I need HELP !

[christelle69]

Hi everybody,

This letter is NOT another lesbian drama bullshit, so please take it seriously and*THIS IS NOT A MANIPULATION* as well. I'm deeply in need of help here

How my nightmare began

During more than 2 months and prior to come in Sydney Katrina and I had spent more than 8 hours on Skype every day. I've made sure that everything was fine with her, asking all the possible questions, before taking the decision to leave everything in France to come to live here with her.

Then I was out to do some food shopping and when I was back I've caught her on a porn site (months later she has admitted that she has manipulated me to send me away to do her things), in itself it's nothing but the videos was straight porn and not lesbian ones. Since I know how to search on computers regardless the fact that the person delete the browsing history, I was devastated to see that she was going on sexual dating sites as well (since I arrived in Australia) especially the site Adult Friend finder, where she was searching for women AND men.

Now you know about the STRAIGHT pornography (more than 800 videos watched in 3 months, more than 200 of them were implying asian women - Katrina is asian with black men), I'm a LESBIAN I've openly say it since I'm 12 years old and YES straight pornography disgust me...

I've ask Kat why she was watching this shit during 8 months, asking her many questions EVERY day, and EVERY day she was lying to me. I've even ask her to promise on Norman's grave (her brother) if she was masturbating in front of straight porn that day, she promised she wasn't but I had the proof that she did it...How can you trust someone who spit like this on the memory of a brother?

but 4 months ago he has FINALLY admitted that she had male partners**that she's been PREGNANT and asked for abortion. Now she's constantly backing off again saying that she's a lesbian after having admitted that she's bisexual.... ALL THAT is driving me crazy...The last male she had was 6 years ago.

SHE LIED TO ME WHEN I WAS IN FRANCE, She has admitted that she had TRAPPED me, lied to me when I was in France because she was in love with me, so she lied, just in oder to HAVE ME...

IMPORTANT The way she's answering to me is weird for a lesbian: when I suspect that a guy interest her, twice she said 'Nothing can happen he's married with children" IS IT A LESBIAN ANSWER???? She has even said to me one day that I was "jealous" of a guy...


here come the 3 questions that needs answers in order to help me (please say what you think abut it)

Knowing everything I've just put the situation is even more confusing. She's saying that the world of sex is fascinating for her, male and female, but that " SHE NEVER FANTASIZE ABOUT MEN IN REAL LIFE (not porn), and "THAT SHE NEVER FEEL ATTRACTED TO MALES AT ALL...Does it make sense to you???

Another thing she's saying that "SHE WAS BISEXUAL IN THE PAST BUT NOT ANYMORE SINCE SHE'S WITH ME...Same thing does it make sense to you?

Last question : she has admitted that straight pornography was a turn on but as well that the penetration by a male was source of pleasure, but NOW she's saying that she never think of doing it again, that "THERE'S NOTHING THERE" referring of being turned on by males in the street or at her work. Do you think that's possible?

Thanks a lot for your future answer, I've spent the last year trying to understand if she's lying to me or if she's in denial....

[Long Duck Dong]

ok, sounds like you are struggling to relate to the thinking of a bisexual person..... lol...

porn fantasies, are a reality for some people... they are turned on by the idea of the fantasy, the imagery but not the reality of the sex.... as real life sex can being issues and problems that people do not want to do with..... hence why some people perfer No Strings Attached sex.... no issues, no problems... just straight forward sex......

bisexual in the past but not while with you..... bisexuality is fluid, its possible for bisexuals to become hetero / gay / les, in the same way its possible for other sexualities to become bisexual ( watch some people argue that that is wrong )...so what she is saying, could be true but most people will see it more along the lines of she is still bisexual, but she is happy with the female on female contact and the desire for males is at a low ebb and not affecting her...... and that can change,.... a few years down the track, she could desire sex with a male.......

so yeah, it is possible again that she is telling the truth about having no desires towards males walking down the road... but that penetration by males is something that she enjoyed, it brings pleasure....... but at this time, there is no interest in males......

ok now for the rest of your post..... how can you trust a person that would swear on the grave of another person ????
right, swearing anything on anything, only carries value if the person places value on the nature of the vow..... IE I refused to swear alligence to queen and country in the military, and I will not swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, on a bible, as I place no value on them, so my words would be hollow and meaningless.

you placed value in the vow, she may have placed value in her brother, but no value in swearing on his grave, so it was just words.... hollow words.....

now I have some questions for you.... as your post is leaning towards a female with low or zero interest in interaction with males sexually, but there is a underlaying aspect of low interest in males as emotional / mental supportive people ( close friends ) in your wording.......

does the idea of your partner being with males and females, affect you ( turn you off ).....

does the idea of being with a bisexual person affect you ? and how does it affect you ?

do you perfer a rigid lesbian partner ?


I am interested in seeing if there is a way that we can help you work thru the issue... and we have a number of lesbian / lesbian members and lesbian / bisexual members that may be able to relate to the situation better than me and better advise you, as they would have a good understanding of how you feel as a lesbian......

[falcondfw]

LDD has asked many good questions and given some very good advice.
For me, the underlying issue are the lies.
Even if she is EVERYTHING you ever wanted in every way, how can you seriously think about a life with someone who is either lying or who you have so many questions about her integrity that you find yourself having to hack into her browsing history, even if she deletes it?
Like LDD says, the needs and desires of bisexuals can be fluid and switch from more heterosexual to more homosexual.
How do you know she is lying? just because you found her browser history does not mean she was masturbating to it (unless there is a surveillance camera in the room).
Admitting that she lied to get you to come to her from France to Australia is serious. Again. this goes back to my second paragraph?
How old are the two of you? Honestly, it sounds like you have jealousy issues (don't be offended. A lot of people do, including me.).
There are a lot of things about your post that honestly don't make sense to me. For example, how you know where to find browsing history even if she deletes it. Sounds like you have done that before. That is why the jealousy and trust questions.

[Long Duck Dong]

lol falcon..... delete the history of a computer and I can still bring up your browsing history...... its called the temp files and cookies

clearing the browser history will only clean the sites visited..... IE the URL list.... but in the MS system, are saved files like the temp files and the cookies that also can be used to tell where a person has been

the thing with the temp file, is you can tell what a person has been looking at, IE pics, vids, music cos they are saved in the temp file, so a person could say that they never went to a site and viewed porn, but I could tell what site, when and what porn they viewed on what page.......

any operating system that is a microcrap system......

I would use Ccleaner and clear temp, cookie, browser history and the temp BACK UP files.... and even then, its possible to retrieve a persons email history for sites like hotmail and yahoo, without being online, as they are saved in yet another file in the system lol

got a old computer with a hard drive in it, never gonna the hard drive again?? take it to a computer specialist and they will show you its possible to retrieve data on a hard drive after you have reformated it fully, 3 times......

my advice with hard drives.... if they are dead, dissolve the things in acid....

[bigbadmax]

The only advice I would say is kick er into touch...get rid of her...hard but you gave up a lot for her and now you must take a stand....


Its me or them, be brutal but be honest....Its you she is hurting and its you, whom you have to live with if you allow it to carry on.

[*pan*]

i understand your delima but i feel if you truly love someone you wont keep suck a tight grip on them. people tend to not want to hurt their partners and sometimes lie thinking they wont, like i have said time and time again a lie is a lie and no such thing as a little lie. you are there, if you love her work with her, give her the freedom she seeks, if she truly loves you no matter what or who she does will not matter she will always be with you. bisexuality is not a choice for most people it is what they are. sometimes being a police wanna be searching through her space and personal stuff can cause more harm then good. if you enjoy being with her then be with her. support her and most of all be a friend first. you are there and they are not. people will often goto others out of curiosity wanting to expirence something in their life. people look at their lives and look back and seek to fulfill a fantasy. thats why i dont like labels some go with same sex then stop some end up prefering the same forever some never do and go back and forth these are considered bisexuals. my only advise is if you truly love her then love her for what she is, what ever that may be. if she didnt care for you she would kick you to the curb. and if you love someone you want to see them happy even if they arent with you and they are with someone else you will still love them and want them to be happy. a caged bird might be pretty but is not free. don't let your love for her put her in a cage. never cage or control it will push her away. build a bond of trust, let her feel easy about telling you her inner most fantasys, be friend to her. and remember what will happen will happen, it can happen with you as her friend and lover or it can happen with you not in the picture. as always this is just my :2cents: to this and in no way am i an expert but just using my expirences, hope this might be of use to you. good luck with many blessings for you both and may love and light be always on your path.

[falcondfw]

lol falcon..... delete the history of a computer and I can still bring up your browsing history...... its called the temp files and cookies

clearing the browser history will only clean the sites visited..... IE the URL list.... but in the MS system, are saved files like the temp files and the cookies that also can be used to tell where a person has been

the thing with the temp file, is you can tell what a person has been looking at, IE pics, vids, music cos they are saved in the temp file, so a person could say that they never went to a site and viewed porn, but I could tell what site, when and what porn they viewed on what page.......

any operating system that is a microcrap system......

I would use Ccleaner and clear temp, cookie, browser history and the temp BACK UP files.... and even then, its possible to retrieve a persons email history for sites like hotmail and yahoo, without being online, as they are saved in yet another file in the system lol

got a old computer with a hard drive in it, never gonna the hard drive again?? take it to a computer specialist and they will show you its possible to retrieve data on a hard drive after you have reformated it fully, 3 times......

my advice with hard drives.... if they are dead, dissolve the things in acid....

well, yeah LDD. I know that. But most people don't know you can selectively clear each of those and just hit the default, if they are trying to delete traces.
Those that do know those things have done some investigation work that the average person just doesn't do.
And if you truly want to erase things, drop some sand inside the mechanics of that hard drive, power that sucker up and let the platters spin around a few hundred times. By the time they replace the read arm, the write arm and piece together what was on the drive, you will have cost someone some SERIOUS money. lol

[drugstore cowboy]

Katrina is with you now, she's not with anyone else.

The fact that she's bisexual should not be a big deal to you.

Don't be one of those highly biphobic lesbians that there are a lot of.

Yes it does sound as though you are jealous of men and that you are are misandrist. It's also a lot of lesbian drama BS.

[christelle69]

@ Long Duck Dong

Here you go!!! I'm sorry to say I'M NOT THE PROBLEM HERE, she lied to me and she continues to do so, yesterday's night she's has back off once again saying that she's a lesbian... It drives me crazy. About our age Kat is 47 and I'm 42

Yes she has admitted that she was masturbating in front of straight porn during months, when I WAS WITH HER

And YES last week she has admitted as well that the world of sex of ANY KIND is "fascinating" for her

I'll answer your questions, even if I know that once again I"m not the problem

"does the idea of your partner being with males and females, affect you ( turn you off ) "

For me, both ideas turn me off. I mean when a story with someone is over it's over I don't fantasise about my past sexual experiences because I need to have cleared the way when I meet someone new, this is the respect I owe to that person. But YES that's true as well that the idea of Kat being taken by a male, make me sick (physically, I've through up the other day just thinking about it).

I'm a very faithful and truth worthy person, when I'm with a partner I don't allow myself to be turned on by anyone but my partner, THIS IS A CONSCIOUS CHOICE...Knowing that Katrina is being turned on by someone else (especially males) HURTS like hell, and NO this is not being misandrist or that I don't like men, I've got more male friends than female, this is just that this idea of Katrina having touched a penis disgust me but MOST IMPORTANTLY the fact that she KICKS ME OUT of the picture with thinking and being turned on by someone else than ME, is so hurtful....Call it anything you want, but once again for me there's only Katrina in my mind NO ONE ELSE

"does the idea of being with a bisexual person affect you ? and how does it affect you ?"

That idea of being with a bisexual hurts me yes....I don't define my entire life around being a lesbian, but I'm nearly 43 years old and my entire sexual universe and culture goes yes towards the female, I relate to them and I need to feel that my sexuality is similar to the one of my partner. it's as respectful as any other point of view...

On that question I can say as well, that when she thinks about sex with males (even if she continues to deny it I know she's) WHERE AM I ? I'm completely out of the picture

To give you an idea on how it affects me, even if I'm a very sexual person, just thinking that Kat had may be thought of a male sexually at her work or in the street turn me off instantly and make me CRY..

"do you perfer a rigid lesbian partner ?"

What do you mean ???? Being a lesbian doesn't mean being rigid


Please for the others, answers my questions:

Knowing everything I've just put the situation is even more confusing. She's saying that the world of sex is fascinating for her, male and female, but that " SHE NEVER FANTASIZE ABOUT MEN IN REAL LIFE (not porn), and "THAT SHE NEVER FEEL ATTRACTED TO MALES AT ALL...Does it make sense to you???

Another thing she's saying that "SHE WAS BISEXUAL IN THE PAST BUT NOT ANYMORE SINCE SHE'S WITH ME...Same thing does it make sense to you?

Last question : she has admitted that straight pornography was a turn on but as well that the penetration by a male was source of pleasure, but NOW she's saying that she never think of doing it again, that "THERE'S NOTHING THERE" referring of being turned on by males in the street or at her work. Do you think that's possible?
..

[Jobelorocks]

Honestly it sounds to me she may be confused about her sexuality herself. She is probably struggling with what her sexuality really is. Now I think it is wrong of her to be lying to you and misleading you. Also the fact that she has the account on Adult Friend Finder, says there is also a possibility of cheating going on, which is not okay either.

I can't say for sure, because each person has the right and only each individual can know for sure what their attractions are, but it seems to me that she is bi. She is probably either afraid of how you would react (scared she would loose you) and/or is confused due to cultural norms within the heterosexual and homosexual communities which both tend to be non-bi-friendly.

With bisexuals our sexuality is fluid and at some times in our lives we may feel more gay or straight or somewhere in the middle. Many of us (just like in the homosexual community) have a hard time coming to terms with our own sexuality.

I would be open and honest about your fears and/or worries. Try to remain cool and calm so you can start getting the truth out. You also have to consider if you really want to stay with this person who is being deceptive. A relationship full of lies brings pain to both people in the relationship. If you do want to work things out, you need to be accepting of her even if she is bi. She can't change her sexuality any more than you can, but she can be faithful and honest to you even if she is a bisexual.

[Gearbox]

Knowing everything I've just put the situation is even more confusing. She's saying that the world of sex is fascinating for her, male and female, but that " SHE NEVER FANTASIZE ABOUT MEN IN REAL LIFE (not porn), and "THAT SHE NEVER FEEL ATTRACTED TO MALES AT ALL...Does it make sense to you???
Nope!

Another thing she's saying that "SHE WAS BISEXUAL IN THE PAST BUT NOT ANYMORE SINCE SHE'S WITH ME...Same thing does it make sense to you?
Not really, but suppose it's possible.

Last question : she has admitted that straight pornography was a turn on but as well that the penetration by a male was source of pleasure, but NOW she's saying that she never think of doing it again, that "THERE'S NOTHING THERE" referring of being turned on by males in the street or at her work. Do you think that's possible?
No.

What are you doing with her FFS? She's not going to reveal all her darkest secrets about her love of cock if your going to spew your guts up every 5mins is she?:rolleyes:
NOTHING you can do will turn her gay! She might BS for you, but your way too paranoid and invasive for that. Fuck me, I wouldn't leave my mobile alone if you were around!lol
She likes pussy&cock, and if you can't handle it your with the wrong woman. And NO you don't get to just love the 'lesbian bit' of her! It's not there!;)

PS Hope you find someone you can be happy with.:)

[tenni]

From what I've read, this is a similar to a hetero partner opposing a bisexual's bisexuality of being attracted to both genders.

There are two ways that your relationship will work imo.

1/ Your partner states that she will never be with a man again and that she will not be sexually attracted to men.

2/ You broaden your attitude to include a woman who also is sexually/emotionally attracted to men as acceptable.

I don't see either happening too readily based on what you wrote.

If you are repulsed by the idea that your partner enjoys sex with men, the relationship is doomed. You are denying her to be herself at her basic core. She may eventually grow to be bitter towards your controlling demands. If she is denying her sexuality (bi) and claiming to be a lesbian that may or may not be true. It doesn't look like she is a lesbian though.

I'm sorry that she wasn't clear with you and that you travelled so far. I really am. If you love her, you will accept her for who she is. Open up and let her talk without judgment.

Have you actually told her that it repulses you that she enjoys sex with men? As Gear states, that is not going to help your relationship with her. Take some time and then calmly discuss how your relationship may move forward...or not. It can work but it will not work if it is your way or the highway. Have you considered using a strap on with her or do you use a strap on? It may or may not satisfy her on one aspect.

[Long Duck Dong]

@ Long Duck Dong

Here you go!!! I'm sorry to say I'M NOT THE PROBLEM HERE, she lied to me and she continues to do so, yesterday's night she's has back off once again saying that she's a lesbian... It drives me crazy. About our age Kat is 47 and I'm 42

Yes she has admitted that she was masturbating in front of straight porn during months, when I WAS WITH HER

And YES last week she has admitted as well that the world of sex of ANY KIND is "fascinating" for her

I'll answer your questions, even if I know that once again I"m not the problem

"does the idea of your partner being with males and females, affect you ( turn you off ) "

For me, both ideas turn me off. I mean when a story with someone is over it's over I don't fantasise about my past sexual experiences because I need to have cleared the way when I meet someone new, this is the respect I owe to that person. But YES that's true as well that the idea of Kat being taken by a male, make me sick (physically, I've through up the other day just thinking about it).

I'm a very faithful and truth worthy person, when I'm with a partner I don't allow myself to be turned on by anyone but my partner, THIS IS A CONSCIOUS CHOICE...Knowing that Katrina is being turned on by someone else (especially males) HURTS like hell, and NO this is not being misandrist or that I don't like men, I've got more male friends than female, this is just that this idea of Katrina having touched a penis disgust me but MOST IMPORTANTLY the fact that she KICKS ME OUT of the picture with thinking and being turned on by someone else than ME, is so hurtful....Call it anything you want, but once again for me there's only Katrina in my mind NO ONE ELSE

"does the idea of being with a bisexual person affect you ? and how does it affect you ?"

That idea of being with a bisexual hurts me yes....I don't define my entire life around being a lesbian, but I'm nearly 43 years old and my entire sexual universe and culture goes yes towards the female, I relate to them and I need to feel that my sexuality is similar to the one of my partner. it's as respectful as any other point of view...

On that question I can say as well, that when she thinks about sex with males (even if she continues to deny it I know she's) WHERE AM I ? I'm completely out of the picture

To give you an idea on how it affects me, even if I'm a very sexual person, just thinking that Kat had may be thought of a male sexually at her work or in the street turn me off instantly and make me CRY..

"do you perfer a rigid lesbian partner ?"

What do you mean ???? Being a lesbian doesn't mean being rigid


Please for the others, answers my questions:

Knowing everything I've just put the situation is even more confusing. She's saying that the world of sex is fascinating for her, male and female, but that " SHE NEVER FANTASIZE ABOUT MEN IN REAL LIFE (not porn), and "THAT SHE NEVER FEEL ATTRACTED TO MALES AT ALL...Does it make sense to you???

Another thing she's saying that "SHE WAS BISEXUAL IN THE PAST BUT NOT ANYMORE SINCE SHE'S WITH ME...Same thing does it make sense to you?

Last question : she has admitted that straight pornography was a turn on but as well that the penetration by a male was source of pleasure, but NOW she's saying that she never think of doing it again, that "THERE'S NOTHING THERE" referring of being turned on by males in the street or at her work. Do you think that's possible?
..

lol sorry, I was not trying to give you the impression that I think you are the problem.... I perfer to try and think as if I was you and in your shoes.... so I can understand the situation as if I was you and seeing things thru your eyes.....

ok based around your answers, which were very helpful, it gives me a better insight into the situation.....

kats actions, have affected you in more than one area... there is the betrayal of trust, the misleading you, and the interest in sexual interaction that is something that goes against your nature.......and yes, I can fully understand how the situation is affecting you.....

I understand that you work to sort the situation out as you have put so much into the relationship, but the bulk of the work is going to be on kats shoulders.... the choices will be on both of your shoulders......

1) it sounds very much to me, that you both may require singles / couples counselling.... even if you both seperate, she needs to talk with a counselor...
what you are saying about her, comes across to me, as if kat is a person that has a internalised sexually expressive nature.... or in simple terms, shes drawn to the ideas not the reality of sexual expression... and thats evident in the way that she drew you into her world but when the reality came about, she *hid * back in her own *reality * with the porn.......
it hints at a anxiety / depressive aspect in a person...

2) you have a very strong and clear code of conduct and understanding... and the way you present yourself, is as a person that does not and can not just jump from one relationship to another, you take the time to *clear the air * before you take a new partner....... that aspect of you is something that I would expect to see in a person that has high standards in relationships... and as so, you give everything to a relationship and a partner.... and hold them to the same standards.... and that is something where kat is failing....

3) a rigid sexuality....based around your answers you are a rigid lesbian, there is not fluid / flexing in your sexuality... and thats indicated by the way that male sex / sexual interaction doesn't interest you in any way.... there is nothing wrong with that at all... but yes, it would make it very hard to be with a bisexual person that is sexually fluid and open minded......or even a fluid lesbian partner.....
it doesn't make you a man hater or anything like that, its simply makes you a person with a sound understanding of their sexuality and their interests......


ok... gearbox mentioned the idea of using strapons... but based around your statements about yourself and kat, I get the feeling that it may not work... as strapons can mean taking the * male / female * roles ...... so is using dildos and sex toys a option for both of you ?

as for saving the relationship and resolving the issues.... christelle.... its going to take work.... kat needs to address her issues and understanding of herself, and take steps towards being more secure in herself, before she talks with you about what she is, or you both will keep going around in circles....

you need to decide if you feel the relationship is going to work and if you can deal with a partner that is sounding like she is all over the place and saying one thing that is not really supported by her actions.....

kat needs to see a counsellor as I am questioning if she has a porn addiction.....

and you both need to sit down and spend time together, having fun, laughing, joking and enjoying life while you both work your ways thru the issues... cos if you both lose sight of the simple pleasures in life, then you both will never work thru the issues at hand without growing angry and frustrated with each other......

[DuckiesDarling]

Okay... from what I read into this, you have major control issues. Yes, you were lied to, but that is something you have to deal with in this relationship. Stop right now going through her computer files, if you really love her, just stop. The more you look the more you will find, that's Murphy's Law. It doesn't mean she's cheating, but it does mean she finds things attractive that you don't and that's fine, it's healthy, it's part of a normal healthy relationship. It keeps things fresh in the bedroom.

You may have moved countries for her but did you move for HER or for YOU and YOUR relationship.


Lighten up, breathe, relax and let go of the control side of the situation, if you can not handle sharing a partner that is one thing, but if you can't handle the fact your partner has attractions that don't begin and end with just you then you need to walk away, no matter the cost.

[aut17umn]

I wld say either move out or have her move out and start a new life in Sydney or go back to France. Sounds like this woman has given u a lot of unnecessary drama.

[IanBorthwick]

@ Long Duck Dong

Here you go!!! I'm sorry to say I'M NOT THE PROBLEM HERE, she lied to me and she continues to do so, yesterday's night she's has back off once again saying that she's a lesbian... It drives me crazy. About our age Kat is 47 and I'm 42

Let's do a full stop there. At present you are insisting the problem is not with you, now regardless of gender,sex, marriage, lack of marriage, you are in a relationship. That makes them BOTH your problems. She lied, that's not uncommon, but what is uncommon is that she felt the need to keep this side of herself hidden from you. From the posts you have made I can infer that throughput your chats you MUST have said things to put her off being honest about her true feelings. Having been in relationships with people online a lot since the inception of the internet, I know how people's statements can make you feel the need to put on a false face. Despite all the negativity she loved you enough to grin and bear and try to figure out how to find solace from her needs without upsetting. SO part of this IS your fault.


Yes she has admitted that she was masturbating in front of straight porn during months, when I WAS WITH HER

And YES last week she has admitted as well that the world of sex of ANY KIND is "fascinating" for her

Now this part screams YOUR issues. In essence I would say you're one a lesbian who finds women who have had sex with men as traitors to your kind and cause. In your mind she's done you wrong and has become dirty in front of your eyes where your prior perception of her was as "clean". As a bisexual I find all kinds of sex stimulating, and some ridiculously nauseating, and it changes from day to day, hour to hour. As LDD said, it's fluid, but even using the term fluid doesn't really classify some of us...it's more tempermental and mercurial, stormy at time.


I'll answer your questions, even if I know that once again I"m not the problem

A closed door admits no entry, a painted window allows no light. "Knowing" you are not the problem makes the problem MUCH larger and means you will accept no fault except hers, no apology, no reality except what you choose. That is the essence of childishness, a foot stomping Veruca Salt screaming,"I want one of THOSE!" and pissed to high heavens because it's not coming faster than light.


"does the idea of your partner being with males and females, affect you ( turn you off ) "

For me, both ideas turn me off. I mean when a story with someone is over it's over I don't fantasise about my past sexual experiences because I need to have cleared the way when I meet someone new, this is the respect I owe to that person. But YES that's true as well that the idea of Kat being taken by a male, make me sick (physically, I've through up the other day just thinking about it).

And as I was saying up above, here is the admission. When a straight person says this about homosexuals you expect THEM to be better about it and get over it, to lose their bigotry, don't you? Of course you do. But quid pro quo, you have to return the favor to all and sundry. The world is not,"Do as I SAY not as I DO!" That's hypocrisy. IE, you're a hypocrite, and there is no escaping that fact unless you do decide to get some counseling. We expect the heteros to get over it, now it's your turn to put up or shut up.


I'm a very faithful and truth worthy person, when I'm with a partner I don't allow myself to be turned on by anyone but my partner, THIS IS A CONSCIOUS CHOICE...Knowing that Katrina is being turned on by someone else (especially males) HURTS like hell, and NO this is not being misandrist or that I don't like men, I've got more male friends than female, this is just that this idea of Katrina having touched a penis disgust me but MOST IMPORTANTLY the fact that she KICKS ME OUT of the picture with thinking and being turned on by someone else than ME, is so hurtful....Call it anything you want, but once again for me there's only Katrina in my mind NO ONE ELSE

And back to the full stop.

Let's play a little game, shall we?

Set the wayback machine to the 1950s, it's the United States, we'll say you're in Tennessee, Memphis to be precise. Let's change the words around but keep them essentially unchanged in spirit to reflect that time period.

"Knowing that Katrina got turned on by a black person hurts like hell, and turns my stomach! And NO it's not being a racist! Many of my friends are black people. I like black people, I even talk to them at work and when they wait on my tables and polish my shoes!"

That's a bigot, so yes, you are a misandrist. Classic, in denial, but still a misandrist.


"does the idea of being with a bisexual person affect you ? and how does it affect you ?"

That idea of being with a bisexual hurts me yes....I don't define my entire life around being a lesbian, but I'm nearly 43 years old and my entire sexual universe and culture goes yes towards the female, I relate to them and I need to feel that my sexuality is similar to the one of my partner. it's as respectful as any other point of view...

And once again we're back to,"It's all about me, me and women, it's us against the world, I need to feel I can trust women to hate men in bed as MUCH as I do...still misandry, ma'am. Your entire culture is geared towards women and YET...and YET you deal with men. Oh my gosh! How lucky they must feel that you hold back your vomiting whenever they close the distance, now one (or more) has dared to ejaculate in your partner LONG before you knew her and suddenly she has stabbed you in the back. That's like saying,"Damn those Indians for being on White Man's land long before we got here! They got no business being there now we want that space!"
So far you're not winning me over. This is more than just control issues, you definitely need counseling to find the core of whatever instilled this in you.


On that question I can say as well, that when she thinks about sex with males (even if she continues to deny it I know she's) WHERE AM I ? I'm completely out of the picture

Ok, now this PISSES me off so amazingly. This is classic feminism and dehumanization but of ANOTHER WOMAN! She loves you, convinces you to come live with her because she cannot bear the idea of life without you, she shares your bed, brings you sexual release, possibly makes you meals and cleans up your messes and you go to movies and parks and all other things couples do and YOU'RE OUT OF THE PICTURE? Are you kidding me? THIS makes you a misogynist as well as a misandrist!


To give you an idea on how it affects me, even if I'm a very sexual person, just thinking that Kat had may be thought of a male sexually at her work or in the street turn me off instantly and make me CRY..

And we're back to the betrayal issues. This leads me to believe that somewhere in your past someone taught you to think this way, some "Friends" or others in the Lesbian Feminist community teaching you to think this is the utmost evil any woman can do to you, and for that she deserves to be treated like a whore.


"do you perfer a rigid lesbian partner ?"

What do you mean ???? Being a lesbian doesn't mean being rigid

Being a lesbian doesn't mean being rigid...being acceptable to you in a lesbian relationship requires rigidity from all you have espoused so far. So you are right but also quite wrong.



Please for the others, answers my questions:

Knowing everything I've just put the situation is even more confusing. She's saying that the world of sex is fascinating for her, male and female, but that " SHE NEVER FANTASIZE ABOUT MEN IN REAL LIFE (not porn), and "THAT SHE NEVER FEEL ATTRACTED TO MALES AT ALL...Does it make sense to you???


If I had you screaming at me as I can easily imagine from your tirade, I'd promise anything in the name of love to get you to calm down, because somewhere inside you is a person that Katarina needs, and she imagines that she can bring it out, or THOUGHT she could because love makes fools of everyone. She did not count on your bigotry running deeper than the Atlantic and you desire to understand be as shallow as puddle of mud.


Another thing she's saying that "SHE WAS BISEXUAL IN THE PAST BUT NOT ANYMORE SINCE SHE'S WITH ME...Same thing does it make sense to you?

In the world we are taught to define our sexuality by the relationship we are in. If we are in a same sex relationship, be silent and call it Lesbian/Gay as the media would, or if it is opposite sex call it Hetero...just as the media would. Some of us are just drawn in by the way society demands comformity. Some of us are not. You are in the former group I can see, and she may be playing up to that or HONESTLY believes it. Either one is not acceptable to you, so why even ask? The true answer to that question will not even be permitted to be seen, like a direction on a road you simply will not take and won't admit exists.


Last question : she has admitted that straight pornography was a turn on but as well that the penetration by a male was source of pleasure, but NOW she's saying that she never think of doing it again, that "THERE'S NOTHING THERE" referring of being turned on by males in the street or at her work. Do you think that's possible?
..

Do I think it's not possible? No, I think tomorrow is a new day and a new possibility for her chemistry to make her aroused at something, and the simple fact that as hard as you are pressing her the more likely she is to snap. Looking at all the priests who are forced to be in sexless lives throughout history and the temptations they succumb to and tried to explain away as Demons tempting them. It's like a pressure cooker you won't even let a little steam out of because you hate the appearance of it, that sucker is going to explode.

My closing thoughts on this Misandric/Misogynistic tirade of yours. I suggest you move out, get some distance and some counseling. Get your problems taken care of and keep in touch with your love. If you love her, you'll fix your issues at their core because this is, without a damn doubt, the makings of a very cruel and possibly physically damaging relationship.

She should not have lied, but you should not have made her have to feel she HAD to lie to be loved. That's unreasonable on both parts, but by far the greatest issues lie as I can see them with YOU.

[*pan*]

ok here we go you said you needed help but yet the problem i see is you have the lesbian mind set, ridged and un forgiving hatred of the fact that men exist and your lover might be interested in them. you are not listening to any one in the fourm. you keep replying with your not at fault, and you caught her looking at hetro porn. bla bla bla. well since you didnt listen to my post or any other post you must not truly love her so you have two choices one - move out and forget her or two - work with her and stop the ridged lesbian mentality and police wanna be behaviour. face up to it you screwed up, she is not a lesbian she is probibly bisexual or has'nt decided yet so deal with it. either move out or change. only one or the other. make this a learning expirence for the next time you decide to fall in love over the internet. to most people on the internet they treat it like it is a virtual world it dosent really exist and cant hurt them and so what if they hurt someone else they can just log off and it goes away. they dont treat people the same as they would face to face in the real world, because they can't log off and hide, the problem wont go away. the positive thing here for you would be a learning expirence, what you learn and gain from this can only strengthen you or it should make you a little wiser. i wish you luck but this is all i have to say on this topic.

[christelle69]

lol sorry, I was not trying to give you the impression that I think you are the problem.... I perfer to try and think as if I was you and in your shoes.... so I can understand the situation as if I was you and seeing things thru your eyes.....

ok based around your answers, which were very helpful, it gives me a better insight into the situation.....

kats actions, have affected you in more than one area... there is the betrayal of trust, the misleading you, and the interest in sexual interaction that is something that goes against your nature.......and yes, I can fully understand how the situation is affecting you.....

I understand that you work to sort the situation out as you have put so much into the relationship, but the bulk of the work is going to be on kats shoulders.... the choices will be on both of your shoulders......

1) it sounds very much to me, that you both may require singles / couples counselling.... even if you both seperate, she needs to talk with a counselor...
what you are saying about her, comes across to me, as if kat is a person that has a internalised sexually expressive nature.... or in simple terms, shes drawn to the ideas not the reality of sexual expression... and thats evident in the way that she drew you into her world but when the reality came about, she *hid * back in her own *reality * with the porn.......
it hints at a anxiety / depressive aspect in a person...

2) you have a very strong and clear code of conduct and understanding... and the way you present yourself, is as a person that does not and can not just jump from one relationship to another, you take the time to *clear the air * before you take a new partner....... that aspect of you is something that I would expect to see in a person that has high standards in relationships... and as so, you give everything to a relationship and a partner.... and hold them to the same standards.... and that is something where kat is failing....

3) a rigid sexuality....based around your answers you are a rigid lesbian, there is not fluid / flexing in your sexuality... and thats indicated by the way that male sex / sexual interaction doesn't interest you in any way.... there is nothing wrong with that at all... but yes, it would make it very hard to be with a bisexual person that is sexually fluid and open minded......or even a fluid lesbian partner.....
it doesn't make you a man hater or anything like that, its simply makes you a person with a sound understanding of their sexuality and their interests......


ok... gearbox mentioned the idea of using strapons... but based around your statements about yourself and kat, I get the feeling that it may not work... as strapons can mean taking the * male / female * roles ...... so is using dildos and sex toys a option for both of you ?

as for saving the relationship and resolving the issues.... christelle.... its going to take work.... kat needs to address her issues and understanding of herself, and take steps towards being more secure in herself, before she talks with you about what she is, or you both will keep going around in circles....

you need to decide if you feel the relationship is going to work and if you can deal with a partner that is sounding like she is all over the place and saying one thing that is not really supported by her actions.....

kat needs to see a counsellor as I am questioning if she has a porn addiction.....

and you both need to sit down and spend time together, having fun, laughing, joking and enjoying life while you both work your ways thru the issues... cos if you both lose sight of the simple pleasures in life, then you both will never work thru the issues at hand without growing angry and frustrated with each other......

Amongst the few answers on that thread this is the most reasonable and true picture of the situation..I've cried while reading you, I can't believe that you've spot exactly what's going on, without advocating for one part or another (being a bisexual I admire that you've not tried to shove into my throat something that I'm not)

Every points you've said are correct and seems right.

I'm afraid she'll not see any counsellor, I've printed your answer she has read it, and then as usual she has yelled at me (she's done that during the last year together every time I've tried to talk about our issues) she has NEVER ask me to sit and talk, I've always been the one who is initiating the dialogue). The reason is understandable since she's still lying about her and her real position about males and she simply doesn't want me to know that.

There's one more thing I've not tell you, and I need to say it here: she has destroyed all the trust that I've in her, but most importantly, she has destroyed all the trust I had in other women....When I put myself in the situation after splitting up with her, I KNOW that I'll NEVER be able to trust any other women, there will be always some doubts about the sexuality of them, if they'll say the truth, if they're lesbians or bisexuals. I'm really damaged on that ground for the first time of my life....And believe me it HURTS LIKE HELL.

Since yesterday we're not talking to each other, I continue to try to find a way, but she's turning her back to me.

[BiDaveDtown]

Christelle, it's only porn.

If you can't accept that your partner who you're in a relationship with is going to sometimes watch porn or even have sexual attraction towards other people-all while not acting on these sexual attractions since you're monogamous.

