Thank goodness I'm a Democrat....

[DuckiesDarling]

Despite the title, I am not slamming all Republicans but some of the things they are pushing this year...........

Well just take a look

http://www.keennewsservice.com/2011/07/13/republican-field-splinters-on-anti-gay-marriage-pledge/

[niftyshellshock]

Bahahahah Romney and Huntsman just lost the support of the Tea Party idiots.

Whoever makes it out of those primaries alive will get the Mondale treatment in 2012.

[chuck1124]

I wouldn't be too sure of that. There are an awfully lot of piss off, unemployed people out there right now. And it sure isn't the Republicans that got us there.

[void()]

I have a theory it was the whole of government, what got us there. We've been refused a lot of proper education over the years. This education could have been geared toward our new 'green' and tech industries.

Of course, I'm not saying that is the magic bullet either. But it is clear every bit could have helped. And now that it is looking to go bust, no one wants to agree on a way to fix it so we don't. Families need to budget. Does the government think it doesn't? Guess we see the results of that thinking.

My mom come up with an interesting notion. If they can't get social security, disability checks on time, then all those getting the checks ought to pack up and go live in The White House. She was also reading off the average salaries of our government representatives.

If I had finished out this full year of working at my former employer, luck would have gave less than $20,000 for the year. Those guys make three and four times as much. And I was doing manual labor with tools prone to break and not be replaced by the employer.

"Don't want to go wasting money now do we?" Was a common phrase slung by a moron of a supervisor whom thought he was every working man's 'buddy'. I often replied. "Want the work done or not? I need tools to do the work. Don't have them, can't work." This caused trouble because it was true and I pointed it out so rationally. Lucky I wasn't fired over it.

I think right now, education will be our greatest tool. We're being kept from it too easily and readily. Once we get it we'll grow and get past all this bull crap in our way. Education can provide work. Someone has to teach. Pay teachers better. Create apprenticeship programs where they don't exist and may prove adequate for training workers.

Oh, and a bottom line here. Let's start basing everything on merit and not by what we currently have. People get tired of not having room to grow, to learn new things, to be better compensated when they do well.

Bah, I ramble on. Just a poor country boy here with no understanding 'tall.

[bityme]

I have a theory it was the whole of government, what got us there. We've been refused a lot of proper education over the years. This education could have been geared toward our new 'green' and tech industries.

. . . . . . . . . .

I think right now, education will be our greatest tool. We're being kept from it too easily and readily. Once we get it we'll grow and get past all this bull crap in our way. Education can provide work. Someone has to teach. Pay teachers better. Create apprenticeship programs where they don't exist and may prove adequate for training workers.

Oh, and a bottom line here. Let's start basing everything on merit and not by what we currently have. People get tired of not having room to grow, to learn new things, to be better compensated when they do well.

Bah, I ramble on. Just a poor country boy here with no understanding 'tall.

You don't sound like a "poor country boy" "with no understanding."

You are absolutely right. Education is the key. Not an education to pass some made-up test, but an education to teach the kids to solve problems. In California the "high-stakes testing" is only high stakes for teachers and administrators. The test results mean nothing for the kids. They get promoted to the next grade before the results are back. The tests aren't even used for placement because it's illegal to "track" students.

The kids need concentrated instruction about the government and how it works. How the corporations are presently dictating all the legislation and buying the elections for the politicians who will support their greed. Why not raise the tariffs on foreign made goods and bring the manufacturing back to our country? It's a sad state of affairs when a country like India is the single largest employer of U.S. college graduates.

Pappy

[bullhead69]

I don't think it matters what party you belong to, they are all out to get what they can for themselves. The reason the country is in such horrid shape is because nobody knows how to fix it. All they are doing in spending all of us (Americans) into oblivion. I don't think social security would be in trouble if congress hadn't borrowed tons of money from it that they haven't really paid back. Every time a good bill is passed, they tack on so many amendments that it defeats the purpose of the bill. But I rant. The system is broke and us joe and jane blows don't have much chance of fixing it.

