Straight men who have sex with men

[elian]

http://www.villagevoice.com/content/printVersion/531971/

After reading article above I am wondering how much I am "bi" vs. just desiring intimate male companionship. Is there a difference? It's funny - the more I try to draw a line the more confusing it gets. You think I would learn the first time not to worry about labels. I have always been more romantically attracted to guys than physical, not that I mind the sex. I do find a hint of truth in the end of the article, I seek unconditional love, touch. Because men always seem to think of being intimate as "sex" I wonder if that limits our potential in that way? Thought I had worked through this.. Surely not all men equate sex with love - that has to be a 2D cardboard mock-up that they use on TV sets..

[NEPHX]

http://www.villagevoice.com/content/printVersion/531971/

After reading article above I am wondering how much I am "bi" vs. just desiring intimate male companionship. Is there a difference? It's funny - the more I try to draw a line the more confusing it gets. You think I would learn the first time not to worry about labels. I have always been more romantically attracted to guys than physical, not that I mind the sex. Thought I had worked through this..

I think you sound more bisexual the way I prefer to look at it. I consider myself bisexual because I prefer the emotionally (romantic) attraction to both men and women as well as physically. I have no interest in guys that just are interested in my physical sexual body parts (dick-centric) without the other aspects. If there isn't that sensual piece, touching, kissing, real attraction for me, I'm just not interested. Its too mechanical. To each their own.

I think the article is interesting in identifying the differences that men who desire sex and that women are not as generally available for what they want (sex/intimate contact without complications) or do what they wish to do (mechanical). I think women usually are more romantic, sensual, don't want to be treated like a sex object. These are products of at least the US (Western) society. Men say yes, women say no. Men and women are often different in that respect (of course there are many that are not) but generally women will not as easily slip into a quick sexual act with someone without the typical run-up.

There are many men that just want to have sex - with anyone. They will "top" a guy. They want to be "serviced" or have they cock sucked, etc. Eventually, as they get more experience, they might venture into the other roles too and get more sensual about it (my observation). That might go to the idea that most all people may have the capacity to be sexual with same-sex if give the drive to do so and the opportunity, experience, etc. Eventually, it loses its shock value when one enjoys it enough.

Now, the interesting part is, its much harder to find women interested in casual intimate interaction. Most of the Craig List Ads for women looking for men are spammers trying to get men to click over to some dating or porn site. It would have been interesting to see those stats from CL in the article. Most W4M are deleted within hours. BUT, there are PAGES of M4M ads. I often wonder if there are any real W4M ads at all.

This is a "quick" reply to your post. Obviously, there are VOLUMES written on this topic. There are scales and grids with variables and studies. Its still clear as mud. So, bottom line is that I think we declare what we are at the moment and it could change. If we're happy, what does it really matter. I am sometimes embarrassed to say I'm bi because it has such negative meaning anymore (for say over 30). Young bi people seem different. Older bi (guys especially) are considered cheaters and nasty, etc. (my observation).

To me, if I want to star into a guys/gals eyes, kiss them and get electrified by it and want to touch their shoulders, caress their backs, and lay with them more than just get my cock sucked or cum... I think I'm pretty bisexual. It so much the same to me regardless of the gender of my lover.

One issue is surely that bisexual is the only sexuality that has sex/sexual in the name. No one questions if gay men want to be romantic with gay men. But, people talk about bi people with terms like "Bi curious." I think someone is bi curious if they are attracted to the same-sex. But usually, people say they are bi curious if they want to try SEX with the same sex.

After all, in 3rd grade, I don't recall wanting to strip off the clothes from my desk mate Margaret. I just wanted to flirt with her and maybe kiss her :-) and then there was Kevin :-) Ditto. (oh, I hope YOU read this Kevin)

(PS please to those who are so inclined to rip peoples posts apart word by word, letter by letter - be gentle this is just a rambling post and not a published book with every possible scenario visited in grotesque detail).

[Long Duck Dong]

ok.... what it is, is the attraction v's the desire aspect .... its a very grey area and its why a lot of people ID as bisexual or are IDed as bisexual... when they are not actually bisexual.... but the term bisexual fits their understanding of who and what they are.......

( I will use males to break this down cos its easier as there is more threads in the forum dealing with attraction vs desire )

we have hard line thinkers that break sexuality down to hetero / gay and bisexual and will tell you that if you are having sex with men and women, that defines your sexuality..... but your sexuality is defined by who you are attracted to....

now here comes the butt kicker.... what if there is no attraction to a gender... but a desire to feel the emotions and feelings that interaction with a gender, bring out in you....

male bonding, be it sexual or otherwise, is seperate from sexuality as its desire based, not attraction based......

a simple way of looking at it is to look at heteros v's gays.... the attraction is to the gender that they feel close to, with heteros, its the opposite gender, with gays, its the same gender......

the desire is the interaction with the gender they are not attracted to, and with heteros, its the same gender, and with gays its the opposite gender..... IE friendships, buddies, etc etc

with bisexuals, its a very grey area as I have posted.....

a lot of them have a attraction to one gender and a desire for one gender.... and a inequal attraction / desire to the other gender..... and will often talk about the issues of not fulfilling their needs to suck cock....

a man that has sex with men, has the attraction to one gender... and a desire for contact and interaction with the other gender.... and do not have issues if they are not sucking a cock.... the fulfillment is not in the sexual act, its in the contact with the other person on many levels...

confused yet ???? lol

in simple terms, attraction is external, desire is internal.....
you are not attracted to a cheese burger, you desire a cheese burger.....
you are attracted to that muscle car, you desire to drive it
you are attracted to blondes, you desire that blonde in your arms

attraction is more broader and wide ranging, desire is more focus and narrow

so a bisexual that says they are attracted to both genders, is telling the truth.... and a man that says he desires sex with both genders, but is heterosexual, is also telling the truth

a bisexual that says that they are attracted to a woman and desires to suck a males cock only... is not actually a bisexual, they are a man that has sex with other men.... and a man that says he is attracted to both genders and enjoys sex with both genders, is actually a bisexual.....

still confused ???????

in very simple terms... attraction is who you feel drawn to.... desire is the need to feel something inside......

still confused ??????

so is most of the world lol ..... :tong: and thats why people perfer that we use the 3 main sexualities, cos it makes it easier for us to label other people according to our opinion of their sexuality and tell them we are right, they are wrong about their own sexuality.......

I know that a number of people in the site are not bisexual, they are people with a GASP ( gender area specific attraction ) but you will not see me bother pointing it out, cos its just not worth the arguements..

[maxtor]

so called straight men that wants sex with other men arent straight!!! simple!! they call themself straight but actually if you want sex whether it be topping, bottoming or getting your cock sucked, it is bi!! face it, you enjoy it. i enjoy playing with another mans cock and enjoy receiving anal sex with a hot hard cock and that makes me bi. i dont get into the intimate aspects as kissing, cuddling and other stuff but still like to please a man with my mouth or ass.

[Long Duck Dong]

so called straight men that wants sex with other men arent straight!!! simple!! they call themself straight but actually if you want sex whether it be topping, bottoming or getting your cock sucked, it is bi!! face it, you enjoy it. i enjoy playing with another mans cock and enjoy receiving anal sex with a hot hard cock and that makes me bi. i dont get into the intimate aspects as kissing, cuddling and other stuff but still like to please a man with my mouth or ass.

then what is the sexuality of a person not having sex with anybody ?

the state of being, is called a celibate stage, but what is the sexuality if the person desires sexual contact... but is not attracted to a gender

[newporter4u]

so called straight men that wants sex with other men arent straight!!! simple!! they call themself straight but actually if you want sex whether it be topping, bottoming or getting your cock sucked, it is bi!! face it, you enjoy it. i enjoy playing with another mans cock and enjoy receiving anal sex with a hot hard cock and that makes me bi. i dont get into the intimate aspects as kissing, cuddling and other stuff but still like to please a man with my mouth or ass.

