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murdoc_N.
Apr 19, 2006, 11:16 PM
Hey I was just wondering (and you may want to reply in private?), how was the first time you had anal sex? (refering mainly to guys)

I have used a dildo before, but I doubt its the same...

I guess Im just curious, I like the dildo so I think Ill try it :male:

BI-FREE
Apr 20, 2006, 10:07 AM
The first time I tried anal sex it was very painful, and I had to have the guy stop after about 30 seconds. Since, my wife has used a fairly large dildo (larger than the guy I was with) and I have found the sensations wonderful. The difference is she takes her time to enter my ass and then sit s there inside until my anus ring is able to relax. She has also used a vibrator in my ass and it gave me multiple anal orgasms (I didn't even know these existed until that happened). So, I guess my advice would be to take it slow and allow the anal ring to loosen, because once that is done, I have been able to receive like a champion (pain goes away and pleasure ensues). :male:

joshua_134
Apr 20, 2006, 10:10 AM
does a vibrator work...ive never used one and ive been curious to it. i thought it was more for chicks

metallywacker
Apr 20, 2006, 1:51 PM
I had fantasized for years about anal sex. Wife enjoyed tongues and fingers but after trying more drew the line. I began wondering about being on the recieving end of it myself. I started with the dildoes too. Eventually graduated to larger sizes until i thought i was ready for the real thing. My first couple of attempts were unsuccessful due to my partners inability. I enventually hooked up with a couple of guys (roommates) who were fully capable. They took turns. It seemed somewhat surreal, not particularly pleasant, but erotic emotionally. Then for several days afterwards came the unhappy consequences. I was very uncomfortable for a week or more. Not real sure if i will go that route again. Maybe i did something wrong. I never had any ill affects from the toys, but the real thing left a long lasting bad impression.

mrplayfuluk
Apr 20, 2006, 3:29 PM
that begs a question from me too.. I have had bad reactions physically after messing with dildos. Constipation, stomach pains are all I got from anal play so I have never been inspired to venture further. Only an aneros massager ever worked for me. have others had alimentary problems? :(

innaminka
Apr 20, 2006, 7:30 PM
I've often wondered about perspectives in regard to this subject.
Being female, the intrusion of a penis into my body has been mentally accepted as something that was going to happen since, well, probably before puberty.
As little girls, we fantisiced about men's "thingy's" going into our hole. (After we were married, of course :bigrin: )
The advance to accepting a thingy into our bottoms was probably more about overcoming taboos about "dirty" rather than actually taking it.
For men, regardless of how gay you are, is accepting a penis into your body proper an act that requires far greater mental adjustmentst than for a woman?
Men are "engineered" to penetrate and does this transfer into actually having to overcome some homophobic (mental) barrier?

I ask this because very often I have read how men found their first anal experience painful.
My first anal experience was with my husband - it was easy, thoroughly enjoyable and gave and gives, incredibly powerful sensations. It is now an accepted part of our sexual lives.
I must admit my only anal experience with plastic has been with a female and was nothing like approaching the "real thing" (sounds sexist)

Anyway back to my original observation/ponder. I'm wondering, is there a greater mental challenge for men than women when considering anal penetration?

Long Duck Dong
Apr 20, 2006, 9:47 PM
interesting post innaminka... and yeah as a male I am inclinded to agree

I have found that female partners who enjoy anal sex, do tend to naturally react as if its perfectly normal and natural..and as for myself, I have to put myself into a feminine type aspect to enjoy anal sex as a bottom

I do find that I have to overcome my mental male conditioning when thinking about anal sex....and the idea of surrendering to a good anal ramming, is something my body enjoys, but my mind reacts to the idea of me * backing down * to a male and I tend to find meself in the situation, of fighting my masculine side as I yield to the penis of a top

in answer to the original thread question....well for certain reasons I can not give certain details of my first time, but, having learnt the gentleman has passed away, I now talk about it, minus the identifying details
I will say, that I went looking for it and requested it from a older man ( 8 years older ), and I was the bottom ( by choice ) but I taught him how to top me in a number of positions and this arrangement went on for 3 years

the side effects of anal sex, is flatuence mainly, tho with dildos and vibrators, I find my body is inclined to fight them and that they do hurt me internally.. yet I can take penis of a larger diameter and lenght with no side effects

bigregory
Apr 20, 2006, 11:12 PM
There should be no pain with anal sex.
Be sure to use lots of lube,and go slow till the muscles relax.
Plastic or the real deal are both great ,with a dildo you need to be sure to go slow.
Funny or sad i cant recall my first time but i do rember the last time .
It can be and is the most intence feeling done right, done wrong the worst day of your life..
lube lube lube :2cents:

APMountianMan
Apr 21, 2006, 8:09 AM
There should be no pain with anal sex.
Be sure to use lots of lube,and go slow till the muscles relax.
Plastic or the real deal are both great ,with a dildo you need to be sure to go slow.
Funny or sad i cant recall my first time but i do rember the last time .
It can be and is the most intence feeling done right, done wrong the worst day of your life..
lube lube lube :2cents:


Absolutely agree! I do remember my first time. As we were both a little scared he went very slow. By the time he was completely in I was begging him not to stop. It was not just the feeling of penetration, (an absolutely wonderful feeling), but also the feel of his body against mine. Also, there was a sense for trust and friendship that has lasted the years. Even though we haven't been together for close to 20 years, we still chat from time to time.

Again, with the dildo use plenty of lube. But this can also be a wonderful experience particularly if you don't rush things.

Enjoy!


:cool:

forrest
Apr 21, 2006, 2:37 PM
anil sex is the best way for a guy to really get into the bi thing! I always start witha inama this cleans you out and you are ready to take on your lover, this also keeps you from "packing-fudge".. When you are cleaned out it goes much better "cleaner". secondly use plenty of lube!!!!!! K-Y, astro-glide, or anilease what ever you use use plenty. And the most important thing is to always use a CONDOM. Get yourself good and clean, lube-up, and wrap-up and let the fun begain :tongue:

OralBradley
Apr 21, 2006, 2:43 PM
Once at a gay baths in PaloAlto, I was cruising the cubicles and entered one with the guy lying on his back so I though he wanted a blow job and entered. He told me that he was just resting and preferred to fuck my ass. I explained that I had had only bad experiences, but he countered that he would take lots of time to get me prepared and would stop at any time.
He started out by kissing an licking my nipples, which are very sensitive, and kissed and licked his way down to my cock and balls. He didn't take my cock in his mouth, but licked along the shaft and head. He placed a thumb against my anus and applied gentle pressure while he was licking my cock and balls.
After a few minutes of that, he started licking may asshole and trying to fuck it with his tongue. With my anus excited by his tongue and lubed up with spit, he gently inserted one finger slowly inside. Sometime alon the line he added some lube to his spit and fucked my ass with his finger for a while. One became two, became three, and I was really opened up and ready for his cock.
He lubed his cock and slowly inserted it into my ass by pussin in a bit and pausing several times. Unlike my previous "lovers," he had me on my back with my butt raised to receive him while I could also see him. Once he was full inserted he remained still for a bit to allow me to get used to the pressure of his cock while he stroked mine and tweeked my nipples.
At last he started to slowly withdraw his cock until he was almost out and the slowly reinserting it until his cock-hair was against my ass. Very soon, I was rising to meet his thrusts and our tempo increased until he was fucking me with some vigor.
He slowed down when he was close to coming and I could feel his shaft get larger inside me With this impetus, I was thrusting up onto his cock even more than he was thrusting into me. At the end, he made a few short, fast jabs when he came, and I shot my load up onto my chest and face.

murdoc_N.
Apr 21, 2006, 10:52 PM
hey whats an inama?

Before I use a dildo (or if Im feeling fruity, a banana, lol) I always take a shower and clean myself out good with soap

Long Duck Dong
Apr 21, 2006, 11:24 PM
enema..lol... a internal clean out lol

its not a good idea to use soap as it can irritant the mucus balance in the rectum and lead to trouble

personally I use aloe vera gel.. its all natural, good for the skin and body.... and it works well

Sparks
Apr 22, 2006, 12:15 AM
There are many answers to this question. For me, my first introduction was forced as a little boy. However, as an adult, "my" decision to give it up was purely voluntary.

My thoughts about the first time? As a little boy, of course it hurt. But as an adult, now, it can be a very intimate, erotic and pleasureable experince. If you choose to do so, make sure the puppy is wrapped in a condom.

Take Care


Hey I was just wondering (and you may want to reply in private?), how was the first time you had anal sex? (refering mainly to guys)

I have used a dildo before, but I doubt its the same...

I guess Im just curious, I like the dildo so I think Ill try it :male:

jasforjas
Apr 22, 2006, 7:32 AM
I have little to say but two points:

A- if you can spell Google then you will soon find lots of good advice on butt f---ing – try “human sexuality”

B- do it when you are ready, but only when your ready – but once you get the idea – it is as wonderful as any other type of sex - hot as hell

Cheers

wanderingrichard
Apr 22, 2006, 10:08 PM
yes, vibrators work. don 't be afraid to experiment with different types. butt plugs, same thing.

take your time, use lots of lube. if you need to, use a gel lube with a desensitizer to help you along.

also, for the benefit of both you and your parnter, use a condom on the toy, and for sure make sure your partner wears one when you go mano a mano. also, use an enema at least an hour before you do this. trust me, it helps relieve pressure problems and isn't as messy!

relax, mentally prepare yourself, physically prepare yourself, and enjoy.

oldcalhippie
Apr 22, 2006, 10:47 PM
My first time getting balled by a guy was a very good experiance. He was older(25)me(17)and took me very slowly and gently.I seemed to easily take his 8inch cock into my ass and he showed me just how wonderfull anal sex could be,several times that night.Ive been wanting it ever since.

KevsBi
Apr 26, 2006, 12:41 PM
I guess I was kind of lucky. I met a guy in a bar one night and we ended up at his place. One thing led to another and we were making out in his bed.
It just happened to be a waterbed (this was back in the 80's).
He used lots of lube and was very slow and gentle.
I guess that combined with the motion of the water made it a little easier.
Don't get me wrong, it still hurt like hell but looking at his face and seeing how much ecstasy he was feeling made it worthwhile.

Masterslick
Jul 15, 2012, 7:57 PM
Is your wife open to do other guys for first timers

dagesk
Oct 6, 2012, 2:33 PM
My first time was amazing. I had been fingering and using toys on myself sometimes so I was familiar with the sensation and knew how to make it feel good.
I started to experiment at my college (and still am) with my newly discovered bi side and had a friend over. We ended up playing around and started by sucking each other off. Eventually I started to rub and finger my ass while I blew him and he got some lube for me, then took over with his own fingers which felt great. Once I was relaxed and slippery I spread my legs and he put his cock up against my hole. His head popped in and he left it there for me to get used to his girth. Soon enough he was slowly easing more inside me and it felt incredible. I could take about 5 of his 8 inches really hard comfortably. At one point though I felt my ass completely relax and open up for him to the point that he moaned and slid all 8 inches deep inside and his balls were resting on my butt. The entire time I stayed rock hard without touching myself and leaked a lot of precum on myself. When he came, he shot inside me really deep and I was surprised that I could actually feel it which I loved.

ErosUrge
Oct 7, 2012, 2:24 AM
I've often wondered about perspectives in regard to this subject.
Being female, the intrusion of a penis into my body has been mentally accepted as something that was going to happen since, well, probably before puberty.
As little girls, we fantisiced about men's "thingy's" going into our hole. (After we were married, of course :bigrin: )
The advance to accepting a thingy into our bottoms was probably more about overcoming taboos about "dirty" rather than actually taking it.
For men, regardless of how gay you are, is accepting a penis into your body proper an act that requires far greater mental adjustmentst than for a woman?
Men are "engineered" to penetrate and does this transfer into actually having to overcome some homophobic (mental) barrier?

I ask this because very often I have read how men found their first anal experience painful.
My first anal experience was with my husband - it was easy, thoroughly enjoyable and gave and gives, incredibly powerful sensations. It is now an accepted part of our sexual lives.
I must admit my only anal experience with plastic has been with a female and was nothing like approaching the "real thing" (sounds sexist)

Anyway back to my original observation/ponder. I'm wondering, is there a greater mental challenge for men than women when considering anal penetration?

Many of your points about men receiving are spot on accurate and your questions are good ones. Reading about men's first experience being painful is generally true with most men and I was no exception. And the first experiences were with men who had no patience or desire to see that I was enjoying it. Luckily I was not physically damaged from the experiences but mentally I was defensive after that; I just couldn't see why anyone would want to do it with so much pain involved. And from that, I didn't for many years after. I developed an attitude of "why would anyone want to; it's repulsive" and a "dirty disgusting activity; nature never intended for us to be using the area for pleasure"...etc etc etc. Several years after this, I became curious about it again because I realized that there were MANY people, male and female indulging in the practice. And besides being the sort of person I am who is and was interested in learning about anything that could enhance the sensual/sexual experience, I was ready to pursue the possibility of it again. So I took it upon myself to research and asking questions and having discussions with those who did indulge in it. To make a very long story short, I decided to give it another go...it took a few years to adjust and enjoy and am glad I made the decision to. When I finally had a good experience I realized how the area was most definitely capable of receiving pleasure. The taboo of it faded.

As you stated men are 'engineered' to penetrate but I would depart in saying that all men have the need to overcome homophobic mental barriers...it is true for many but not all. Later I had issues about being homosexual or more accurately in my case, bi. But I never worried about being labeled homosexual because of this kind of play. I think that the mental challenge has to do with overcoming the fear of pain because of first negative encounters. Again, you are correct about some men not wanting to be labeled as gay or bi from indulging this way. But there are many men who are not concerned about being labeled as much as they are interested in it being a good and enjoyable experience...

I will finish by saying that after those first negative experiences, I learned to adjust and experience incredible heights of ecstasy through receiving anal from men who were patient or from having women use toys or fingers on me until I learned in time to enjoy it...so pleased that I did too. I remember how amazed I was when the door opened (good accidental pun at this point) to this new found pleasure. It was like nothing I'd ever experienced before and as though a new secret pleasure had been revealed and awoken within me. And the orgasms were of an intensity I'd never experienced before...I don't know if this sheds any light on your observations and questions INNAMINKA.....

brighteyes2012
Oct 10, 2012, 10:03 PM
The first time I had anal sex it started out painfull. Luvkily, my partner at the time was very patient with me. When he first entered me the pain was intense as I felt him enter me and my anal opening closed around the head of his penis. He held me tight so that I couldnot pull away. He was very caring and assured me that ythe worst was over.He remained still for a time allowing me to get used to him in me. He gradually started to thrust in and out slowly each time entering me alittle deeper. I started to relax and it started to feel good. I tried to push back to meet his thrusts and whren he would pull back I felt myself trying to squeeze down to stop him. Once he was inside me deep enough and hit my "G" spot I lost chile he was enjoying my ontrol of myself. It felt so good and every time he hit it I could feel myself loosen up and he would take advantage of it and thrust even deeper into me untill I could feel his pubic hair. He then started to make long, slow in and out thrusts. I was loosing my mind and was gasping uncontrolably every time he thrust in and hit my "G" spot again. While he was enjoying me, even though I couldnot get an erection, I was leaking Precum, and every time he hit my "G" I would ejaculate more semen. When he finnaly started to thrust in and out very fast I knew he was about to cum inside me. Suddenly, he thrust deep inside me and grabbed my hips tight as I felt him filling me with his semen. At the same time, I was so excited that I had my own orgasm. IT WAS THE BEST ORGASM OF MY LIFE, IT LASTED SO LONG. In addittion to feeling so good, I also received GREAT PLEASURE knowing that the first time I had intercourse with a man he enjoyed me as a partner that he was able to have an orgasm inside me and I felt so good performing my womanly duties. It was the best orgasm I ever had and I realized that I was meant to be a woman to please a man. Today, I have to practice SAFE SEX, but at the time it felt so good when he came inside me. I also think that it also helped lube me inside because as he was moving his penis it seemed to slide easier. When he finally pulled out I felt so EMPTY but never HAPPIER. I would like to find another partner so that I can repeat this joyous event. When he first entered me and the pain was INTENSE, I imagined that my hymen was breaking because it was my first time and he took my virginity both orally and vaginally. I have life long happy memories of this event. Also, before he entered me, I performed oral sex on him to get him hard and I knew the harder and longer I could get him, the more I would GET HIM inside me. Anyone interesed in a Pre-Op in the Brooklyn/NYC are contact me.

BootyBuffet
Oct 11, 2012, 9:53 AM
The first time I had anal sex felt amazing. I was 18, horny and on a school vacation with a friend. The only room left was one queen size bed. I had really not had any fantasies about men, but we had to share a bed rather than him sleep on the floor. When he reached over and touched my cock I became hard as a rock. After sucking eachother, he reached into his overnight bag and pulled out some lube and quickly spread it on his cock and my ass and with me on my back, put his hard 7 inches in. No pain, just super pleasurable. He plunged into me and then turned me over and mounted me again. The feeling of being taken was very intense and pleasurable, and when he gripped my hips and tensed up, I could feel him gush cum into me. It was so hot I came against the sheets. He then wanted me to fuck him, so being 18 and instantly hard again, I did the same to him. We both lost our virginity that night! That experience was repeated many times, and was so good that I think that is why I became only a bottom with men!

azurlad
Oct 12, 2012, 2:47 AM
my 1st time was a guy who was divorced and was a member of a club i worked at. As he looked like Magnum from the TV i was attracted to him. A mate of his picked me up in his car and drove me to his house 30 miles away. Was i excited in the car as the driver played with my cock through my jeans. Arriving at the house i was given a drink then immediatley stripped of my clothes!! My cock was solid and he was amazed at the size of it as i was so slim. I was made to suck both guys and then the magnum look a like was eager to fuck me so i was lubed up. On my back he started to prod my ass as the other made me gag with his HUGE dick. To say it was sore having a cock in my ass for the 1st time is an understatement!! Eventually i relaxed a little to enjoy the sensation. It does get easier after time and now i hold a decent selection of toys that i like to take to my cruising areas and parking lots!!

celticmagic
Oct 12, 2012, 10:32 AM
Innaminka,
When I got penetrated the first time, it was not unpleasant or painfull. It was something I allways wanted and was expecting. I got it dressed as a women becuase I just wanted to experience and feel the sensation a women enjoy when having sex with a man. I loved it! I still do it as often as possible, and make my guy enjoy it in full, by giving him a nice oral treatment before leting him penetrate my cherry, and when he do, I receive and enjoy it as a real "girl". As for you, Innamika - no matter in wich way or with whom you enjoy sex - just do it and be happy. You deserve every minute of it as long you are not hurting no one.

loadingmikke88
Oct 13, 2012, 1:24 PM
First time was last weekend and i was at my boyfriend. I asked him what he wanted to do, and he replied: i want to be inside you. I have been thinking on it for a while, and i Lubed him up and sat on it.:p lots of trying and failing before it went up my Bottom. I had imagined a lot of pain, so i was suprised it was as good as it was.:)

funin951
Oct 13, 2012, 4:16 PM
First time I did it was with a guy I trusted ALOT.. he was larger then I was and it was part of a 3some too. I was very relaxed and still it hurt.. had to have him stop but he said I felt great.. I liked that.. since then I have taken other guys but I make sure they are my size or smaller. still working on the initial pain but it starts to feel good especially if I am really comfortable with the other person. I have to trust the other guy and the level of comfort has to be super high before I will even let anyone try. I know I love topping a guy though and want the full experience. just keep it safe with guys and girls.

bi4asplay
Jan 10, 2014, 9:37 AM
My late wife started me out with a home made dildo as you could not but them in the early 70s. She found that I liked anal stem while giving me head and just brushed my ass as I was about to cum. She though I was going to blow the back of her head off. After that she would finger almost everytime. Then she made the toy.We both found out that I would have anal Os when she used it on me.A couple of years later on her birthday she said all she wanted was for me to do everything she asked for a 3 day weekend. I said sure. She had invited 3 other couples over that I had no idea were bi. A long story short, though I had never even thought about sex with another man I ended up sucking all 3 of the guys many times that weekend. All of other people there either pegged or fucked me. First with the toy than with the real thing I never had any pain since she had gotten me realxed and opened up before the first cock. When the first guy entered me the first time that he hit me P spot I shot a hugh load. I could not get enopugh. We would all play a couple of times a month for the next 10 years. The only bad experance I ever had was one guy that we had over was so nervous that everytime he tried to enter me he would go soft. We had him back over a bit later and this time he was more relaxed. He had the biggest cock I have ever taken, and fucked for a long time. Very nice.

mikeyd270
Jan 10, 2014, 1:01 PM
It was wonderful. I love feeling a man pumping on my ass. I had a good partner who was patient and used lot's of lube. It was a little uncomfortable in the beginning but once he got it in it felt so good. This is when I discovered I am a true bottom as I can't wait to be fucked again.

gotlek
Jan 10, 2014, 5:31 PM
I was about 13 the first time one of my bf wanted to top me, and he did.It hurt and bled(I was a virgin).
After few days of healing I just loved it soooo much and I still do.

BiCuriousVAN
Jan 10, 2014, 8:27 PM
I've often wondered about perspectives in regard to this subject.
Being female, the intrusion of a penis into my body has been mentally accepted as something that was going to happen since, well, probably before puberty.
As little girls, we fantisiced about men's "thingy's" going into our hole. (After we were married, of course :bigrin: )
The advance to accepting a thingy into our bottoms was probably more about overcoming taboos about "dirty" rather than actually taking it.
For men, regardless of how gay you are, is accepting a penis into your body proper an act that requires far greater mental adjustment than for a woman?
Men are "engineered" to penetrate and does this transfer into actually having to overcome some homophobic (mental) barrier


I am still a virgin back there, but am keen to try, but when I have tried to hook up, they have cancelled or been no shows etc or we never get that far. I haven't had a 2nd get together with the same guy yet. I have been fingered and rimmed (once), but that is it with a guy. I have had three oral experiences, but still badly want to have anal sex. I have gone as far as using a plug on myself and leaving it in for a bit and then using a dildo. It is amazing how much looser it is back there after the plug has been in me awhile, so when I do anal, that is where I will start.


As far as me accepting a guy entering me, I may be weird, but I have often thought about what it is like for a woman to have a man inside her. I have always thought that is as intimate as it can get having a guy inside you. So for me, wanting anal sex is my chance to experience having a guy inside me and rocking my ass. The thought of anal excites, yet scares me, but I know it is something I need to do to feel complete. I am a lot less scared after playing with my ass with a dildo and knowing I can relax back there. I know that once I do it, I will be fine and want more. I just can't wait to get there. I have the feeling, this is the year.

jjharden
Jan 11, 2014, 3:09 PM
My first time was with a tranny, I thought she was a female until she exposed her cock. What was I to do? Run? No I wanted to try it. So I sucked her dick for a little while, then she said she wanted to fuck me. I let her. She went slow and it didn't hurt, well maybe a little. Since then I've been hooked on cock and pussy as well.

This whole thread is making me horny. Dammit.

Asspussy302
Jan 15, 2014, 7:52 AM
My first time was not fun, it hurt cause I didn't know what I was doing.

Newly_Bi
Jan 15, 2014, 8:44 AM
My first time, I was on top, and was super excited so I put it in too fast and it hurt for a few seconds but then it felt VERY good. As long as you relax and enjoy it, it's very fun.

jlp123
Jan 15, 2014, 3:47 PM
I was in my late 60s the first time I had anal sex and the man that took my cherry was very well practiced. He was 8" but not real thick. He fucked me three times and I enjoyed it and wanted more even then. I have only had anal twice since then and I wanted more every time altho none were as profecient as the first one. I hope to find more and to be able to find more than one at some point in time. I think it will be great to find more than one so I can hold one in my mouth while one is in my ass, and when he gets through with my ass the other can take over. Don't know how I will feel after this experience but I am going to go after it. Untill I know I don't like it I am going to try to remain open to anything I can experience.

Fzmr9t
Jan 15, 2014, 9:01 PM
My first time, and only time was with a partner who was as inexperienced in being with a man as I was. It was our 2nd or 3rd meeting and we'd only done 69 before. This time we decided to shower together, which was also my first time with a man. That was VERY exciting! Afterwards we got into our normal 69 position and started enjoying each other. He asked if he was doing it right, his usual question when we were together, and I said yes. I then said, I'd love to feel you inside me, or something to that effect, and he pulled our a condom, and i grabbed some lube and I lubed up his cock, and he lubed up my ass.
After a few awkward attempts, he finally entered slowly, and it hurt for a bit. After a few moments he slid in further and then further still until I could feel his stomach against my ass (I was on my hands and knees). He then moved in and out slowly and it hurt a bit, but the pain subsided, and the pleasure intensified. I could feel him coming, he was tensing up and gripped my hips a bit, and once he came, he pulled out and I pulled the condom off of his cock and cleaned him off.
we met a few more times, but that was our one and only time having "ENTER"course. LOL

I Look forward to the NEXT time, whenever that is.