[niftyshellshock]

I don't think it matters what party you belong to, they are all out to get what they can for themselves. The reason the country is in such horrid shape is because nobody knows how to fix it. All they are doing in spending all of us (Americans) into oblivion. I don't think social security would be in trouble if congress hadn't borrowed tons of money from it that they haven't really paid back. Every time a good bill is passed, they tack on so many amendments that it defeats the purpose of the bill. But I rant. The system is broke and us joe and jane blows don't have much chance of fixing it.

This country is not in horrid shape. You should travel more and see what 'horrid shape' really is.

[BiCplAz]

I don't know when you Democrats are going to admit that when you have Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reed and Barack Obama running ANYTHING, much less the U.S. Government, you're going to have a major disaster. And that is just what happened. Now lets hope we can get Republicans, Independents, whatever to fix the mess those idiots caused.

[Realist]

Nifty,

You're lucky to live in Texas!

Come to Florida and see thousands upon thousands of homes in foreclosure, people clambering for jobs of any type. There's very little industry, tourists are not coming as before, less people, more taxes, less infrastructure, more crime, drugs....it ain't a pretty picture.

I lived in Kentucky for 30 years, they have blighted areas, too. But I've known Kentuckians who can live happily on less than most think possible. They're used to a hard life and some I've known can deal with any depression...especially the farmers.

Lived in Pennsylvania for 10 years, their industry's gone, steel mills silent...for the most part and the oil's pretty well depleted. I lived in a small town that had a huge medical complex and they were doing well, but a few miles away, it was sad to see the decline.

Yep, Texas, North Dakota, I think they're doing pretty well, but many other places, that used to be prosperous, are not well, at all.

I'm no political wizard, but I can tell you that neither party has done us right for many years. When's the last time you heard of an honest politician? I think it's a huge mistake to put your faith in any politicians. I'm 71 years old and other than Eisenhower and Truman, I can't think of a one, I'd trust with my life!

I'm afraid this democracy is on it's downward turn and I'm not confidant about the situation improving. I hope I'm wrong, but only time will tell.

[MikeSoFla]

I don't know when you Democrats are going to admit that when you have Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reed and Barack Obama running ANYTHING, much less the U.S. Government, you're going to have a major disaster. And that is just what happened. Now lets hope we can get Republicans, Independents, whatever to fix the mess those idiots caused.

QFT, LOL.
Fun Fact: Hope & Change hasnt "fixed" anything. Not saying McCain would have done any better, he probably would have done worse. He's nuts. Just sayin, Obama has made a bad situation worse. The only kudos he gets is for being the man in charge to say "meh, ok, why not?" for our SEALS to go kill Bin Laden. Good job O, but thats it.

[LouiseBrooks]

I wouldn't be too sure of that. There are an awfully lot of piss off, unemployed people out there right now. And it sure isn't the Republicans that got us there.

Oh, really? I seem to remember the economy was so awful during Bush's last year a depression seemed imminent. I'm not really satisfied with Obama IN THE LEAST but I do wonder why the Republicans didn't have such deficit scruples when THEIR man was in office running up the deficit on his pointless, wild goose chase WARS. People like you are the problem. You get angry, vote someone else in, then vote his enemies in 2 years later before he has half a chance to do ANYTHING then bitch about how they don't cooperate enough.

Yep, no one bitches about the deficit when it's being run up by the Pentagon but heaven forbid a penny goes to a needed social program.

The only time Republicans give half a shit about the deficit is when there is a Democrat in the White House. FACT. Yeah, times were really bad under Bill Clinton with dollar gas and a federal surplus until George Bush solved everything for us with 1920s-style Wall Street deregulation, tax breaks for his buddies, and endless wars. And yet Obama is supposed to solve all that in 4 years. No, not 4 years. TWO years because once people like you voted in the Congressional races, his hands were pretty much tied. Now he'll probably be voted out in 2012, then things will continue terrible, then the Democrats will be voted back in during the midterms, then the fruit flies will vote Republicans back in, and so on and so forth.

