The economy in the US? Are you being affected?

[onewhocares]

Hi All,

I know that I have not been around much in the last several months. Much has been going on at home. Bill and I are doing well…making progress, or perhaps I should say holding our own regarding the open marriage we have.
The topic of this thread is NOT sexual at all. In the USA, much has been made of the “Fiscal Cliff” which we, as a nation, are fast approaching. While I do not wish to speak to the generality of the issue, I want to take it down to broad everyday terms. Since the depression or recession which started in 2008 or so…how did it affect you? Have you recovered? Are you in the same job you had prior to that time? Have you lost your place to live? I know that here in the northeast….recovery is SLOW. What plans if any have you had to make to adjust to the impending changes in the economy here.
I know for myself, life in the last years has not been the same. I work in a business where we sell homes, and the last one we sold was two years ago. Nothing new is selling, only used homes. Has this down turn in the economy taken a toll on seeking a partner for your bisexual life? Some of the bi folks I know have said that they are not going out as much socially to seek a playmate/mate as they have in the past.
Are you at all optimistic toward the future? I would be most interested in the general consensus of the group.

Belle in Boston

[Realist]

Hi, Belle...good to see you back!

The impact on me, being retired, is probably not nearly as bad as those still working. I don't make much, but I have no debt and have learned to live within my means.

My GF planned to move closer to me, but the job situation in Florida is stagnant. Even as a medical admin professional, she will have to stay where she is....for a while, at least. There's very few opportunities, of any kind, in this area.

My home, although paid for, is not nearly as valuable as the last appraisal, 5 years ago. I was banking on being able to sell it and make a nice return, but I'd probably get much less than the last appraisal, now!

Many younger folks are leaving Florida, now. Texas, with a good strong job market, and the Dakotas, have barely flinched, however.

I'm glad I'm no longer worrying about finding decent work. I was lucky to have been born when I was and always had viable skills to keep myself afloat, when times were hard.

I don't think anyone born these days will have the opportunities I did, but I hope I'm wrong. Things look bleak, from where I sit!

Best of luck to those of you still trying to keep your heads above water!

[void()]

No, my wife & I are not exuberantly optimistic. Change for the better is
not impending any time soon as best we perceive. Sorry.

[enkidu]

I am not in the same job I had when the first implosion in 2008 happened. I've actually managed (through some miracle or other) to trade up as far as pay and quality of benefits. I had to move across country to do it, which meant I had to leave California (which is not a bad thing). Before this, I had wanted to refinance or renegotiate my mortgage because I was living paycheck to paycheck; despite living in an area where there were a lot of people and investors who spread themselves too thin, I was not upside-down on my mortgage. But because the bank didn't take me seriously and everything around me was a short sale, I had no choice but to do the same when I moved. My credit rating took a hit, but it was high enough to begin with that I don't think there was too much damage.
:)

Having said that, I (like most people in the DC area) am a federal employee, and I am very concerned about keeping a job I've only had for seven months! The investment account I've had since 1995-ish has gone down by about 13% and the retirement account I opened in the beginning of 2011 has gone down by the same amount as well. Part of this is my own lack of knowledge when it comes to trading (I manage both myself), though a large part of it is the market being overrun with investor nervousness: I am a very disciplined investor, but that doesn't work well when the entire market is overrun with fear and uncertainty.

Am I optimistic toward the future? No way! I have absolutely no faith in our current Congress or president to resolve any policy matter of real substance, nor do I have any faith in state legislatures around the country to do the same. I similarly have no faith in European leadership to prevent a true financial catastrophe in the Euro zone, nor do I have faith in businesses to resist the temptation of easy money obtained through questionable means (an extreme example being several banks which are now facing criminal charges for money laundering and making illegal transfers to blacklisted countries). From what I've seen, financial problems are just the beginning.

Sorry to come off sounding like a prophet of doom, especially in my first post on this site, but these have been my experiences, and this is how I feel.

[void()]

I am a very disciplined investor, but that doesn't work well when the entire market is overrun with fear and uncertainty.

