poll about 'cheating'

[cherry88]

well i am curious now. //

'cheating':
cheating present participle of cheat (Verb)



Verb





Act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, esp. in a game or examination: "she cheats at cards".
Deceive or trick.











from wikipedia: "Cheating refers to an immoral way of achieving a goal. It is generally used for the breaking of rules to gain unfair advantage in a competitive situation. Cheating is the getting of reward for ability by dishonest means. This broad definition will necessarily include acts of bribery, cronyism, sleaze, nepotism and any situation where individuals are given preference using inappropriate criteria.The rules infringed may be explicit, or they may be from an unwritten code of conduct based on morality (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality), ethics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethics) or custom (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention_%28norm%29), making the identification of cheating a subjective process. Cheating can refer specifically to marital infidelity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adultery). "



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ok..... after that other thread with poor lilbendy i want to ask soem questions about cheating.... i know there are many many very valid reasons why peopel feel unable to expose all of the truth about themselves to a partner.....

its true there is all kinds of social pressure, family pressure, etc etc huge reasons why people feel unable to disclose all kinds of information that the other partner really, really might want to know in a truly honest fully consenting situation..... sexual information, legal information, family information, all kinds of stuff. people are human, life is messy and that stuff happens.

so for certain kinds of people, people who are on the fence or just experimenting or not sure about what they want re their sexuality, or people who -are- bisexual or naturally non monagamous and know it but dont want the world to know, yeah the temptation is there and its a very real issue if you dont know what to tell your partner and you fear the truth will hurt, to just NOT SAY ANYTHING AND HOPE IT GOES AWAY... or not say anything and hope you can keep doing what you want to without being disturbed. or thinking it will avoid problems in the relationship. or avoid accountability, or having a difficuilt conversation, or perhaps being broken up with.. or losing your family even.. your job.. any number of things depending on the person... thats really understandable.. the thing is isnt that ultimately flawed logic.. if the person ends up -acting- on that stuff, and gets caught, -without- having been honest about it beforehand, a lot of the time -everyone- suffers way more than necessary, 99% of the time not at all because of the sex aspect..... because of the DISHONESTY aspect. if you cheat and get caught, you will probalby lose all that stuff anyway, and in a much more painful and dramatic way.. you are just gambling you wont get caught. it jsut seems so short sighted.

to not reveal you are bisexual, (or anything else) because you are afraid your partner would leave you, but then cheat on them, or otherwise deceive them and get caught, is jjust totaly the most flawed logic to me. a person may or may not leave you because you are bisexual, but to me theres a much -much- bigger chance they will leave you because they dont feel they can trust you, you deceived them, and they feel you dont respect them...



dishonesty in a relatoinship is a big deal and can go far beyond just sex. thats what i want to ask about right now. peopel can deceive and cheat their partners in tons of ways that are equally problematic and hurtful but not at all about sex. maybe it would help to take the converstaion away from sex, and talk about just plain honesty. your partner could have a closet gambling problem and wipe out your entire savings without telling you...... they could be HIV positive and infect you without your knowlege....... they could be a closet drug abuser and subject your house to geting robbed by drug buddies when your not there. theres all kinds of ways to get an 'advantage' in a relationsihp (get what you want without accountability or fairness) by not disclosing certain kinds of information.. peopel do it all the time.. i personaly maintain they are all equally problematic.... not because of the situaiton invoilved but becuase, dishonesty and hiding stuff rips apart the very fabric of any committed loving relatoinship. becuase relatoinships are built on trust.

the bottom line is, when you are in -any- relationsihp with other human beings, lovers, friends, roommates, etc etc, there is some expectation that you will enter the reltaionship in a respectful way, that is treating the other as you would wish to be treated, and this often means, disclosing to the greatest extent possible, information or activities or situaitons which could compromise your partners health or safety.....or things they need to know to make truly informed decisions about thier life and their inviolvement with you.. thats just fair. and i think -everyone- expects that to some degree, whether its about sex or about drugs or about health status or ability to pay the rent ontime, everyone has their own standards of honesty that they are not willing to have violated.

i think most people would agree when you remove it from the sphere of sex alone, you can see why disclosing stuff like that is obviously the correct and necessary thing to do. the more something has potential to impact your partners life, health, and safety, the more obligation yiou have to share with them what you are doing.

if your partner is HIV positive, and they dont tell you, im sure pretty much anyone would be righteously pissed off...... even though they udnersteand how embarrasing it is to tell, the stigma, the difficulty, the fear of rejection, that is still information that MUST be shared. that stuff cant be fooled around with. stuff like that must be disclosed. im sure likewise soemone who is -totally- ok with thier lovers fucking around with any number of other people, would still be totally furious if their partner started draining their bank account or leaving needles around the house or failing to pay important bills and just not saying anything. all that stuf is dishonest and bullshit. even though it has nothign to do with sex. does your partner have the right to be a drug addict and not pay the rent and not tell you. sure as hell. do you have the right to not put up with that if you think its bullshit. sure as hell.

