LGBT sexuality school lessons concern father

[Long Duck Dong]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/7242226/Rainbow-class-worries-father

I have no issues with alternative sexuality lessons in schools as part of a open and honest view of alternative sexuality..... but like the father I do have some concerns over this and the way it was done.......

we are LGBT, and if we are going to talk to students, we should do it in a simple, concise way that is informative and not full of remarks that make us look like we were taking LSD before the class

The teenage boy said two of the presenters introduced themselves to the class as lesbians, one who was attracted to transsexual girls, while the third said he had been a woman attracted to women but became a man "with a vagina".


The class heard two of the presenters' coming-out stories, including how one had grappled with discrimination and deciding if they were male or female. "[The transsexual speaker] was saying things like, 'it's legal to have a physical relationship with your cousin but it's illegal to have gay marriage'. And things like, if you're really homophobic you usually turn out gay.


sadly its not the first time I have heard issues about the rainbow youth school project........and the way that the LGBT are being portrayed as people with twisted understandings and reasonings, that share them with others as what the LGBT are like....... we have taken a giant step backwards with educating people about the LGBT

on behalf of NZ and the LGBT community I want to apologzie for the fact that our LGBT education project is run by people with no fucking idea how they make the LGBT look ......and I seriously believe that the students would have been better going to a LGBT pride parade and talking with the people there cos at least they would have talked with people that have a working brain in their heads......and could see that we are normal people just like everybody else......

[æonpax]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/7242226/Rainbow-class-worries-father

I have no issues with alternative sexuality lessons in schools as part of a open and honest view of alternative sexuality..... but like the father I do have some concerns over this and the way it was done.......

we are LGBT, and if we are going to talk to students, we should do it in a simple, concise way that is informative and not full of remarks that make us look like we were taking LSD before the class

The teenage boy said two of the presenters introduced themselves to the class as lesbians, one who was attracted to transsexual girls, while the third said he had been a woman attracted to women but became a man "with a vagina".

The class heard two of the presenters' coming-out stories, including how one had grappled with discrimination and deciding if they were male or female. "[The transsexual speaker] was saying things like, 'it's legal to have a physical relationship with your cousin but it's illegal to have gay marriage'. And things like, if you're really homophobic you usually turn out gay.

sadly its not the first time I have heard issues about the rainbow youth school project........and the way that the LGBT are being portrayed as people with twisted understandings and reasonings, that share them with others as what the LGBT are like....... we have taken a giant step backwards with educating people about the LGBT

on behalf of NZ and the LGBT community I want to apologzie for the fact that our LGBT education project is run by people with no fucking idea how they make the LGBT look ......and I seriously believe that the students would have been better going to a LGBT pride parade and talking with the people there cos at least they would have talked with people that have a working brain in their heads......and could see that we are normal people just like everybody else......


I am a mother, first and foremost. I am progressive, bisexual, female centric and try to be open minded. But of all the things I am, I am a parent, first. I have the right to determine what my children learn and when certain things are appropriate. I will allow no school and no government to usurp my rights and responsibility as a parent.

Certain subjects are the domain of a parent. Religion for example. I'm a Theist but have allowed my girls to choose what they want to believe in...if anything at all. Sexuality is another domain. I'm not talking biology or the social implications of behavioral sexuality. In this case I'm talking orientation. My daughters know I'm bisexual and they know about the various orientations. I believe schools, particularly "primary" schools, should at the very least, acknowledge and teach that various orientations exist beyond heterosexuality. By "secondary" school, I believe a child is old enough to choose what "elective courses" they wish to learn, including orientation/sexuality, that goes beyond the core curriculum....which brings me to the article.

The first thing that jumped out at me was this phrase; "alternative sexuality education classes". I don't know about NZ but that would suggest to me an "elective" course, not part of the core curriculum. (The article does not state) In the US, such courses are offered as an alternative, where a child or parent may choose to attend, but is not legally or scholastically mandatory for graduation. In many cases, a parent must give the child written permission to attend such a class. In all cases, a concise description of what the course is and what is presents is offered.

In the US, if such a class were mandatory and part of the core curriculum, (especially in a public school) I daresay all hell would break loose. Now as open minded as I feel I am, such a course should not be mandatory. I may not agree with some the religious/political garbage parents fill the heads of their children with, it is still a parental right, which I hold as sacrosanct.

IF the course mentioned in the article is mandatory and was done without due notice, then (using my standards) a parent has a legitimate grievance.

[Long Duck Dong]

the rainbow youth education project is a 2x1 hour option that the schools must ask for... and the rainbow youth education project is not part of the education system schedule.... and its a auckland based volunteer group with no formal training that the school board of trustees asks to come and talk to the students, and the school conducts it during school hours....made up of mostly early to mid twenties people...... however the NZ education board do not support or condone any part of it...

the school board of trustees is elected from a pool of parents ( they do not have to have kids at the school ), education board members, officials, the principal of the school, they all have a meeting and make choice about the school, including things like the rainbow youth education projection coming to the school, but most times the board of trustees will not be present at the school to see what actually happens when the rainbow youth education project do go to the school

what has been happening is that they go into the schools, talk about how they grew up as LGBT and came out, encourage the teens to do word association ( you write lesbian, bisexual, gay and trans on a board and get the teens to share the negative words that they would use against the LGBT )..tell the teens that they should not refer to the LGBT using those terms ( there have been reports about that getting right out of hand a number of times ) etc