I have to agree with Maxtor. I reserve the kissing, cuddling, etc. for women.

As for those not having sex, while they may be celibate, at that time, their sexuality can be decided by whom they desire. If it is both sexes then they are bi, if it is limited to one or the other they are either straight or gay.

[biguycancun]

... but actually if you want sex whether it be topping, bottoming or getting your cock sucked, it is bi!!....

While I agree that straight men who want sex with men are not straight, I'll question your calling them bi. Your post doesn't mention women at all, so don't you mean gay and not bi?

LDD's and NEPHX's dissections are very interesting to ponder. Note that they both contain references to the opposite sex. I've known men who label themselves bisexual who have had nothing to do with women for decades. One would think that if they had the "desires" mentioned that there would be the occasional male-female encounter in their sex lives.

Personally I think they label themselves as bi in an attempt at self denial of their "gayness", somehow deriving comfort from the idea that they can claim an attraction to the opposite sex while actually never going there at all.

It's a pity that being "gay" in many places still carries the stigma that it does and while the mouth breathers who openly scorn gay men (and women) are vociferous in their hate, they're so far down the developmental chain that they've yet to consider or even understand bisexuality. Identifying as bi may be a safe place; anonymous and ignored as opposed to openly defiled. I could see why one might chose the label.

[Realist]

NEPX wrote:

"There are many men that just want to have sex - with anyone. They will "top" a guy. They want to be "serviced" or have they cock sucked, etc. Eventually, as they get more experience, they might venture into the other roles too and get more sensual about it (my observation)."

That is certainly my experience!

At 14, all I wanted was to be serviced, as often as my seducer would. That same year, I had another encounter. Still the same attitude ensued; I would take all he would give.

Then, my third sexual connection began as before, but quickly escalated to more! I fell in LOVE! Immaturity, inexperience, and ignorance aside, I was as close to being in love as a kid can be. Everything we did was magnified into a ecstatic level.

Then, I wanted to give as good as I got. In fact, although I did have a few relationships with guys that weren't deeply romantic, I never again felt the way I did in the beginning.

We kissed, reveled in touching, and the very sight of each other created erections! I felt as much need to please, as I did to be pleased. It was fantastic, but I was to learn that relationships like that are rare, indeed.

By the time I had my first MF relationship, at 15, I knew I had to care/love that person, if I was going to get the best from that union.

You can have your one night stands, sex with strangers, a quick orgasm.... then go! I'll take tenderness, caring, and love any day, over that.

We each have our own needs and desires. I know what I like, but do not condemn others for their own idiosyncrasies.

It's all about doing "our thing" in the end.

[Darkside2009]

Deep in a wooded glade in Ireland, two Leprachauns are sitting on toadstools discussing the events of the day,

'Here, Seamus, Have you seen what this Kiwi Fella says?'

(reads aloud)

... what is the sexuality of a person not having sex with anybody ?

(Seamus thinks for a moment) I think he'd either be dead, or living in Ireland with Roisin's Mother.

(reads some more)

'the state of being, is called a celibate stage, but what is the sexuality if the person desires sexual contact... but is not attracted to a gender?'

'Well, I like geese me-self, but I wouldn't want to shag one of them'

'I'm thinkin' you'd better lock up the goat if ever he comes a courtin', he sounds like Father O' Brien, always on about sex organs. Sure you can only play one organ at a time, what the Hell would you want six for?'

(Sigh) 'You know Seamus, sometimes I don't know why I bother talking to you'

[cornholejoe]

straight men will not have sex with another man in the last 2 years i have found most men are bi and most of them are married because they crave sex they cant get at home :cool:

[DuckiesDarling]

This will probably cause trouble but when have I have ever backed away? :tongue: So if you are offended... don't read below.










Straight, bi, gay... men are the same. Sex is sex, a hole is a hole and when they aren't getting what they want they will take what they get.

[elian]

then what is the sexuality of a person not having sex with anybody ?

I have been accused of being "asexual" before, mostly by people who misread my signals since I have to pretend to be in the closet half the time. I don't figure I'm asexual at all - if anything I dwell on it too much but mastrubation tends to take the "edge" off so I don't get in the condition that DD describes. I think Eddie Murphy does some interesting comedy about men and sex in his "Delirious" show. http://www.script-o-rama.com/movie_scripts/e/eddie-murphy-delirious-script-transcript.html

DD, I think what you say has some truth - a lot of men have been trained to take what they want. They may unconsciously do it or some of it may be deliberate, depending on the circumstances. Also, hormones can be a bitch - although that's no excuse for SOME behavior regardless of your preference.

(I just read some of the delirious transcript - he talks about gay people in a derrogatory way, but the fact that he's even bringing up gay people and AIDS in the 80's was probably pretty daring at the time. People did NOT talk openly about gays and lesbians on the media back THEN the way that they do NOW. As much as I don't like the word, I thought the show was still pretty funny - I guess some awareness is better than silence on the issue.)

[Long Duck Dong]

lol elian..... asexuality is something many people confuse with celibacy....

asexuals lack the sexual desire and arousal aspect .... so yes asexuals can masturbate and have sex but they gain nothing from sex, no pleasure or satisfaction

menopausal or hormonally inbalanced females can become asexual, yet have sex with their partners, just to get some peace and quiet....lol

celibacy is the absence of sexual contact and connection and often a choice that is made and the sexual drive and desires are surpressed

Asexuals, while typically lacking in sexual desire for either sex, may engage in purely emotional romantic relationships.

aromantic: lack of romantic attraction towards anyone of any gender
biromantic: romantic attraction towards person(s) of either gender
heteroromantic: romantic attraction towards person(s) of the opposite gender
homoromantic: romantic attraction towards person(s) of the same gender
panromantic: romantic attraction towards person(s) of any gender or lack of gender
transromantic: romantic attraction towards person(s) of variant or ambiguous gender
polyromantic: romantic attraction towards person(s) of more than one gender or sex but without implying, as biromantic does, that there are only two genders or sexes

lol as you can see.. the world of sexuality is not limited to 3 sexualities, its far greater and more complex than the average person knows.......

it may make sense as to why I refer to myself as currently a asexual celibate bisexual.... they are all different aspects of my life

[indenver_indenver]

I've been bisexual all my life since playing doctor with the little girls and swapping cock sucking favors with the boys. It wasn't until I was in my late teens that a well hung buddy had me discover that I was a hopeless sub cocksucker. Now in my senior years, I am married to a woman who finds my bi side very erotic. I keep my bi life discrete. No friends, neighbors or family know. I like it that way. It keeps my sex life simple. I have no guilt whatsoever.

But, here is what I have found over the years. Most all my partners who enjoy my excellent oral skills have been married and their wives don't know about thier alter life. So many married (STRAIGHT) men are dying to have their cocks sucked and someone who enjoys swallowing their cum.

Thank heavens for so many wives who don't take care of their husband's cocks. And, the best ones are the ones who became friends of mine. The sex if torid! The "kids" who advertise on craigslist for blow-and-go just don't know that they are missing.

[Realist]

Interesting, LDD

From your descriptions, I am a biromantic, not just a plain-Jane bisexual! I have always preferred to be in a caring/loving relationship, rather than a platonic one.

[ErosUrge]

I've been bisexual all my life since playing doctor with the little girls and swapping cock sucking favors with the boys. It wasn't until I was in my late teens that a well hung buddy had me discover that I was a hopeless sub cocksucker. Now in my senior years, I am married to a woman who finds my bi side very erotic. I keep my bi life discrete. No friends, neighbors or family know. I like it that way. It keeps my sex life simple. I have no guilt whatsoever.

But, here is what I have found over the years. Most all my partners who enjoy my excellent oral skills have been married and their wives don't know about thier alter life. So many married (STRAIGHT) men are dying to have their cocks sucked and someone who enjoys swallowing their cum.

Thank heavens for so many wives who don't take care of their husband's cocks. And, the best ones are the ones who became friends of mine. The sex if torid! The "kids" who advertise on craigslist for blow-and-go just don't know that they are missing.

Your reply reflects many of my feelings about this subject, though not all. I too have been bi all my life and have experienced the same thing concerning men who call themselves straight but are all too ready to have their cocks sucked regardless of what gender is doing it. Yet there are many more who prefer a man doing it usually (not always of course) since most men (not all of course) are often more skilled at it. And once they get their satisfaction, zip up, and are on their way to return back to their women....and still define themselves as straight. I use to find that a bit perplexing but doesn't concern me anymore. In essence I suppose they are straight, but the act itself with a man is with a man and that part of it can't be denied. There are many men who define themselves as straight simply because they are on the receiving end and never participate in giving orally to a man...some do as we all know, but many don't. And as you described, it allows for those of us men who love to give orally a satisfaction as these men are usually very passionate and in need of oral relief that they aren't getting at home.
As far as getting into defining what is and isn't, that is such a complex matter. I am always saying I am bi, but my definition of it is different from others who define themselves as bi. Some believe that to be truly bi, one has to have emotional as well as physical interests in both sexes and others like myself say that we have only emotional interests in one gender but sexual interests in both. I think the beauty of bisexuality is that there are so many different aspects to it all.
As time goes by though, I feel that it would be so much better if we could just get past the labels. We're all sexual creatures regardless of what our preferences are. And the truth is, we're all here because of the sexual act...at least the interaction between opposites. To take this a step further, a woman gives birth to both sexes but it's the male's sperm that determines which sex the child will be...in that sense, we're all bi...lol.....dunno.....just rambling but I've always loved thinking about that.

[NjbiGuy01]

I think it comes down to labels and perception. How you see yourself, and how you want others to see you. Personally, I think some people simply don't want to be labeled as "gay' "straight" "bi" or whatever. Just like a woman being bi or playing with other women (in private swing environments or Madonna swapping spit with Britney on stage), is somehow "ok". When (or if two men do something like that (or more), whether in public or private, it's usually called disgusting.

I never cease to be amazed by bi women who shun bi men in swinger circles. I find it odd that a woman is open-minded enough to play with a woman or swing with a couple, but acts like a bi man is a Leper ! It's also interesting how many couples post profiles with "straight" male halves who are actually bi or open to it. They got flack from other members on the website about him being bi...again, your are open-minded enough to swing, but cannot accept bi men ?!

I live a traditional "straight life". I have a wife, a business, two kids, and nobody would know nor suspect I enjoy sex with men. It's usually with another MF couple, or with a select few sensual massage therapists I see a few times a year on the DL.

[12voltman59]

A thread like this once again goes back to a point I continually try to make---that the terms we use now like gay, bisexual, hetersexual, etc---have some utility--but they are all also very narrow and limiting.

We do need to move from beyond our currently used labeling system that expresses the range of human sexuality.

When it comes to the thing of "well--when a guy--no matter what he calls himself has sex with another guy---he just has to admit it--he is GAY and that is that"---to me this is just about one of the biggest BS things going.

I can say that when it comes down to it in my life---I never really ever was purely heterosexual--I did know though that I was not also gay---I was something in between both of those "either/or" definitions.

As I have said before----I have come to the conclusion that when it comes to the way we in the western world define what it is to be a gay man---other than the fact that I do like to have and greatly enjoy sex with other males---and even if I never have sex with another female the rest of my days--only having sex with other guys and even coming to have a long term sexual and romantic relationship with one--I will NEVER, EVER be gay---because the sexual aspect of "being gay" is only a very small part of what it is to be a gay male. The only thing I do have in common with gay males is that I do like to have sex and even emotional intimacy with other guys--but that is the only similarity I have with them.

As limiting of a term that "bisexuality" is----for me---it is the term that does best describe what I am in terms of my sexual nature.

[IndyBiFun]

Am I in the minority? Contrary to Maxtor, I absolutely enjoy cuddling and kissing another guy. Just as with a female, it has the be someone that attracts me.

A toe curling kiss with either gender is one of life's simple pleasures. At least for me.

[elian]

A thread like this once again goes back to a point I continually try to make---that the terms we use now like gay, bisexual, hetersexual, etc---have some utility--but they are all also very narrow and limiting.

Yeah, I know it's best not to label at all - I've told myself that. As you may know people go through emotional cycles. Every once in a while I still feel shame - label or not the potential thought of society rejecting me for something like wanting to love (or lusting after) after another human being hits home.

Thanks for the thoughts everyone.

[DuckiesDarling]

Typical ignorant reply from an even more ignorant hetero female who knows nothing about human sexuality.

If a guy is actually heterosexual or straight and he's not having sex with women or having luck finding a female sexual partner he's not going to go out and try to find men to have sex with.

They may go to a female prostitute, they may go home and jerk off to their hetero or lesbian porn, or they may get drunk and try to pick up slutty loose women at bars or dance clubs but actual hetero/straight men don't go out and seek out male sexual partners even if they strike out at all of these things and finding female sexual partners.

I have never met an actual heterosexual or straight man who has actually wanted to have sex with a man or who had sex with a man (aside from non-consensual sex), looked for a male sexual partner when a woman was not available, and if a person is actually heterosexual or straight they are not going to have any sexual attraction at all to the same gender or seek out the same gender for sex when they're not getting any.

Then you have idiots who want to claim that people who are "bi-curious" or "heteroflexible" are something somehow completely different than being bisexual but that is not true as these are just other terms for being bisexual that people use to actually avoid admitting to themselves and others that they're not heterosexual and that they are bisexual.

So you know lots of prisoners who had sex with other males with and without their consent? So call anyone an idiot you want, I suck, and then remember that you did need to look in the mirror as well. Have a nice day :)

[Long Duck Dong]

Typical ignorant reply from an even more ignorant hetero female who knows nothing about human sexuality.

If a guy is actually heterosexual or straight and he's not having sex with women or having luck finding a female sexual partner he's not going to go out and try to find men to have sex with.

They may go to a female prostitute, they may go home and jerk off to their hetero or lesbian porn, or they may get drunk and try to pick up slutty loose women at bars or dance clubs but actual hetero/straight men don't go out and seek out male sexual partners even if they strike out at all of these things and finding female sexual partners.

I have never met an actual heterosexual or straight man who has actually wanted to have sex with a man or who had sex with a man (aside from non-consensual sex), looked for a male sexual partner when a woman was not available, and if a person is actually heterosexual or straight they are not going to have any sexual attraction at all to the same gender or seek out the same gender for sex when they're not getting any.

Then you have idiots who want to claim that people who are "bi-curious" or "heteroflexible" are something somehow completely different than being bisexual but that is not true as these are just other terms for being bisexual that people use to actually avoid admitting to themselves and others that they're not heterosexual and that they are bisexual.

the experts are the ones that disagree with you, they are the ones that do the studies and find the differences between different people

ask yourself this..... do you use the kinsey scale, or do you just call yourself, bisexual, gay or hetero..... cos if you use the kinsey scale you are using the same type of psycho analysis that you are arguing against

[_someone_]

Actually, the idea of liking certain sexual aspects with one sex and other aspects with the other seems pretty common from a lot of people I know. I don't know that those would all identify themselves as "straight" though.

Attraction is both and emotional and a physical thing, but I couldn't get in a relationship with someone who lacked the former. It's complicated that things are not always 100% consistent in the feelings with both sexes.

Somewhat in line of the topic, I oftentimes don't really find myself emotionally attached to guys in the way that women are for me, but some of the physical sides of things work more the other way for me. In fact, there's been times where I have checked out people of my same sex, not caring what people would think, though the most predictable things came out of it. But when a good looking woman catches my eye, that doesn't stop me either. But there's also many who either believe bisexuality does not exist or is for indiscriminate horny types.

then there's stuff like awkward fetishes ;) that can go beyond the orientation.

[Long Duck Dong]

correct, I suck.... but most men that have sex with men, state they are not sexually attracted to other men either....

its like the kinsey scale.... you ID as a mostly gay male ... but you are not gay, you have sex with females....

however that doesn't mean that you are sexually attracted to females, it means you can have sex with a female but given the chance, you perfer the contact with other males....

so what is correct... are you a gay male that has sex with females, a bisexual that perfers males and has sex with females or a bisexual that is attracted to males and females sexually but perfers males .....

by your defination, you should not be refering to yourself as a mostly gay male, only a bisexual male as you have sex with males and females, regardless of whom you are more attracted to......

[sixthickcut]

buy an inflatable doll
there is no emotional baggage
if it pisses u off just quietly deflate it and go to the bar and find another
:)

[ErosUrge]

my my, so many different view points on all of this....

I suppose I like the idea of being able to define to some degree what my sexuality is. I'm comfortable with calling myself bi since I do love sex with both sexes so much. The experience just happens to be different with each for different reasons. I can find sexual ecstasy with either sex, but no doubt that when I am with a woman that means so much to me, the intensity of it all is increased for various reasons....yet, it is much more complicated than the experience with a male.
For that reason being with men sexually appeals to me because there is nothing else about the moment except sex.
"Straight" men who have sex with men???....really???....straight?....
well, they might feel and believe they're straight because they only receive orally or top and don't submit to receive anally, but I would argue there is a surrender to have the experience with a male just the same though it be just for fulfilling a hunger they're not getting with a woman...

[jackbirdjay]

Back before I got married in the 70's early to mid 80's. I use to cross dress fully all the time. I had my own place and hosted many older married guys that just wanted to get off because of the sexless marriage they were in. About 80% were straight. They wouldn't touch my cock but would fuck me or have me give them a BJ. They told me they perfer women but since none where around they just needed to get off. So it dose happen more than u thunk.

[elian]

buy an inflatable doll
there is no emotional baggage
if it pisses u off just quietly deflate it and go to the bar and find another
:)

I thought about buying a six-pack of them for the carpool lane. <smiles>

[jem_is_bi]

I know I am in the minority. But, I don't have a problem with a guy indentifying as heterosexual if he only receives rather than gives male-to-male sex. I need to have it go both ways before, I bestow the title of bisexual, which I am happy to be.

[bluesky55]

So my girlfriend had to work tonight and here I am reading the writings of mostly men that like to suck cock. Some are trying to justify it to themselves or others. Then there are those that feel a need to label or define it from their viewpoint. Then there are the women either defending, chastising or arguing for no reason at all.

I see some validity in each ones comments, but probably lean more towards the belief that if you are a man that likes or desires to have sex with men, you are not straight. At the same time I'm sorry, but I just don't buy into that Kinsey BS cited by LDD. If you feel a need to go on about a degree of bi-ness by saying that you (or you believe someone else) is mostly a gay male, but has sex with… etc., etc., then you probably can't say that someone lives north of you. They live east north east or north north west or whatever degree of north you need to define on your compass.

I was raised in a puritanical lifestyle where anything of a sexual nature that involved members of the same sex or groups where same sex contact even incidentally occurred was strictly taboo even to talk about. I suppressed a curiosity over the male anatomy as I grew up but had the occasional boy boy situations like the real circle jerk. I was equally fascinated with the female anatomy as well. As I look back now, i had instances then with classmates that I really enjoyed. To this day I still remember the first time I sucked a friends cock at 14 and him mine. I really liked it then and I really like it now. I suppressed those urges for many years and now wish that maybe I hadn't. I was married for over 20 years and never cheated on my wife. I was still married when I got my first bi-porn video that only came out when she was away. Still, I never strayed even as curious as I was. I even dated women exclusively for 5 or 6 years after I was divorced. Finally curiosity got the best of me. I wasn't worried about labeling myself straight or bi at the time. I didn't tell myself that "I'm straight but I want to have sex with a man." Finally with my continued curiosity and for lack of knowledge, I thought of myself as bi-curious and went out to have my 1st time with a long time bi-guy that I met online.

Since then I've had the opportunity to enjoy men while still enjoying women. I don't "do" one to maintain a reputation as straight. I have sex with women because I love sex with women. I have sex with men because I love sex with men. I can have wild sex with my girlfriend and then crave cock. I can be with a man for a couple days and have some great experiences only to then crave pussy. Sexually I am Bi !!! I really can get excited no matter what my hand finds inside the pants, even though very few know that. There are some I long to tell but don't. I don't care about labels but I do believe that if you're a man and have sex with men and women, you are bisexual (or at least bi-curious). If you have a partner that likes to have sex with members of the same sex and you can accept that, you're awesome. If you have a partner that accepts the fact that you enjoy sex with members of the same sex, they're awesome. I'm just going to leave it at that and continue to enjoy having sex with men and women, no matter what someone else thinks.

[ErosUrge]

bluesky55:

Since then I've had the opportunity to enjoy men while still enjoying women. I don't "do" one to maintain a reputation as straight. I have sex with women because I love sex with women. I have sex with men because I love sex with men. I can have wild sex with my girlfriend and then crave cock. I can be with a man for a couple days and have some great experiences only to then crave pussy. Sexually I am Bi !!! I really can get excited no matter what my hand finds inside the pants, even though very few know that. There are some I long to tell but don't. I don't care about labels but I do believe that if you're a man and have sex with men and women, you are bisexual (or at least bi-curious). If you have a partner that likes to have sex with members of the same sex and you can accept that, you're awesome. If you have a partner that accepts the fact that you enjoy sex with members of the same sex, they're awesome. I'm just going to leave it at that and continue to enjoy having sex with men and women, no matter what someone else thinks.

hear! hear!.....very well put

[Long Duck Dong]

sexually you are bisexual but romantically what are you....

thats why the kinsey scale is numbered, it factors in the romantic attraction along with the sexual attraction.. and the romantic factor for bisexuals is covered by the mostly gay, mostly hetero or equal aspect..... cos lets face it, not all bisexuals are equal in their attractions.....

so yeah I feel sorry for all the people that use the kinsey scale as a quick and simple form of showing their romantic and sexual attractions, they should stick to long sentences and posts to define themselves, rather than a quick and simple scale...... cos as you put it, its kinsey bs,... and so what must matter in life, is who you will fuck, not who you will love..... and yes I am being mildly sarcastic there

[drugstore cowboy]

a lot of them have a attraction to one gender and a desire for one gender.... and a inequal attraction / desire to the other gender..... and will often talk about the issues of not fulfilling their needs to suck cock....

a man that has sex with men, has the attraction to one gender... and a desire for contact and interaction with the other gender.... and do not have issues if they are not sucking a cock.... the fulfillment is not in the sexual act, its in the contact with the other person on many levels...

so a bisexual that says they are attracted to both genders, is telling the truth.... and a man that says he desires sex with both genders, but is heterosexual, is also telling the truth

a bisexual that says that they are attracted to a woman and desires to suck a males cock only... is not actually a bisexual, they are a man that has sex with other men.... and a man that says he is attracted to both genders and enjoys sex with both genders, is actually a bisexual.....

LongDuck you're the last person on this site who should be saying how someone is somehow not bisexual.

You're asexual and not bisexual or pansexual at all despite falsely claiming both pansexual and bisexual as labels when it's just convenient for you. You're neither since you're asexual.

Just because a guy only wants to get sucked off by another man that does not somehow make him "straight" or "heterosexual" since if he actually was hetero or straight to begin with he wouldn't be having sex with men even cross dressers and transvestites even when he couldn't find a woman or his girlfriend or wife was not putting out.

There are men who are bisexual and yes even gay who just want to get sucked and don't want to reciprocate oral sex or give it to a man. This does not somehow make them any less bisexual or gay.

Guys who have sex with men yet claim that they are "straight" are in complete denial about their actual sexuality which is either bisexual or gay, and are a major danger since they usually bash and beat up the bisexual or gay man.

I've had sex with lots of men over the years. Most were gay, a fair amount have been bisexual but none of them are or were heterosexual or straight at all.

