Adult Children..help them or not?

[tenni]

Here is a video presenting interesting non sexual issues that you are or may have to deal with?

Should parents pay the bills of adult children?

Should parents of adult children pay the down payment of a house for them?

When or should parents financially help their adult children?

Should the parents dip in to their savings to help their adult children?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/video/video-carrick-talks-money-should-i-dip-into-my-savings-to-help-my-adult-kids/article21189928/

[jem_is_bi]

I did not read the report. But, I helped a brother get through college. It was well worth every penny. I know another who helped a niece do the same.

[Annika L]

Should parents pay the bills of adult children?

Should parents of adult children pay the down payment of a house for them?

When or should parents financially help their adult children?

Should the parents dip in to their savings to help their adult children?


I find it interesting that you phrase each of these as a question of "should they", rather than as "should they *not*"? I mean, of *course* there isn't anything out there saying parents *should* (i.e., have some moral obligation to) pay their kids' bills, make down payments on their houses, or help them financially in general, let alone dip into their own savings to do so. However, there is reasonable debate over whether *it's ok* to do these things.

Personally, I think that a parent's greatest responsibility to their children is help them to be functionally independent adults. The greatest disservice a parent can do is to facilitate their children's dependence on them (or anyone else).

There are of course instances where exceptions can and perhaps should be made (i.e., certainly not letting your child perish or come to grave harm). But even then any financial involvement needs to be done carefully, so as to get them out of a *genuine* scrape (not just inconvenience or discomfort), and so that a lesson is learned (rather than just a bail).

I'm currently watching a situation unfold with my partner's sister that threatens to impact myself and my partner...she is being unnecessarily floated by their mother, and has no inclination and little ability to do for herself. It's a drama that's played out over years (and not helped by their father while he was alive). A great fear of mine is that my partner's mother will pass away, and this sister will show up on our doorstep expecting grace, and we'll be put in the position of either providing (understand this is someone who for years would not tolerate my presence) at some level for her, or be condemned by the extended family for turning a cold shoulder to "her own sister". So I have some feelings on this issue.

[pole_smoker]

I'm currently watching a situation unfold with my partner's sister that threatens to impact myself and my partner...she is being unnecessarily floated by their mother, and has no inclination and little ability to do for herself. It's a drama that's played out over years (and not helped by their father while he was alive). A great fear of mine is that my partner's mother will pass away, and this sister will show up on our doorstep expecting grace, and we'll be put in the position of either providing (understand this is someone who for years would not tolerate my presence) at some level for her, or be condemned by the extended family for turning a cold shoulder to "her own sister". So I have some feelings on this issue.

You might as well get used to your wife/partner's sister asking for money, and getting it from your partner/wife. Or even moving in with both of you after your mother in law dies.

It's your partner's sister and you're not related to her, so it's not your business as she's not your family member. Plus if your partner does want to help out her sister that's her choice. If your partner does turn her own sister away she will be condemned by both family and friends for turning away her own sister, as she should be.

[tenni]

Interesting observation. "Should they" means for me that is a question if it is a parents responsibility. I never felt that it was my parent's responsibility to rescue me in my 20's. Life is a bit more difficult to find a full time job though. I agree with Annika that it is a parent's responsibility is to teach independence but there is so much expectation to have "things" today. Doing without is not part of the societal expectation...or is it?

Independence seems to have become more difficult in this era compared to thirty plus years ago. Jobs are difficult to find and even then comments are reported that they are part time with no benefits. People in the twenties and older are finding it difficult to obtain financial independence. The question raised at one point was whether parents should help with down payment on houses. The advisor strongly stated that they should not if they have to borrow money to do it or worse spend their savings with nothing for their own retirement. What has happened with society that parent's feel responsible for adult children housing?

