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  1. #31

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by bearisbare
    I can only speak for Toronto, but I could say for it that not one women's bathhouse night in Toronto has happened in a place that is exclusively for women and trans people. Generally, the events are two to four times a year, so the vast majority of the year, the same place is a men's sauna.
    Quite so. There are NO spaces available that are for women and trans people only. We have to fight against ideas that women will somehow damage men's spaces and shouldn't be there at all. Bathhouses for men are not so welcoming of women. Some won't allow us there at all lest we bleed on things or something.
    Dana Shaw (aka Black Orchid)
    ---------------------------------------
    Living a both/and life in an and/or world.

  2. #32

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by purple rose
    i am a bi pagan woman and my husband is a bi pagan man and i took offense to alot of the things in your article and it is my oppinion that you absolutely do not know what you are talking about when it comes to wicca.
    You say I shouldn't talk about things I don't know about. I agree.
    I've been a Wiccan High Priestess in th Alexandrian tradition for 14 years. I've been the Wiccan Chaplain at the University of Toronto for the past 4 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by purple rose
    i have never felt like an "outcast" and do not appreciate being categorised by you or stereotyped and i don't think anyone i know would appreciate it either.
    In this case I'm referring specifically to groups that contain people that do not fit into societal norms - straight, christian, conservative. If you want to refer to that in some other way, feel free. It's not a judgement, just a descriptive term.
    Dana Shaw (aka Black Orchid)
    ---------------------------------------
    Living a both/and life in an and/or world.

  3. #33

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by hudson9
    I have to say that I think that "outcast" is a poor choice of words for these groups -- particularly if you're including community theatre and sci-fi fans, for example. I'm a theatre person, artist, musician, somewhat bisexual, and a "leftist," but have never considered myself an "outcast."
    Feel free to use another word to describe groups that aren't based on straight, christian, conservative ideals. As I mention in a reply above, it's not a value judgement, just a descriptive term.

    Quote Originally Posted by hudson9
    That female bisexuality is more accepted in these groups than male bisexuality, actually mirrors the general population(!).
    I agree! The fact that women are more prevalent as bi in our society is a fairly common phenomenon.

    Quote Originally Posted by hudson9
    I also think the characterization of religion is grossly oversimplified. As a religious person, member of a mainline-protestant group, I have never found my religious beliefs to push me towards intollerance, social control, or to repress my sexuality. Just the opposite
    That's great! I'm not claiming that these generalizations are true for all people, only that observation shows them to be true *in general*.
    Dana Shaw (aka Black Orchid)
    ---------------------------------------
    Living a both/and life in an and/or world.

  4. #34

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfcamp
    Could it be that women open up to women on this topic in a way that men would not? <snip> Just how do you know that most or all of the women in a group are bi? Do you just say, "Hi, I'm bi, are you?" This isn't a facetious question. I am just curious.
    It's certainly likely that women are socialized to be more open in general about things that men would consider private. However, mostly we find out about each other being bi over a meal, when one feels it important to mention it to the other one-on-one, or sexual behaviour is observed amongst women and then the assumption is made that it's okay.

    If you're shy, it's harder to be open about your sexuality in general.
    Dana Shaw (aka Black Orchid)
    ---------------------------------------
    Living a both/and life in an and/or world.

  5. #35

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by ghytifrdnr
    BTW, does anyone but me think Dana Shaw's photo is HOT!
    (blush) Why, thank you!!
    Dana Shaw (aka Black Orchid)
    ---------------------------------------
    Living a both/and life in an and/or world.

  6. #36

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    ok let me clarify what i'd stated a bit earlier, i was pretty vague and it didnt come out the way i wanted it to.

    i belong to a very sex positive group out here in pacnw.. it's "one of those yahoo groups" gasp!@! and i shared this topic with them on their message board by way of a url / link /referral/recommendation to come read it. why? because when i read it, i immediately thought of them.

    it's also a swingers group for the " not so pretty people", in other words, us regular folks who have real lives, careers, kids, dogs and cats, financial worries etc, you know, just, PEOPLE! most of us are in our 40's or so, some well into their 60's and i think we even have a few septugenarians too...

    i've seen 1st hand the situationally bi thing, mostly because of very controlling hubbies or very sub wives, and the truly bi women roles, well, pretty much , with this group i've seen most everything..

    what i can also tell you is that almost every person i've met in this group, and one or two others, is either pagan or non christian, non mainstream in their religion.

    i've also noticed that these folks have a totally different freedom of mindset concerning their bodies and sex and partners in general.

    but, please do not construe it to mean that they are not principled or dont have standards . quite the opposite, many of us could do well to better our lives to follow thier examples. they have got to be some of the warmest and loving people you'll ever meet outside your own family.. in fact , here, their standard greeting goes something along the lines of " welcome to our wild, wide,whacky weird warm and loving family" and they really mean it.