[Long Duck Dong]

I am explaining to others how people can come to the understanding of how they see their sexuality...

I think I have pointed that out to you a number of times, and you still fail to understand that sexuality is not defined by being sexually active, its defined by attraction.... asexuality is a state of being, not a attraction.....

if a person chooses to use a sexuality label, its their choice, you are the one trying to tell people what label they should be using, not me...

I do find it interesting how you define yourself as mostly gay, and say you are bisexual... why define yourself when as you say, there is gay, hetero and bisexual, no in between... unless of course you are defining your level of attraction and desire, the same way the people do, that you are saying, are wrong....

have a nice day / night....

[drugstore cowboy]

I do find it interesting how you define yourself as mostly gay, and say you are bisexual... why define yourself when as you say, there is gay, hetero and bisexual, no in between... unless of course you are defining your level of attraction and desire, the same way the people do, that you are saying, are wrong....

have a nice day / night....

So what?

I'm somehow not bisexual enough for you? Based on your standards and definitions people who are not a 3 or equal on the Kinsey scale but who are 4-5 on the scale are somehow not bisexual. :rolleyes:

I can fall in love with men and women.

I'm more sexually attracted to men, yet I am sexually attracted to women as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kinsey_Scale.gif

[Long Duck Dong]

So what?

I'm somehow not bisexual enough for you? Based on your standards and definitions people who are not a 3 or equal on the Kinsey scale but who are 4-5 on the scale are somehow not bisexual. :rolleyes:

I can fall in love with men and women.

I'm more sexually attracted to men, yet I am sexually attracted to women as well.

roflmao not bisexual enuf ??? snorts... I am not the one stating who is allowed to use the label bisexual....

I have had sex with both genders many times over the years, I have a attraction to a male friend and a female partner, I last had sex 2 years ago cos I am asexual and I ID correctly as pansexual cos I develop attactions to trans gender and intersex people

simple and bluntly, cowboy, you are as bisexual as you want to be, be it romantically / sexually / platonically... and the world will always be full of people that we bitch about for trying to tell us that our sexuality is wrong cos they say so, while we tell others their sexuality is wrong....

so if both of us are not bisexual or bisexual enuf to be here... the rest of the site has a problem cos they are not bisexual or bisexual enuf to be here either..... and I am not stupid enuf to start telling people if they should be here or not.... I leave that job to drew.....

[justlooking222]

Straight, bi, gay... men are the same.
Sex is sex, a hole is a hole and when they aren't getting what they want they will take what they get.

....does this include your b/friend duckies ? :rolleyes:

[tenni]

....does this include your b/friend duckies ? :rolleyes:


no he is a saintly, mentally ill (according to him) bi asexual (according to him).... One who has "expert" opinions on most things about other people who are sexual beings (unlike him).

[DuckiesDarling]

....does this include your b/friend duckies ? :rolleyes:

It includes all men who are looking for sex, Justlooking. *smiles sweetly*

[Darkside2009]

Tenni.

Every thread, every opportunity, you have an outburst or personal attack against either LDD or DD.

You are just back today after an absence of several days and your first post is another personal attack on the same person. Frankly, it has gone way past being silly, and I for one am sick of listening to these stupid, venomous, comments.

I'm sure others are too, and appealing to your better nature hasn't worked. So until you learn some manners, and stop behaving as though you were a petulant child, or until Drew bans you, whichever comes sooner, I am putting you on ignore.

I can only suggest that others, as irritated by your behaviour as I am, follow my example.

[littlerayofsunshine]

Tenni.

Every thread, every opportunity, you have an outburst or personal attack against either LDD or DD.

You are just back today after an absence of several days and your first post is another personal attack on the same person. Frankly, it has gone way past being silly, and I for one am sick of listening to these stupid, venomous, comments.

I'm sure others are too, and appealing to your better nature hasn't worked. So until you learn some manners, and stop behaving as though you were a petulant child, or until Drew bans you, whichever comes sooner, I am putting you on ignore.

I can only suggest that others, as irritated by your behaviour as I am, follow my example.


https://cdn2.content.compendiumblog.com/uploads/user/b8bbc9ab-67b1-4a8e-ac5c-5811daa967bd/7cb46e13-4ccd-4f4d-b53b-268da9c29b3e/Image/94bc00c53a05199d6a2e3d4adf3b7cfb/everybody_likes_this.jpg

[rdy2go]

This will probably cause trouble but when have I have ever backed away? :tongue: So if you are offended... don't read below.










Straight, bi, gay... men are the same. Sex is sex, a hole is a hole and when they aren't getting what they want they will take what they get.Nope, on this I am sure, If you don't want to put you dick someplace you won't. If all men subscribed to your theory no opening would be safe, guys would be fucking anything, and it just ain't so! Curious is one thing, but not all guys will act on that curiosity. I did, and it did noothing for me! However, saying that I am a firm beleiver that before passing an opinion give it a whirl, at least then somebody can speak from experience, and be honest.:2cents:

[Bicuriousity]

Overall i dont think anyone who has sex with men is straight, they are either vi or gay.

However, i do think there are a certain number of men who arent having their sexual needs met who turn to men. Many years ago i was on vacation and talking to a girl and somehow the topic of gay guys came up and also if guys were bi. At the time i hadnt beem with a guy yet and didnt identify with being bi yet alhough i had had fantasies. In any event it was her thought thst some guys go bi or gsy due to lack of opportunities wih women or social awkwardness with women. While i can see this being the case in a very small fraction of cases, id argue that most bi and gay men are more succesful with women and could have ample opportunities. I know tons of women who throw themselves at my gay friends and would definitely sleep with them if the guy had interest...

[tenni]

"They are interested in the sexual contact with other men. They are working through issues of father hunger, lack of touch from other males, and the need for contact with other men on deeper levels that women enjoy with each other and men do not. Some of these men tell me they meet other men and really just want to be held and talk to the other men, but that the men they meet want it to be sexual, so they go through with it but really don't want to. Ironically, since men are not allowed to touch—except for a pat on the butt in sports—they use the sexual realm to find ways to touch each other and receive touch."

Ok..this may be a little muddled thinking but.....

I think that the quote above highlights some of the thoughts that Elian has mentioned. I agree with the quote based on myself and my own experiences. I also agree with Voltie about the labelling by others than ourselves as being tricky. Once a guy self identifies as bisexual or even gay and moves his own labelling away from straight/hetero, then the rest of us should accept it. If he wants to refer to himself as "straight" who really should care?

The above quote gives lots of reasons why a man may have these needs/attraction to other men and men tend to react more physically than emotionally.

Bisexuality is defined as a sexual attraction to both genders. It further is defined as an emotional or physical attraction. It may be either or both. The word "romantic" is being thrown about in this discussion and that may be taking it down a road that a lot of men would find great difficulty accepting due to societal norms as how guys should relate to each other. They may indeed have emotional needs/attractions but to self identify these emotional attraction/needs is much more stressful. It is easier to state that you just want your cock sucked or suck a cock without having to analyse or accept the possibility of an emotional need from other men.

I agree with Bicuriousity and the quote at the top as to reasons why some men turn to other men. I'm not sure but suspect that the number who are just fed up with women's behaviour and the changing society expectations may be greater than he gives credit though. It is more likely a generational thing perhaps...lol

Where I clearly have difficulty is when someone begins to judge and condemn others based on their own perspective and experiences but we all may be inclined to do that whether we are straight or whatever. It is when we condemn others without walking in their shoes that we may get into trouble. This happens a lot on this site and particularly those on the Kinsey scale closer to having a lower number judging /interpreting behaviour/thoughts of those with higher numbers imo. In an entire lifetime, many people may move from being exclusively heterosexual behaviour to same sex behaviour attraction. I think that contemporary men may generally being moving towards a greater need for same sex interaction as they mature but I may be wrong and it only applies to myself or my generation. Things change societally and I have no idea if younger men are less restricted in accepting emotional (for lack of a better word) interaction with other men.

If a man is sexual or asexual that certainly colours how he perceive the world. If they have no strong sexual drive it just seems quite different from discussing whether a man's sexual behaviour is straight or not. I think that this impacts our perspective of others and perhaps ourselves maybe more than being straight, bi or gay. It is just an entirely different kettle of fish with its own issues that are so far removed from sexual beings imo.

It seems to get all mixed up when we move from the physical to the emotional aspects of sexuality in men. It seems to me that sexual beings are the ones who can experience complexity much more so than asexual beings but I may be wrong cuz I'm interpreting from a sexual being's perspective. This may be particularly true more so for men than women. As the article states it is fine with society for Katy Perry to say she kissed a girl...no male singer has had a hit saying he kissed a guy and liked it...lol To move from calling yourself "straight" who likes his cock sucked by another man to "I like to kiss a man and I need emotional and sexual physical contact with other men is a big leap that society doesn't accept...yet. How can individuals not experience difficulty then self identifying away from labelling yourself straight?

[Pasadenacpl2]

I will not claim to have any answers about the spectrum of sexuality labels. But, I do have a problem with the title of this thread. If a man has sex with another man (willingly), he isn't straight. I won't say he's bi, or gay or make any attempt to foist a label upon them. But, whatever he is..it's not straight.

Pasa

[Realist]

Like Pasadina, I'm not one to label folks.

But, as a life-long bisexual man, I've always considered it odd when a person could be stimulated, aroused, and have orgasms with someone of the same gender, but still proclaim their straightness!

I can remember two guys and one woman who had that attitude. Each one felt that, since they did not reciprocate with the person giving them pleasure, they remained straight!

One guy, who could not achieve an orgasm with his wife, would erupt any time a friend gave him a BJ.

But, mind you, in his mind, he was NOT gay/bi!

Whatever works, I guess.

[Gearbox]

I've heard how gay/bi friends have sucked straight blokes cocks lots of times.:rolleyes:
I suppose that might make sense if they were thinking about women at the time. As they do when they masturbate with their male hands.:bigrin:

But if their thinking about the man that's sucking their cock....?

[Wolf_Sr]

Straight men? Does this really exist? It is largely a question of opportunity and if not opportunity, immagination. The mere fantasies about the same sex already change everything isn't it? We are all at least bi-sexual.

[elian]

I think I'd say that there's always just plain human curiosity, people who are straight might experiment a few times, or be drunk a few times and try sex with the same gender. I wouldn't label someone who has sex with same gender once or twice bi or gay.

I agree and echo a lot of the sentiments here, if a gay has feelings for another guy, either romantic or otherwise I wish it wouldn't be shameful to admit those feelings exist.

Some friendships last a long time and run deep, and yet still I think a lot of guys are not secure enough to actually say the words "I love you" to a same sex friend, even if there's no lust involved. Of course, they usually find other ways to show it, but sometimes I wish people could just come out and say it without having to feel fear or shame.

[maxtor]

they are not straight,,,,only in name only...like Rhino in DC.

[Pasadenacpl2]

Straight men? Does this really exist? It is largely a question of opportunity and if not opportunity, immagination. The mere fantasies about the same sex already change everything isn't it? We are all at least bi-sexual.


This I cannot agree with, and is just as inflammatory as saying that a lesbian is a lesbian because she has just not met the right man.

Pasa

[Long Duck Dong]

misunderstanding of men that have sex with men, has a lot to do with the * I am therefore they are * type thinking.... and simple and bluntly, we apply the way we think, desire and want sex with men, to the men that have sex with men.... and cos we can not understand them or relate to them, we fall back on what we know and apply that.....

many bisexual males are attracted to other males, they find pleasure and enjoyment out of being with other males and most often, its sexual.....
men that have sex with men, often do not go with other men for the reasons we do... yet what they do and why they do it, is not that different to what a lot of bisexuals do

as a asexual person ( lacking a sex drive ) with a number of years of past sexual experience, I can relate pretty well to men that have sex with men, and how its very possible to fuck somebody just for the sexual release...

much of it comes down to the fact that they do not relate to the other person as another male, they see them as a person and in a sense, gender void.... most bisexuals see the other person in terms of genitalia and how they would love to fuck that ass, suck that cock, eat that pussy, which is something you see a lot of in this site.....

its a bit like the old saying * even ugly girls can get laid if the lights stay off * and yeah when you stop thinking about the person you are having sex with.. you can pretty much fuck anybody...

most men that have sex with men, have a neutral attraction... or in simple terms they are not attracted to other men, something that we all understand as the person beside us that we know but feel nothing towards, yet we would fuck the brains out of the person on the other side of us......

we tend to think of attraction in terms of you are attracted to a gender and the idea of sex with them or you have no interest and are repulsed by the idea.... neutral attraction males are not attracted to other males, but nor are they repulsed by the idea of sex with other males.... it simply doesn't registar.... its simply casual sex with a person with the * lights turned off *

it makes a lot of sense to me as I am asexual ( lacking a sex drive ) I can have sex with people, but there is no * pressure or craving * in me to go have sex with other people... which makes me different to a male that has sex with men, as they have a sex drive, just a neutral attraction personality

so why do they ID as straight... cos its fits the defination of straight, they are attracted to the opposite gender.... they have no attraction to other males.... other males are just people to have sex with and walk away, without many of the * issues * like commitment, fear of pregnancy, clingy women, dating etc etc
many bisexual males that engage in casual sex will know that its no different to what they do... they want the casual sex, no strings attached aspect as well as their primary relationship / marriage with their wives / GF's

[tenni]

"..most men that have sex with men, have a neutral attraction... or in simple terms they are not attracted to other men, something that we all understand as the person beside us that we know but feel nothing towards, yet we would fuck the brains out of the person on the other side of us......

I can see the difference in thinking between sexual beings and asexual beings with these statements. Actually, most men (sexual beings) have a physical sexual attraction whether it be for women or men while asexuals do not have a sexual attraction to either men or women. For some sexual men is not a "neutral attraction" as much as lacking "emotional attraction" towards other men according to AVEN(Asexual Visibility and Education Network http://www.asexuality.org/home/overview.html
).

The sexual men are capable of having sex with men to either fulfill their sexual urges or reduce their drive impulse. Asexuals just do not get horny while sexual men do. AVEN also states that asexuals may masturbate though and separates that act from sexual attraction. Sexual men may not necessarily connect the physical sexual act with their emotional needs at all whether the sex is with men or women. Even for a man who considers himself "straight" he may be willing to participate in a sexual act with another man to reduce his sexual drive needs while an asexual does not have this urge and may not comprehend what it is to be a sexual being. The sexual man may have a sexual attraction to a body part (cock) but not the other body parts (face etc.) or any emotional love attraction to the individual. Even if they say they "love cock" they may mean that they are physically sexually aroused by cock not that they have an emotional attraction to other men. An asexual man would probably not comprehend this sexual attraction. Some asexuals may have emotional needs or call these needs as "romantic drive" or a need for emotional intimacy. AVEN states that "most asexuals do not make the connection between love and "sex"(physical act). Sexual being men are capable of separating emotional love from the physical sex act and need to reduce their sexual pressure while asexual men do not. "Emotional and romantic attraction are separate from sexual attraction" according to AVEN.
http://www.asexuality.org/home/general.html#def2

Although a straight man probably would not participate in same sex activity the sex drive may over ride this if females are not available (ie prison etc.) Usually, a straight man would revert back to being sexually aroused by women and not men. It may become a "chicken or egg" argument as to whether the so called straight man was really straight or bi if he continues same sex activity when women are available again though. He may have "acquired a taste for cock"...lol He may have not acquired an "emotional attraction" to other men though as sexual attraction is not the same thing.

[Bicuriousity]

I think in some cultures, men believe that if they receive oral or top that they are still straight. I have heard is story from some Mexican friends for instance.

The other issue is a number of married men who are in sexless marriages finally find its time to act on their curiousity.