I also have a sibling whose financial responsibility has been poor judgement after poor judgement. I have bailed her out and she gave her own inheritance to her children. Now, she has nothing to fall back on. I will not help her. Fortunately, my parents presented themselves as not being able to help us. They taught me(missed my sister) to live within my financial means. One of my sister's children has let them move in with her! Child is supporting to some extent her parents. The parents gave money away to pay off the adult child's debts and made bad financial decisions beyond that. Now, they are basically destitute with very small income.

I do think that it is different today as far as people in their 20's and 30's financial independence. Housing costs are harder to make the downpayment. Still, I think that it is a very hard decision. Siblings who have crappy financial planning should be forced to do without. No parent wants to see their kid on the street though. Are parents trying to make life "perfect" for their kids and not letting them experience the struggle? Some may be.

[12voltyV2.0]

I think that we are free to help anyone of any sort for any reason if that is what we want to do --or not as well and it all depends on the particular circumstance at hand---there are no right or wrong answers to this---at least ones that come from sources beyond the boundaries of any relationship. It really "ain't no body's bidness" but your own if you decide to so something of this sort

[Melody Dean]

I'm not sure what to think on the subject. I don't have children, and even if I did, I'm too young (33) to have adult children.

My mom and stepdad cosigned my first car loan (no money, just signed), but other than that, I've been on my own, funded my own education, bought my own cars, provided my own downpayments.

I live in a college town where there are many kids who don't have to pay for anything themselves. Their education, supplies, and housing are paid for by their parents, and many even have credit cards supplied to them by their parents. Neither of my coworker's grown daughters have ever held a job in their lives, one is supported by her boyfriend/babydaddy, and the other is supported by her parents. They both wear designer clothes and drive high priced cars.

I get resentful of these people when I work so hard to earn everything that I've gotten. And I'll admit, I'm also jealous of all the financial stress that they don't have.

At the same time, if I had kids, I'd want them to get the best start in life possible. Sure, I'd probably pay for part of their education at the very least. I don't know where I would draw the line.

[Annika L]

You might as well get used to your wife/partner's sister asking for money, and getting it from your partner/wife. Or even moving in with both of you after your mother in law dies.

It's your partner's sister and you're not related to her, so it's not your business as she's not your family member. Plus if your partner does want to help out her sister that's her choice. If your partner does turn her own sister away she will be condemned by both family and friends for turning away her own sister, as she should be.

Y'know that quote you're so fond of about "you don't know me or my partner"? It works both ways, y'know.

[Annika L]

Interesting observation. "Should they" means for me that is a question if it is a parents responsibility. I never felt that it was my parent's responsibility to rescue me in my 20's. Life is a bit more difficult to find a full time job though. I agree with Annika that it is a parent's responsibility is to teach independence but there is so much expectation to have "things" today. Doing without is not part of the societal expectation...or is it?

Thanks for the clarification. No, it is not a parent's responsibility. Responsibility for one's children ends when the child becomes an adult. After that, it's all down to choice.

As to societal expectations to "have things", I have a couple thoughts.
(1) Again, in terms of adult children, it *might* be seen as your obligation to supply your child with "things" when they are a child...but when they become an adult, it's up to them to have the wherewithal to procure their own "things"; and
(2) Society expects a lot of crazy shit, frankly, and it is far from a parent's responsibility to make sure their kids meet all those expectations (frankly, they cannot be met, because many conflict). But honestly, if it was a societal expectation that children be addicted to heroin, then should a parent provide heroin to their kids (I mean, seriously, if all your friends were jumping off a bridge...would you do it)? I rather think not. It is the parent's responsibility to teach a child right from wrong, safety from danger, both when right and safety agree with and when right and safety disagree with society.

Some days I think I'm a little too independent for my culture. I'd hoped maybe I wasn't too independent for Canadian culture, but tenni makes me wonder.

[tenni]

I personally agree with Annika completely. I think that she is also in sync with the video expert. Where this pressure comes from for parents to take care of their children's needs and wants is a bit vague but I know that it happens. I hope that the majority of parents see their responsibilities as Annika described.

"Some days I think I'm a little too independent for my culture. I'd hoped maybe I wasn't too independent for Canadian culture, but tenni makes me wonder."

The above statement is a bit of confusion. Canadian culture differs most strongly in the concept of independence versus interconnection. Canada, with its more Nordic outlook towards others in the society differs from the US culture. This is most evident in Canada's universal health care. Canada is not as interconnected with its citizens as the Scandinavians but there is a very interesting similar outlook to collective care for citizens. I'm not sure that I have Annika's idea correct but I think that most Canadians do see their role in child rearing is to create independent adult children. Yet, we believe in a collective societal caring for all citizens. Yep, Canucks are strange...lol

[Annika L]

I personally agree with Annika completely. I think that she is also in sync with the video expert. Where this pressure comes from for parents to take care of their children's needs and wants is a bit vague but I know that it happens. I hope that the majority of parents see their responsibilities as Annika described.

"Some days I think I'm a little too independent for my culture. I'd hoped maybe I wasn't too independent for Canadian culture, but tenni makes me wonder."

The above statement is a bit of confusion. Canadian culture differs most strongly in the concept of independence versus interconnection. Canada, with its more Nordic outlook towards others in the society differs from the US culture. This is most evident in Canada's universal health care. Canada is not as interconnected with its citizens as the Scandinavians but there is a very interesting similar outlook to collective care for citizens. I'm not sure that I have Annika's idea correct but I think that most Canadians do see their role in child rearing is to create independent adult children. Yet, we believe in a collective societal caring for all citizens. Yep, Canucks are strange...lol

Hi tenni....sorry for the confusion. If you agree with my views on the importance of parents being independent-minded from their society/culture, and the importance of teaching independence to children...and if your views are somewhat representative of Canadian culture (as I'd hoped), then you alleviate my worries. Wanna raise a child together? ;)

I get and fully approve of that "Scandinavian collectivist outlook". This is one of those areas where the US is schizophrenic: on the one hand we say we want a sink-or-swim culture; on the other hand, we can't handle the results of such a thing (i.e., most people sink because a very few excellent swimmers hog up all the resources), so we have tension and create all kinds of ridiculous half-measures to mitigate our social responsibility...while on the other hand, floating businesses (who we now consider people??) tons of money in a most socialist-type way. Ok...way off-topic there.

[tenni]

Raise a child together? hmmm Shall we raise the child as Jewish or Muslim...lol?

I would like to think that Canadian culture still has a value of raising children to be independent. However, much like I suspect the US and even Britain has adult children in some form of delayed independence. I am aware of two adult children who seemed to delay their independence. One is a nephew of mine. One of his parents informed me several years ago that she could not see him living on his own until mid twenties. That is rapidly approaching now and the adult child is still completely dependent. He has some exceptionalities and so I can see how his mother thought this way. He is stuck in his life. Except for kicking him out of the house I see little to improve his status. I know of another adult child who remained in his parents house until well into his 40's due to alcoholism and job difficulty. I think that he has got his ca ca together now and lives on his own. The parents finally gave him an ultimatum. It is really hard to know how to get my nephew to start his own independent life. Due to his size and his ADHD factors it is hard for him to get a job..well it has been impossible. He lives in an area where without a car, you can not get job...Due to his condition he is afraid to drive a car out of fear that he may lose focus and kill someone. Sad. I know. There are suggestions but ... I'm sure that a lot of delayed adulthood scenarios are similar.

[viothe]

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[jem_is_bi]

I think that we are free to help anyone of any sort for any reason if that is what we want to do --or not as well and it all depends on the particular circumstance at hand---there are no right or wrong answers to this---at least ones that come from sources beyond the boundaries of any relationship. It really "ain't no body's bidness" but your own if you decide to so something of this sort I have looked through all the responses and like this one best.

[darkeyes]

There is no black and white answer... except for those who simply could never help their children in any case..not financially. Some are unable even to help pay bus fare.. but for those who can, it all depends on circumstances of everyone involved and the personalities... some adults never quite break free of parental apron strings... others would die before they would ask their parents for a penny... most of us are in between I think... after all families are about support and help in times of crisis or even just to get along in the world... I am great believer in the family and am part of a close knit, loving and co-operative family who help each other out either in times of crisis or just for a leg up... my parents helped me out many times and paid the deposit for me first flat when I left home (and 1st months rent).. and as I went through my education I had an allowance from my father so that life wasnt too much of a struggle.. not everyone was that lucky... woulld I do the same for me own children?

Our kids have trust funds so the issue really wont arise... both trust funds are healthy and wealthy because of good management, good fortune and bad (inheritances)... and as yet we have never needed to draw from them for any reason.. in September 2016 our elder child will we hope begin her higher education and the fund will be available to take some of the stress out of her life with a bit left over at the end.. that's where the wise comes in...

In principle I have no objection 2 helping our kids financially.. others have different ideas and different principles... we would however normally draw the line at throwing good money after bad... I say normally for again much depends on circumstance..

..as to dipping into savings.. i suppose we already have or rather we dont have as much saved as we could have because of our regular contributions to the kids funds.. and there is another next year to be set up so for a few years they will take an even bigger hit..and we are glad to do it.. but we are lucky enough to be able to do it... well over half the people of this country are not... once the funds are exhausted would we dip into our savings for our kids? Of course, depending on the whys and wherefors.. kids do not have any obligation to us.... rather we as their parents have obligation to them for we are the ones who brought them into the world or chose in my case to adopt one.. what right have I to cast them adrift willy nilly and left to the mercy of the world?

..but Annika has it right... we raise our children to become independent... we enable them to be so... or we should.. I think we are doing a decent job with ours... but there is no handbook to raisning children and making them so.. and many parents get it wrong.. we may well be getting it wrong, but we do what we do and what we can because we love them and will not see them have any more hardship in life than is absolutely unavoidable.. we wont be taken for a ride.. but we wont let the little buggers sink either..

[jamieknyc]

I still pay for some expenses for my children, even though they are both working. Those who aren't parents really have no idea how hard it is even for young people who are working full time to pay for things we took for granted.

[pole_smoker]

I still pay for some expenses for my children, even though they are both working. Those who aren't parents really have no idea how hard it is even for young people who are working full time to pay for things we took for granted.
Do you pay their rent, cellphone bill, medical insurance, and for a car?

[Annika L]

Raise a child together? hmmm Shall we raise the child as Jewish or Muslim...
Oh, tenni, details, details! :tongue:

I can't believe you overlooked the obvious question of whether we should raise them as US-er vs. Canadian!

[darkeyes]

Oh, tenni, details, details! :tongue:

I can't believe you overlooked the obvious question of whether we should raise them as US-er vs. Canadian!Wy eitha? Wy not just nice human beings? Peaceful, fun luffing, compassionate, tolerant, accepting and not at all a pain in the arse, a dimwit and pole smokerish!!:impleased

[Annika L]

Wy eitha? Wy not just nice human beings? Peaceful, fun luffing, compassionate, tolerant, accepting and not at all a pain in the arse, a dimwit and pole smokerish!!:impleased

Due solely to the necessity of having a location in space. I wasn't talking about nationalism/patriotism. But if we're in different countries and want to raise a child together, we'd have to pick on. Not necessarily *either*, really...I'd be happy to raise a child in the UK or New Zealand, or possibly in a Scandinavian country. But tenni and I have had so many interesting back-and-forths about Canadian vs. US culture that that seemed a reasonable way to start the question.