Am I optimistic toward the future? No way! I have absolutely no faith in our current Congress or president to resolve any policy matter of real substance, nor do I have any faith in state legislatures around the country to do the same. I similarly have no faith in European leadership to prevent a true financial catastrophe in the Euro zone, nor do I have faith in businesses to resist the temptation of easy money obtained through questionable means (an extreme example being several banks which are now facing criminal charges for money laundering and making illegal transfers to blacklisted countries). From what I've seen, financial problems are just the beginning.

Sorry to come off sounding like a prophet of doom, especially in my first post on this site, but these have been my experiences, and this is how I feel.


See http://www.bisexual.com/forum/showthread.php?13696-Once-Upon-A-Time&p=243045&viewfull=1#post243045

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

In the last year or so, enrollment for students with viable disabilities has dropped drastically. The parents of such students cannot afford to have their children go to college. They are going through the vid-classes instead, which do not require Mobility Aides, like myself. I still do on-line tutoring, and one on one help, but I not longer have to go To the college to help my students, which meant taking yet another hit on the paycheck. :( Its tough all over Darlings. We just do the best we can, and handle it from there. :}
Good luck to al lof us..:}
Cat

[Jason0012]

I have worked more erraticly since the collaps in 08. I am contract skilled labor and many projects got shelved due to the uncertainty. Alltogether I went about 2+ yrs without work. My wife has been completely unable to find work, she was in school when it all went downhill so she emerged to a dead job market. We lost our previous house in 2009. Rather than rent we then took the cash we would have paid the bank and bought an old forclosue outright. With a little (Ok a LOT) of help from a carpenter friend we now are debt free and have twice the house! So while it has been a rough ride we did come out the better for it. I however doubt that it really is over though.

[Annika L]

Hi Belle,

So far, we have weathered the decline ok...couple years without a pay increase, and some more general "austerity measures" is about the extent of it.

But frankly I am not optimistic about the future. The Earth is rapidly approaching its carrying capacity for humans, with no signs of being able to stop before exceeding it. Our country is way over its head in debt, with no signs of being able or willing to curb its growth, let alone pay it back. We have passed the peak for oil production, and yet still have an economy that is based on cheap oil. I believe the competition over increasingly scarce resources is poising to get truly nasty, and I think that the time to take measures to ensure that we needn't reach a violent crunch-point is long past. I keep trying to figure when to divest from the stock market...do I wait to see if we can get back up to what it once was...or would I do better to cut and run now, while it's reasonably close? I suspect I'll wait too long...but I also suspect I'll be in good company.

Sorry to be a downer...but you asked *smile*. Here's hoping I've got it all wrong!

[darkeyes]

What happens in the US economy affects us all especially in the west... certainly it affects Europe.. we know Europe doesn't have its troubles to seek, and the British economy although not part of the Eurozone is headed for the first triple dip recession in its history.. so interlinked are the economies of the world that the health of such a huge economy as the US will always have its effect.

Most people in the UK are suffering a huge reduction in living standards as the British government struggles with Eurozone problems on one hand (even although not a member), and the effects of the crash on the US in particular and other countries in general.. I won't go into whether they are making a good job of it (yes I bloody well will.. but only lightly) but personally, for myself and my family we have been among the lucky ones.. salary incremental advances over the time of the crash and the fact that I am no longer a student, and a promotion and incremental advance for my partner have helped.. had we been at the top of our respective pay spines like so many others, we would have seen a deterioration in our living standards..

We don't have a mortgage on either the family home (inherited from my partner's dad) or the cottage (inherited from my dad even although I did have to dig deep to buy out my brother and sister's shares, so savings and investments have taken a huge hit admittedly for reasons which have nothing to do with the recession although it is easily argued that these would not have been hurt quite so badly had the recession not taken place..., so we are still in a better position than when the crash began and are better off than we were last year as much by personal misfortune as good fortune... how much better still we would have been but for the crash certainly amounts to 6 or 8% of our current income so in a sense we too have paid a high price even if we still live better now than at the very beginning of the mess or even just last year.....

However, Government tells us we are in the poo until 2018 at the earliest... and both partner and myself will be on top of salary scales several years b4 then... and unless good fortune smiles and career advance or a miracle beckons we too shall begin to see our living standards begin to fall some good time before 2018.. we need an economically strong US to help our own economy recover as well as an economically strong planet, but the former's good economic health remains the most potent symbol of recovery.. but our own government needs to do more to help that along...