[drugstore cowboy]

This country is not in horrid shape. You should travel more and see what 'horrid shape' really is.

I agree with you there.

I have been to other countries even just South of the U.S. border a few miles and it's a lot worse in Mexico and other countries than it is here in the United States.

I don't like either the Democrats or the Republicans.

[niftyshellshock]

I agree with you there.

I have been to other countries even just South of the U.S. border a few miles and it's a lot worse in Mexico and other countries than it is here in the United States.

I don't like either the Democrats or the Republicans.

To be fair, you don't like the United States Constitution, either.

[**Peg**]

Thank goodness I'm Canadian.....an excellent synopsis there LouiseBrooks.

[LouiseBrooks]

You're welcome, Peg. Being unemployed, I admit things are terrible. But they were even worse as a whole in 2008. And any rage I have is towards the Republicans...who seem to love everything in life that I find hateful and base.

[IanBorthwick]

I wouldn't be too sure of that. There are an awfully lot of piss off, unemployed people out there right now. And it sure isn't the Republicans that got us there.

I LOL'd at this until I realized you were serious. Now I pity you...brown shirt.

[bullhead69]

Louise, please check back to the Clinton years. By the time he left office the economy was already on the decline, For at least the last year.

[LouiseBrooks]

I LOL'd at this until I realized you were serious. Now I pity you...brown shirt.


*nods*

[LouiseBrooks]

Louise, please check back to the Clinton years. By the time he left office the economy was already on the decline, For at least the last year.

But of course, those highs couldn't be maintained indefinitely. Now me, every time I come to a hill in a car, I really enjoy the ride, but once I'm on the downhill slope I tend to just jerk the wheel and put the car in the ditch completely. Signed, George W Bush Driving School graduate.

[elian]

People don't give the kid enough credit, Obama's term in the white house has been in one of the shittiest periods in our nation's history - cleaning up after the mess Bush left. Do people forget about the mess Bush left? Not really a coincidence that any of the top individuals involved in the mortgage scandal haven't faced criminal charges - what, with the chairman of Goldman Sachs being in a chief position of White House committee pushing de-regulation of the finance industry before everything went to shit...all during Bush's term...

and of course all congress can do about the budget is make a lot of friggin noise and posturing, watch them run the damn country into the ground - what else is new...dildos.. <grrr>

Yes, we need to cut spending, but yeah - EVERYBODY has got to feel the pain - a little less raping the middle class please. The Republicans called for spending cuts but probably more like lip service as usual, now that Obama is taking them up on the offer and wants to develop a serious 10 year plan they are stuck - can't just posture your way out of this one.

Every other institution has failed, why not congress too? Maybe we ought to start learning to work together..

It's actually kind of exciting time, Obama went over to Egypt and told the kids in that auditorium that democracy is cool, I guess they must've thought so because a few of them have decided to try NON-VIOLENT protest instead of blowing themselves up and it seems to be "working" - they are now fighting their own battle against their own dictators. Of course, kind of scary when all they know is they're sick of that shit but they don't really have a plan for what to do after the corrupt government is toppled. Kind of like Russia, the government told them what to do for so long that nobody knew what to do with all that "freedom" they got when the Berlin Wall fell.

People bitch about Obama "starting another war" but the whole point of what he did in Libya was to NOT portray it as direct pre-emptive US involvement (that would piss off the Muslims even more), but rather support for NATO and Arab League.

Of course, Pakistan says "We don't need US Aide money!" - sure, no problem, we'll take that back but still not going to apologize for violating your "sovereign space" - so sorry you can't save face in your own country (tough shit) when you harbor fugitives.

[niftyshellshock]

I don't know when you Democrats are going to admit that when you have Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reed and Barack Obama running ANYTHING, much less the U.S. Government, you're going to have a major disaster. And that is just what happened. Now lets hope we can get Republicans, Independents, whatever to fix the mess those idiots caused.

Er, hi, you must be new to the United States. President Obama's trying to fix 8 years of shitty management. As far as major disasters go....yeah, I'm not even going to touch that. Too easy.