people have a right to be told certain things in an intimate, committed relationship if only to preserve their own health and safety and freedoms as an adult. and to preserve their right to enter into relatoinships in a state of informed consent. this is just the respectful thing to do... for everyone. its not just always about sex. the problem is DISHONESTY.


i think the whole cheating argument is derailed becuase it gets confused with people's 'right' to have sex and be sexual. but they are really totally seperate issues. lying and dishonesty is juts never really ok. sometiems it happens and sometimes it happnes around the topic of sex, but pretty much no mater when it happens, its just plain disrespectful, because you are gaining something from someone else, their love, their involvement, that if they knew the truth, they may choose not to give. to not allow them that option is disrespectful, no matter what the topic is. that gets all watered down becuase peopel are so protective of their right to be sexual beings. but thats a totally different argument than the idea that peopel also have a right to expect a certain amount of fairness and honesty in intimate relationships no matter what the topic.


thats dishonesty and using someone else, geting something without paying for it, as it were, at its highest form. thats why it isnt ok. (imo)

so im just curious about what the people here really think about cheating so i made an anonymous poll. i just wanted to see how it really breaks down since there was some argument about whether people here seem to condone 'cheating' or not using 'bisexuality' as an 'excuse'.

ps its ok to check multiple answers. i know life is fucking complicated.

[BareProf]

i didn't expect a lecture! my wife and i are selective swingers meaning not every saturday night, just a couple of times a year. we are both orally bi. a guy on a swinger site contacted us but she wasn't interested. he then wrote me needing my photo services (i'm a pro), needing a shot for his business cards and a nude shot or two for the swinger profile. i told him my "fee" was to blow him. he was very happy with the photos. i loved being on my knees sucking him. i've never told my wife.

[tenni]

I think that you forgot a few options and seem focused on the cheating aspect rather than the bisexual aspect.
• I think that the poly is the natural default mode for bisexuals .
• Poly is the natural default mode for bisexuals and it is extremely difficult to self disclose in a judgemental monosexual society
• Cheating happens for a variety of reasons regardless of sexuality including when a partner refuses to have sex for years with their partner, or get counselling or even discuss the lack of sex
• Cheating happens when communication is closed down
•
Although cheating is wrong it is not a black and white rationale regardless of sexuality.

I agree that being able to sit down and discuss your bisexuality with your monosexual partner is best. The factors and consequences of doing so with a closed minded monosexual is often disasterious with two thirds of such relationships ending before two years after disclosure.

[Realist]

Here's my story:

Sad to admit, I've had three failed marriages. My bisexuality was not a factor in the demise of those unions, because that aspect of my life was not revealed.

I didn't cheat during marriages numbers one and three. But, at times, I was sorely tempted during number three.

I never loved wife number two, but that doesn't justify my infidelity. I hated hiding my secret live, but felt compelled to get my needs met elsewhere. (I know, a lame excuse)

During that 23 year marriage, I had three male and more female lovers. We both put up fronts, that we were satisfied with the marriage, but that was only proof that one can fool themselves. Finally, the cheating, always looking over my shoulder as I felt eyes watching me, became too stressful. I revealed my dissatisfaction and the fact that I didn't love her, then divorced her.

The last marriage lasted 10 years, but when the temptation became too strong, I reveled myself and then, we divorced, too.

I've finally found myself in the best relationship of my life, with a bisexual girl, who understands and accepts me. (I met her right here in 2008) Now, I can see that is what I should have searched for, from the beginning.

Life is a learning exercise, but some of us are remarkably slow learners!

[fredtyg]

I'll differ with at least some in that I'm not sure I'd always consider having sex with someone other than one's wife to be cheating. If a couple has an active sex life, yes I consider it cheating, both emotionally and physically. If a couple doesn't have sexual relations and hasn't for years, as is my case and that of dozens of other bi- guys I've heard from, I'm not sure I consider that cheating.

Hard to explain but so long as the sex doesn't involve an emotional bond that takes one further from the spouse, I just don't see how there should be a problem with it.

As long as you stay emotionally committed to the spouse or partner, I just don't see a problem with non- monogamy in cases where the two of you aren't having sex and have no plans to. It's no different than masturbating, although I have heard of wives who take exception even to that.

[fredtyg]

The point I'm trying to make is I don't believe it is cheating, at least in most cases. I'm sure you do and that doesn't surprise me. You have some pretty strange views on just about everything.

[Lisa (va)]

Hashing out the cheating argument again I see. If you assume that being bisexual makes you more prone to poly or opem relationships, it helps if those within that realationship have the same values and views. Having sex outside of a presumed commited relationship is cheating, whether it is the same or opposite sex. If these 'urges' can not be controlled, work on the current relationship or start a new one with someone with the same ideals.

Lisa
hugs n kisses

[chicagom]

I agree wholeheartedly with Lisa.

[tenni]

[QUOTE=Lisa (va);251781]Hashing out the cheating argument again I see. If you assume that being bisexual makes you more prone to poly or opem relationships, it helps if those within that realationship have the same values and views. Having sex outside of a presumed commited relationship is cheating, whether it is the same or opposite sex. If these 'urges' can not be controlled, work on the current relationship or start a new one with someone with the same ideals.

Lisa

Hi Lisa
On the surface your view makes sense. Why don't things work as easily as you state is left for me to ponder? Maybe, it is the concept of being in a "committed" relationship? Is being in a committed relationship not a monosexual concept supported by the mainstream for centuries?

[hasty1]

I don't think that a committed relationship is necessarily the same thing as a monogamous one. I'm sure couples that have open relationships would say they are committed to each other. Of course being in a monogamous, committed relationship has been the 'norm' in the west for a long time, but generally I think it speaks to human nature (in the larger sense) Many people like being in a committed relationship, whether that's due to conditioning or not, it's how many people naturally are. Raising a family with a partner is easier than doing it alone, I'm thinking here in evolutionary terms, I wonder if it goes back further than we might imagine. Just a thought.

Personally, my partner and I are currently committed and monogamous, which is his choice, but we expect to expand that at some point in the future to include threesomes with bisexual men, and who knows what after that. We're both open to the possibility of someone coming into our life that we don't want to leave, having sex sometimes leads to love, which is what happened to us. We had an 18 month sexual relationship which was NSA and wasn't exclusive, but we fell in love and wanted to spend our lives together. We are committed to each other, and will remain committed to each other once our relationship is no longer monogamous. If we ever invite someone else in to our relationship that person will get the same level of commitment from both of us. We're not perfect, but for various reasons ( for me it's things left over from my relationship with my ex-husband, and he has a certain neurological condition which is much helped by not having to guess or assume things in our relationship) so we've had to hash things out and come to an understanding that has rules, or boundaries if you like, for us. We see it as a very personal thing and wouldn't assume that it would work for anyone else. For me, and I can only answer for me, the concept of cheating in a relationship is when either partner goes outside of the boundaries that have been agreed, or implied by avoiding the discussion. I support monogamy and poly relationships, and any other arrangement you can think of, I support the right of people to participate in them as they choose, with honesty and respect. That's all.

[elian]

I had the benefit (if you want to call it that) of knowing I was different at a very young age so I struggled to first see if I could be happy "straight", then "gay" - after trying both and eventually always wanting the other then I said "WTF?!" and then I found this site.. I do have empathy for people who are struggling to come out to their families, children and friends but I just can't take the next step and agree that it is okay to hide the fact you are in another relationship from someone you love. It is the deception that I have a problem with, not the sex. If two adults enter a relationship knowing it was going to be an open relationship, fine. Otherwise, I can't see how you can grow in the relationship if you HAVE to keep a part of who you are a secret. People may choose to do it anyway, for their own benefit, or the benefit of stability .. sounds peculiar saying it out loud but I can imagine people not wanting to hurt the ones they love..

Actually, who am I to say about the life of anyone else, period? ..but you asked and those are my thoughts. Part of my aversion comes from growing up in a divorced family, I know that bisexuality could be cause for divorce but "hiding" things is a lot worse, unless you both know you're hiding them and both partners are okay with that...

[iluvsatinpanties2]

While I have cheated 5 times in almost 23 years, my wife is fully informed. Anything I do in the future she understands I am fulfilling needs she cannot meet. I don't regret cheating. I do regret not telling my wife sooner and not trying to get her to play along when we were younger.

[Meliss]

I have had partners cheat on me. Never has one of them admitted it. First had the lover announce it when I chanced upon them returning from a date. Second person denies two people despite evidence that was damning and unexplainable behavior by both in my presence and partner. I have had numerous opportunities but hold myself to a slightly different standard. It affected me in that I now keep other friends to possibly replace a partner should I become convinced current partner has fallen short of expectations and promises. Thus leaving a cheating partner is no longer me being alone and them having chosen someone. It would be me choosing another over them since there would be no negotiations on my part to "win" them back.