Either case theymare bi and we should welcome them into the community! But often they are afraid and scared as many of us were early in our bisexual experimentation days.

[bihardman]

pardon me, but there is no such thing as a "straight bi person". the term is laughable. if you have a relationship with either or both sexes, you are bisexual. period. if i`ve offended anyone with my rhetoric, i`m sorry.

[Papelucho]

This is how I would explain myself:

I'm a sort of bisexual in that I enjoy intimacy with both men and women, but in different ways. With men, I become sexually attracted as a biproduct of having a close relationship with them, but it's not sexual at the onset. It's almost like incidental, and a way to get closer, and I like that. But with guys, sex is secondary. I'm often not able to connect with gay guys for this reason.

With women, sex is a primary part of the relationship, and a driving force in the interaction. I don't know what I would classify myself as, "bisexual" has been what I've used for a while, although I'm sure there's something more specific that would describe me better. Anyway, this is the first time I've ever really put it into words and I revel in the opportunity.

[elian]

pardon me, but there is no such thing as a "straight bi person". the term is laughable. if you have a relationship with either or both sexes, you are bisexual. period. if i`ve offended anyone with my rhetoric, i`m sorry.

If I didn't want to know what people thought I wouldn't have asked the question. Thanks for your response.

[maxtor]

they arent straight....maybe to their straight friends only but behind closed doors they open up and enjoy what they say they dont like.....like some republicans in name only...hence...Rino...they are Sino's. when they have sex with a man then their virginity is broken....you cant go back and get it back!!! just as well to enjoy it and do it till it hurts then. it is not bad to be bi...i guarantee you...you have twice the chance for a date at a party!!! i am not particulary attracted to men but love to have sex with men...not into the romantic stuff but love to suck and play with a cock and receive anal from a man that love to fuck an ass...i love the feel of a man mounted on me fucking my brains out. love the feel of that cock sliding in and out into my belly and hitting those special spots inside....what a feeling and a rush when that special spot is hit.

[Long Duck Dong]

"..most men that have sex with men, have a neutral attraction... or in simple terms they are not attracted to other men, something that we all understand as the person beside us that we know but feel nothing towards, yet we would fuck the brains out of the person on the other side of us......


I can see the difference in thinking between sexual beings and asexual beings with these statements. Actually, most men (sexual beings) have a physical sexual attraction whether it be for women or men while asexuals do not have a sexual attraction to either men or women. For some sexual men is not a "neutral attraction" as much as lacking "emotional attraction" towards other men according to AVEN(Asexual Visibility and Education Network http://www.asexuality.org/home/overview.html
).

The sexual men are capable of having sex with men to either fulfill their sexual urges or reduce their drive impulse. Asexuals just do not get horny while sexual men do. AVEN also states that asexuals may masturbate though and separates that act from sexual attraction. Sexual men may not necessarily connect the physical sexual act with their emotional needs at all whether the sex is with men or women. Even for a man who considers himself "straight" he may be willing to participate in a sexual act with another man to reduce his sexual drive needs while an asexual does not have this urge and may not comprehend what it is to be a sexual being. The sexual man may have a sexual attraction to a body part (cock) but not the other body parts (face etc.) or any emotional love attraction to the individual. Even if they say they "love cock" they may mean that they are physically sexually aroused by cock not that they have an emotional attraction to other men. An asexual man would probably not comprehend this sexual attraction. Some asexuals may have emotional needs or call these needs as "romantic drive" or a need for emotional intimacy. AVEN states that "most asexuals do not make the connection between love and "sex"(physical act). Sexual being men are capable of separating emotional love from the physical sex act and need to reduce their sexual pressure while asexual men do not. "Emotional and romantic attraction are separate from sexual attraction" according to AVEN.
http://www.asexuality.org/home/general.html#def2

Although a straight man probably would not participate in same sex activity the sex drive may over ride this if females are not available (ie prison etc.) Usually, a straight man would revert back to being sexually aroused by women and not men. It may become a "chicken or egg" argument as to whether the so called straight man was really straight or bi if he continues same sex activity when women are available again though. He may have "acquired a taste for cock"...lol He may have not acquired an "emotional attraction" to other men though as sexual attraction is not the same thing.

paraphrase much tenni ?????..... cos it doesn't say that on any of the pages and if it does, I am looking at the wrong pages......

you need to stop with the * asexuals can not know anything * crap.....
I may be asexual now but I was sexually active and had a sex drive for near 20 years..... so I have experience from both sides of the fence and more

according to AVEN.
http://www.asexuality.org/home/overview.html and I have copied exactly what is there, not paraphrased it and changed it......

Relationships
Asexual people have the same emotional needs as anyone else, and like in the sexual community we vary widely in how we fulfill those needs. Some asexual people are happier on their own, others are happiest with a group of close friends. Other asexual people have a desire to form more intimate romantic relationships, and will date and seek long-term partnerships. Asexual people are just as likely to date sexual people as we are to date each other.

Sexual or nonsexual, all relationships are made up of the same basic stuff. Communication, closeness, fun, humor, excitement and trust all happen just as much in sexual relationships as in nonsexual ones. Unlike sexual people, asexual people are given few expectations about the way that our intimate relationships will work. Figuring out how to flirt, to be intimate, or to be monogamous in a nonsexual relationships can be challenging, but free of sexual expectations we can form relationships in ways that are grounded in our individual needs and desires.

Arousal
For some sexual arousal is a fairly regular occurrence, though it is not associated with a desire to find a sexual partner or partners. Some will occasionally masturbate, but feel no desire for partnered sexuality. Other asexual people experience little or no arousal. Because we don’t care about sex, asexual people generally do not see a lack of sexual arousal as a problem to be corrected, and focus their energy on enjoying other types of arousal and pleasure.

Identity
Most people on AVEN have been asexual for our entire lives. Just as people will rarely and unexpectedly go from being straight to gay, asexual people will rarely and unexpectedly become sexual or vice versa. Another small minority will think of themselves as asexual for a brief period of time while exploring and questioning their own sexuality.

There is no litmus test to determine if someone is asexual. Asexuality is like any other identity- at its core, it’s just a word that people use to help figure themselves out. If at any point someone finds the word asexual useful to describe themselves, we encourage them to use it for as long as it makes sense to do so.

[elian]

other types of arousal and pleasure.

Hmmm...I wonder what those could be.

[tenni]

"paraphrase much tenni ?????..... cos it doesn't say that on any of the pages and if it does, I am looking at the wrong pages......

you need to stop with the * asexuals can not know anything * crap.....
I may be asexual now but I was sexually active and had a sex drive for near 20 years..... so I have experience from both sides of the fence and more"

This thread is not about asexuals per sei. Yes, I paraphrased and also used quotation marks for the direct references while attempting to connect to the point of the thread. This thread is about straight men and sexuality. You referenced asexuals and write from a rather unique (read made up) language. No where does the site refer to "neutral attraction" that is your own invention and not about asexuals straights bis or gays. So, what you were referring to in the past about platonic as being part of bisexuality and romantic drive was really about your asexuality or your own inventions.

If you do understand sexual attraction and sex drive from personal experience, your writing certainly reflects the thoughts of an unsympathetic position.

[Long Duck Dong]

"paraphrase much tenni ?????..... cos it doesn't say that on any of the pages and if it does, I am looking at the wrong pages......

you need to stop with the * asexuals can not know anything * crap.....
I may be asexual now but I was sexually active and had a sex drive for near 20 years..... so I have experience from both sides of the fence and more"

This thread is not about asexuals per sei. Yes, I paraphrased and also used quotation marks for the direct references while attempting to connect to the point of the thread. This thread is about straight men and sexuality. You referenced asexuals and write from a rather unique (read made up) language. No where does the site refer to "neutral attraction" that is your own invention and not about asexuals straights bis or gays. So, what you were referring to in the past about platonic as being part of bisexuality and romantic drive was really about your asexuality or your own inventions.

If you do understand sexual attraction and sex drive from personal experience, your writing certainly reflects the thoughts of an unsympathetic position.

elian in post 12 first mentioned being seen as asexual.... not me... I first mentioned it in post 13 and I was talking to elian.....

I refered to myself as asexual, tenni.... and asexuals are as varied as bisexuals.... in the same way I am a out bisexual male with a female partner and you are a closeted bisexual male with a male partner..... and the aven site will tell you that there are some asexuals that do have sex....and many that do not have sex.....

a neutral attraction is when you do not feel drawn to other people romantically / sexually.... thats why people have platonic friends, that is part of a neutral attraction.....they do not see the people in a sexual issue or feel sexually drawn to them, but they can fuck them if they choose.....

the reason I never said it applies to asexuals, tenni, like you claim... is cos its not a asexuality trait... its a aspect we all fucking have, unless you want to argue that nobody does, in which case, we would all be sexually aroused by every person we meet, including strangers walking down the street......

but if you want to start a poll asking if people have fucked people they are not attracted to... you will find that you will get answers from people that prove what I am saying, to be correct.....

now reread what I said about neutral attraction....

it makes a lot of sense to me as I am asexual ( lacking a sex drive ) I can have sex with people, but there is no * pressure or craving * in me to go have sex with other people... which makes me different to a male that has sex with men, as they have a sex drive, just a neutral attraction personality "

I said different to me, tenni, I am asexual, so if I am saying that they are sexually active people with neutral attraction, then I can not be saying that its a asexuality only trait.....

the fact that you rushed off to a site to discredit something I did not say in the first place, only makes you look more childish and immature every time you try to rubbish me in the forums.....

[bihardman]

If I didn't want to know what people thought I wouldn't have asked the question. Thanks for your response.

well put, and thanks

[elian]

.. in which case, we would all be sexually aroused by every person we meet, including strangers walking down the street......


<pant pant> hmm...this is probably not as erotic as it sounds <tries to imagine Margaret Thatcher in a speedo>.

[tenni]

LDD
I am sorry if my thoughts offend you. I do find you difficult to understand. You claim to be so many things both sexually and professionally that it confuses me at times as to what the hell you are attempting to write?

As I understand it, asexuality has not been clearly determined as to whether it is another sexuality or not by organizations determining such things. There is insufficient credible information on asexuality from one article that I read awhile back. The article was attempting to clarify just what asexuality is. It is however a distinction between being sexual or asexual as opposed to be a sexual orientation such as straight, bisexual or gay at the present time from what I've read.

Your postings over the past few years have used language that is confusing to me and others. You have argued that bisexuality involves "platonic love", "romantic drive" and other terms that AVEN references and connects to asexual perspective rather than sexual or bisexual. You now argue that you were sexual but are now asexual. AVEN states that does not happen (again not a direct quote though) and so you must be in yet another unheard of unique niche category.

Yet, you persist in commenting on many aspects that involve sexual drive and I'm just say'n that your perspective is unique rather than more universal. You seem to be in a niche and use language (whether debating circumcision or sexuality) in an unorthodox manner. It is as confusing as a straight man claiming to be straight while sucking cock...to attempt a connection to the thread ;) I have stated that I agree with the article and points made but also acknowledge the ability of sexual men to get sexual pleasure from other men quite differently than asexuals. It all gets so confusing and off topic though. A bisexual, bi asexual, pansexual, former sexual being etc. perspective is very difficult to comprehend and relate to.

[Long Duck Dong]

LDD
I am sorry if my thoughts offend you. I do find you difficult to understand. You claim to be so many things both sexually and professionally that it confuses me at times as to what the hell you are attempting to write?

As I understand it, asexuality has not been clearly determined as to whether it is another sexuality or not by organizations determining such things. There is insufficient credible information on asexuality from one article that I read awhile back. The article was attempting to clarify just what asexuality is. It is however a distinction between being sexual or asexual as opposed to be a sexual orientation such as straight, bisexual or gay at the present time from what I've read.

Your postings over the past few years have used language that is confusing to me and others. You have argued that bisexuality involves "platonic love", "romantic drive" and other terms that AVEN references and connects to asexual perspective rather than sexual or bisexual. You now argue that you were sexual but are now asexual. AVEN states that does not happen (again not a direct quote though) and so you must be in yet another unheard of unique niche category.

Yet, you persist in commenting on many aspects that involve sexual drive and I'm just say'n that your perspective is unique rather than more universal. You seem to be in a niche and use language (whether debating circumcision or sexuality) in an unorthodox manner. It is as confusing as a straight man claiming to be straight while sucking cock...to attempt a connection to the thread ;) I have stated that I agree with the article and points made but also acknowledge the ability of sexual men to get sexual pleasure from other men quite differently than asexuals. It all gets so confusing and off topic though. A bisexual, bi asexual, pansexual, former sexual being etc. perspective is very difficult to comprehend and relate to.

point one.... I do not use the term bi asexual .... aven, you and a few others use that term, I use the term bisexual asexual....

point two, your remark about aven saying ( you did not directly quote them saying this ) that people do not go from sexual to asexual.....

I quote directly from avens FAQ page

You would certainly have a lot in common with other asexuals. At the times when you are asexual you may choose to identify as asexual, at the times when you are sexual you could still have asexual issues--such as explaining asexuality to sexual partners--and therefore could find a place in the asexual community.

so i am not sure what you read tenni ( and did not directly quote ) but based around the quote I have posted here,.... they are saying that asexual people can be sexual at times.....

point three.... when shakespeare wrote about platonic love with romeo and juliet, how did he predate what i was saying about platonic love by a good few hundred years, if I am supposed to be the only one saying anything about platonic love... and why is it that I am supposed to be saying its a bisexual aspect when shakespeare refers to it in regards to heteros.....

maybe because it has existed since man fell in love with somebody he could not have...... and that definately predates me by a good one million years or so

point four I have made the statement to you in a past post in this thread ....." if you want to start a poll asking if people have fucked people they are not attracted to... you will find that you will get answers from people that prove what I am saying, to be correct..... "

now when you post that poll ( and I am not holding my breath waiting ) it will prove that asexual thinking is no different to sexual thinking.... that some people will fuck a person regardless of gender, purely for sexual relief... not cos they are interested in or attracted to them... but cos they can fuck them....
I have experience with anal sex as a top and a bottom... so I have a good understanding of sex with males and females, as a top and a bottom.... and that is why I told you to post the poll....as I know you have no interest in anal sex, you have stated that yourself.... so who is more likely to know about anal sex with males..... the males that have it, or you, that doesn't ?

point five... party girl bisexuals.... it gets argued that they are not really bisexuals as they are only making out or getting it on, to get the attention of other people..... yet its argued that guys that do the same thing, are bisexual......and strangely enuf, its males stating both opinions..... yet you tell the same males that their bisexual nature is not actually bisexuality, they go off their nut......

so who is right.... the people using the labels that best define who they are for them... or the people telling others that they are wrong, while telling the gay community to stop telling them that they are gays in denial and closeted..... and I am asking you that cos you would know more about being in the closet than me, you have more experience at hiding your sexuality than me

[DjMikeWatt]

:male: I've thought about this a lot, too. I think that we should differentiate between bi-sexual and bi-amorous. I sometimes enjoy sex with males (I am male) but I have never had, and almost certainly will never have, romantic emotional feelings towards a man.

I am a very sexual person, and I think that at some point it dawned on me that I was limiting my potential for sexual gratification by limiting myself to only sex with females. When I am with a man, it is 100% purely sexual. I never walk down the street and see a man and think about how hot he is or how badly I would like to have sex with him... but it seems like I can't go ten minutes without thinking that way about a girl that I see.

Am I bi-SEXUAL, obviously... I have sex with men on occasion, as well as with women. However, I really think that in my case, and likely in many others' case, it's more that I am HYPER-sexual.

I am never even really sexually attracted to a guy, I'm sexually charged by the idea of sex in general. I am much more excited by women, and I could only ever have feelings for a woman.

So where does that leave me?
+mf