[Realist]

Whether we are a Democrats, Republicans, independents, or whatever, most people are missing the real issues and actual events that got us in this mess to begin with.

Emotionalism, making decisions with no factual references, using hearsay as gospel, adhering to one party no matter what, and turning a blind eye toward the truth, has allowed those in power to turn us against each other. When you divide your adversaries, the "war" is easier to win.

While we argue and fight among ourselves, those in power continue to use their own agendas and motivation to keep us in turmoil. This is not what the founding fathers envisioned for a free society.

One of the worst things to happen is the devaluation of our money, by printing more and more of it.......with no real wealth to back it up. (History buffs will remember that Germany did the same thing, during the Wiemar Republic's reign) The final straw was when Nixon's administration took us off the gold standard. Before him, Lyndon Johnson's administration began coin alloys, taking the majority of the real silver, then laminating it over copper and zinc. Before most folks were aware of what was going on, the money with real worth was removed from circulation.

These are just a few examples, as I see it. I think, if you put all your faith on one party, you are setting yourself up for a fall.

[void()]

"(History buffs will remember that Germany did the same thing, during the Wiemar Republic's reign)"

Yes. People were stealing wheelbarrows of cash, dumping the cash because the wheelbarrow itself was of more value.

Here in the U.S. a little further back than '40's Germany, there was another incident which adds fuel.

"The United States Gold Reserve Act of 1934 authorized the United States Treasury to buy and sell gold at a rate of $35 per ounce of gold in order stabilize the value of the dollar in foreign exchange markets. This legislation laid the foundation for the world to return to the gold standard for international transactions after World War II. The value of the dollar was fixed in gold, and the value of other currencies was fixed in dollars. The system only became fully operational after World War II, when most countries lifted bans on the exportation of gold. This gold exchange standard for international transactions remained in effect until 1971."

-- http://historical-facts.e-articles.info/title/Gold-Standard/

Believe I further recall some research pointing out that around 1932 the U.S. government had also banned the use of gold as currency by citizens. The government then suggested buying up your gold surplus, transposing worthless paper money. From what I gathered there was a bit of slight of hand involved in so doing, too. "Well, we can give you land grants which back this here paper money.", the goverment said. Unfortunately not many realized they already owned the land.

Cattle need land to graze. People use meat from cattle as food. We need the land to graze as well it seems. War is a Phonecian word meaning - get more cattle. Only stands to reason you'd also take the land the cattle graze on as well. So, in effect the government was threatening us with taking away land, which was used to create food and prosperiety. "We can give you this land." It's not theirs to give or take. So for them to say they can give it implies a threat of taking it away.

They took gold away. Gold comes from the ground, too. Maybe there's something to a notion of land having value. It's all so Orwellian and clear when I look at it. And it still doesn't convince me to vote. For whatever reason, likely human nature, when people become government agents they forget citizens pay their wages and they ought be a servant of those bosses. As is said in _V for Vendetta_, "People should not fear their governments, goverments should fear their people." I'm not advocating Syria in the U.S. but it is time we did something.

[niftyshellshock]

"(History buffs will remember that Germany did the same thing, during the Wiemar Republic's reign)"

Yes. People were stealing wheelbarrows of cash, dumping the cash because the wheelbarrow itself was of more value.

Here in the U.S. a little further back than '40's Germany, there was another incident which adds fuel.

"The United States Gold Reserve Act of 1934 authorized the United States Treasury to buy and sell gold at a rate of $35 per ounce of gold in order stabilize the value of the dollar in foreign exchange markets. This legislation laid the foundation for the world to return to the gold standard for international transactions after World War II. The value of the dollar was fixed in gold, and the value of other currencies was fixed in dollars. The system only became fully operational after World War II, when most countries lifted bans on the exportation of gold. This gold exchange standard for international transactions remained in effect until 1971."