[darkeyes]

I have had partners cheat on me. Never has one of them admitted it. First had the lover announce it when I chanced upon them returning from a date. Second person denies two people despite evidence that was damning and unexplainable behavior by both in my presence and partner. I have had numerous opportunities but hold myself to a slightly different standard. It affected me in that I now keep other friends to possibly replace a partner should I become convinced current partner has fallen short of expectations and promises. Thus leaving a cheating partner is no longer me being alone and them having chosen someone. It would be me choosing another over them since there would be no negotiations on my part to "win" them back.
It's a bit calculating isnt it? Having a list of potential replacements to move in just in case... I rather liked being on me own and had a helluva a lot of fun while being so.. even after Kate walked out the door after I'd cheated... don't get me wrong, am neither proud of it or wish go through it again but whether cheating or having been cheated upon, and the relationship breaks up I reckon we need a break from relationships... not necessarily from sex but serpently from relationships. so a lot of comfort to forget the pain... which is how I always lived and liked living... and sex with dishy person or persons is as good a way to find that comfort as any and better than most to help heal our wounds...

I have been cheated on too as it happens.. but am not a natural monogamist and apart from when it happened when I was very young and first had bfs and gfs, I may have cringed a bit sometimes but I have never blown up and walked away for that reason alone.. often they have ended it with me when they were rumbled.. I wosn't in love so I never fretted unduly.. maybe regretted a good lay had gone from me life.. but I got on with living and never went into a near catatonic coma of morose misery.

I am a romantic and wanted love, but I never went out every day expecting to find it and neither did I fall head over heels for every Tom, Dick or Harriet, Life was good, it was fun and it wos how I liked it..sex was good, it was fun and I liked that too... I am believer in kismet.. and if love finds us, then great.. if not, then I was quite happy just to carry on being a gud time girl acting the tart with no long term relationships .. I'd never dream of lining up another from my circle of friends just cos I was 2timed or dumped... it smacks too much of vengeance if nothing else and I am not a vengeful person...I am not a possessive person and don't like being a possession... I live in a monogamous relationship because that's how my partner, the girl I once cheated on wants it... but she is not possessive about me for we both have our lives together and our lives separate, but we show interest in both.. we have our joint circle of friends, and friends who are our own separately...but sexually she is a one person girl..and about that she wont be changed... I am not unhappy with monogamy although I would rather she was more like me in that regard... I love her and enjoy life with her more than anyone else I have ever known so agreeing to her terms was not that difficult and what else am I to do? I don't wish to spend my life with anyone else but her and our kids so really it is not a hardship I find that easy at times but I can, have to live with it......

As I have said a million times before, there is no compromise between two people, one of whom believes in monogamy and the other does not.. if the relationship is to have any chance of survival, one partner has to accept the other's terms... which is what I have done for good or ill... but if she found that I was cheating again would she have someone lined up to take my place? Knowing her I doubt it... she may meet someone on the rebound as she did last time, although I believe if it happened again she would be much more wary of doing that, but she isn't that calculating that she has someone already lined up to choose from as my replacement... I on the other hand would sob for a while and break my heart as I did last time and slag meself off and curse meself for being a right cow .. she knows this just as she knows I would soon return to the bad old ways in part out of a need for comfort, in part because I am a bit of a tart and in part because I like living and have always reached out for the greatest experiences of which many are sexual... being how we are doesn't mean I love her any the less or that she does me any the greater .. it simply means we are two different people in love who have differences and we live together happily struggling and battling, trying to stay happy and hold things together to be what each of us wants the other to be as far as we are able.,, but on the question of how we conduct our sex lives and how we would like our sex lives to be, our view of the world is so very different, and if we are to carry on living as happily as we do now, one of us has to give.. we cannot compromise... because there can be none.

[Meliss]

Yes my way is a bit calculating and may not be anyone else's ideal. In my view of the world it takes time to have an intimate relationship that I desire. I tend to make friends easily but am a bit slow when it comes to intimacy. Indeed to this point in life all my lovers have been friends first even when we had that special click or spark of attraction from first sight. I can not control others and their actions. What I can do is have friends who would make nice romantic partners should I find myself looking. My belief is some friends can be potential backup mates. I don't know that I am by nature monogamous. In fact I suspect I am quite poly by nature. It is just I am well trained in being mono and my social environment does not offer many opportunities for flirting or pairing off with others. My thoughts are far from pure and I admit to dirty dog/slut potential. This is just where I am now. TY for a thoughtful response Darkeyes.

[darkeyes]

Yw Meliss.. I wasn't criticising ya, please don;t think I wos... it wos just such a surprise 2 me, tho for life ome really it shudnt have been... we all have our own ways of dealing with life and we serpently do wen it cums 2 relationships... I c nowt wrong with trying insure against pain.... I cud nev slag ne 1 off for doing that...:)