Then you shouldn't be in any sort of relationship or partnership at all with anyone at all.

Don't blame this other woman for your own issues and problems because you're biphobic. You're the one to blame for the fact that you can't trust anyone, are biphobic, and want to force a bisexual woman to lie and pretend that she's a lesbian just because you don't like bisexual women at all and are a bigot.

[christelle69]

Christelle, it's only porn.

If you can't accept that your partner who you're in a relationship with is going to sometimes watch porn or even have sexual attraction towards other people-all while not acting on these sexual attractions since you're monogamous.

Then you shouldn't be in any sort of relationship or partnership at all with anyone at all.

Don't blame this other woman for your own issues and problems because you're biphobic. You're the one to blame for the fact that you can't trust anyone, are biphobic, and want to force a bisexual woman to lie and pretend that she's a lesbian just because you don't like bisexual women at all and are a bigot.


Sorry you're wrong

I'm 42 and I've had 2 long love stories (7 and 12 years), I was completely trusting my partners, letting them FREE which is very important in any kind of relationship, because LIES were not there. As an example, my first long relationship Helene said to me that she's been with a couple of guys before me and she has said it up front, we've talked about it, and it WAS FINE...

What you and few others don't understand is that LOVE IS A SACRED PLACE....For me I don't allow myself to be turned on by other partners than mine, I'm EXCLUSIVE like that...It seems to me natural to ask the same commitment to my partner, otherwise this is NOT love...MY PARTNER IS ENOUGH FOR ME AND IS IT RIDICULOUS TO ASK THE SAME TO MY PARTNER?????

I'M NOT A BIGOT, I've been a very active member of Act Up in the 90's, I've been a very active member of the LGBT scene, NEVER breaking the contact with any part of this, I was fine with bisexuals before this.

I'M NOT TRYING TO FORCE TO SAY THAT SHE'S A LESBIAN, I want her to say who she's really....But that's true that if she's saying to me that she's turned on by males in the streets or anywhere, for me that's not love, because I'll be out of the picture completely ONCE AGAIN KAT IS THE ONLY ONE IN MY MIND EMOTIONALLY AND SEXUALLY, is it irrelevant to ask for the same thing???. I want to remind you that it's SHE that has presented herself as a lesbian, before I took off from France, I've asked her many times her opinion on bisexuals, SHE LIED TO ME, I've NEVER LIED TO HER....

[IanBorthwick]

Sorry you're wrong

I'm 42 and I've had 2 long love stories (7 and 12 years), I was completely trusting my partners, letting them FREE which is very important in any kind of relationship, because LIES were not there. As an example, my first long relationship Helene said to me that she's been with a couple of guys before me and she has said it up front, we've talked about it, and it WAS FINE...

So let's get this straight. Because LDD candy coated his responses and didn't set you straight in a fashion that rocked you back on your heels, you thank him for not taking sides despite the fact that YOU already have and it's all been Kat's fault. And in your OPNION, not FACT, Dave is wrong because you say so and in the past you had less problems with other relationships you have had THAT WEREN'T THIS RELATIONSHIP. If that doesn't sound weak to you, nothing is going to wake you up here. Prior relationships are not THIS relationship. What you said to them before is irrelevant. What you said/say to Kat is the only thing relevant here and so far you're building castles in the sky before us and we can only watch as they tumble down.

So far you have changed your stance more than once and not for any reason except you are looking for more sympathy. Believe me when I tell you that LDD is sweet, as is DD, but they are going to come at the problem mildly or not at all. This is tough love. You're shoving your issues onto Kat and that is not HER fault. In the end the only thing we can do is correct our own issues and you have issues on top of your issues. Back pedaling now is not going to make them disappear.


What you and few others don't understand is that LOVE IS A SACRED PLACE....For me I don't allow myself to be turned on by other partners than mine, I'm EXCLUSIVE like that...It seems to me natural to ask the same commitment to my partner, otherwise this is NOT love...MY PARTNER IS ENOUGH FOR ME AND IS IT RIDICULOUS TO ASK THE SAME TO MY PARTNER?????

Where to begin...

This statement is an Ad Hominem attack on any of us that dissent with your view, making US supposedly the ones unable to understand how anything could seem sacred and thus you take us to task and try to commit DARVO(Defend, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender). It's classic denial tactics, commonly used by anyone in a biased, bigoted, racist or position that simply will be intractable based on a narrow Point of View.

Now the appeal to emotion, "IS IT RIDICULOUS TO ASK THE SAME OF MY PARTNER", except that she hasn't cheated on you and has only masturbated to porn. Once again, you can get Dr Phil to say you're correct that masturbation and fantasy is cheating, but then he's a hack that has been questioned about his brand of therapy on more than one occasion and is being investigated for a lot of his misconduct. Asking someone here to back you up on that very thing simply will not happen, and those that do are enabling you to continue this misbehavior.


I'M NOT A BIGOT, I've been a very active member of Act Up in the 90's, I've been a very active member of the LGBT scene, NEVER breaking the contact with any part of this, I was fine with bisexuals before this.

Screeching stop here. BEING in the GLBT community does not, in any way, make you immune to your own brand of bigotry.Gays and Lesbians since time immemorial have done their best to erase and or paint over our existence as either confused, lying, in denial or hiding.You can be a part of any demographic and still be a bigot. So far you are more than a bigot, you are Biphobic by your own admission, not to mention misandric and misogynistic. Your prior rants all show that to be true. SO no joy here, dear, we recognize a skunk by the smell and we recognize a bigot by the way they walk and talk.


I'M NOT TRYING TO FORCE TO SAY THAT SHE'S A LESBIAN, I want her to say who she's really....

So far haven't seen that, because if YOU made her feel comfortable enough to say she's a bisexual she WOULD say she's a bisexual.


But that's true that if she's saying to me that she's turned on by males in the streets or anywhere, for me that's not love, because I'll be out of the picture completely



And the ugly head of Biphobia and Misandry RISE to the top like a bubble. For YOU this is not love. Bu tin a relationship YOU are not the only one that gets to define what love is, that's fact. If you insist it's your way or the highway, get ye hence. I wouldn't choose you if your demands are this pernicious and aggressive. Can't look at or get aroused by men, it's cheating by just getting wet as far as you're concerned, and you're out of the picture because she would dare feel her own body imperatives. Good GOD woman! You sound as bad as any man jilted by a lesbian or bisexual woman in the past! Can't you hear yourself objectively?

You still haven't said how you're "Out of the Picture". This is a wild, baseless, intractable, nonsensical FEAR. This is something someone, somewhere taught you, as I said before. This is where your current relationship problems lie. YOU, not Kat, need to deal with this issue in YOUR head and heart.


ONCE AGAIN KAT IS THE ONLY ONE IN MY MIND EMOTIONALLY AND SEXUALLY, is it irrelevant to ask for the same thing???.

In a word, FUCKYEAH! Because you are not ASKING this you are DEMANDING it and couching it in terms that pretend to be reasonable and are anything but!


I want to remind you that it's SHE that has presented herself as a lesbian, before I took off from France, I've asked her many times her opinion on bisexuals, SHE LIED TO ME, I've NEVER LIED TO HER....

And here is the final admission that you are guilty of the worst crime against her sexual desires. HOW did you ask her? You at least now said what I surmised that you did speak to her about this before you got to her, and I'd suspect your questions were more along the line of interjecting your ill-feelings of distrust at her about bisexuals!

Tell me if any of these sound like something you said to her:

"Bisexuals are so flighty and cruel, I could never trust one. What do you think of them Kat?"

"Being with a bisexual is hard for me, because it's hard to be with a woman that has been with a man before. What would you do Kat?"

"I need my women to be completely dedicated to me and never think of a man, because those damn bisexuals leave you for men and I could never deal with that. What do you think Kat?"

You can twist this stuff around a pole and still get the same emotional baggage added to any question. Asking her after you made her feel she had to answer she was a lesbian is not ASKING her, it's demanding love through a colored filter. What you are in the middle of you are equally, if not more, to blame.

Now you can either shoulder your burden, get to a counsellor and get your issues looked over and addressed and perhaps become a better woman and a better part of the BLGT community or not.

It's your life, but you're not fooling anyone here except yourself.

By the way, there are lies and there are lies. Making someone have to lie to you is the worst kind of coercion around. That's worse than lying in my humble opinion, that's emotional terrorism.

[funseekingcouple]

I have read the entire thing, Im a very upfront honest person who cant stand lies or being lied to. One of the BIGGEST problems in relationships is lack of communication,trust and honesty. I wont say that you are the problem I dont know either of you. She could be telling something differnt. But honestly if you feel the need to check up behind her you dont need to be with her. Rule of thumb for any relationship, If you have questions and concerns now then you will always have them. My suggestion either you stick it out and try to work it out or just get out.

[darkeyes]

There is a nastiness in Ian's word's, Chistelle, born I suspect of pain, events in his life and not a little anti lesbianism and misogyny which may have resulted from whatever those events were... but he is not all wrong. I have never believed in the principle of tough love, because it usually has quite the opposite effect from that intended, and itself causes a return of something the person who inflicts "tough love" would rather not endure...

But he isn't all wrong, neither is he all right either but you do have problems, mostly of your own making.. that communication is the key is unquestioned, but communication with.. not at.. sometimes people say what others wish to hear because of how they feel for the other person.. there is fear involved as well as love.. fear of loss, fear of disapproval.. sometimes just because they fear... love may have been there but will have long since gone.. sometimes just out of acceptance of the status quo.. thats how it is.. it will never change.. but it is changing imperceptibly all the time and soon bitterness and hate raises its ugly head, and the time comes when reconciliation is impossible and moving on is inevitable.. trust and love have gone and never recoverable..

I am no great lover of counselling.. and am not sure that either of you will benefit from it... but it is an option you may wish to consider.. both of you need to go way and sit down and think exactly what you both want out of life, and from each other and be honest with each other absolutely.. and you have to communicate that to each other... but you should listen to and seriously think about what she says.. not just hear the words.. and in the end you have to decide whether who she really is, not the person you want her to be or think she should be, is what you want... bearing in mind that you have caused so much of the problem yourself... it is even more important that she is given the same opportunity and that you encourage her to do so... it will probably hurt and hurt badly.. but you have to be prepared for that and decide how you will react... and whether you love enough for what you hear to do what is necessary to help the realtionship survive..

Love isnt a person bowing down to our will.. it is not forcing a person to not be who they are or what they are and shaping them into what we want them to be.. it is allowing a person to be the truly free person that everyone should be.. it is give and take willingly by both parties...in relationships sometimes this means the wants and desires of one person will win out.. it often means that because sometimes there are things which are impossible to completely reconcile.. but each of us must decide for ourselves what we sacrifice, and how much we will not.. if we cannot be honest with the person we love and accept the honesty of those we claim to love, then is it love?

If love is there, with respect and trust between two people, it is easily possible, indeed more than likely that they have a real chance of staying the course, and becoming ever more deeply committed to each other, loving each other.. and yes.. even just liking each other...

[christelle69]

@Darkeyes:

I just want to remind you that I've NEVER LIED TO HER on ANY PART OF MY LIFE. I've not manipulated her, SHE DID. You're talking about this " it is even more important that she is given the same opportunity and that you encourage her to do so... it will probably hurt and hurt badly" look I've NEVER stopped to ask for this, this is ALL what I'm asking for...BUT SHE CONTINUES TO LIE TO ME.

Talking about honesty she's lied to me during more than a year, where I was constantly asking for THE TRUTH AND RESPECT....I've opened all the doors, I've NEVER put on her shoulders, any guiltiness BUT asking for the brutal truth of who she is...

I know I'm posting on a bisexual forum, I respect your life style and your conceptions of what sex and relationship are suppose to be from your point of view, BUT I've as much the right to say that somethings are hurting me and asking for the commitments I DESERVE....

You know I'm not the only lesbian on earth, we're quite a few and YES at some point, the penis disgust us, this is not that men are evil, this is not that we're males haters but this is what it is, as much you guys love both...It's as much respectful as anything else....

This is the reason why I've ask her once when we were on Skype if she was bisexual, and talked about that subject, many times, she was saying before I took off from France that she was not and that at some extent she dislike "them very much" (her words here)...You know I've been burned badly once by another bisexual ( I still don't know if my Katrina is bisexual yet, after more than a year with her...That's ridiculous), her name was Sidonie, after 3 weeks of love, I was back from a gig (I'm a musician playing with MALES and I love them, get it now???) and I've caught her fucking a guy, and saying that it was not a big deal.... Since that moment I've promised to myself to NEVER date ANY bisexual women....

For God sake I've BEEN TRAPPED do you get it now??? I'm NOT responsible for this, if she had been CLEAR FROM THE BEGINNING, I would have NEVER left everything in France and letting myself loving her so much....I've been the one who has shown HONESTY, TRUTH AND RESPECT...She's failed on every aspect and meaning of these words

BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY : during a full year I've ASKED for the dialogue that she has NEVER initiated, in addition of my pain imagining her wanking in front of black cocks and asians (which she has admitted she did this, not too long ago), while I was asking for sex with her, (during the first 5 months she was watching porn we were hardly making love), SHE HAS ADMITTED "THAT IT WAS FUCKED", Can you understand what it feels when your partner prefer PORN instead of YOU, and even worse in a lesbian relationship, straight porn

Do you get it???

[Jobelorocks]

I am sorry you have been hurt in the past by a bisexual woman. Just know, we are not all like that. I am a bisexual and my husband is way more important to me than porn or my attraction to women. If he was all uncomfortable with me playing with women, I wouldn't do it at all. Respect for your partner's feelings and honesty are important to make any relationship work.

I think that her lying is wrong and needs to stop. I know you moved and gave up A LOT to be with this woman, but you need to decide if it is worth staying with her, when she is addicted to porn and lying repeatedly.

Now with that said, I do think it is a little unreasonable to think that just because you are in a monogamous relationship, that your partner will never think of anyone else as attractive. It is just bound to happen. Now dwelling on it is a different story. You can expect them not to dwell on these thoughts, but you can't help being attracted to people.

I really wish you the best of luck and hope everything works out for the best for you.

[christelle69]

@ Jobelorocks

"It is just bound to happen. Now dwelling on it is a different story. You can expect them not to dwell on these thoughts, but you can't help being attracted to people."

Yes and that's the very reason that has led me to sign in on that forum....I want to know if she's/will be attracted to guys. For me this is an open door to the cheating, the risk exists

[darkeyes]

@Darkeyes:

I just want to remind you that I've NEVER LIED TO HER on ANY PART OF MY LIFE. I've not manipulated her, SHE DID. You're talking about this " it is even more important that she is given the same opportunity and that you encourage her to do so... it will probably hurt and hurt badly" look I've NEVER stopped to ask for this, this is ALL what I'm asking for...BUT SHE CONTINUES TO LIE TO ME.

Talking about honesty she's lied to me during more than a year, where I was constantly asking for THE TRUTH AND RESPECT....I've opened all the doors, I've NEVER put on her shoulders, any guiltiness BUT asking for the brutal truth of who she is...

I know I'm posting on a bisexual forum, I respect your life style and your conceptions of what sex and relationship are suppose to be from your point of view, BUT I've as much the right to say that somethings are hurting me and asking for the commitments I DESERVE....

You know I'm not the only lesbian on earth, we're quite a few and YES at some point, the penis disgust us, this is not that men are evil, this is not that we're males haters but this is what it is, as much you guys love both...It's as much respectful as anything else....

This is the reason why I've ask her once when we were on Skype if she was bisexual, and talked about that subject, many times, she was saying before I took off from France that she was not and that at some extent she dislike "them very much" (her words here)...You know I've been burned badly once by another bisexual ( I still don't know if my Katrina is bisexual yet, after more than a year with her...That's ridiculous), her name was Sidonie, after 3 weeks of love, I was back from a gig (I'm a musician playing with MALES and I love them, get it now???) and I've caught her fucking a guy, and saying that it was not a big deal.... Since that moment I've promised to myself to NEVER date ANY bisexual women....

For God sake I've BEEN TRAPPED do you get it now??? I'm NOT responsible for this, if she had been CLEAR FROM THE BEGINNING, I would have NEVER left everything in France and letting myself loving her so much....I've been the one who has shown HONESTY, TRUTH AND RESPECT...She's failed on every aspect and meaning of these words

BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY : during a full year I've ASKED for the dialogue that she has NEVER initiated, in addition of my pain imagining her wanking in front of black cocks and asians (which she has admitted she did this, not too long ago), while I was asking for sex with her, (during the first 5 months she was watching porn we were hardly making love), SHE HAS ADMITTED "THAT IT WAS FUCKED", Can you understand what it feels when your partner prefer PORN instead of YOU, and even worse in a lesbian relationship, straight porn

Do you get it???

Hun.. I happen to know you're not the only lesbian on earth cos I am one also, living with and married to a bisexual woman... but Ive known since very early on she was bisexual and her sexuality isn't something which concerns me in the least... I fell in love with her as a woman and a human being, not as a bisexual..

We had our problems too about honesty and deceit.. mine... not hers.. but we overcame it in time because the alternative of not overcoming it did not bear thinking about.. it took work and much patience.. .. a great deal of both and consequences which were very hard on both of us.. and it took both of us listening to one another and not going overboard with the hysterics... you sound bitter and angry and bitter and angry sorts nothing... bitter and angry gets in the way not simply of repairing any relationship but just coming to terms with its end...

...if she is as you say... you have only one option.. walk away and allow your anger and bitterness to disperse with time.. and live your life...

[christelle69]

@ Darkeyes

"...if she is as you say... you have only one option.. walk away and allow your anger and bitterness to disperse with time.. and live your life..."

So what you're saying is based on the exact description of our situation on this thread, you are saying that I've to walk away right?

Is it the same opinion for the rest of the people who are reading this thread?

[Jobelorocks]

@ Jobelorocks

"It is just bound to happen. Now dwelling on it is a different story. You can expect them not to dwell on these thoughts, but you can't help being attracted to people."

Yes and that's the very reason that has led me to sign in on that forum....I want to know if she's/will be attracted to guys. For me this is an open door to the cheating, the risk exists

Yes if she is truly bisexual she probably will find men attractive here and there. This goes for everyone though of all different sexualities. People of all sexualites in monogamous relationships have those moments where they find someone attractive and are tempted to dwell on those thoughts and it could lead to cheating. I think your past experience is probably contributing to your worries. Bisexuals aren't all the same just like lesbians aren't all the same or gay men aren't all the same or straight people.

[Jobelorocks]

@ Darkeyes

"...if she is as you say... you have only one option.. walk away and allow your anger and bitterness to disperse with time.. and live your life..."

So what you're saying is based on the exact description of our situation on this thread, you are saying that I've to walk away right?

Is it the same opinion for the rest of the people who are reading this thread?

By what you say I would have walked away. A relationship full of lies and deciet is not good. How can you trust someone who is always lying? Also if she has a porn addiction to the point where she is more interested in it than she is in you, she needs help. You are worth being told the truth and worth being cherished.

[darkeyes]

@ Darkeyes

"...if she is as you say... you have only one option.. walk away and allow your anger and bitterness to disperse with time.. and live your life..."

So what you're saying is based on the exact description of our situation on this thread, you are saying that I've to walk away right?

Is it the same opinion for the rest of the people who are reading this thread?

If u feel as you write, yes I do.. the other option is to allow her to explore and enjoy what she is without recrimination, questioning or pressure.. a bisexual woman.. I don't think from the way you write you are prepared to accept that... I think you will always put stress on both her and the relationship and if she is as u say.. she will always return the compliment...

[Gearbox]

It's pretty obvious your not compatible, and no amount of relationship therapy will solve that IMO.
She got you to move on false pretences, and is most prob a bi who gets cravings for men. That's not what you ordered, so walk away!!

[elian]

I hesitated responding to this thread because I can only see one point of view in the relationship but for simplicity's sake you might as well think of her as bisexual.

Even if she has the best of intentions in telling you "she'll never go back" I just don't trust that. I can't tell you if she intentionally "manipulated" you or not. Maybe she's just not that emotionally mature, she might be struggling to define what her sexuality really is. Many people seem to post on here "Help, I think I might be bi" every month or so.

She may also have an addiction to pornography, it's hard to tell with only one view of the situation.

If the idea of your partner having desire for a man, or others bothers you then it would be better to leave the situation as soon as you can find a stable place to live.

If you could be friends or roommates or some other arrangement that wouldn't bother you then maybe it would be alright but honesty is a big part of a good relationship - I would be more than a little worried if she continued to lie..like afraid to keep my wallet or purse lying around worried..until you REALLY get to know who she is and what she's about.

[christelle69]

Hi

I don't know if you remember me, this is the rigid lesbian....Finally she has admitted everything yesterday and I've cried all night till now: She's bisexual, she thinks about sex with males no matter what I do to her, and yes she fantasise about males, real men that she has met in her life not the one on the porn...The pornography thing was just a consequence, so yes she's a full blown up bisexual....And It hurts me SO MUCH


WHAT THE FUCK CAN I DO????? She'll NEVER be able to love me, the way I do, which means at 100%, : there's only her in my head and in my sexuality, she has admitted that she "can't help it"..

How can I deal with someone that will put me completely out of the picture???? How can I deal with someone that has lied to me more than a year? I'm SURE that it's the door wide open to any cheating now, since she's been able to lie to me all this time

How can I deal with someone who is incapable of TRUE love?

I'm so hurt, I don't know what to do

Christelle

[binjlooking]

Sounds like you should view your relationship with your friend as strictly a matter of mutual pleasure. Nothing wrong with that. Your hatred of st8t porn is disconcerting......

[christelle69]

I'M SO HURT....I'M IN HELL I CAN'T STOP CRYING .....

[Herculoid Poirot]

Hey, it's going to be OK. Not now, not for awhile, but it will be.

I'm the bi person in my relationship and I tell you right now, it CAN work. There is only one true love in my life and that's my wife. Does my bisexuality complicate our lives? Sure. But everyone has issues. Everyone. This is ours to work through.

Ask yourself, do you still love her? Do you love her enough to talk to her honestly and openly about your relationship? If you answered yes, then get to some couples counselling pronto. You can work this out, or, at the very least, be honest and open with each other and work towards doing what is right for both of you.

Don't suffer alone. Call someone. Call ANYONE and get some with you.

[christelle69]

"There is only one true love in my life and that's my wife. Does my bisexuality complicate our lives? Sure"

How your wife is dealing with your bisexuality??? How ???? (sorry if i make my answers short, it very difficult to write when you cry, I'm just all pain and suffering )

[Herculoid Poirot]

There are many, many, many different paths that a mixed orientation partnership can take.

For my part, by repeated word and deed I have let my wife know that she is my true love. I may look at gay porn or like to use sex toys but she is the one that I love. Right now we're monogamous. Maybe someday we won't be. What matters is that we are honest and respect each other. Don't give up!

[Jobelorocks]

I know that you are hurting right now, but you have to also remember you are posting on a bisexual forum. You make it sound like we are incapable of true love, but that is false and frankly offensive (how would you feel if I said lesbians weren't capable of true love?). I love my husband very much and he loves me even, yes my bisexuality. At first he had a slight fear of me cheating or leaving him for a woman, but now that is no longer an issue. We have grown in our relationship and he realizes that me being bisexual doesn't make me a cheater or a lier. I love him and want to spend the rest of my life with him and No-one else.

If you love her and want to make it work you can. A couples counselor would be the best route. If things are to work between you two she needs to start being honest and work on her pornography use and you need to love her, all of her, this includes her sexuality.You two will have to find compromises on things, you can't expect everything to be exactly your way and she can't expect everything to be exactly hers. Most people in monogamous relationships are attracted to people other than their partner. It is just how it is. Many lesbians will find other women attractive, many gay men will find other men attractive, many straight women will find other men attractive, many straight guys find other women attractive, and many bisexuals will find other men and women attractive.

Do not let your past dictate what you are doing now. Just because you dated a bisexual who betrayed you and cheated, does NOT mean the bisexual woman you are with now is a cheater. That is not fair to put another woman's wrongs on her head. Listen to her, really listen. She is probably hurting just as much as you. It is not easy feeling you have to stay in the closet and honestly with how you talk about bisexuals here, I would have probably been afraid to be out as well. I am NOT saying her lying is okay, but I understand where she is coming from.

Generally relationship problems come from both sides, which I think is the case here. Now one side might not be as guilty as the other, but the guilt lies partially on each of you. Going to a couples counselor is your best bet if you want to make things work. They are trained in these areas, we aren't.

[void()]

Knowing everything I've just put the situation is even more confusing. She's saying that the world of sex is fascinating for her, male and female, but that " SHE NEVER FANTASIZE ABOUT MEN IN REAL LIFE (not porn), and "THAT SHE NEVER FEEL ATTRACTED TO MALES AT ALL...Does it make sense to you???

Another thing she's saying that "SHE WAS BISEXUAL IN THE PAST BUT NOT ANYMORE SINCE SHE'S WITH ME...Same thing does it make sense to you?

Last question : she has admitted that straight pornography was a turn on but as well that the penetration by a male was source of pleasure, but NOW she's saying that she never think of doing it again, that "THERE'S NOTHING THERE" referring of being turned on by males in the street or at her work. Do you think that's possible?


1. Yes it does make sense. I am not one to be overly fond of any pornography. I am also a human being. This means there are times I do enjoy watching some porn. I can watch any variety of genre of porn and enjoy it. If I masturbate to it, then it means the porn did what it is supposed to do. It entertained and aroused, provided a release. My wife is more adamant on not liking porn. She asked me to not watch it. But she also knows I do at times. It is a non-issue with us.

Because she and I both know and agree that one person cannot ever hope to be the be all end all for another. I remain discrete out of respect and love, in watching what little porn I do watch. I watch it to be entertained, and sometimes it's nice to bang one out. It is a human need. You having an issue with it seems to imply you have issues loving the other person wholly. You have to accept human beings for being human. That's what love really is and anyone telling you otherwise is a robot.

2. Yes it makes sense. There have been periods in my life as a fully bisexual person, I have chosen to be straight, and times I'm gay. And sometimes I go for a few years of being either or. More often I am just me and you can take it or leave it. I'm bi, nice to meet you. People have a right to love whom they love. They have a right to fuck whom they fuck, too. Again, this seems to bring issues presented by you in accepting a person as is, wholesale. People can and do change, anything is possible. Until you can accept that, you will face conflict and drama.

3. Sometimes what the card says is what it means. An ace of hearts is an ace of hearts. If she tells you men don't turn her on, then accept that at face value. Sometimes men don't turn me on, sometimes women don't and sometimes butterflies don't. It happens and anything is possible. Also, see the other two responses above.

In short I feel similar to Jobe. You're bringing a lot of insult here. I don't think you realize a lot is directed back at yourself. And no one here is trying to insult you. You are putting it on yourself.

Accept people for being people. Understand and accept that anything is possible. You may find life a bit more bearable.