-- http://historical-facts.e-articles.info/title/Gold-Standard/

Believe I further recall some research pointing out that around 1932 the U.S. government had also banned the use of gold as currency by citizens. The government then suggested buying up your gold surplus, transposing worthless paper money. From what I gathered there was a bit of slight of hand involved in so doing, too. "Well, we can give you land grants which back this here paper money.", the goverment said. Unfortunately not many realized they already owned the land.

Cattle need land to graze. People use meat from cattle as food. We need the land to graze as well it seems. War is a Phonecian word meaning - get more cattle. Only stands to reason you'd also take the land the cattle graze on as well. So, in effect the government was threatening us with taking away land, which was used to create food and prosperiety. "We can give you this land." It's not theirs to give or take. So for them to say they can give it implies a threat of taking it away.

They took gold away. Gold comes from the ground, too. Maybe there's something to a notion of land having value. It's all so Orwellian and clear when I look at it. And it still doesn't convince me to vote. For whatever reason, likely human nature, when people become government agents they forget citizens pay their wages and they ought be a servant of those bosses. As is said in _V for Vendetta_, "People should not fear their governments, goverments should fear their people." I'm not advocating Syria in the U.S. but it is time we did something.

Short of armed revolution, the vote is the best weapon we have. The reason we get idiots in power is because people who educate themselves are like, "Yeah, I'm not going to vote."

And voting beats protests, because for Americans to protest, you'd have to take away their TV.

[Pasadenacpl2]

A president gets to claim they are fixing the mess from the previous president for the first half of their first term. After that, whatever the results are, it's now his. You can claim that Obama is only trying to clean up 8 years or Bush's mess, but at this point, that really no longer flies. And when the 2012mess election cycle really gets going it will truly be "it's the economy, stupid."

Obama has not shown to be any great improvement over Bush in this department. He hasn't been the FDR or Scoop Jackson (to use Democrat iconic examples) the we needed. Instead we have a rapid expansion of government (and any economics student will tell you that a government is by design the least efficient and most costly way to employ people) coupled with 9.8% unemployment (17% real unemployment) and rising prices on everything from peas to gas to health care premiums.

If you want to discuss 2012, let's at least do it without feeling the need to slam Bush. He's been gone for nearly three years. It's Obama's for better or worse.

Pasa

[IanBorthwick]

I'm not advocating Syria in the U.S. but it is time we did something.

You're wrong....


It's past time.

[Diva667]

just saw this , had to post it. This seemed like a reasonable place...

http://fstdt.com/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=82600

Note: I'm not saying that its reasonable to assume this guy is republican.But he's definitely right of center.

[austinbi]

If you want to discuss 2012, let's at least do it without feeling the need to slam Bush. He's been gone for nearly three years. It's Obama's for better or worse.

Pasa

If you want to discuss 2012, leave bushCo & his crime family right in the middle of it, because it will take a lot longer than three years to clean up their crimes, if indeed they can be cleaned up. Far as I'm concerned, he took this country over the edge.

If anyone can bring the USA back from the dead, Obama can. Now, spend your time and resources making sure he gets four more years to work on it.

[niftyshellshock]

A president gets to claim they are fixing the mess from the previous president for the first half of their first term. After that, whatever the results are, it's now his. You can claim that Obama is only trying to clean up 8 years or Bush's mess, but at this point, that really no longer flies. And when the 2012mess election cycle really gets going it will truly be "it's the economy, stupid."

Obama has not shown to be any great improvement over Bush in this department. He hasn't been the FDR or Scoop Jackson (to use Democrat iconic examples) the we needed. Instead we have a rapid expansion of government (and any economics student will tell you that a government is by design the least efficient and most costly way to employ people) coupled with 9.8% unemployment (17% real unemployment) and rising prices on everything from peas to gas to health care premiums.

If you want to discuss 2012, let's at least do it without feeling the need to slam Bush. He's been gone for nearly three years. It's Obama's for better or worse.

Pasa

Man, can you imagine the outrage if Obama wanted to go FDR? We'd never hear the end of it. "WHARGARBL FASCISM!"

[niftyshellshock]

just saw this , had to post it. This seemed like a reasonable place...

http://fstdt.com/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=82600

Note: I'm not saying that its reasonable to assume this guy is republican.But he's definitely right of center.

