Should bi women be allowed to claim "lesbian" identities?

[allthecats]

Butch, femme, d***...my fellow bi women, do you think we should be able to use these identities for ourselves? So many lesbian women think that bi women using these identities is appropriation of lesbian culture.

Do you think it's always appropriation? Sometimes? Never?

[Annika L]

Butch, femme, d***...my fellow bi women, do you think we should be able to use these identities for ourselves? So many lesbian women think that bi women using these identities is appropriation of lesbian culture.

Do you think it's always appropriation? Sometimes? Never?

I think these words have two uses: as identities and as just plain adjectives.

In other words, there is the butch identity as a "subclass" of lesbian, and then there is the word that describes a woman with short hair, and masculine dress (wow, she's really looking butch, these days).

I think that if you identify as bisexual, then I see no point in adopting lesbian identities. But I see nothing wrong with saying I look femme or even that I am a femme bisexual. In other words, bisexuals using these words as adjectives as appropriate makes sense to me...but I think applying them to ourselves as nouns/identities is at best confusing.

[cock queen]

NO WAY.I am bi and do not intend to give up my sexiness.I enjoy both men and women and on any given day I could and can have done both and enjoyed one just as much as the other.I believe that being bi is just that.I have gone to gay bars and a lot of lesbians turn me off.On the flip side my husband and I have had some swinger experiences where they have turned into bi fun with other women.I also think that the true lesbians do not want to share their title with bis.

[Long Duck Dong]

who really owns the rights to the words, bisexual and lesbian or any of the sub words....

my sister, skye was a bisexual that later IDed as a lesbian in the last couple of years of her life and there was a few people that did take exception to it..... my sisters way of thinking was that she was not trying to stand with any group or community, she was merely adjusting her label for herself and the changes in her life, she was still the same person but showing that she was leaving the free loving lifestyle behind and settling down with a lady that she loved to bits.....

in skyes words, the changing or using of a label did not change who she was, what she was, a lady that could and had enjoyed the company of males, females and others... but now she was embracing a love so deep and so strong that it eclipsed the interest in sex with other people and the changing of her label was a way of saying that she was acknowledging that level of attraction, interest and desire for a person........

in some ways kris was a butch girl, short hair, not into make up or dresses, a real farm girl / tom boy type but that was who she was and skye was a ex model, femme but a very skilled fighter and able to deal with things that would rock a lot of people to their core.... and both were true to themselves and others about who they were as people.... their sexuality, sexual activities and personalities were just part of the whole deal.....

I can look at people and think that they are butch or femme, bisexual or lesbian..... then I can get to know the people and it really does not matter to me any more, what label they use...because I know the person behind the label.....

[Meliss]

People are easily confused, and the more insecure they are the more tightly they cling to possessions, be it a friend, a lover, a spouse, a title.
Some men want all bi men labeled gay saying if you have had sex with a man once you are gay... opposite problem to what you say. Seems a woman worrying about this issue ma y want to limit access to men and be a bit controlling.

[darkeyes]

I think that if you identify as bisexual, then I see no point in adopting lesbian identities. But I see nothing wrong with saying I look femme or even that I am a femme bisexual. In other words, bisexuals using these words as adjectives as appropriate makes sense to me...but I think applying them to ourselves as nouns/identities is at best confusing.I probably agree withya in main, Annika... but the descriptor "butch" was attached to a certain kind of lesbian by others as much as it was claimed by them... ther is a goodly preponderance butch str8 women, and indeed butch bi women r not in short supply... so is "butch" properly a descriptor for a certain kind of lesbian? Or just a certain type of woman irrespective of sexuality?? As a lesbian (of the lippie variety) I have nev cared much wot peeps call themselves.. lots on site and in life moan bout attaching labels to peeps.. yet most do it and we do need descriptors or ther is a fair ole chance we wud nev meet our own kind.. and how dreadful wud that be:eek2:???

[Annika L]

...the descriptor "butch" was attached to a certain kind of lesbian by others as much as it was claimed by them... ther is a goodly preponderance butch str8 women, and indeed butch bi women r not in short supply... so is "butch" properly a descriptor for a certain kind of lesbian? Or just a certain type of woman irrespective of sexuality?? As a lesbian (of the lippie variety)...

This is pretty much what I was trying to say about the distinction between "butch" as a noun/identity and "butch" as an adjective/descriptor. Lesbian, bisexual, and straight women can all have butch appearances...but to call oneself "butch" would (to me) imply an identification with the lesbian butch style, and all that goes with it (and frankly, I'm not that familiar with the "all that goes with it" part...so maybe you're saying that there's nothing more to the identity than the appearance?).

Your reference to "lipstick lesbians" made me remember a relatively recent conversation. I commented to a friend that I'm close in style to "lipstick lesbians", except that I'm not lesbian, and (although I wear makeup of virtually every other kind) I almost never wear lipstick. His response was to call me an "eye shadow bisexual", which I found hilarilously descriptive. It made me wonder if this was in fact some kind of phenomenon he'd uncovered...surely I can't be the only one!

Any other eye shadow bisexuals out there who would care to identify themselves? :tongue:

[Mr.Funbuns]

I've never taken identity too seriously. My own tittle would probably be "feminine-bi-bottom-male." However out of fair play when with couples if the guy happens to start blowing me. I'm not going to be rude and mention my title again. A lil blowjob isn't the end of the world which is sort of the opposite problem that males have.

Women also translate how someone dresses and their mannerisms with a much keener eye then men do. So the butch thing is a bigger issue then men will ever realize. Using myself as an example again to prove my point. I have a shiny shellac mani/pedi, zero body hair, wear thongs every day, etc. When men see me, they still have doubt. Usually they just think "well he's a bit fancy" at first. When women see me, they'll ask if I want to try their lip gloss, or go get our nails done together. It's like I might as well just have a big dick across my forehead to the power of female intuition LOL. They knew what I was before I did....

My point is that women in general are smarter then identities when it comes to that stuff. They could be following Bruce Lee's philosophy and flowing like water:)

[zigzig]

I don't get why for some people it is hard to accept bisexual identity? Maybe because they will never understand how we feel? I had cases, when people ask me am I gay even though I said ,,No, I like both.''

[innaminka]

As a lesbian (of the lippie variety) I have nev cared much wot peeps call themselves..

Totally agree. I hate labels, although there is a minority (repeat, minority) of women in the lesbian community for who labels are critical.
Each to their own I guess.

[darkeyes]

Totally agree. I hate labels, although there is a minority (repeat, minority) of women in the lesbian community for who labels are critical.
Each to their own I guess...and yet.. like so many who couldn't give a sod 'bout wot peeps call themselves.. wot do I label mesel? A lesbian.. of the lippie variety:tongue:.. ho hum:eek2:.. fun innit:)? We all label ourselves summat!!;) ...and usually for gud reason:impleased...

[innaminka]

. wot do I label mesel? A lesbian.. of the lippie variety:tongue:.. ho hum:eek2:.. fun innit:)? We all label ourselves summat!!;) ...and usually for gud reason:impleased...

sadly, (maybe not..??) I would have to label myself a lesbian of the "hippy" variety............. as in hips, :yikes2:.....not flower power.

[darkeyes]

sadly, (maybe not..??) I would have to label myself a lesbian of the "hippy" variety............. as in hips, :yikes2:.....not flower power.:cutelaugh..