As the US begins to hold its own and shows signs of recovery, the British drowns because it's government does exactly the opposite to what the US does by and large..and differently from the Germans too for that matter and they are beginning to feel the pinch too because of the Eurozone crisis, but much less so than ourselves for all that.. the British Government as best I can tell lives in hope that US recovery will dig it out of the mire while it fiddles and does its own thing for its own kind and allows the rest of us to pay the price.. and as I say we are lucky so far because of where we are in our lives and careers... in a few years we wont be quite so lucky very likely, and if public sector cuts continue at the rate they are, and public services continue to be butchered as they are, who knows whether I will retain the position I have now, and my partner, in the private sector but working for a firm relying largely on public sector work, her future too has some question marks upon it...

..and I agree with Annika... whether or not the US economy recovers, and the British and the rest of the world... there are so many other factors which make our future very questionable...and threaten the sustainability of any economic recovery and even the future of our species.. we are in a whole new economic ball game too.. the US is no longer the great all powerful economic behemoth and unchallenged... what affect that will have on us is too early to tell but it is bound to..and so far the signs are less than promising...

So, as to the economy in the US.. yes we are affected... even in these small islands far away... our own government needs to do more, but for all that whatever it does, we require a strong US economy for our personal prosperity to continue and for that of the millions in a far less fortunate position to ourselves to recover...

[Jason0012]

The economy is doomed because we refuse to change anything, here or in europe. Bankers didn't go to prison, the burden was heaped on the working folks ,and they continued the practices that caused the mess in the first place. "double dip"is an absolute lie since the recession was only slowed by a huge infusion of cash barrowed against taxpayers. I hear about all the new job oportunities in town but they are all paying in the $8-12 per hour range! Not exactly a living wage.

[jem_is_bi]

I have worked in medical research and have been totally supported by NIH funding for more than 20 years through a sequence of 2 and 3 year grants. But, now with the economy struggling and the debt issue, research funding has been significantly impacted and my funding ends at the end of this year. Eventually, some money will become available, because research groups I have worked with will need someone like me on their grant proposals. However, I have restarted a previous medical related career and hope to ramp up to full time by March. If all goes as planned, I will make significantly more money than in research. Plus, any future research related funding will be added on top of that. My long-time friend has more economic issues, but he has me.

[ohbimale]

the economic depression did not really affect our online stores until this year. 2012 has been the first year out of 14 years in business that we have seen our sales drop by 1/3. We are still in business, however our 16 year old car is held together with welding bars and still running, may actually be driven into the ground literally. Our washer died earlier this year, no money to replace it, so the laundrymat is now our friend. I have done whatever it takes to keep our home, nothing illegal though. I was very dissappointed to see the voters return the same people to government, meaning more government by paralysis. I do not see the economy improving anytime in the near future, but in fact things may get worse. For us small business owners who are constantly under fire from the government things do not appear very optomistic.

[enkidu]

void(), that was a very interesting video, and it's nice to finally put into words some of what I've suspected since high school (not like any X-Files-style conspiracy, but more subtle).

Having said that, if stumbling helps us appreciate the journey, should we absolutely love it if it's a swan dive off a cliff? :impleased

[12voltman59]

I am just treading water---I had lost full time, "go punch the clock" sort of work (in that I had a set place to go at a set time doing a set job and getting a more or less stable rate of pay) before "the crash" came---I had been doing freelance journalism and that was holding its own---but the entire publishing industry is being changed by many factors of course, the internet being a big one--and then came the economic "downturn," so things really went down---newspapers and magazines that had already been shedding staff like crazy at all positions, except maybe advert sales---surely people like staff writers, editors, contributing writers and the like---got cut. If you do get any work these days---you can expect that for most publications---they pay one heckuva lot less than they used to do.

I had taken training to do decorative painting and for some in that field---it is almost more lucrative than ever--but that work mostly goes to those who already have a name and had the resources to weather the downturn that industry did feel even at the highest levels---I was someone just trying to get started---and I was still in the process of setting things up--when the crash came--I basically just threw in the towel on that----because no one around Dayton, Ohio for a long time commissioned anything other than just simple, straightforward interior paint jobs---forget about charging five grand to do a wall that looked like ancient Tuscan plaster or something of that sort.