    outcasts? not hardly.. community? very most definitely.. a mirror of the rest of the true population? oh hell yeah..

    anyway, sorry to have rambled and lost the whole thought train.. what i'm getting at is that i agree ,based on 1st hand knowledge, with just about everything the author has said, and with the perceptions and postings about the reasons why women seem to be more openly bi and men not.
    "To each monkey, it's own swing.." - old Latino Provberb

  7. #37

    Cool Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    [object Object][object Object]I am a role-player, am into tattoo's, and have hung around with goth's (though wouldn't really call myself one). I am also as bi as a bi thing from bi-town! I don't feel that I am an outcast. I feel that the people who are "outcasting" me are really outcasting themselves because they are closed to any idea that does not follow the conventional way of thinking.

    Maybe it is just that people who are open to unconventional views are also more open to bisexuality. If so, then great. They are more interesting people anyway.

    Besides, who excludes prople from their group based on the fact they have views or a way of life that is not seen as the norm? Nobody I want to drink any beer with!
    You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on - Dean Martin

  8. #38

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    yes, black orchids photo is hot, everytime i see her picture i want to pvt her and tell her she moves me

  9. #39

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Of course, I hope that any interested parties will contact me about this but I always thought that a facility fronted by an alternative café would include 2 sauna/spas sharing resources such as plumbing, heat and such. On one side: women only and on the other men and women. I think there are enough gay saunas catering to men only in any major city that it would be futile to even go in that direction. I wouldn't want to compete with those excellent establishments either.

    The café would allow for strength in numbers for safety.

    What do you think?
    We're not confused about our sexuality... other people are!

  10. #40

    Thumbs up Loosely Defined "Pagan","Wiccan" and Broad Diversity

    Dear Bi Di:
    I too am a practicing Celtic/Druid, now loosely defined as Pagan, and sometimes Wiccan. In the true form, as I am a lineage "Cailleach D'Eyre" we, all of us were Polyamorous, male/female regardless. Of course after the Catholics took over Ireland/Scotland; The Highlands and depicted "us" as devil worshippers[hah, can't worship that which has no name nor place]we retreated and lived in secrecy, and our mainstay-love, sex, pleasure, and celebration of these acts/Maypole etc. were hidden. The 60's [an era I was born into]allowed for some of the old ways to be talked about by grandmothers etc./ and these stories were carelessly slid into our "Christian/Americanized lifestyles" .As time progresses the Goddess will have her "children" back as her "Witches" slowly teach the humans that they are not born evil and with sin, and they do not have to repent or spend an eternity in "Christian Hell", and that we were made out of pure pleasure and love, AND THROUGH SEX! IN ALL ITS WONDERFUL, PASSIONATE GLORY! The truth is that most men are bisexual, but are socialized into hiding it, but most have had atleast one experience is my "experience" . Ask them in a non-disclosing way, and they'll admit it. I am raising my children to respect the Celtic/Gaelic traditions,we believe we are all one, and no-one better, or less, and in the Celts way of life, the women were as equals, thereby leaving less of a strain on the male population to feel as though MM was any less natural than MF, or group/adult[only] was to be anything other than sheer ecstasy and our Goddess given right, so mote it be!

  11. #41

    Re: Loosely Defined "Pagan","Wiccan" and Broad Diversity

    Quote Originally Posted by polyamour2000
    Dear Bi Di:
    I too am a practicing Celtic/Druid, now loosely defined as Pagan, and sometimes Wiccan. In the true form, as I am a lineage "Cailleach D'Eyre" we, all of us were Polyamorous, male/female regardless. Of course after the Catholics took over Ireland/Scotland; The Highlands and depicted "us" as devil worshippers[hah, can't worship that which has no name nor place]we retreated and lived in secrecy, and our mainstay-love, sex, pleasure, and celebration of these acts/Maypole etc. were hidden. The 60's [an era I was born into]allowed for some of the old ways to be talked about by grandmothers etc./ and these stories were carelessly slid into our "Christian/Americanized lifestyles" .As time progresses the Goddess will have her "children" back as her "Witches" slowly teach the humans that they are not born evil and with sin, and they do not have to repent or spend an eternity in "Christian Hell", and that we were made out of pure pleasure and love, AND THROUGH SEX! IN ALL ITS WONDERFUL, PASSIONATE GLORY! The truth is that most men are bisexual, but are socialized into hiding it, but most have had atleast one experience is my "experience" . Ask them in a non-disclosing way, and they'll admit it. I am raising my children to respect the Celtic/Gaelic traditions,we believe we are all one, and no-one better, or less, and in the Celts way of life, the women were as equals, thereby leaving less of a strain on the male population to feel as though MM was any less natural than MF, or group/adult[only] was to be anything other than sheer ecstasy and our Goddess given right, so mote it be!
    Wonderfully told!! How wonderful life could be if more thought this way.
    Why must it be "either/or", why can't it be "and"? Love needs to be inclusive, not exclusive.