[christelle69]

" Most people in monogamous relationships are attracted to people other than their partner. It is just how it is"

Here we go, may be I've not been clear enough: I'M NOT A PART OF THESE PEOPLE, I DON'T FANTASIZE ABOUT OTHER WOMEN

Do you get it now? And this is where it hurts like hell, I'm committed, devoted to the person I've decided to live with, this is what it is, Does it sounds ridiculous to ask to be loved the same way??? Beyond the fact that cocks disgust me, this is exactly the way I see what love is, a full loyal, devoted life with the one I love. And once again I don't think that it's much to ask to be loved the same way

I'M NOT BRINGING INSULTS HERE, I'M JUST A LESBIAN (RIGID) THAT IS TRYING TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE : LIVING WITH A BISEXUAL....CAN YOU UNDERSTAND THE GUTS AND THE COURAGE I NEED TO HAVE TO COME HERE AND SAY EVERYTHING ABOUT MY FUCKING LIFE WITH HER???? Come on !!!! I've been lied on, manipulated, betrayed and humiliated, and I still try to find solution for us SHE DOESN'T and you dare to say to me that I'm insulting ?????

I tell you what: it has been 7 months that I'm reading EVERY DAY bisexual forums, french , Australian and american, I know now quite a few things about "type" of bisexuality, I COULD have able not being hurt if my partner would have been able to be think of me only being in the sequence : I'm a lesbian relationship and it satisfied me 100% ....BUT that's not the case

WHAT HURTS THE MOST IS THAT I'LL NEVER NEVER NEVER BE ENOUGH FOR HER DO YOU GET IT ???

Believe me when I say that most of the lesbian community DOESN'T want to have to do anything with the bisexuals women, NOT even trying to understand and to find ways...With posting here I'm doing exactly the opposite

Intellectually I'm READY to admit that I'm not "all white" in this mess, my responsibility is that yes I'm a rigid lesbian, like million of others, but for god sake I'm the one being hurt by someone who TRAPPED ME in this relationship

[Gearbox]

Christelle your partner is a person, not a robot that you or she can program. It IS utterly ridiculous to expect her to have the exact same range of emotional control that you claim to have. It's NOT going to happen!
She may have fooled you into being with her, but you are hurting yourself now, not her.

How are you trapped? Why can't you leave?

[christelle69]

"How are you trapped? Why can't you leave?"

Before I took off for Australia I was 2 days from getting an apartment in Lyon with a very low rent. You probably don't know that but it's very difficult to find this in France, as much as finding work....I've no friends left in France mainly due because I've travelled and lived in foreign countries (4 years in Ireland and 2 in the USA) so my social network has vanished....I've let go this flat because of Kat, I've trusted her, I was in love....

If I go back in France in addition of my depression *and a broken heart, that'll be the slow death in the streets I know it., homeless people in a financial crisis doesn't last long...The economical situation out there has deteriorated a lot the last months is the euro zone. MY parents turned their back on me years ago because of my homosexuality but most importantly we were so different from each other

NOW I've got NOWHERE TO GO !

So I'm stuck here with someone who has humiliated me, betrayed me, lied to me during more than a year.... AND THE WORSE OF ALL : I STILL LOVE HER

[Jobelorocks]

You know you keep on saying how you are fine with bisexuals, but obviously you aren't. Yes I dare to say you are being offensive if you think that we are not capable of true love. That is very very offensive. I love my husband very much and I have moved away from all my friends and family, moved from my home, got excommunicated from my old church, lost most of my friends (because he is a Catholic and I was raised in an anti-Catholic group), for a person I love. Don't you dare tell me bisexuals can't love. That is closed minded and offensive.

If you can't handle being with a bisexual, don't be with one. Love hurts a lot sometimes. That is part of getting close to people. Sometimes you get betrayed. If you have a job, get your own place, do what you need to and move out. Maybe that means being a roommate to a person you don't know or renting a bedroom in a home. Lots of people do it every day. If you can't and must live with her, live with her, but don't be her partner anymore. Many people are in this situation.

If you want to make it work, go to a therapist of some sort. I don't know how it is in the country where you are at, but here there are plenty of cheap or free therapists. I understand why you are angry, but most people are not like you and are attracted to people other than their partner. It does not mean they are less devoted, they just function differently then you do. She betrayed you, I understand that and why you are hurt, but I feel you are being too harsh on her. Every relationship has problems on both sides. It is a fact.

You will have a hard time finding someone who is not going to find other people attractive if they are in a monogamous relationship with you. Not everyone can turn that off. You can't expect someone to turn off their sexuality any more than they can expect you to. She is a bisexual. If you love her, you will have to love all of her, including her bisexuality. Sexuality is such a big portion of ourselves and we cannot make our sexual identity or preferences go away.

[Herculoid Poirot]

If you expect a lover to NEVER feel ANY attraction to anyone else, you are going to be very lonely.

[Jobelorocks]

If you expect a lover to NEVER feel ANY attraction to anyone else, you are going to be very lonely.

Indeed.

[Gearbox]

Your options are:
1. Leave and risk homelessness and ill health.
2. Stay and continue to have expectations that won't happen.
3. Stay and just drop those expectations and try to love her as she is. Or at least tolerate her bisexuality.
4. Get a place of your own with her help and start letting her go.

I'd pick No3, but also find out how you could get your own place too, just in case things don't work out. At least you'll have some control over your future.

[Jobelorocks]

Gear is spot on. I agree with choice 3. If you want to make any relationship in your life last, you will have to make compromises. Just the nature of relationships, if you can't or are not willing to make compromises, leave. Simple as that.

[Lay-Lay]

One of my great lesbian friends liked having sex with guys but she doesn't do it anymore. She doesn't want to be with guys again. And most of the lesbian woman and gay men I know say they like watching heterosexual porn because it looks real. They say they feel like most of the porn stars doing gay porn just isn't that into it. So there is a possibility that your girlfriend is telling the truth

[void()]

"Most people in monogamous relationships are attracted to people other than their partner. It is just how it is"

Here we go, may be I've not been clear enough: I'M NOT A PART OF THESE PEOPLE, I DON'T FANTASIZE ABOUT OTHER WOMEN

Do you get it now? And this is where it hurts like hell, I'm committed, devoted to the person I've decided to live with, this is what it is, Does it sounds ridiculous to ask to be loved the same way???

I'M NOT BRINGING INSULTS HERE, I'M JUST A LESBIAN (RIGID) THAT IS TRYING TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE : LIVING WITH A BISEXUAL....CAN YOU UNDERSTAND THE GUTS AND THE COURAGE I NEED TO HAVE TO COME HERE AND SAY EVERYTHING ABOUT MY FUCKING LIFE WITH HER????

WHAT HURTS THE MOST IS THAT I'LL NEVER NEVER NEVER BE ENOUGH FOR HER DO YOU GET IT ???

1. I never generalized your situation in comparison to anyone. I gave you personal examples. I did not say because it works for me it will work for you.

2. Yes, I understand what you are saying. No need to shout. I too have courage. A certain medical condition effects 1 out of every 10,000 guys. It does the same for women too. This condition causes a person to not really be a man or woman. For men, you don't hit puberty until you get testosterone booster treatments. This means you grow up to about age twenty-five or so and have a really small penis, testicles. At twenty-five I had been out of the navy because they rejected me. I have no sense of smell. I can never be man enough for my wife. She says otherwise, and it's not lip service. But there is always doubt, fear.

So what? I'm still here trying to talk with others, to help, to be helped. I enjoy being bi, enjoy the company of bi friends, butterflies, gays, straights. I still accept them for them. People are people. We all have faults.

3. Why do think a lesbian with a bi not doable? Let me interject a definition, impossible is an adjective. It simply describes the level of difficulty. That means someone else did it, they had to in order to describe it. Now, you can go do it better. I'm bi, my wife is straight. It is doable for us. I love her unconditionally. Shoot I have let her go out and fuck other guys. What's good for the gander is good for the goose too. No desire exists in me to find another woman. Yes I can admit there some that if I were able would not stand a second chance, I'd be hammering away. But those are few and far between, besides that I got the best woman at home. Men on the other hand, I can be all over.

And my wife knows that I will come home to her. I know she will come home to me. We do not cheat or lie to one another. We do accept each other as the people we are. We accept that sometimes a person may need something different, we move on. She too had doubts about being enough for me. Point blank, she is. She had to consider us being open. She took five years to decide. I honoured her time of consideration and had no one but her in my life. After she decided we could be open, she was the one pushing for me to get hooked up with a guy or two. She was looking for guys for me to date.

Again, the way we have may or may not work for you. You do need to consider accepting people for themselves. No one is perfect. And I'm sorry to tell you but love is not perfect either. It takes work, communication, more of itself, compassion, compromise. And you need to not expect anything from anyone. Life doesn't play that way.

[christelle69]

Since I can't move out from our relationship, this is what we agreed

After very painful 4 days of conversation where I've cried non stop (she never shed a single tear), this is what are the only solutions for us

Since she'a a full blown bisexual, Kat and I agreed to never go out together even for the food shopping (I'll do it), I don't want to see in her eyes the desire about males, and there's NO WAY that I become a passive accomplice of that shit.... So yes as a consequence, we'll only see each other in our apartment

We have agreed as well that I'll never kiss her or licking her, since I don't want to take the risk that she has cheated on me few hours or days before, the simple idea of imagining that a penis has touched her make me really sick. So she'll have to deal only with the toys.

This is my last post, I'm devastated by all that but that's better this way...Thanks a lot for all your answers and good luck