I had been selling some of my abstract art---selling my paintings for significantly less than what those with established names were able to command--once again--at the high end of the art world---things actually did damn good with top artists getting commissions and selling paintings and other work for untold amounts of money--but if you were operating under the radar and not at all well known---forget it---that market DIED.

I earned my boating captains license----but for the kind of work that some associates of mine in that field do---do one time deals where they take boats around and deliver them---that business almost has died too---my one captain buddy had NO such trips that got booked at all during 2012--at least he did have work in each of the prior years to 2012 and subsequent to the crash of '08. I can tell ya--the boating industry is not what it once was and it probably never will be again--unless this country experiences some sort of major renaissance--something I do admit to have a strong degree of pessimism about for some of the same reasons expressed by others on this thread.

I am doing what I can--living off of "my accounts" I have--but one concern---while I am doing my best to not drain them and living frugally---they are going down and I ain't getting any younger---I really do need to do something to generate a cash flow to be incoming---rather than mostly being in the outflow.

The one big expense I am going to have to make---while my vehicle is in great shape--its now 10 model years old--now at around 150k miles--which is not bad really--I just put a few grand into it---but at some point--I am going to need to get a "newer" vehicle--if not a new one----I'd kind of like to buy some sort of "luxury" model/brand like a Mercedes, BMW or Audi---get one a few years old off a program and basically drive it till it falls apart----but then again--I guess I should lower my sights a bit and get a nice--but "reasonable" make/model---and even though I do like having a bigger vehicle--my current car was a true mid-sized SUV--but then again--its probably wise to get a car that gets good gas or maybe diesel mileage. I kind of would like a newer vehicle of some sort---but man--with this car having been paid off years ago--I am not looking forward to either taking out a big chunk of cash---buying outright or leasing or borrowing a note to get a car and having payments.

My current goal is to do my own thing on the internet---using my skills in writing, photography and am training myself in videography so I can start my own website doing stories on news, entertainment, music, etc--starting slowly and hopefully attracting other talent over time--but that takes time and money--so I have to do it in drips and drabs since I don't want to just go and burn through too much cash too fast.

I know that everyone says that the internet is such a great thing---but as much as anything that does hold me back--I am really coming to the conclusion that in so many ways---the internet has become more of a curse than a blessing----and wonder if it really does have all the "value" that its hyped to have!!

[Realist]

A friend's son graduated with an arts degree, with a focus on computer generated imaging and televised program production. He can't BUY a job! He's now driving a potato chip truck...and lucky to have it!

Like Volty indicated, those already in jobs like that are firmly ensconced, with reputations for excellence...plus seniority. Some of them will never leave, probably dying on the job!

The things I did for a living paid well, but now technology has taken over. I'm lucky to have retired, while things were going strong. I don't envy any young person entering (or trying to enter) the job market, today!

[jamieknyc]

Here in New York, we have been less affected than most of the rest of the country. However, 2012 was, relatively speaking, a lean year.

[Lisa (va)]

I was not gonna reply, but I so like that word frugal (thanks google). And yes I am frugal, I like to but things when they are on sale. But the reality is most if not everything is increasing. We are fortunate though, we have what we need and even a few things we want. I also don't see things changing much any time too soon. I wouldn't even mind if we had to pay more in taxes, but even that is not likely to change the way things are. < rest of rant deleted >

Lisa

hugs n kisses

[terri]

It was a long time ago, I was just a boy, dont know if it was the late 1950s' or the early 60's my grand ma said to me.... "Terry, my dear one, just remember one thing", she said to me, " It always gets darkest just before it turns pitch black,so smile for things could always be worse."
Although it seems morbid at times, it does help me keep things in perspective. I am still married, my children are healthy, the bank hasn't taken our home. Those are good things, sure I wish I had a steady job, a new roof on the house, some presents to put under the tree . Having been mostly unemployed since Thanksgiving 2008 and approaching Age 60, returning to the good old days seems to be a dream gone to the way side...... but it still could be worse .