the stigma of marriage

[NorthBiEast]

This may seem like an odd question, but I'm wondering if I'm "fortune-telling", which is my supervisor's term for expecting and worrying about the worst from future situations.

I'm finding that I'm having a hard time coming out to certain people. I'm not worried about people seeing me as bi, or thier reactions to that. I think I'm worried that people are going to make assumptions about my marriage. My mom, especially, will get over me being bi (wouldn't be thrilled) but I doubt she would ever forgive me for thinking about cheating (even with his consent/knowledge/participation). If I tell her I'm bi, I know that the next question will be "well, what difference does that make? It's not like you're going to act on it."

I guess my question for the group is this; Do you ever find that people judge you more for being bi and married than just for being bi? Or is this something I'm expecting but isn't really a problem? It'd be easier if I were just lesbian.

Help :confused:

[Herbwoman39]

While I have not experienced this particular bias first hand, the phrase "heterosexual privilege" has been used a great deal in context with those of us who are married and bisexual.

I agree that although we blend in easier, we also have to deal with the presumption that we are straight simply because we are married or dating a man. It's extremely frustrating to me that those of us who are married, because we do not fit the stereotype of a bisexual, are either completely ignored or met with rejection by the lesbian and gay community all because of "heterosexual privilege".

Hell, every time I hear the phrase i want to yell "It's not that much of a privilege!" I mean really, to either be closeted my the rest of the LGT community or accused o being some sort of traitor is enough to make anyone want to scream.

[bigirl_inwv]

I can't really say that I have that problem either. My fiance and I swing and are VERY open about it. So normally, when people find out that I am bi, it's because we were talking about swinging to begin with. Im no help. Sorry. lol.

[mikeiam4]

My wife and I are totally open about it as well. In fact, it was her that kinda put me on the track so to speak. However, I can sympathize with the feelings that you dont every want to come out with being bi to others because of the cheating stigma. Thats probably the number one reason that I dont come out to family (or many friends for that matter) is the fact that they will all assume that I am cheating should I ever act out on the bi-ness. My dad in particular takes a VERY negative view on 'cheating,' I dont ever want to find out what he would think if he found out that my wife and I often share each other, with guys or gals!!

[jedinudist]

This may seem like an odd question, but I'm wondering if I'm "fortune-telling", which is my supervisor's term for expecting and worrying about the worst from future situations.

I'm finding that I'm having a hard time coming out to certain people. I'm not worried about people seeing me as bi, or thier reactions to that. I think I'm worried that people are going to make assumptions about my marriage. My mom, especially, will get over me being bi (wouldn't be thrilled) but I doubt she would ever forgive me for thinking about cheating (even with his consent/knowledge/participation). If I tell her I'm bi, I know that the next question will be "well, what difference does that make? It's not like you're going to act on it."

I guess my question for the group is this; Do you ever find that people judge you more for being bi and married than just for being bi? Or is this something I'm expecting but isn't really a problem? It'd be easier if I were just lesbian.

Help :confused:


Yeah, I have. A common comeback I hear from someone who has just found out that I am Bisexual is "But you're married! You can't be bi".

Then, depending on the overall personality of the individual, the conversation can go in a thousand different directions, and unfortunately many of them are assumptive and judgmental. My particular favorite came from a guy that has been married and divorced like 6 or 7 times, cheated on every single one of his wives, owes child support in so many states he is actually afraid to apply for some things as it would alert authorities to his current address. His take on it? - "dude, that's fucked up you being bi and married. That's just wrong". Need I mention we have not spoken since?

I have my wife's blessing to fulfill my "Bisexual" side's needs in a safe manner if I wish to do so. Oddly enough, I haven't done so yet for fear that she will have a change of heart when it's too late to go back and "undo" it. I love my wife dearly, and just do not want to risk hurting her. So, yes, my being married "complicates" my life as a bisexual, and particularly seems to make people think less of me than if I was single and Bisexual.

But I wouldn't trade my wife for anything. She is the best thing that has ever happened to me - no contest.

I tend to keep my orientation a little quiet. I have reached a point where I do not deny it unless there is some level of danger in coming out, but other than that - the people who do know me will eventually figure out that whether I "pursue" my Bisexual needs or not is really only the business of my wife, myself, and the guy I might choose to "pursue" it with.

Good luck to you :)

[spartca]

For what it's worth I refuse to get married because of the presumption that it makes me monogamous. Plus same-sex couples can't get married, that's just not cool.

I'm bi and poly and that's that. When marriage is re-written with all the possibilities in mind, I might consider it, but I'm not holding my breath.