To be fair, I took a trip to D.C. once in 2006, and saw something very similar, but with then President Bush's name instead of President Obama's.
Crazies are crazies.

[void()]

"The reason we get idiots in power is because people who educate themselves are like, "Yeah, I'm not going to vote.""

Fair enough. Let me expound on not voting from a personal view. Not defending but want it understood why one may not desire voting. I have seen voting not working. You've got lobbyists for everything with billion dollar a year profit corporate money, or old money backing them. They apply pressure to the Electoral College, end of voting. The system has been corrupted from the inside out.

And I'm not alone in this view, nor am I some doped up psychotic crackpot.
Neither was Socrates, Stalin. There are others but these can guide the way. Frankly, I think we need a Taoist form of governing. Lead by example and do the 'greater good' by teaching and following the golden rule. But that won't happen, nor will mankind living with nature.

Guess I am a bit odd, always seek balance in everything. Moderation even in itself. You're probably right about television too. Maybe a good Family episode would nudge things on. :)

[elian]

Never understood people not voting in a presidential election, people die every day in the name of upholding Freedom

I guess when it comes down to it that also includes the freedom to say "I don't give a shit" and not vote.

[DuckiesDarling]

The replies make me wonder if most actually read the link and how some Republicans were refusing to sign on to the Marriage Vow that some Republicans were pushing saying they would do all they could to make sure that a constitutional ban on same sex marriage was added as an amendment.

[Bicuriousity]

Realist has one of the best posts on here. As an independent i pity those who are manipulated into emotional thinking by the two political parties. Both parties have every reason to make everyone as emotional as they can so they can recieve your campaign contributions and votes. In return you get nothing but a devalued currency and threat of economic disaster due to poor fiscal policy.

[Pasadenacpl2]

I agree.

And DD, no, most did not read the article. See, what happens id that you mention the word "republican" or the word "democrat" and you get ideologues who insist demonizing one or the other, usually resulting in a discussiin on Bush and his "evil" cronies, rather than the actual topic at hand. Bisexual.com is the worst forum I've ever been on for this sort of behvior.

The incessant need to demonize the other side rather than just present your idea for how the govenment should best handle x issue is terrible on this site. But, it is also the same behavior we see from members of this site regarding a great many things, and not just politics. Why have a civil, on topic discussion when we can scream about how it's Bush's fault or how straight women keep making posts on a bisex site? It's all symotoms of the same problem.

Pasa

[elian]

Sorry DD, guess I just needed to vent - thanks for providing a useful public service!

[DuckiesDarling]

No worries, Elian :)


And Pasa? You should sit at my dinner table. My parents are Republicans, I am a firm Democrat. Can get interesting when the nightly news is playing in the background. :)

[fubar13]

Democrat...Republican...Keep thinking that way & the idiots that run this once great country will continue on their merry way to destroy everything this country once was. Don't remember which "founding father" said The worse thing we can do as a country would be to go to a 2 party system, If you do this you'll have half the country always blaming the other half for every little thing that's wrong & nothing will ever be done to better the situation, only aid the government in taking more freedoms from the people. Before you try to blame Bush for all the ills in this country, stop, think, every thing was going along fairly smoothly, 4-5% unemployment, $1.55 gas prices, housing prices were stable till 2006. What happened in 2006? Why Nazi Pelosi & Prince Harry took over both houses of congress...hmmm...Not to cut Bush any slack, Dept. of Homeland Security, using the Patriot Act has taken more freedoms then most people realize. Because of the Patriot act i'll never vote republican again & as far as democrats go, they're the same bunch of people that threw rotten veggies at me, called me baby killer & now profess to love the troops...yea right! Only votes i cast are for 3rd party, usually libertarian. Ask yourself, Is there ANY aspect of your life the government ain't got it's stinking nose stuck in?? Who's better at running your life, you or a bureaucrat?? Put your faith in yourself not some entity that's only interested in increasing their own power by any means necessary...:2cents: