tenni
Nov 13, 2011, 4:27 PM
For those who wish to discuss the Viet Nam war, protests etc.
Use this thread please.
Originally Posted by Hephaestion View Post
LDD we see different end points. Without the USA there, the war drew to its inevitable end. The protestors preciptated the USA withdrawal. It's like babies. There is sex and much later there is a birth - cause and effect. Let's agree to differ.
When it comes to supporting the vets, we do this at every opportunity in this country. We do protest through all avenues at the treatment of our service personnel. Certainly we support Rememberance Day. There are firms which exclusively or preferentially employ (often disabled) service men and women.
However all of these are constantly in danger from the greed and excessiveness of the amoral capitalists and back slappers.
The market adjusts to the elevated monetary standards that these people are able to set. There are inevitable casualties in a world of unbridled relentless competition where there are winners and losers. One aspect of your price rises is just this.
Some competition is good. Too much competition leads to inefficiency and emaciation. The problem being that there is now no competition for the amoral capitalists (thank you Mrs T and her like). That's where demonstrations come in.
Set up checks and balances e.g. a functioning democracy and the demonstrators will go away (because there will be an alternative mechanism)
You do have a point that the greenies of which I include myself do ask for too much but we must all realise that there are finite world resources. These are under threat from the size of the world's population and the idea that economies can continue expanding and consuming.
I have no intention of getting into the Vietnam argy.. it was an unnecessary war which needn't have been... all I can say is well done the protestors of the 60s and 70s... no they didnt end the war, but by their actions they were responsible for it.. a war which neednt have started in 1946, could have been ended once and for all in 1955 and was continued only to feed the paranoia of two power blocs with one considerably more paranoid and responsible than the other.. Vietnam wasnt by the way two seperate countries, it was two seperate parts of the same every ancient country forcibly partitioned arbitrarily in 1955 to satisfy everyone and satisfied no 1 with inevitable results. After 1955 Vietnam became a civil war as much as a war of colonialism and ideology. Its end was at best two decades late so I say yes, well done the protestors.. without you it would probably be going on yet...
..and even with checks and balances Heph demonstration and protest will be needed.. they are in fact an honourable check in themselves to balance uppity governments which any democratic system is likely to throw up...
Finally.. as a committed "greenie" who spends rather a lot of time and money on green issues (including soon to be installed solar panels on her roof), and has a partner and children who are even more devoted and committed to the green cause than me, the greenies babes, have been and are being incredibly reasonable in the face of international intransigence by governments and capital alike... the clock ticks on and the environmetal state of the world isnt improving that much if at all.. the world warms, we pollute, we rape the earth and give so little back.. to save our world I'm afraid costs... unfortunately humanity and its institutions doesnt seem to be prepared to pay those costs sufficiently.. so maybe before long, it will be the ferryman we will have to pay... and dear old Charon's price for passage is more than I or anyone else would prefer or can afford to pay...
Use this thread please.
Originally Posted by Hephaestion View Post
LDD we see different end points. Without the USA there, the war drew to its inevitable end. The protestors preciptated the USA withdrawal. It's like babies. There is sex and much later there is a birth - cause and effect. Let's agree to differ.
When it comes to supporting the vets, we do this at every opportunity in this country. We do protest through all avenues at the treatment of our service personnel. Certainly we support Rememberance Day. There are firms which exclusively or preferentially employ (often disabled) service men and women.
However all of these are constantly in danger from the greed and excessiveness of the amoral capitalists and back slappers.
The market adjusts to the elevated monetary standards that these people are able to set. There are inevitable casualties in a world of unbridled relentless competition where there are winners and losers. One aspect of your price rises is just this.
Some competition is good. Too much competition leads to inefficiency and emaciation. The problem being that there is now no competition for the amoral capitalists (thank you Mrs T and her like). That's where demonstrations come in.
Set up checks and balances e.g. a functioning democracy and the demonstrators will go away (because there will be an alternative mechanism)
You do have a point that the greenies of which I include myself do ask for too much but we must all realise that there are finite world resources. These are under threat from the size of the world's population and the idea that economies can continue expanding and consuming.
I have no intention of getting into the Vietnam argy.. it was an unnecessary war which needn't have been... all I can say is well done the protestors of the 60s and 70s... no they didnt end the war, but by their actions they were responsible for it.. a war which neednt have started in 1946, could have been ended once and for all in 1955 and was continued only to feed the paranoia of two power blocs with one considerably more paranoid and responsible than the other.. Vietnam wasnt by the way two seperate countries, it was two seperate parts of the same every ancient country forcibly partitioned arbitrarily in 1955 to satisfy everyone and satisfied no 1 with inevitable results. After 1955 Vietnam became a civil war as much as a war of colonialism and ideology. Its end was at best two decades late so I say yes, well done the protestors.. without you it would probably be going on yet...
..and even with checks and balances Heph demonstration and protest will be needed.. they are in fact an honourable check in themselves to balance uppity governments which any democratic system is likely to throw up...
Finally.. as a committed "greenie" who spends rather a lot of time and money on green issues (including soon to be installed solar panels on her roof), and has a partner and children who are even more devoted and committed to the green cause than me, the greenies babes, have been and are being incredibly reasonable in the face of international intransigence by governments and capital alike... the clock ticks on and the environmetal state of the world isnt improving that much if at all.. the world warms, we pollute, we rape the earth and give so little back.. to save our world I'm afraid costs... unfortunately humanity and its institutions doesnt seem to be prepared to pay those costs sufficiently.. so maybe before long, it will be the ferryman we will have to pay... and dear old Charon's price for passage is more than I or anyone else would prefer or can afford to pay...