[photogr]

I'm a little unhappy with Bi and married. Marriage in the conventional sense apart from all the usual legal stuff is being faithfull to one person. I can't see the difference between having a sexual relationship with someone of the same sex and then another of the opposite sex, why not? ie a free for all. What about changing the rules of marriage to 'it's ok to have as many sexual relationships with opposite sex or same sex as you want', ie taking sexual fidelity out of the contract! Ofcourse that would leave a property and child rearing contract in place. Little point of getting marriage, eh?

[Solomon]

Just my two cents, but my wife and I agree 100% with some of the VERY successful people we're affiliated with in business. For the people that have nothing to do with our choice in lifestyle, frankly it's not their business what we do.

I can see the want for supportiveness to continue. But, if your friends and family don't support you just because you're doing something, then you didn't have friends, and your family lied to ya, and you are just finding out. I guess the question is do you really want or even feel strongly the need to find out?

Sorry if that seems cold, but the truth often is cold.

REAL family and friends are there for ya through thick and thin. NO MATTER WHAT.

[Solomon]

I'm a little unhappy with Bi and married. Marriage in the conventional sense apart from all the usual legal stuff is being faithfull to one person. I can't see the difference between having a sexual relationship with someone of the same sex and then another of the opposite sex, why not? ie a free for all. What about changing the rules of marriage to 'it's ok to have as many sexual relationships with opposite sex or same sex as you want', ie taking sexual fidelity out of the contract! Ofcourse that would leave a property and child rearing contract in place. Little point of getting marriage, eh?


We choose the advise of people that have the fruit on the tree (are successful in life and marriage). I've always been told by them that the ONLY rules that apply to marriage, are the ones that the couple in question AGREE too.

I believe that that's why integrity counts BIG.

[bicomrade]

Being bi and married is a bit of an oxymoron. Unless you have a very open and tolerant relationship ie your partner supports your having lovers then it sounds like you are bound to have some flings. I'm married at least for the time being but my wife doesn't support my being bi so until we get divorced I have to sneak around. I read Dan Savage describe bi folks as being fetishist due to the rarity of a bi person settling down with another same sex partner. Announcing you are bi almost IMO a declaration that you don't belive in monogamy.

[Avocado]

Being bi and married is a bit of an oxymoron. Unless you have a very open and tolerant relationship ie your partner supports your having lovers then it sounds like you are bound to have some flings. I'm married at least for the time being but my wife doesn't support my being bi so until we get divorced I have to sneak around. I read Dan Savage describe bi folks as being fetishist due to the rarity of a bi person settling down with another same sex partner. Announcing you are bi almost IMO a declaration that you don't belive in monogamy.

Your wife doesn't deserve this

[csrakate]

Your wife doesn't deserve this


I wholeheartedly agree!! Bicomrade, do your wife a favor...set HER free and give her a chance to find someone who might show her a little respect! If you are looking for a reason to justify your need to cheat, claiming that bisexuals are merely "fetishists" that "don't believe in monogamy" isn't going to fly. Bisexuals are just as capable as anyone else to enter into a committed relationship and remain monogamous.

[Mrs.F]

Your wife doesn't deserve this


I agree totally!!

[innaminka]

Being bi and being married - an oxymoron? No, at least not through my perspective.
But then I am a "mature" :eek: person who perhaps has learned to shrug certain attitudes off as not worth worrying about.
Also I am not a flag-waving bisexual. I am out to the people who probably need to know, and although I have never denied it, (except to myself for a few years!!) I have kept the information reasonably close.
Have I been asked that question - "but you're bi and you're married?" Once really seriously by one person - my sister.
My answer was that being bi has nothing whatsoever to do with being married. The dynamics of the relationship are between my husband and I and later my children. No one else.

The hidden, or at least unasked query is that being bi surely you'll be shagging a woman somewhere. It comes down to a topic covered by countless threads. Just because we're bi - does that mean we'll be frenetically having sex outside marriage?
Why should a bi person be any more likely to do that than a hetero person???
Its a question answered within individual marriages.
The whole question of "you're bi and you're married" really, like all relationship questions boils down to open communication and amicable solutions to problems within individual marriages.

Every one else can go jump!

[spartca]

I think this topic really shows how different being bi can be for men and women!

For women, it's the hottest possible thing to be bi from a mainstream perspective - what straight guy wouldn't want to be married to a bi woman? It's certainly the mainstay of straight porn.

On the other hand, it can be very dangerous to be out as bisexual for many men. It's just not accepted in the mainstream, so many bisexual men make the choice to stay in the closet. I'm not saying it's right - but my experience, being out as a bisexual man may have made it difficult for me to find a partner who is willing to make a go of it and have a family together. This is why many bi guys lie. Can you blame them? Well, you can, but it's not going to change anything. Better to blame those who stigmatize bi guys - then something might actually change.

So it's no wonder that the bi women here say "Everyone else can go jump!" - they're in a position of power.

And it's no wonder bi men here say "I'm married at least for the time being but my wife doesn't support my being bi so until we get divorced I have to sneak around."

Just the facts of bi life folks! Wish it weren't so.

This also explains why often it seems that there are actually *two* very different bisexual communities, one for women, and one for men. It would be great if more bi women were sympathetic to the plight of their bisexual brothers!

[NorthBiEast]

Being bi and married is a bit of an oxymoron. Unless you have a very open and tolerant relationship ie your partner supports your having lovers then it sounds like you are bound to have some flings. I'm married at least for the time being but my wife doesn't support my being bi so until we get divorced I have to sneak around. I read Dan Savage describe bi folks as being fetishist due to the rarity of a bi person settling down with another same sex partner. Announcing you are bi almost IMO a declaration that you don't belive in monogamy.

Thank you for proving my concern. :paw:

[Gemini523]

My wife and I are totally open about it as well. In fact, it was her that kinda put me on the track so to speak. However, I can sympathize with the feelings that you dont every want to come out with being bi to others because of the cheating stigma...

Same here, including the part about my wife putting me on this road. She has encouraged these thoughts and desires in me, and has made it clear that if I choose to act on these desires that I would be welcome to do so...with conditions:

1. She gets to watch,
2. She would like a hand in the choosing,
3. No going behind her back.

She will not tolerate cheating in any way (with a man or another woman), nor do I have a desire to do so. She is the best thing that has ever happened to me, and I would never jeopardize our relationship. She has stated to me that I will not be cheating on her if she is present, and in fact, is our favorite fantasy. Also like you though, I would be very, very hesitant about telling anyone else as this would cause repercussions both from my profession and family. Does tend to put a damper on it, doesn't it?

[jedinudist]

Your wife doesn't deserve this


I agree - sneaking around on your wife because she doesn't "understand" you just furthers the already shitty public image of bisexuals, particularly bisexual guys.

Set her free and then go play around

[jamiehue]

For what it's worth I refuse to get married because of the presumption that it makes me monogamous. Plus same-sex couples can't get married, that's just not cool.

I'm bi and poly and that's that. When marriage is re-written with all the possibilities in mind, I might consider it, but I'm not holding my breath.
indeed.

[jamiehue]

I wholeheartedly agree!! Bicomrade, do your wife a favor...set HER free and give her a chance to find someone who might show her a little respect! If you are looking for a reason to justify your need to cheat, claiming that bisexuals are merely "fetishists" that "don't believe in monogamy" isn't going to fly. Bisexuals are just as capable as anyone else to enter into a committed relationship and remain monogamous.
Dan Savage has had many turn arounds on the subject of bisexuality.I dont care.I know that ive been in two loving committed relationships. The last one ended tragically.I was and still am devastated by the loss of my partner.Now im in a grey area.And thats not all that.

[spartca]

Dan Savage has had many turn arounds on the subject of bisexuality.I dont care.I know that ive been in two loving committed relationships. The last one ended tragically.I was and still am devastated by the loss of my partner.Now im in a grey area.And thats not all that.

Yeah Dan Savage can be as closed-minded as anyone else when something is in his blind spot. He's been really off-base on polyamory as well... but that's another story.

I'm sorry to hear you've been through that - I too had an awful breakup about four years ago, and it's still with me in some ways. Hang in there. I wish I could say it all gets better, but some scars are there for a reason I guess...

[innaminka]

For women, it's the hottest possible thing to be bi from a mainstream perspective - what straight guy wouldn't want to be married to a bi woman? It's certainly the mainstay of straight porn.

!

'Fraid not. Would my hubby prefer I was str8 - 110% you betcha!
As far as the insinuation that 3'somes are common (I belive that's what you're referring to) are complete rot.
I/we (Dean and I) have NEVER remotely contemplated sharing in a 3'some - NEVER!And 100% of the bi ladies I know well are the same. 100%

Maybe you've watched a bit too much porn! Do not make assumptions you know nothing or little about!

My bi-activities are private and do not include anyone else in my marriage bed!

[Hockey Girl]

...I guess my question for the group is this; Do you ever find that people judge you more for being bi and married than just for being bi? Or is this something I'm expecting but isn't really a problem? It'd be easier if I were just lesbian.

Long story short...I am currently going thru a transition where I am discovering I like girls, like more than boys maybe, but have been with my husband for 23 years. I am monogomous so I am getting divorced because I need to find this out about myself and will NOT cheat. I basically came out/was outted to pretty much everyone I know over the holidays, woohoo!!

I am not sure what I am right now so I consider myself bi. However, I have got to say that, YES, it has crossed my mind that it's easier to let ppl think you are 'gay' over 'bi'. Married or single, I think ppl judge you more or just plain don't understand it. :2cents:

I have been in that situation receintly...I just think it's easier, and probably less drama, for my 93 year old grandmother and neice to get their heads around me being 'just gay'. And for right now, I am all for less drama ;)

Peace!

Hockey :girl:

[bicomrade]

I wholeheartedly agree!! Bicomrade, do your wife a favor...set HER free and give her a chance to find someone who might show her a little respect! If you are looking for a reason to justify your need to cheat, claiming that bisexuals are merely "fetishists" that "don't believe in monogamy" isn't going to fly. Bisexuals are just as capable as anyone else to enter into a committed relationship and remain monogamous.


I do intend to set her free. I don't think I' m being disrespectful . The reality of the situation is that I've had to deal with my bisexuality for some time. Mostly I thought I was hopellessly dysfunctional for having attractions to men and women . My wife thinks I'm possesed by evil spirits. I thought so too and prayed for salvation. That was back in my christian cult years. Getting divorced is not a simple matter when you have kids as well. I know some will get upset due to my sneaking around and you have a point. I won't dismiss it but some situations take time before a solution even becomes apparent.

[bicomrade]

[QUOTE=Gemini523][FONT=Franklin Gothic Medium][SIZE=2][COLOR=DarkGreen]
Same here, including the part about my wife putting me on this road. She has encouraged these thoughts and desires in me, and has made it clear that if I choose to act on these desires that I would be welcome to do so...with conditions:

1. She gets to watch,
2. She would like a hand in the choosing,
3. No going behind her back.

You are a lucky man. How common is this type of arrangement?

[bicomrade]

On the other hand, it can be very dangerous to be out as bisexual for many men. It's just not accepted in the mainstream, so many bisexual men make the choice to stay in the closet. I'm not saying it's right - but my experience, being out as a bisexual man may have made it difficult for me to find a partner who is willing to make a go of it and have a family together. This is why many bi guys lie. Can you blame them? Well, you can, but it's not going to change anything. Better to blame those who stigmatize bi guys - then something might actually change.



Thank You!

[spartca]

Thank You!

I feel you buddy - we're on either side of the closet door, but both examples of what happens when society pernalizes guys for being out as bisexual. Hang in there! :)

[Lisa (va)]

Being bi and being married are both self defineable.

I am bi, I am married and I am monogamous.
True there are those that will assume that being bi means I have women on the side (either with or without my husband). I notice this more on the internet when question 1 is "are you bi?" followed by question 2, "do you have a girlfriend?". There are those that may not understand when I answer "yes" then "no". But it's not to hard to explain it to them and I really don't find the majority judgemental: this is what works for me. As far folks I meet in my daily real life it really doesn't come up much, most folks know I have had girlfriends before, but then being bi is just a small part of me, I don't feel the desire to go around announcing that small fact (though if asked I will gladly explain).

Being mongamous as bi is the same as being monogamous as straight. I very much love my husband and the idea of having to make love with others (men or women) to feel completely bi is not something I need.
Though this is the way I choose to live I still support those marraiges where there is a concious choice to include others sexually. By concious choice I mean with agreement on all parties involved. Just as folks have to define 'bi' to fit themselves, marriage boils down to what the partners want and expect out of marriage.

As far as sneaking around, I'm sorry, I don't agree with that at all. Whether with the same sex or opposite sex it's still the same thing: being bi doesn't give you special privledges to betray the trust of a love one. It's just not fair to the person you claim to love. If you can't trust and confide in your partner what does that say for the relationship?

Lisa

hugs n kisses

[NorthBiEast]

[QUOTE=Gemini523][FONT=Franklin Gothic Medium][SIZE=2][COLOR=DarkGreen]
Same here, including the part about my wife putting me on this road. She has encouraged these thoughts and desires in me, and has made it clear that if I choose to act on these desires that I would be welcome to do so...with conditions:

1. She gets to watch,
2. She would like a hand in the choosing,
3. No going behind her back.

You are a lucky man. How common is this type of arrangement?
That's the exact arrangement my hubby and I have! I'm lucky, he's more comfortable with me being bi than I am! :bibounce:

[AngelOfTheMystic]

I think that people may have a tendency to judge you a bit more if you are bi and married because people look at is at as if though you are married and that is a sacred thing and being with another person while you are married, espically one of the same sex, is just "wrong". To me lieing and cheating on someone you are with would be worse. I would rather my husband know that I am bi and not like it as opposed to me going behind his back and cheating or not even telling him that I am bi in the first place. You need trust in a relationship without that you have no relationship in my opinion. I am glad that I have a husband that understands that I am who I am and lets me be just that. He knows who all I have been with and is alright with that. I wish you the best of luck.