my goldfish loves Cher. Should I be worried Doctor?"

That's pretty scary indeed. Do they actually say what the "cure" would consist in? Or is in that case abortion acceptable? Do they give a list of punishments for potentially gay kids?

"La route des Enfers est pavee de bonnes intentions"

[TorontoGuy2007]

it is my belief that sexuality and sexual orientation develops neurologically during pregnancy, therefore, there is really no way to tell, and obviously, no way to "change" it.

gee, these bible thumpers are annoying. they have bastardized their own religion so badly that someone like me is afraid to associate myself with them

[nothings5d]

It's because of people like that that I will be forever Agnostic. Even if I did find a religion I agreed with I'd never be able to claim that I did because I wouldn't want to be associated with people like that...

[darkeyes]

ahh the progressive mind of the religious zealot..makes ya wonder jus wer they cum from... all sounds like Nazi Germany 2 me...

[Mrs. Taz]

i would like to know how to know if a baby will be gay or bi when they grow up, is there anyway of determaning that at all?

[deletetacount123]

True sometimes you know someones gay when they are very very young. Sometimes theres nothing till the teen years when the teen starts becoming interested in people.
Sometimes some people can not know (or scared to come out) till later on in life, 20s, 30s, or older. They can even have gotten married to the oppsite gender.

I think religion is weird.... makes people do and say strange stuff.
Im talking about bible followers.
THERE IS NO WAY you're gonna be able to tell if a baby is gay when its still in the womb!!!!

[Jeff1229]

I can just hear the sound of jackboots and Heil Bush now...It scares me to death that the far right has grown so powerful. They take the Bible and twist and turn it until it just becomes the dogma they want to shove down everyones throats. If you don't fit into what they perceive as their perfect little world, then you're immediately an outcast and a threat.

Another thing that scares me, is that some people believe every word the far religious right spews out. They're just robots,who have been brainwashed into forgetting what true love of fellow humans is all about. :2cents:

[Daisy999]

I can just hear the sound of jackboots and Heil Bush now...It scares me to death that the far right has grown so powerful. They take the Bible and twist and turn it until it just becomes the dogma they want to shove down everyones throats. If you don't fit into what they perceive as their perfect little world, then you're immediately an outcast and a threat.

Another thing that scares me, is that some people believe every word the far religious right spews out. They're just robots,who have been brainwashed into forgetting what true love of fellow humans is all about. :2cents:

Agreed.

If they ruled the country we'd all be in concentration camps and probably dead for not being heterosexual.

Also if a gene were discovered that shows sexuality before someone is born they'd use that and get an abortion and say that it was justified.

People who think like or are queer and align themselves with a party that's against them need professional help.

[element_of_wind]

*Surfaces from Lurking, like a submarine!*

Fear not!

I wouldn't get scared over something a Southern Baptist Seminary says. Religious Conservatives say mean, ignorant things about homosexuals anyway (and us, when they acknowledge our existance).

Anyway, he's talking about a hypothetical technology (pre-natal treatment to prevent a child from being gay), founded on a debateable premise (it is even possible for pre-natal treatment to stop a child from behing gay). If that premise is false this scheme won't work anyway. Even if it was true, the technology would still have to be developed.

And then, it would still take an apocalyptic legal battle to force every mother in the country to blast their infant with this magic-anti-gay-ray.

In such a fight, the Christian Right wouldn't just be opposed by those silly liberals and libertarians - moderates and even some conservatives would oppose this measure. Lots of people who wouldn't vote for civil unions still wouldn't want the government to force mothers to undergo unneccesary prenatal care. Unless everything in the next twenty years somehow goes Their Way, this is a battle that the Christian Right would lose. Hard.

*Returns to Lurking, like a submarine!*

[Solomon]

Agreed.

If they ruled the country we'd all be in concentration camps and probably dead for not being heterosexual.

Also if a gene were discovered that shows sexuality before someone is born they'd use that and get an abortion and say that it was justified.

People who think like or are queer and align themselves with a party that's against them need professional help.

yep, more issues.

[Domino]

This is so sad, they treat being Gay like it is some form of disease.

I really hope this does not come to pass. I would not care if my boy was gay, I don't even see it being an issue, more like a preference. Like favouring pepsi as opposed to coke.

[darkeyes]

yep, more issues.but for once Sol,without reservation, though with a few qualifications and a little bit of knowledge I happen to agree with her! Whats happened once can happen again, and one of my great fears is that for all the progress since the 1960s in gaining some form of acceptance we can end up with the gear for one reason or other being shoved into reverse and intolerance shall once again be the norm and we shall be forced as human beings to deny who we are.

[matterinhand]

These are the same religious people who say that a baby is a 'gift from God'?

So, if a baby is genetically predetermined to be gay or bi, God has given that baby those genes?

Or is this just a way of God telling us that when he said 'Love thy neighbour' he didn't care what sexuality they had?

("Puts cat in pigeon loft, stands back to see feathers flying")

[ElizabethJane]

Organized religion is God/ddess's joke on the masses, I'm steadfast in my belief that the spiritual entity to our existance would praise those that could rise above this organization and know Them for who They really are. They are NOT man made religion. I hope that these men feel free enough to think for themselves one day before they leave this beautiful world. :bipride:

[darkeyes]

Organized religion is God/ddess's joke on the masses, I'm steadfast in my belief that the spiritual entity to our existance would praise those that could rise above this organization and know Them for who They really are. They are NOT man made religion. I hope that these men feel free enough to think for themselves one day before they leave this beautiful world. :bipride: The trouble is Elizabeth Jane that a few of them do think for themselves and where they are in a position of power and influence they use that to stir up those who are less able to do so. That is one of the reasons church and state have what they call "the norm", and use that as a form of control on the masses and to suppress the fall guys. Its not necessarily that they disapprove of a lifestyle or anything else. In Nazi Germany many of the leadership were gay or bi but that didnt stop them sending hundreds of thousands for extermination. Its called a lust for power and there are those who will do anything to achieve it and worse to keep it.

[Enoll]

Hey does that mean we can cure those nutty straight people?
Hahaha....hmmm

[bi-robin-calif]

Am I reading this right?

1. There's a biologiacl basis for homesexuality. If you are very religious, that can only mean one thing: that's the way God made you.
2. But even though he made you that way, you're not allowed to *be* that way, because it's wrong, because the Bible--a book written by a primitive patriarchal society--says so.
3. Therefore, God made a mistake, and so:
4. We, his followers and worshippers, are going to correct that mistake, because:
5. If he made you that way, he obviously wants you to *be* that way, but the Bible--which we humans wrote--says he *doesn't* want you to be that way.

Do I have it right, or am I missing something?

This is the 21st century: we no longer use the same medical techniques that they used 5000 years ago; why do we still hold onto 5000-year-old primitive prejudices and superstitions about sexuality?

[Cerealk]

I dont think the Bible says homosexuality is bad, I think its only against abusive sex. I kind of remember something like that being said here. So its not what the Bible says, but what people with power want it to say.

[Herbwoman39]

The Bible has been re-written and re-interpreted so many times that if compared to the very first text, the two would not look a whole lot alike. Who's to say what the original meaning was.

What *does* piss me off is that there are people that think of same-sex attraction as a disease that can be cured. We are now seen as a disease to be eradicated.

Last time that happened a whole lot of people died in concentration camps.

[deletetacount123]

Quoted from "SAVED" with Mandy Moore.

Quote was in the near end scene about Mary's gay bf whos the father of her baby.
"If God wanted us to all be the same.... then why did he make us different?"

I wonder if religous people know there have been discoveries that Jesus had homosexually experiences ??
I read this on CNN.com and theres websites that says the same thing.

I would love to know why God's ten comm.s, say "Thou Shall NOT hate, steal, kill..........etc"
Most religous people go ahead some kill cause "God told me so."
some steal cause god told them to.
Some hate cause "its wrong in gods eyes!!"

Remember Elizabeth Smart?? her kidnapper believed God told him to KIDNAP. and to this day he still thinks he did nothing wrong.

You know... honestly.. all these "super reglious" people are crazy... makes us look much more sane.

I say "super" cause some reglious people are very nice, I had a friend who was reglious, she didn't believe in homosexually and other things but said "Do whatever you want" To her, she didn't care what you did as long as it wasn't hurting anyone (murder, volent, drugs....etc)
She was the kind who believed God put us all here for a reason... made us who we are for reasons only known to him.

Tasha

[tink1978]

Quoted from "SAVED" with Mandy Moore.

Quote was in the near end scene about Mary's gay bf whos the father of her baby.
"If God wanted us to all be the same.... then why did he make us different?"

I wonder if religous people know there have been discoveries that Jesus had homosexually experiences ??
I read this on CNN.com and theres websites that says the same thing.

I would love to know why God's ten comm.s, say "Thou Shall NOT hate, steal, kill..........etc"
Most religous people go ahead some kill cause "God told me so."
some steal cause god told them to.
Some hate cause "its wrong in gods eyes!!"

Remember Elizabeth Smart?? her kidnapper believed God told him to KIDNAP. and to this day he still thinks he did nothing wrong.

You know... honestly.. all these "super reglious" people are crazy... makes us look much more sane.

I say "super" cause some reglious people are very nice, I had a friend who was reglious, she didn't believe in homosexually and other things but said "Do whatever you want" To her, she didn't care what you did as long as it wasn't hurting anyone (murder, volent, drugs....etc)
She was the kind who believed God put us all here for a reason... made us who we are for reasons only known to him.

Tasha


Thank you Tasha you beat me to it. As long as we are not hurting anyone leave us alone.

As for "trying to fix unborn children" I say leave them alone they have a hard enough time just trying to make sure every thing is ready to live in this world to have to be "fixed".

Tink :2cents:

[izzfan]

The way I see it, homosexuality may be "unnatural" but if that is the case then heterosexuality is also "unnatural". Seriously, I mean if you look at nature, most animals are bisexual. Hell, before the 18th/19th century sexuality wasn't even labelled as 'heterosexual', 'homosexual' or 'bisexual' it was just sexual behaviour and not identity. Of course the churches, mosques, snynagogues etc... moaned about it but they tended to criticise the actual act and thought that everyone could be tempted to commit "sodomy" not just a select group of people who have been labelled 'gay' or 'bi'.

I mean if this Southern Baptist President thinks that people can be turned 'straight' through genetics [wait a minute!!! I thought christianity didn't like genetic engineering? All that thunderous moralising about people 'playing god' etc...]then I think that is severely messed-up. I mean as I said earlier, total heterosexuality [without even a single same-sex fantasy] is just plain unnatural. I dread to think how the future of humanity would end up if people could use genetics to mess with people's sexualities before birth.

As Cerealk points out, most of the bible's passages about homosexuality are misinterpreted [I mean, from what I've heard the old testament rule against same sex activity was originally intended to stop pederasty amongst soldiers - nothing to do with consenting adults] as for St.Paul - he just seemed to hate sex full stop. Its like when conservatives use Deuteronomy 22:5 to condemn cross-dressing - the original verse was intened to stop men from entering female areas of the temple in disguise. Also, to be perfectly frank, most of the blokes back then wore dresses/robes anyway lol - seriously, trousers are actually a really recent invention ....sorry, going off topic a bit lol...

Izzfan :flag3:

[dans94]

I don't believe the timing of this thread. Did any of you see South Park last night? It was a hiliarious take on bisexuality.

[nyabn_webmaster]

Hey does that mean we can cure those nutty straight people?
Hahaha....hmmm

:bipride: So right!!

[Avocado]

This is why anyone who thinks proving a biological link will help lgbt rights are mugs