( I contacted a teacher that was at the school and the meetings, mentioned in the article ) the group was a lesbian female, a lesbian female that perferred transexual females a pre op FtM trans ( former lesbian / man with a vagina, the trans words, not mine ) and one gay male..... the coming out talks were done by the trans person and the lesbian female..... and the main focus was on homophobia and how wrong society is about LGBT and how the LGBT should be living ( personal opinions, not positive, supportive statements ) and yes, the remarks about how 'it's legal to have a physical relationship with your cousin but it's illegal to have gay marriage' and if you're really homophobic you usually turn out gay'

there was not a balanced and positive view of the LGBT presented, there was no follow up plan, the teens were told to create their own LGBT alliance ( that is dangerous as there is no trained professional consellor support available ), teens were encouraged to be out at school, even if they were getting bullied ( that is asking for trouble, as bullying and youth suicide are very high in NZ ) they were told that sex with the people they were attracted to, was not wrong ( but they are 15, it would be illegal )... they did not really deal with the experience of realizing their sexuality..... the list goes on......

I have said it before and I will say it again, its not so much society that is the problem, its the LGBT in some cases... and unofficially, there have been 12 LGBT suicides that may be indirectly linked to school visits by this group in the last ten years......

I am not against LGBT teachings in schools, but we need to do it right and have supportive and long term follow up plans in place........

and in case anybody is curious as to why there are no bisexuals involved in the school visits, its cos there are no bisexual volunteers and so nobody to represent the B in the LGBT

[tenni]

It is difficult to contextualize what happened during that class without knowing the entire curriculum on sex ed from say 6 year olds up to 15 year olds. What has been taught previously before these fifteen year olds were given this lesson? Looking at this particular lesson in isolation is not appropriate. It does read as too much was trying to be covered in one self disclosing discussion lesson?

The other point that stuck out for me was the use of the term homophobia in reference to what appears to be transphobia but it is unclear in this brief article. Perhaps the lesson on a transman?(man with a vagina) should have been separate event from the self disclosing lesbian lesson. It is a brief article and nearly impossible to determine what the objectives of the lesson were?

Just because you are a lesbian doesn't mean that you are qualified to teach homosexuality to 15 year olds. Just because you are a transman doesn't mean that you are qualified to teach transexuality to 15 year olds either. We have no idea what were the objectives of the lesson nor whether some of this information came out as part of a Q&A section after the self disclosing presentation.

Contrary to Aeon, I believe that the education system should have sex ed as part of its curriculum from four year old to eighteen year olds. Most parents are not comfortable nor qualified. The op out option should be available though for parents on an annual basis but personally I do not really like it.

[Long Duck Dong]

It is difficult to contextualize what happened during that class without knowing the entire curriculum on sex ed from say 6 year olds up to 15 year olds. What has been taught previously before these fifteen year olds were given this lesson? Looking at this particular lesson in isolation is not appropriate. It does read as too much was trying to be covered in one self disclosing discussion lesson?


did you actually read the article ? the answers to your questions are in the article.....

Earlier this year Rainbow Youth presented two one-hour sessions to the 15-year-old's class



One presentation was about gender and sexual identity and the other addressed issues such as homophobia and bullying.


She estimated they were involved with 30 of Auckland's almost 200 high schools
Rainbow Youth's education co- ordinator Priscilla Penniket said the organisation went into schools by invitation


Depending on the high school there's varying levels of homophobia which can sometimes be really [emotionally] unsafe for the volunteers coming out who are telling their story."


She denied volunteers were encouraging homosexuality, or saying homophobics were gay. Penniket said research had proven that when people were overly homophobic it was often because they were hiding something such as their sexual identity or the identity of someone they knew.


the rest of the info is in my post, detailing how the education system doesn't support or condone it.... IE it is in no way at all, any part of school lessons as laid out by the NZ education system.......

[tenni]

Sorry
I did scan that section about the different classes a bit too quickly.

My position remains that any presentation should be done in context to the entire curriculum of sex ed.

[biguy71]

There's certainly nothing wrong with sex education in schools, but I believe that should be limited to the biological process. I do see talking about sexual preferences as being part of that topic, but only in defining what heterosexuality, homosexuality, and bisexuality actually are. Personal beliefs about various sexual preferences or practices are definitely the domain of the family. And I also don't see transexuality as being an appropriate topic for sex education because that is a matter of gender identity rather than sexual preference. Therefore, it should be studied in the context of psychology rather than sex education. I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with my views on this subject, and that is exactly my point. Everybody's views are different, so parents should have the right to teach their kids whatever they feel is appropriate.

[elian]

I think the biology should be taught in public school, I think the social and moral issues revolving around sexuality should be taught in church WITH parental involvement .. http://www.uua.org/re/owl

[Long Duck Dong]

I tend to agree elian..... the moral and social issues change depending from person to person and its dammed near impossible to teach them without a personal influence or agenda slipping into it

but honestly, I struggle to think of any group that I am fine with teaching social and moral issues cos I can not think of any group that doesn't push a agenda of acceptance, tolerance and respect for people without finding fault in the actions or thinking of others and believing that it needs to be changed

personally I would teach " love them or hate them, agree with them or disagree with them, we have to share the world with them..so its to each person how they do that with the different groups in society "... and as one of my friends puts it, the person most likely never to be heard saying a unkind word about any person, is the man in the moon.....