The other biphobia

[ambi53mm]

Phobia
: an exaggerated and often disabling fear usually inexplicable to the subject and having sometimes a logical but usually an illogical or symbolic object, class of objects, or situation.
n : an anxiety disorder characterized by extreme and irrational fear of simple things or social situations;

I believe biphobia exists. How the straight or gay communities view me does not bother nearly as much, as the phobic nature that I bare witness to everyday. It manifests itself in many of us that are bisexual. Fear of our own bisexuality seems to be the forgotten aspect of biphobia that seems the hardest to point a finger at call it by what it is. It’s not to say that both the gay and straight communities do not contribute to our biphobia, but it runs much deeper than that.
I’ve always wondered who coined the analogy of “being in the closet”. It’s probably been years since I’ve actually physically been in a closet. It was always a favored place for hide and seek. I can recall how dark it was inside of there. Hearing the footsteps walk past and being alone with myself until finally discovered.
Alone in the darkness…waiting to be discovered....Sound like biphobia to anyone else?

[Driver 8]

The Bisexual Resource Center did a wonderful pamphlet called Bisexual Internalized Oppression (http://www.biresource.org/pamphlets/internalized.html) that we used to hand out at meetings.

When I re-read it, it reminded me of a lot of things I've heard around here ... these jumped out at me:


We deserve to feel guilty about who we are within the lesbian, gay, and heterosexual communities.
If we leave a relationship, we are betrayers.
We do not fit in anywhere.
We are in a category of one, and no one can or will understand us.


Take a look at it; I really recommend it.

[ambi53mm]

Thanks Driver8 :)
I had the opportunity to check out the website and was amazed by how many of those items posted on that list I've felt at one time or another. It also gave some insight into how many of those things I'll need to continue to work through at the internal levels.The list posted on that website I think most of us can relate to and I've saved it to pass on to others as well.
Part of what generated that thread were conversations with another member and myself, over those we've come into contact with through groups that we both belong to. There are those that have the desire to actualize the same sex experience that is part of the bisexual experience, but are unable to get beyond their own biphobia / internalized oppression for one reason or another.
My personal motives for posting this thread and many of the others I write date back to an earlier dark period of my life. I lost a brother to suicide largely due to his own biphobia that still haunts me to this day. We were both in our early 20's and it was a time when support groups like this were unavailable. Working through my own issues and sharing them as so many in this group do, hopefully will prevent a tragedy for someone.I continue to recommend this site to so many because of its uniqueness and diversity of thought.
Again my appreciation. :)

Ambi :)

[Bothbi_cpl813]

I can relate as well, having both st8 and gay friends. both groups have a huge problem with bi men.... now as for bi females, it seems everyone is looking for that elusive bi female. but when it comes to a bi male, they want nothing to do with us. It seems when I am not "out of the closet" I am putting myself in harms way by the sheer fact I am a bisexual male. Even other bi couple, say that they are worried about aids. "are they worried about aids when they find a bi-female" no......

My "outing" as discussed in other threads here, was a diaster. The biggest mistake of my life. One which I wish i could undo. though I didn;t lose a family member from death,. I did lose everyone due to the fact of my bisexuality. they stated in parting that " we always knew there was something the matter with you... always suppected you are mentally disturbed. Further, there is a bi-phobia even amoung the so-called swinging lifestyle. Bi sexual men are hugely discouraged from an encounter, even in a private room. ZI know this because i wa asked to leave the business, for the fact I was in a room with a man. I was told if i wanted to be a faggot, I could find other places that catered to their perverted needs. Being relately, self-assured, I just blew this off and left with my wife, from the swing club. On the other hand, My male counter part was emotionally damaged by this public display against bisexual males. He to this day hasn;t talked about it. Both he and his wife haven;t been to a lifestyle club since.

Gay people, think we (bisexuals) are living a lie... We in their minds are gay and we are afraid to admit it to ourselfs, no less the general public.

Now i think there is certainly liberal minded people out there that accept us for who we are, what we are. From my experience, they are few and very far bettween. It also seems that there are levels of bisexuality when it come to men. there are men who are only bisexual if a female is present, there are other ones who only receive oral sex and don;t partisipate in any "mutual" sex acts. There are others who will do oral, but not anal, others who will do anything, but won;t kiss or cuddle. Even amoung other bisexual men, I have been told I am too gay for them. Even this group, labels you in a 1 to 7 range for your sexuality. Why can;t we all just be bi, with decided likes or dislikes. My wife and I are very communicatible about our bisexuality. and even she has a hard time understanding the whole bi-phobia thing. because as a bi female she doesn;t see it. moreover feel it.

I guess, maybe everyone is right, that I am probily gay. But in reality I truly love both male and female. both have their pluses and minuses. I think thatis our problem, we do like and love both genders and I guess that is our cross to bear Jerry

[hydropop]

I think the genearl public has really shuned the bi-male community for what reason I am still confused about it. Seems being gay is more widely accepted, and also being a bi woman is acccepted. But being a bi male is really looked down opon, Arent we in the year 2006 and wasnt not long ago that we seemed to accept the gay community? I really hope one day everyone can just accept everyone for who they are. OOPS isnt that like asking for world peace :-) , oh what the hell. Can we have some peace around here.

Sorry thats my 2 cents worth :-).

[Driver 8]

Wow - two men in a row posting about how it's okay for women to be bi but not men. Since I just posted about why I don't believe this is true, (http://main.bisexual.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1012) I won't repeat myself here except to say that the fact that some guy's dick gets hard when he thinks about two women does not make my life as a bi woman any better or any easier.

[Mimi]

driver! i wish i had come across this "Bisexual Internalized Oppression" pamphlet before doing my study!!!! this is one of the things i was studying, and this would've been PERFECT. DOH!!! :banghead:

and i agree that bi women AND bi men still have a long ways to go in getting accepted in this world. the so-called "acceptance" that bi women get is actually objectification and sexism. even though a bi woman may not have to fear for her safety every time she comes out the way a bi man might, she starts to feel treated like a peice of meat that is available for everyone to take a bite.

but back to the topic of this thread, which is not about biphobia from the straight and gay worlds, but INTERNALIZED BIPHOBIA IN OURSELVES. ambi53mm, i'm very glad that you raised this issue. i think that it is not talked about enough.

i think we all have taken in and believed the messages out there -- it is impossible NOT to when they are being crammed down our throats in the media, from our family, friends, co-workers, church, government, etc. and i think it's a serious and important step to take, to finally become aware that some of our own ideas are not actually our own ideas but the propaganda of someone/something else. i know this may be hard to swallow for some people. but i challenge you to name FIVE positive bisexual role models out there. can you do it? if you can't, why not? it's not a coincidence.

mimi :flag1:

[ambi53mm]

i know this may be hard to swallow for some people. but i challenge you to name FIVE positive bisexual role models out there. can you do it? if you can't, why not? it's not a coincidence.

mimi :flag1:

Dear mimi,

I can name five of what I would consider to be positive bisexual role models...but unfortunately I only know them by there screen names LOL..but your point is well taken and you're right it's not a coincidence.

respectfully
Ambi :)

[Mimi]

I can name five of what I would consider to be positive bisexual role models...but unfortunately I only know them by there screen names LOL..but your point is well taken and you're right it's not a coincidence.

well, that's wonderful there are role models here. :) but of course i meant people who are known "out there," outside of the small protected cove we call bisexual.com. there are so few celebrities that have publicly identified as "bisexual." megan mullaly (from Will and Grace) is one, and margaret cho has identified as "bigger than bi" or "pansexual. maybe we could start a list on bi celebrities... :bigrin:

mimi :flag1:

[grizzle45]

I have only recently grasped the core need for bi visibility and that is, for me, that bi invisibility can be, and often is, personal. Even now, after having come out as bi in 1992, still discount my same sex experiences. I can even go so far as to forget that I had same sex experiences before I ever had any experience with the opposite sex. I'm actually quite amazed that as I began to question my identity I was able to consider bisexuality as an option. I'm not sure where the term was introduced to me or how.
I think the greatest counter to bi invisibility, or internalized biphobia, is visibility. I think there needs to be a visible contingent of bisexual people for the new or young queer to see and identify with, or to seek out for support, even among the largely gay and lesbian groups that exist. I would like to see more visibility of non monosexual characters in the media as well, as does any minority, for the same reason. And most importantly, I think as a bisexual identified person I need to continue to confront my own biphobia, in terms of how I discount and closet myself, and in how I adhere negative types and myths to others, such as the gross misconception that bisexual women are more accepted than bisexual men, or that a bisexual character needs be male in order to represent "my" bisexuality.

[JohnnyV]

Just a quick thought --

My experience might be totally different. I've found that lots of gay and lesbian people hate bisexuality in theory, but they are very supportive of my marriage to a woman, and they want me to be happy. Straight people tend to be the same way.

The trick, I think, is not to push a political agenda on either gays or straights, that they find threatening to their sense of sexual order. If you rely on their personal goodwill toward you, biphobia really dwindles down to almost nothing.

J

[Mimi]

Even now, after having come out as bi in 1992, still discount my same sex experiences. I can even go so far as to forget that I had same sex experiences before I ever had any experience with the opposite sex.

i feel for you, grizzle, but i admire your self-awareness in recognizing your own internalized discimination. it can be so easy to do that, when the gay and straight communities try to "erase" us any chance they get. one thing i do to fight against that is to come out to people so that they know and so i have less chance to "hide" myself either consciously or subconsciously. it's like if you like to play tennis and tell your friends about it, then they will more likely take you out for a game of tennis or to talk about tennis or buy you tennis gear than if you tried to hide it. another thing i did when i was still struggling a lot was buy bisexual jewelry or stickers. i would wear my pink/purple/blue bracelet even when dating my bf so to remind myself of my core identity.


I think the greatest counter to bi invisibility, or internalized biphobia, is visibility. I think there needs to be a visible contingent of bisexual people for the new or young queer to see and identify with, or to seek out for support, even among the largely gay and lesbian groups that exist.

i hear ya! that's why i try to be AS OUT AS I CAN so that i can be a "beacon" for others that may be more closeted. when i was running the Fluid group at UCLA (bisexual student group), it was tough work, but it was great to be the one of the few bisexual college groups in the nation. and then random people started coming to me to ask about bisexuality because it was known on campus that i was bi. i sure do miss those days...

mimi :flag1:

[grizzle45]

I've avoided going to the LGBT group on campus because of the age difference between myself and the average student. It's a silly excuse and I think the truth is really just old fashioned neurosis. It seems that coming gets easier but never ends. And as I stated, after 14 years I'm still struggling with my own internal bi-invisibility. I still question whether I am accepted by my friends. They never draw attention to, criticize, or belittle my identity, but at the same time they don't acknowledge or seek to share in my orientation. Is that neccessary? Is thier silence in truth an unqeustioning acceptance? This need for validity comes from a number of sources and isn't limited to my orientation, but it seems to me being seen is an important aspect of being visible. I want bi characters in the media because I want to see "me" represented. I want the reflection of self in the world around me. I want a community so that I can share my struggles, and my victories, with those who truly understand.
I don't think a person who has never come out truly understands or appreciates what an endless act of courage it is. You can never step out and be done with it but must readdress the issue everytime you meet a new person, enter a new classroom, start a new job, etc.
What was the point of this long diabtribe? To justify why I've never gone to a meeting of the local LGBT group? To demonstrate that I am out and always so? Or just to vent? I guess a little of both. :bigrin:

[qiangqiang]

Wow! This seems to be the plot (https://acmejoy.com/)in a movie or novel!
You are destined not to belong to me alone, but I just hope you remember me. In your free time, you can remember that there is someone who is silently paying for you! ! ! !