living without a sexual label

[Long Duck Dong]

I love 3 things in this world... jack daniels..being bisexual... and people that make me think about things

so...lol i am curious about something

i was talking to a person that told me that I am unique.... I am bisexual... but i don't carry a bisexual banner...lol....i don't say that it matters if the whole world knows i'm bisexual and i don't care if they like it or not lol

so i said to the person, " do you tell the whole world that you are heterosexual and do you feel its important at times, to carry your heterosexual banner ?? "
they replied no... so i called them a liar and pointed out the last 7 times during group outings that they were quick to point out the fact that they were heterosexual lol

however... it got me thinking....

what if sexual labels didn't exist.... we had a world where there was no sexual divide to define sexual preference

the need for a sexual identity would disappear, and so would the stress of trying to define oneself for the benefit of others... and in fact that it is why we have sexual labels, for the benefit of others
i hardly get up in the morning and look in the mirror and do a sexuality check to make sure that I am bisexual....also i don't care what circles i move in....most groups are using one part of themselves to define themselves and their right to belong to different groups

so it poses the question of do people use certain aspects of themselves to stand out from the crowd and be assigned a certain label... or are they isolated from the main group and stuck with a label...

for the most part... we use labels to define our uniqueness from the crowd, but we display the labels in order for others to see... and so we can isolated from the crowd
seriously, what is the point of using the bisexual label if you are not gonna tell people about it

its cos others opinions matter, as much as we don't admit to it

the number of posts and threads in bisexual.com, asking for help to define bisexuality, shows us clearly that people worry about the label they wear... and once they are happy they are wearing the right label, they then worry about who will see the label

go out to the local bi / gay / les bar and DON'T reveal your sexuality....i mean you are there for a good time, a few drinks, good conversation, dancing etc....and so the bisexual label doesn't play a part.... well unless they have bi sexual only drinks and a bisexual only area on the dance floor and see how people interact with you... then tell them you are bisexual after a few hours, and watch how things change

labels are important to some people as they feel that they can carry their heads high and be proud of their label......
sure, be proud...how does it improve your job prospects.... if your income higher.... do you get a extra discount at shops.... if there bisexual only parking....

I can speak in latin, chinese, japanese, mandarin, cantonese, vietnamese, some dutch, french, german... so i am multi linguistic .. it also means i can eavesdrop on conversations without people knowing i understand what they are saying....but if they knew, they would immediately change the way they talk around me

so are labels important.... well labels display our uniqueness... so they can help... but if labels are so important to display uniqueness then why not have the following labels

I wipe my ass from back to front
I love to smell my own armpits
I love to fart in places where it echoes
I have a shit 3 times a day
I wear my underpants for 4 days at a time

all are labels that can be used... all define uniqueness.... and all are things that we just don't need to know....

so are labels needed in a sexual sense..... actually no.... but its a personal choice if you carry your label where all can see it

me... i am bisexual.... big deal.....i still don't get laid much....my relationships are crappy.... me and my family hardly talk... i get shit wages..... my friends are my friends...as much as they drive me nuts......and I post in bisexual. com.....and believe it or not... the biggest part of my bisexual label appears in one place.... bisexual.com...lmao.... * goes off to get another drink *

[gentlepen9]

what if sexual labels didn't exist.... we had a world where there was no sexual divide to define sexual preference



I only wish.

[LoveLion]

I really like what you have written here. I like how you not only expressed the irony of sexual labels and expressed the ideal of rejecting these labels like so many post on this site do, but also talked about the other side and about the need people have for these labels. Although it can be great to not label yourself a lot of people are much more comfortable with a self label and knowing where they stand. The problem is a lot of the they dont fit into the established labels (gay, straight, etc). So then perhaps rather then striving to reject labels all together and going through what can be a very uncomfortable purging process, one should strive to redefine or create one's own labels that they can live comfortably with. The problem with the general social labels (Gay, Straight) are that they are rooted in the continuous western ideal that everything is finite, has a beginning and an end and must fit into a category. One the flip side of that coin you get eastern philosophies such as Buddhism which says nothing is finite and everything is always in a state of change. This philosophy can be even harder to accept then trying to fit into one of western societies finite categories.

so what is one to do? They feel unfulfilled and out of place trying to live by the western worlds standards, but uncomfortable trying to reject the finite definition of anything because their roots are so deeply entwined in the western ideals.

Frederick Nietzsche said "God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him". He is not referring to death in the sense that we comprehend it (as man dies). What he was referring to is that man is no longer able to live by the established Christian moral codes because man no longer truly believes in or recognizes the existence of a greater cosmic being. The Christian morals to which Nietzsche was opposing were based in the supernatural realm of God, and could not relate to the modern world. By accepting that "God is Dead" and with him (or her) the established notion of living a life based on Christian morals and ideals, one is free to create a totally new and personal set of ideals and outlooks on life. Accepting the "Death of God" also pulled one's mind away form this cosmic supernatural realm of God and into the actual world we live in, thus facilitating the creation of one's personal morals, ideals and vision of self based in our world.

So how does this relate? well rather then trying to reject our self labels and live the completly foreign notion that we are labeless, One should try to accept the fact that the established social labels (Gay, straight) are inadequate for the world we live in. By rejecting these specific labels themselves we free ourselves and pull our minds away form this preposterous western social idea that everything is black or white. This allows us to create our own labels bases in the world we actually live in and that make sense in our lives.

Go ahead and label yourself, but make the label yourself :2cents:

[ambi53mm]

Interesting topic. Whether someone chooses to use or, chooses not to use a sexual label I suppose is a personal preference. The benefit for me is personal and I relate it to my need to understand the language and symbolic nature of my thoughts. By that I mean, a way of organizing the eternal flow of imagery that wells from deep within and kind of bubbles to the surface of my conscious mind. These images or mental concepts are assigned definition, are categorized, and neatly stored in memory files that when communicating to myself or others, go a long way in being able to express certain concepts with minimal explanation. When I use the term “bisexual” it conveys to myself a definition of my sexual nature that is distinguishably different from other recognized labels associated with sexual identity.

Labels are words first and foremost. The need and desire, to identify and distinguish is necessary I think mainly for our own clarification. There are many labels I attach to myself that are nonsexual of course as we all do, but inherent in each label is a small aspect of self-discovery. For instance, I use when describing certain aspects of my eclectic views of spirituality the label Pagan. It by no means defines my total identity but goes a long way in distinguishing and identifying those aspects that would be somewhat universally understood to those familiar with that particular label.

When I go shopping at the local supermarket I go to the soup section. There are hundreds of cans of soups to choose from and thank God they come with labels LOL. Without those labels I would be having to guess as to the contents. I could be wanting Chicken Noodle, but opening up instead a can of Mushroom. I wouldn’t be able to distinguish one tin can from another by it’s appearance, smell, taste, or the way it feels in my hand. In the bigger scheme of things it probably seems insignificant after all soup is soup but, it’s convenient and eliminates the guesswork of what I’m getting into. To some extent the same can be said about sexual identification but I would have to agree, that often it creates more of a barrier than a revelation of the contents.

Long Duck Dong begins his post with:

“I love 3 things in this world... jack daniels..being bisexual... and people that make me think about things”

Without any further explanation needed on his part it says a lot about Long Duck Dong that I can identify with, and it’s only in this way that labels serve a purpose for me. Had those three things been: a syringe full of smack…. being a pedophile…. and people that like to be abused. It would have sent me heading back to the tranquility of my own thoughts LOL

“Imagine” by the late John Lennon probably comes closest to the way I wish the world could be… I’m a dreamer. (yet another label :rolleyes: ).

Ambi :)

[ambi53mm]

After writing this post as I tried in vain to get back to sleep my mind drifted into this verse using the music of Imagine by John Lennon

Imagine no divisions
It's easy if you try
No gays or straights to confuse us
Around us only bi's
Imagine all the people
Loving both guys and girls......

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday to enjoy you
but doubt that day will ever come

Imagine no more labels
I wonder if you can
The gays and straights would love us
cause they'd think we're just like them
Imagine no more reasons
to explain what they can't see

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll enjoy me
but until then I'll just be Ambi :)

OK...I'm in serious need of a checkup from the neck up LOL...It's off to Epcot this morning. Have a great and wonderful day all

Ambi :)

[Long Duck Dong]

mmmm adds the music and a nice vid and sends it away to the music companies.... ambi will be live in concert at the end of next week lol

lol well done.... a world full of bi's...lol..... OMG i need a pacemaker and a lot of viagra lol

[wanderingrichard]

me... i am bisexual.... big deal.....i still don't get laid much....my relationships are crappy.... me and my family hardly talk... i get shit wages..... my friends are my friends...as much as they drive me nuts......and I post in bisexual. com.....and believe it or not... the biggest part of my bisexual label appears in one place.... bisexual.com... *

gee, without ever meeting, you've described me to a T.....got a crystal ball tuned into my place ??

[DiamondDog]

go out to the local bi / gay / les bar and DON'T reveal your sexuality....i mean you are there for a good time, a few drinks, good conversation, dancing etc....and so the bisexual label doesn't play a part.... well unless they have bi sexual only drinks and a bisexual only area on the dance floor and see how people interact with you... then tell them you are bisexual after a few hours, and watch how things change

labels are important to some people as they feel that they can carry their heads high and be proud of their label......
sure, be proud...how does it improve your job prospects.... if your income higher.... do you get a extra discount at shops.... if there bisexual only parking....


I do this often, I'll go out and then finally tell the people I've met at the end of the night and it's not a big deal.

Yeah I don't really get all that wrapped up in being bisexual either and put my whole world view/existence around it either.

[ancestral]

hmm, firstly, im new here, been browsing the site and so far i like what i see, good job, secondly, a little about me, ive known of my sexual orientation since just after puberty, not an easy thing for a teen to come to grips with, as for labeling, for the sake of explaining things to others who dont really understand, i tell them im bisexual, no biggie, however my first response will always be, im not straight, gay, or bi, i fall in love with people, it doesnt matter to me if they are male or female <shrug> some grasp the concept, others need a little more help. a prime example is a coworker whom ive become friends with who is probably the straightest woman ive ever met, when she asked i gave my usual response to which she replied "huh? whats that suppose to mean?" then the secondary reply, im bisexual, i like men and women, needless to say she was floored, and while she doesnt hold this against me, she has stated in no uncertain terms that she cannot understand this concept, her favorite phrase "how can you be attracted to me then turn around and be attracted to a man?" ive yet to help her understand this dilemma. to me it doesnt matter, i guess to her its a little bothersome. my point is, label wise, identifying with a particular group did nothing to help this particular person understand, for others, my stock answer usually settles nicely. ive never felt "different" from anyone else, as far as im concerned im not, sexual orientation race, creed, color, sex, or any other preferences really shouldnt and dont make a difference when it comes to dealing with one another if people could only learn to look past these presentations. Lovelion you made an interesting comment about "god being dead, i.e. people stop believing in a cosmic power" while i honor your opinion i cant really agree with it. ive never stopped believing in something, now while that may not be christianity, or bhuddism or hindu or any of the numerous other religions, i do feel that i have a personal interest in god, mind you i dont go to church, i dont associate with religion, even though it would be easier i just cant bring myself to do it. the one firm belief i have is that we are all gods children, we are all equal in that regard and god loves us. other than that it matters not what we think, feel, or do.
ive found that being honest up front establishes who you are and makes life generally easier when dealing with new people, some will run in terror, some will hate, and some will accept, id much rather deal with the ones who will accept right off the bat, does this mean i run around screaming i love men and women? no of course not, it does mean that i make it a point to establish this fact before entering into a new relationship. being in the bible belt this is far easier said than done but the point remains, i have a nice circle of friends who have accepted me from the start or who have learned to accept me over time. makes life much more pleasent knowing these people like me for me and not because of how people assume i "choose" to live cause as we all know, its not a choice. anyway im rambling so ill bring this to a close.

[Long Duck Dong]

lol ancestral, welcome to bisexual.com

i can't resist this, i just gotta say something about what you posted


[a prime example is a coworker whom ive become friends with who is probably the straightest woman ive ever met, when she asked i gave my usual response to which she replied "huh? whats that suppose to mean?" then the secondary reply, im bisexual, i like men and women, needless to say she was floored, and while she doesnt hold this against me, she has stated in no uncertain terms that she cannot understand this concept, her favorite phrase "how can you be attracted to me then turn around and be attracted to a man?"]

darling... its simple, darling... you have a nice body, beautiful eyes, a great personality and you are so attractive.... and your husband has a hot body, gorgeous eyes, a nice accent, and very approachable.... so darling...i can be attracted to you in the same way your hubby is attracted to you, and I can be attracted to him in the same way you are attracted to him...darling


tho I still remember the day i told my ex fiancee i was bisexual and she asked me to explain it

I said, well its like this... my ass gets itchy...and my finger ain't long enuf...so i gotta stratch that itch....i wanna make love with you 24 / 7 but you need to eat and sleep....so simply while you eat and sleep... i'm gonna go be my ass stratched

the relation lasted another 3 years...lol

[ancestral]

hmm, yes i tried this approach lol, i also tried explaining that its not a body i look at first, its the emotional connection, i tried to explain it by asking how she could be with one man then be able to be with another man. shes just very very very very very straight lol, i feel sorry for the girl

[twodelta]

Without any further explanation needed on his part it says a lot about Long Duck Dong that I can identify with, and it’s only in this way that labels serve a purpose for me. Had those three things been: a syringe full of smack…. being a pedophile…. and people that like to be abused. It would have sent me heading back to the tranquility of my own thoughts LOL

I think that labels are useful as sort of a navigational bouy. As is illustrated by Ambi's words above. Lets say that I walk into a bar(who? Me?). At the end of the bar is a guy wearing a denim shirt and jeans. From that description, I'd say that I'd probably like him, as he seams to be a casual person, like myself. However, if that denim shirt is sleeveless, with a confederate flag and the initials KKK sewn onto it, I know to sit at the other end of the bar! Labels can also help us to connect with others that are like minded. I wear a Bi-Pride wristband. As I wear several wristbands, most people don't even notice it, but to someone who knows what pink, purple, and blue mean, it is a welcome mat that says, "come in and sit a spell, I am Your friend". Actually, I don't mind labels at all, and believe that they can be very useful. For instance, if I write in our profile that Cat and I are looking for a "single male", we might get hundreds of replies, but would any of them be what we are really looking for. Probably not. However, if I write in our profile that we are looking for a "single male, interested in a long term polyfidelitous triad", I may only get one or two replies, but I know that they will be from guys that we are looking for. That saves me from having to turn down tons of replies from guys who are just interested in sex.

[TorontoGuy2007]

i agree labels suck.. i've never told anyone i am bi-curious, but come to think of it, i've never gone out of my way to tell anyone i am not bi-curious.

i'm fairly new to this site, and fairly new to the fact that i have come to realize my curiousity.. seems the most common question people want to ask is "how do i know if i am bi" or "i don't know if i am bi"

anyway, i'm not here to worry about a label, i'm just here to explore my curiousities and hopefully learn more about myself by learning more about the stories from others on this site..

[LoveLion]

Lovelion you made an interesting comment about "god being dead, i.e. people stop believing in a cosmic power" while i honor your opinion i cant really agree with it.

I wasnt really specifically talking about "God is Dead" rather using this theory to relate to the topic. Personally I have no idea if God exists or is alive or Dead. The "God is Dead" theory isnt really so much about that either (its just a name people have put on Nietzsche's theory it give it more impact). What it is really about is realising that social standards are ridiculous, out dated and completly inadequate for the real world; and that we need build our own standards rather based in our lives and world rather then living by ones created with a ideal or supernatural world in mid. Nietzsche used religious standards as his main example, but this also extends beyond religion.

Basically the main argument I was trying to make didnt really have anything to do with theology. It is near impossible to truly reject labels, and to do so we would have to completly change our views from the way they have been programed our entire lives by the society we live in. So rather then rejecting all labels, it is better to just reject the labels themselves (ie "I am Gay", "I am Straight") which are based in an ideal world where everything is black and white, and create our own labels that suit the real world we live in.

[ancestral]

perfectly understandable lovelion, i hope you dont think i was trying to start a debate or argument, more just rambling than anything, im a theology buff so it gets me going rather easily.

[someotherguy]

A label is for letting people know your contents so they know how to use you in a recipe, or, the correct dosage, or if you work to get rid of ants. Lables are for OTHER people, not the person themselves. It helps the people around you to know about your sexual habits so they can act accordingly. I agree it's a private matter, unless you wish to share the information. Unfortunately a label is sometimes a target. What I found out about myself is that sometimes I am straight, sometimes gay, and sometimes bi. It changes around and so if I use a label to explain myself it depends on how I feel at the time. I'm sure that can only confuse people if I try explaining it.

[spartca]

I think the problem with the word "bisexual" is that it has become associated with so many cultural assumptions...

For example, the term "bisexual woman" comes bundled with the "hot bi babe" assumptions and images of straight porn...

Whereas "bisexual man" is loaded with assumptions about men who cheat on their wives with men on the "down low."

But there is still a qualitative difference between the terms "straight," "gay," and "bisexual" that has some cultural currency, which is to say that it most accuratle conveys some truth about me - that I am attracted to both men and women. So until some other word comes along, I still use it, especially in straight space. In queer space often I will use the word "queer."

Not having a label for me has come to mean "I'm anything you want me to be, baby," which comes off even sleazier than the usual assumptions about male bisexuality, while simultaneously saying "I'm too weak to identify as queer," so I'm sticking with the bi label, at least until we don't have these silly boxes to check on the forms any more...

[LoveLion]

Lables are for OTHER people

I disagree with this. Of course labels can be used for other people and labels other people put on you are for their use, but any label you out on yourself should be for you own use. I know that when I was struggling to figure out what my orientation was I was troubled because I couldn't figure it out for myself. Now that I have and I can place an appropriate label on myself that I have created, I am no longer troubled by it. I havent told any one what this label is and for now they can go on thinking that I am a hetro, so my label is not for them. When it comes to self labeling I think we do it for ourselves as a way of self definition. Its for our own comfort so we can facilitate alot of things in our lives such as decision making (ie. Im bi, so how should I react in this situation as a bi?) This can be dangerous however if you label yourself incorrectly out of frustration (or a number of other factors), or if you refuse to change/update your label as you evolve. Which brings me back to creating your own label. Alot of people can become frustrated and confused and label themselves with one of societies "ideal" labels because they are sick of trying to find one that fits. This would lead them to beleive they are something they are not and they can end up living a lie.

[morkelkey]

I think that labels are useful as sort of a navigational bouy. As is illustrated by Ambi's words above. Lets say that I walk into a bar(who? Me?). At the end of the bar is a guy wearing a denim shirt and jeans. From that description, I'd say that I'd probably like him, as he seams to be a casual person, like myself. However, if that denim shirt is sleeveless, with a confederate flag and the initials KKK sewn onto it, I know to sit at the other end of the bar! Labels can also help us to connect with others that are like minded. I wear a Bi-Pride wristband. As I wear several wristbands, most people don't even notice it, but to someone who knows what pink, purple, and blue mean, it is a welcome mat that says, "come in and sit a spell, I am Your friend". Actually, I don't mind labels at all, and believe that they can be very useful. For instance, if I write in our profile that Cat and I are looking for a "single male", we might get hundreds of replies, but would any of them be what we are really looking for. Probably not. However, if I write in our profile that we are looking for a "single male, interested in a long term polyfidelitous triad", I may only get one or two replies, but I know that they will be from guys that we are looking for. That saves me from having to turn down tons of replies from guys who are just interested in sex.


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[12voltman59]

Great posting LDD! I love discussions lilke this---for some reason--what you talked about brought up an age old question of mine-----why do people who are so very much "straight"---seem to so often be the type that almost always bring up in coversation--their fixation with people who are not "staight?" They tend to be the ones who always have to make some sort of disparaging remarks about 'the faggots and queers," even in discussions that have nothing to do with sexuality at all----they cannot help but to somehow inject such comments during the course of the conversation.

I have always wondered with those folks who are "straight" that always have to talk about it and make negative comments about those who aren't--if they are so secure in their sexuality---why the hell does it even matter that there are people who aren't "straight"--why waste so much of your precious time and energy even giving one thought about non-straight people??----it is tough enough to live our own lives--why worry about what other people are doing that are so far removed from you??-(or you think they are far removed from you while you live in your suburban cul-de-sac)

Just one of those things that always makes me go "hmmmmm???"