Mixed Signals

[x9191]

Typical situation...in love with my best friend of 6 years. Both married, both straight (or so I thought), worked together, live by one another, etc. Over the years, we've told each other "I love you," albeit, usually under the influence. All this time, I knew I had sexual feelings for her, and I thought she felt the same, although we never talked or did anything about it.

A few months ago, a situation came up, and I told her how I felt. She told me she was surprised, had no idea that I felt this way, but that she does not feel the same. She said that she values are friendship and will pretend that I never said anything. Nothing has changed between us, we are still very close, we still say "I love you", and she will still hold my hand every now and then, but one time (again, under the influence) told me she wanted me. The next day however, she dismissed this particular comment as giving me a hard time and not know what she was saying. These signals confuse me.

There are other things going on in her life at the moment that make it difficult to address this issue with me, so things are not being discussed. If anyone has had a similar experience, please message me, I'd love to talk.

[Bigc69]

I have not had that particular experience but I can still sense some things which may help you.
Your "friend" may have at sometime had some bi sexual thoughts, but I think she is not comittied to that yet ,if ever. Curiosity about same sex is a completely different thing than she has with you. You are, by your account, her very close friend. There is a love there. But I doubt if is is the same kind you feel for her. You have made your feelings clear and the ball is now in her court, but tread lightly or risk losing something very special. She as everyone does may have some bi fantasies, but before she can ever get into a serious same sex relationship, if ever she can, she has to come to terms with her own interests. I think you should remain as you are and just see what happenes. Just my opinoin, Good luck

[TicTac]

I've learned very recently that I had, over many years and for various reasons, somehow 'substituted' my emotional touchpoints, with 'buttons' which I believed could only be pressed by physical intimacy.

I hope the way I've put that makes sense... if not the rest of this might end up confusing...

:rolleyes:

Anyway... before realising what I had done, I really thought I had a problem because every deep, loving friendship I tried to establish (not a common thing for me), would always result in me eventually yearning for physical intimacy with this 'friend', and feeling pretty bad about how I felt. What happened then is even worse... by keeping it inside, mostly because I felt it wasn't appropriate and/or I was scared, I have always ended up thwarting really good friendships because of having something to hide... not being myself... ashamed of who I was because of what I was thinking. In the end, I was closing off my emotional side, for fear it would reveal my 'wiring'.

Strangely... it took my longest standing friend in the world, to help me exorcise the root of this problem... and in a fantastic weekend of both emotional and physical self discovery... even re-discovery in some ways... I've now recognised what I've been doing to myself, and I am all the better for it.

The immediate upside to this, is that another friendship I have with another man - which was starting to become very painful for me because I believed I was in love with him AND wanted to have sex with him - has not only survived, but strengthened and deepened, simply because I can now seperate this emotional 'love' I have for him... and the sexual urges I've thought were one and the same thing. I have learned to simply trust how I 'feel' about him, and to focus on how good it is to love him 'from the heart', as opposed to 'from the groin'. Our friendship is great... AND I've simply stopped wanting to sleep with him... BECAUSE he's one of my best friends.

I've stopped confusing 'love' and wanting emotional intimacy with some sort of 'yearning' for physical intimacy... When these things go together... great!

But they don't HAVE to always go together... this is what I've learned.

I guess I'm telling you this here because I think your situation is different, but in some ways you could consider whether it's the same. If you are truly wanting a deeper relationship with your friend, try to focus on your emotional closeness as something seperate to your wanting some kind of physical intimacy with her. It might help to seperate the two.

Also... even if your friend has given you a very weak signal that she feels the same way, try to consider whether she is perhaps terrified of her own feelings, even ashamed... which might make sense in light of her only confessing to you after having a few drinks. She might also simply be too scared to risk your friendship, or confused by the love she feels for you because it's intertwined with physical stuff.

Somehow... these two things might both be solved, if you simply try to deepen your relationship emotionally. Tell her who you really are, and learn who she really is. It'll take time... but that's what friendships are about.
Once you discover how much you love each other, it will be a lot easier to trust one another, then to openly discuss how you feel without fear. You'll end up at least having a really good friend.

Anything more will be so sweet it will bring tears to your eyes... but it might not be physical. Somehow, by then, I think you won't mind if it isn't.

Hope this helps. Thanks for asking us what we thought... going into my second month on this site and feeling like I've learned 100 years of lessons in this place.

Love to all.
tictac
:)

[julie]

wise words tictac

[wellred]

Wow TicTac!