  12. #42

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by DiamondDog
    I feel compassion for them but again I see this as living a lie and partialy their own fault that they aren't out to their spouse/partner, and frankly I'm sick and tired of playing therapist/Dr. Phil for closeted men who won't take me or my advice seriously.

    I just wanted to add to this in that although you may have given these men advice with the best of intentions (I'm not sure what advice you're talking about, however) the same advice isn't necessarily the best for every person.

    As for "living a lie" as it were, I kinda resent that kind of rhetoric. I don't feel it necessary that everyone should feel the need to share their sexual anything with anyone they don't want to. If you want to advertise to the world that you're gay/bi, that's YOUR prerogative.

    Personally, I never felt that way about it. Announcing one's sexuality isn't mandatory in society whether you're gay, bi, asexual or australian (Oi, oi, oi!). Sexuality is a personal thing that people share with whom they choose. Need to know. I have several friends and one relative who knows I'm bi, but really, I don't think telling my 80 year-old parents or my siblings will help my life or theirs. I've never gone out of my way to ask them about their sex life. Why? BECAUSE IT'S NONE OF MY BUSINESS! I'm a gentleman and I have some decorum. In the same breath, I have defended gay rights when the subject came up, especially gay marriage.

    Does this really make me a chickenshit? Oh, well! I guess I'll stick to just telling those people who really matter... the ones I want to have sex with. They are, after all, the ones who really need to know. If I'm honest with myself and them, that's all that matters.

    PS The Supreme Court of Canada ruled in its latest attempt to set guidelines that govern sexual morality in Canada, the top court said two swingers clubs in Montreal were not operating as illegal "bawdy houses," because what went on there did not cause any harm to society. This is good across the country. Sooooooo, this means that if the cops want to get inside a sauna, they better be sure there's at least a pound of heroin in the place or flip for the sawbuck like everybody else.

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...tory/National/
    We're not confused about our sexuality... other people are!

  13. #43
    Do we HAVE to look at this ugly-ass picture every freakin' day? Can't you put up a photo of someone who's attractive for a change?

  14. #44

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by biguyinla
    Do we HAVE to look at this ugly-ass picture every freakin' day? Can't you put up a photo of someone who's attractive for a change?
    Now we know why you have limited experience and you're divorced...

    Peace, out!
    We're not confused about our sexuality... other people are!

  15. #45

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Lol, this article is so true to me...and voices a lot of musings I've had about "outcast communities" for a while. I'm bi, interested in body mods, an SCA fencer, a sci-fi/fantasy nerd and I play D&D with my friends. It's not like one happened before the other. Being bi and being part of an "outcast community" just evolved during high school as part of my entire self-discovery.

    Sweet.

  16. #46
    This bitch looks worse than a tranny.

  17. #47

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Frankly I am sick of heaving every time I log onto this place.

  18. #48

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Not sure the last two posts comport with the position of "Unofficial Community Leader" -- !!

  19. #49

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Domino
    This bitch looks worse than a tranny.
    cute pic you have.

    but i have a lot of "tranny" friends who put your pic to shame.

    tho i do agree a little variety would be nice on the log-in page.

  20. #50

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    The topic of this article/thread is not "Let's flame the writer". Instead of complaining about the lack of a new article, how bout writing one yourselves?

    ......Oh wait, that's right, you are not an activist or have anything to contribute to the community.

  21. #51

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fire Lotus
    The topic of this article/thread is not "Let's flame the writer". Instead of complaining about the lack of a new article, how bout writing one yourselves?

    ......Oh wait, that's right, you are not an activist or have anything to contribute to the community.
    i pray you aren't referring to me...

  22. #52

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    I'd like to say a few words about the topic at hand(and I'll try to use as few words as possible):

    As a Bi man I found the article well written and informative. I also read in the article the writer's opinions as well as factual statements that can be researched by anyone if here if they put forth a little effort. Journalism(of any kind) in today's world will have a mix of facts and opinions, so members who feel the same as Purple Rose should see this and accept it. Perhaps using the term "fringe groups" instead of "outcast" might not ruffle as many feathers, but the use of the term did spark discussion, and I think that is what the writer intended.

    Lastly, I'd like to say something about the Avitars used here. Some are amazing(like flexuality)and some are a little odd(the use of "Max Headroom"), but others don't seem to like the one used by the writer of the article. To them I say this: We can't all be male models and beauty queens. Accept this fact and life becomes a lot easier.

    I'm stepping off my soapbox now...

  23. #53

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    i hate being falsely accused...

    so to clear up any misconceptions, my first comment was aimed at Domino, not the author of the article.

    secondly i expressed ever-so-slight concern about there being variety on the log-in page, which has nothing to do with the current featured article.

    so whoever shoots(accidentally or on purpose) anymore goody goody remarks at me can kiss my(smooth and pretty durn cute) azz.

    buh-bi!

  24. #54

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by SpaZZ

    I just wanted to add to this in that although you may have given these men advice with the best of intentions (I'm not sure what advice you're talking about, however) the same advice isn't necessarily the best for every person.

    As for "living a lie" as it were, I kinda resent that kind of rhetoric. I don't feel it necessary that everyone should feel the need to share their sexual anything with anyone they don't want to. If you want to advertise to the world that you're gay/bi, that's YOUR prerogative.

    Personally, I never felt that way about it. Announcing one's sexuality isn't mandatory in society whether you're gay, bi, asexual or australian (Oi, oi, oi!). Sexuality is a personal thing that people share with whom they choose. Need to know. I have several friends and one relative who knows I'm bi, but really, I don't think telling my 80 year-old parents or my siblings will help my life or theirs. I've never gone out of my way to ask them about their sex life. Why? BECAUSE IT'S NONE OF MY BUSINESS! I'm a gentleman and I have some decorum. In the same breath, I have defended gay rights when the subject came up, especially gay marriage.

    Does this really make me a chickenshit? Oh, well! I guess I'll stick to just telling those people who really matter... the ones I want to have sex with. They are, after all, the ones who really need to know. If I'm honest with myself and them, that's all that matters.

    PS The Supreme Court of Canada ruled in its latest attempt to set guidelines that govern sexual morality in Canada, the top court said two swingers clubs in Montreal were not operating as illegal "bawdy houses," because what went on there did not cause any harm to society. This is good across the country. Sooooooo, this means that if the cops want to get inside a sauna, they better be sure there's at least a pound of heroin in the place or flip for the sawbuck like everybody else.

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...tory/National/
    Coming out isn't telling the world about your sex life or your sexuality. I know old people think it is but it's seriously not about that at all. Also the men I was refering to are married and don't even think of themselves as being bisexual or queer even though it's obvious to everyone but themselves that they are.

    Coming out is more like being open and telling your family/friends and your spouse if you have one about a small aspect of yourself. Or not being afraid to be yourself when questioned about your sexuality, or when you're assumed heterosexual by default.

    Obviously you didn't read my post that well.
    Last edited by DiamondDog; Apr 7, 2007 at 9:55 AM.

  25. #55

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by superyumboi
    i hate being falsely accused...

    so to clear up any misconceptions, my first comment was aimed at Domino, not the author of the article.

    secondly i expressed ever-so-slight concern about there being variety on the log-in page, which has nothing to do with the current featured article.

    so whoever shoots(accidentally or on purpose) anymore goody goody remarks at me can kiss my(smooth and pretty durn cute) azz.

    buh-bi!
    The remarks I made were made to someone else. Primarily to Domino.

  26. #56

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    You are somewhat right. I , for example, am Wiccan AND Bisexual. =D

  27. #57

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by DiamondDog
    Obviously you didn't read my post that well.
    I read it right. Maybe you wrote it wrong?
    We're not confused about our sexuality... other people are!

  28. #58

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    well to tell you the truth im bi-male and just finding out that i really am bi- well i guess im more bi-curious dont know what it takes to be bi- had only one experience with one guy so far!!!! my wife has used a strap-on me several times and she says yes your bi- but, in a nutshell it has always been the mans role to be masculine and strong to see a man on all fours getting banged by another man shows submission and me being a man just cant fatom the idea.Until recently if you would have asked me about it before now i would have been discussed by the idea of it but to see 2 women bi- or lesbian it is very sensual to see 2 smooth bodies caressing each other now thats is exceptible, ask yourself as the average person how claims to be st8 if they would rather see 2 sexy women or 2 hairy guys go at it and what do you think they would say?
    In truth we are bi- some just prefer one over the other. God gave us the tools to use sexually he made man and woman when he cast us out well he opened the doors wide open so i think sex isnt what our forefathers thought of it as being husband and wife and even then we dont really know what went on the ones that was preaaching that was or at least had thoughts of it. just my thoughts on it. I say if it feels good and noone gets hurt then why not//

  29. #59

    To shave or not?

    Hair (pubic) or not? I prefer not for 2 reasons. One, I like the sensation I get from it without and two I love it my partner invested the time and sensuality to make it so. Comments?

  30. #60

    Re: What's With All These Kinky, Pagan Bisexuals?

    Quote Originally Posted by Domino
    Frankly I am sick of heaving every time I log onto this place.
    So why do you continue to log on?

 

 

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