The peaceful, full-loving, etc., all go without saying for me. :tongue:

[Lisa (va)]

So many variables there is no one correct answer. I do believe there is a huge difference between a "helping hand" and a "hand out". Parents generally want the best for their children, that's obvious, but does that mean you pay for thing only till they reach the age of 18? Those who have furthered their education know how tough it can be to provide for you daily/weekly/monthly needs on top of the ever increasing cost of education. I know there are grants and scholarships out there, but I see no harm in having an investment account for higher education for your child. But you also have to consider the finances of the parents: are they willing to? are they in a position to do so ? Does 'footing' the bill discourage self reliance and independence? There is no definitive answer, like most things, it's case by case.

Lisa

hugs n kisses

[aLABiM75 & StrF51]

Help only if it's appreciated and reciprocated.
Never "help" a User/Abuser.
Basically: Hand-up, not Hand-Out


__________________________________________________ ______________

I have a 46 year old brother who lives on our Parents land, in a separate House they bought specifically for him (that he burned down and they rebuilt, bigger).
He does so Rent free, and even did it before that in a previous house they put him up in next door, before they moved out of the City.

While: I worked my butt off, only for our Parents to empty my bank account (without my permission or immediate knowledge) for a failed business they had that I never supported, even in the idea stage.... I'm now living in an apartment, where rent is more than a descent house payment, because they ruined my credit.

[like2bepegged]

My sister is a 47 yr old alcoholic that lives with my mother. my mother supports her and her cat while my sister that earns a decent wage, is out drinking every night.

[darkeyes]

Due solely to the necessity of having a location in space. I wasn't talking about nationalism/patriotism. But if we're in different countries and want to raise a child together, we'd have to pick on. Not necessarily *either*, really...I'd be happy to raise a child in the UK or New Zealand, or possibly in a Scandinavian country. But tenni and I have had so many interesting back-and-forths about Canadian vs. US culture that that seemed a reasonable way to start the question.

The peaceful, full-loving, etc., all go without saying for me. :tongue:
...nev thought u wer talking bout nat/pat, Annika... I assumed u wer talking culturally.. point I was trying to make is national cultures are a bit of a mishmash of good and bad.. the arguments bout wot is gud and wot is bad in each should b fun..and wot is meant by peace luffing, compassionate etc... u have a gud idea wot I mean by it.. am not sure British or even Scottish society (tho the latter does moren the former) share precisely the same meaning and am damn sure US and Canadian don't... that is prob an arrogance and a conceit but it is how I feel...

[Annika L]

...nev thought u wer talking bout nat/pat, Annika... I assumed u wer talking culturally.. point I was trying to make is national cultures are a bit of a mishmash of good and bad.. the arguments bout wot is gud and wot is bad in each should b fun..and wot is meant by peace luffing, compassionate etc... u have a gud idea wot I mean by it.. am not sure British or even Scottish society (tho the latter does moren the former) share precisely the same meaning and am damn sure US and Canadian don't... that is prob an arrogance and a conceit but it is how I feel...

I agree with you on the complexities of culture. But no...when I said "as US-er or Canadian" I was referring only to what country we'd raise them in...not *how* we'd raise them in that culture.

[charles-smythe]

Here is a video presenting interesting non sexual issues that you are or may have to deal with?

Should parents pay the bills of adult children?

Should parents of adult children pay the down payment of a house for them?

When or should parents financially help their adult children?

Should the parents dip in to their savings to help their adult children?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/video/video-carrick-talks-money-should-i-dip-into-my-savings-to-help-my-adult-kids/article21189928/
.
...I see no problem with helping out your children if they get in trouble through no fault of their own...and you can afford it...

[sterculius]

If the parents are in the financial position to do so, I see nothing wrong with judiciously helping one's adult children to reach their goals providing that those children are already doing everything reasonably possible in their power to accomplish these goals on their own, but can benefit from some assistance. The best thing a parent can give to their offspring is the ability to navigate through life independently.

[tenni]

bump up due to a troll removing threads

[jem_is_bi]

bump up due to a troll removing threads What does that mean? How does a troll remove threads?