What an impressive, thoughtful response. Your posting addresses the heart of so many bi-related issues. True friendship is a rare privilege for most people; and I believe it is especially difficulty for those of us in the bi-world. Speaking only for myself, there tends to be so much inner dialogue that I can barely hear those reaching out to me in friendship. And when I do hear, I often feel unworthy.

Congratualtions for your "break-through" and I sincerely value your willingness to share your experience, so that others can benefit from your growth.

All the best,
Red

[mike9753]

Hi Folks:

I too am learning from all the sharing that people like TicTac have done and are doing on this site. Well done and well saud!

And I would agree with the input. Your friend is confused, perhaps even on an unconscious level. She may be mixing up sex and love.

Don't you think that when we find someone who we love romantically and who loves us in the same way and the relationship grows into an emotionally satisfying and sexually exciting and fulfilling one that we then tend to lump love and sex together? But they really are not the same all the time. For me, sex is like the glue that keeps the relationship intact, but there can be other things that act as this adhesive - but for me sex is the best one.

And I wonder how many of us don't really know how to seperate the two when we should. The media - movies, books (romance novels), TV, etc. all seem to want to say that romantic love and sex have to go together. So we get bombarded with it from the media.

Would you watch a movie that was about a love relationship but that didn't have sex? Even the cult classic, "Harold and Maude" (with Ruth Gordon and Bruce Cort) (for those of you who don't know, it is about this very thing - Ruth plays a 79 yr old woman whose attitude rescues Bruce's character - an 18 yr old spoiled rich kid - from an obsessive infatuation with suicide - he thinks he is falling in love with her and they do have a brief sex scene - but she helps him to realize it's not about sex) had a sex scene. I think we have been programmed not to find plutonic romance to be interesting. Sex xells, but in this case, I think sex sells us short. (It was even hard for me to write that last line because I do value sex so highly - in a way, it felt like I was "betraying sex" and you can't betray an activity).

Anyway, just my $.02
Mike

[x9191]

I know there hasn't been much time since I posted my original message, but I have received some very thoughtful and insightful responses.

Thank you for taking the time to respond! I can't tell how much it means to me!

You have given me the opportunity to revisit thoughts that have weighed heavy on my mind, as well as consider new thoughts and directions.

I am not sure how to describe what I feel. What I feel for my same sex best friend is the emotional love and depth that you all spoke of...we are very emotionally and intellectully deeply and connected. I have not ever felt this level of attraction to anyone, and now I feel this of the same sex. Yes, I have been intellectually attracted to women, yes I have thought some of them to be very beautiful, and yes, I have thought about what it would be like to be with them sexually...but all of this was very superficial...and certainly not all in one package...and I never had the thought or urge to be with them.

You all know what I am speaking about...to feel this way about someone on three levels is VERY special.

She different than anyone I've ever met - I love her to the core - and love her and all the baggage that she comes with - and I know/feel all the baggage! I became very attracted to her because of her brain, her intellect, her ability to debate and challenge me on every turn and thought. This led me to letting my guard down and letting her in...I became emotially attracted to her, we became emotionally close and attached...she became my best friend...then, I became physically attracted to her, because of the intellectual and emotional attachment...a very, very deep emotional connection...if you were to ask her, I'd be surprised if she didn't respond in a similar way...perhaphs not as blunt....

I have not felt this way about any other woman, sure I've wondered what it would be like, but I was way too boy crazy...this person has stolen my heart completely! I don't know how to describe it...and if I were a man, I don't know if the description would be any different.

My physical and sexual feelings for her are very tender and loving...I don't want to have passionate sex with her...I just want to hold her...and kiss her in a very sensual way...I want her to feel what I feel...I want her to enjoy. I don't know that I want much more than to hold her and kiss her...but of course, if she's ok with things...who knows...

I don't know that I want to have sex with her at this time...of course, not having ever done this, I don't know how to even do this!

Regardless, the points made about the difference between sexual and and emotional intimacy resonate with me. I have definitely gone through this with the opposite sex and have become very comfortable and confident in my thougths and feelings. However, this is not the situation, this is with the same sex, who happens to me my best friend and soulmate...I guess, as you have suggested, I need to take this time, think about how I'm feeling and what I want, and hopefully she will do the same...

I am not a patient person, but this is very important to me...regardless of age, you do adapt...and as tictoc suggested, it will be sweet but not necessary physical or sexual...and I believe you are right, in time, I don't think I would mind for a second, BECAUSE she is my best friend and I do love her with all my heart.

Thank you all for your comments, it has forced me to think even harder...and not with my sex drive, but with my heart and my head...but at the same time, if I, or any of the other posts are off base, I'd like to hear that too!

Please keep the feedback coming...I can use all the support you can give...I certainly can't talk to the person of which I speak. As you all know, this stuff takes time...for all parties!

[mike9753]

I think you have given yourself a hint, perhaps without knowing it. You said,

"She different than anyone I've ever met - I love her to the core - and love her and all the baggage that she comes with - and I know/feel all the baggage! I became very attracted to her because of her brain, her intellect, her ability to debate and challenge me on every turn and thought. This led me to letting my guard down and letting her in...I became emotially attracted to her, we became emotionally close and attached...she became my best friend...then, I became physically attracted to her, because of the intellectual and emotional attachment...a very, very deep emotional connection...if you were to ask her, I'd be surprised if she didn't respond in a similar way...perhaphs not as blunt...."

If you think she might respond in a similar way, then maybe you are right. Now I don't mean that you should bare your soul as you have here in the Forum, but perhaps if there is an appropriate time and place (meaning a time and place that she will feel comfortable talking seriously), you can begin to plant a few seeds about the depth of your honest feelings for her. Not all at once - but think of it as "depositing" thoughts in her "mind bank". They have to be real, they have to be honest but subtle, not too "in your face". The goal here is to share your truest feelings in a way that is non-threatening, with the hope that they will blossom in time to her full awareness, that you care so deeply for her.

A few of these conversations, over time may have a more positive effect than an intense conversation that she feels she has to react to immediately. I believe that human beings need to think about things, let thoughts percolate a bit, and then we can respond more honestly. Our filters from our background, our religious beliefs, our definition(s) of propriety and morality tend to block our expression if we don't allow our minds and our hearts to work together in order to develop an emotionallly honest answer.

Now the next step is the hardest. You need to prepare yourself to accept that you and she may always have what you have now - nothing more. And if that is what she wants, even if you'd like to see things become more intimate, that is just fine, because ...that's the way life is sometimes. And it sounds like you and she have something very special now, even if it does not go any further.
Mike

[josbo67]

It's amazing how different men and women are. Women are in it more for emotion. Guys are in it for the physical. This guy I worked with for a few months got a new job. We had known each other previously from working together at a different location and time. And I 've known him for quite a while. Only recently did I find out some things about him and me as well. We talked, but never got together on it. When he left, I was surprised to find I had a bit of a crush on him. Being new to this whole bi-sex notion, nothing was said. And he left. I tried to keep in touch. Two years later, I get a call from him. We ended up at his place. Besides the gratifing sex,and the old crush coming back, I decided to let "sleeping dogs lie". We were friends before sex and to me that's worth a little more. :2cents:

[Bi-ten]

Hi X9191,

What you are saying is so familiar to me, and I would like to share a little of my experience with you.

A few years back I stuck my neck way out on a relationship with a close friend and colleague. My love and emotional connection had grown over the course of seven years until I found it unbearable to hide my feelings for her (gasp, this was/is a heterosexual relationship).

Like you, my respect and love for her was so deep that sex was a secondary consideration, although I desired her...I could get along simply knowing that she cared about me the same way. In fact the concept of sex with her was very difficult for me, because I was married to someone else at the time.

I am sharing this with you because I did eventually confess my feelings to her. Here is what happened.

After my confession, she admitted that she was attracted to me too. We had an emotional and physical affair and truely, I have never felt so connected to anyone in my life. I was in a state of utter euphoria, I was convinced that this was in fact my kindred spirit, my beloved.

For many reasons the affair had to end, it was the most painful thing I have ever felt. To this day I still sit right across from the person I love most in the whole world, and I cant even give her a hug.

This story is not entirely sad though, because in the two years since my confession we have become even closer, I feel I can tell her anything, and she remains my dearest friend and confidant.

Through my relationship with her, I learned many things. I found out what it meant to really love another human being, and that sometimes real love means letting that person go.

I became more in touch with my emotions (yeah lots of tears) and I learned that I can be intimate without having sex (a big thing for me).

Finally I have learned to accept and love myself unconditionally, which has led to a precious gift...the personal acceptance of my bisexuality.

So yes, when we love there is risk, and there can be pain...but I would do it all again in a heartbeat... because now I can say that I'm truely alive.

God bless be courageous, my thoughts are with you.

Bi-ten :bibounce: