Presently, the report is 53 dead and over 50 in the hospital over the murder of people in a GLBT club near Orlando Florida, USA. It can not be ignored that the target was non heterosexuals. The murderer is reported to be a 29 year old man.
I'm sure more information will come.
Your thoughts?
Last edited by tenni; Jun 12, 2016 at 11:12 AM.
This is a horrendous act of terrorism. This nightclub and it's patrons were deliberately targeted by a member of ISIS just because of their lifestyle. This young man is a radicalized Islamic son of Afghan refugees, he is a known wolf, investigated by the FBI years ago and we are letting thousands more of them into our countries every month. This is going to turn out well. We are going to see increasing amounts of violence like this in the years to come. Islamism is not compatible with modern western values and all too many of us are willfully blind to this.
I would also point out the similarities between this attack and the one in Paris last year. This attack targeted gays because of their lifestyle, in Paris Jews were targeted because of their religion. Other attacks in Los Angeles, Kenya, Brussels, Egypt, Israel, Iraq, Syria, Turkey, etc. all targeted their victims based on their religious or lifestyle choices. Unfortunately this will not be the last one.
My sympathies to the victims, their families, and their friends.
Last edited by a2smith09; Jun 12, 2016 at 12:59 PM.
You may be correct a2smith but information has not been given out yet by the FBI..just the media speculating. The murderer's family has not been informed yet and that is why the police are only giving out his age. I don't think that the bodies have been removed yet let alone identified.
This is being investigated as a hate crime against LGBT as well as a domestic terrorist attack.
Lets not place one hatred (Islamophobia) on top of this until it is stated as such by the police. You seem to be blaming Muslims instead of hate crime against LGBT communities.
Last edited by tenni; Jun 12, 2016 at 12:58 PM.
Our hearts go out to the victims, their families, and friends in Orlando.
Yes a radicalized Muslim named Omar Mateen did this, and yes it was an attack on the LGBT community.
Willfully blind Tenni, willfully blind. You may be right and I may have jumped the gun and be wrong, time will tell. I just see a worldwide pattern deliberately targeting persons with incompatible values, of which LGBT is a big one. Its not all muslims either just a significant minority willing to use violence in their belief system. You can add Bangladesh where LGBT are deliberately targeted and slaughtered just because of their lifestyle. By no means is this only a domestic issue.
Way too early breaking news, apparently the gay pride parade in LA was also targeted. Coincidence? coordinated targeted attacks?, who knows? I'm sure it will come in time. Fortunately the perp was caught and arrested before he could kill anyone.
I'm not willfully blind. I'm aware of the possibility a2smith. Our Canadian media called it domestic terrorism at this point. Again, unofficially a US citizen may have done this. That makes it domestic. It has just been reported that ISSIS has posted on its website that they were responsible.
Jumping to conclusions before the police have had time to look carefully seems prejudice...as in pre judging before the police and FBI have determined the facts. Trying to get the news before it is validated seems to be a sickness of US media..got to be #1.
In the past two years a man of Arabic background killed an honour guard on Parliament Hill and invaded the Parliament building. He was killed in the halls of Parliament. There was no proof of direct link to ISSIS but he was radicalized by his own research.
It is all speculation at this point except that 50 people were murdered in a gay club last night. Incidents in Bangladesh or other countries of violence towards women and GLBT shows that this is not a safe world as much as some in the west think. GLBT bashing is one level down from what happened last night.
Personally, I think that we can almost expect mass murder in the USA by gun violence. Does anyone recall murder of more than say 5 GLBT people at one incident? or even more than one at a time in the past ten years?
Last edited by tenni; Jun 12, 2016 at 2:38 PM.
Originally Posted by tenni
Tenni, this guy was affiliated with ISIS. But you're an Islamic appologist, and keep in mind that most Mulsims in the world even so called "moderate" ones want bisexual, gay/lesbian people dead or in prison.
CAIRO (Reuters) - Islamic State’s Amaq news agency said on Sunday that the Islamist militant group was responsible for the shooting that killed at least 50 people in a massacre at a gay nightclub in Orlando, Florida.
“The armed attack that targeted a gay night club in the city of Orlando in the American state of Florida which left over 100 people dead or injured was carried out by an Islamic State fighter,” Amaq said.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...0ced23ca85ad5?
http://nypost.com/2016/06/12/suspect...-shooting-idd/
The shooter who killed at least 50 people at a gay nightclub in Orlando has been identified as Omar Mateen, law enforcement sources told The Post.
Mateen was a U.S. citizen with no apparent criminal history, was born to Afghan parents in New York in 1986 and was living in Port St. Lucie, Fla., according to multiple media reports.
Mateen had committed himself to ISIS before carrying out the bloodiest mass murder in US history at a gay nightclub in Orlando on Sunday, federal officials said.
Mateen “made a pledge of allegiance to ISIS,” California Rep. Adam Schiff, the top Democrat on the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, told CNN.
That may all be true Pole..minus name calling. Have the police made these statements or are you going with a terrorists news system from Egypt? There was also an Iman present in front of cameras early today.
It has just been reported that the murderer is not just a US citizen but he was born in the USA. His father said that he hated seeing men kissing. Other pieces of information are being broadcast without the backing or validation of the FBI. ie he bought the guns less than two weeks ago but the FBI was aware of his behaviour since 2013. He was interviewed twice but not put on a terrorist watch list. All unproven or substantiated info.
Last edited by tenni; Jun 12, 2016 at 3:31 PM.
Quit making up excuses for Islam. This guy was associated with ISIS and a part of them.
I'm just going to leave this here. I found it on another site I lurk at.
Alright guys, here's the straight dope from an Iranian immigrant, who happens to consider himself a socialist and Agnostic - if you read the Quran in it's original Arabic, the words "kill" and "unbeliever" appear together very often. In fact, the entire thing reads like a warning of doom to believe, submit, and either punish, or revel in god's punishment of, the unbelievers, ad infinitum. Those who have never read it have no idea. They think it reads like the Bible or Torah. It doesn't. Every page is almost the same in what it says.
The problem is that in English translations of the Quran, "kill" is usually translated to something like "chastise" and "unbeliever" is usually translated to something like "sinners" (I have both versions, I'm not making this up).
This is all part of an Islamic doctrine called taqiya which essentially allows the muslim to lie about his faith (or whether he even holds such faith at all) either in order to protect him/herself, assimilate in whatever society he's in, etc.
The truth of the matter, and again, I am a socialist, agnostic, and ARDENT ANTI-RACIST since the age of 13...the truth of the matter is that Islam is a backwards religion (in fact a political ideology masquerading as a religion) that has no place in civil society. Now, I'm not saying that any harm should come to Muslims. It's not their fault they were born into a Muslim family or society and were indoctrinated. What I'm saying is that the seeds of why these things happen are embedded in the religion and Muslims need to come to terms with this and be open and honest about it, and look for ways to mitigate these negative aspects of their "faith". IF they are willing. Many are not.
There are three kinds of Muslims:
1. Open jihadis and radicals.
2. Crypto-jihadis that utilize taqiya to live their day to day lives
and
3. Useful idiots. These are the ones who actually believe "Islam is a religion of peace", which, if you read the Quran in the original Arabic, you will see without a shadow of a doubt that it is not.
In fact, Islam exists because Muhammad was trying to gain a mandate among his tribe to lead them into war/gain political power, and also to gain the ability to have sex with whomever he pleased by decree of "god" (his second wife, Ayisha, was 8 when they married and 9 when he "consummated" their marriage). He was a power-hungry pervert who invented a religion to promote his lust for power and sex. Yes, this sounds fucked, and you might think I'm deluded, but I know what I'm talking about. I'm an an Iranian ex-pat (and happily so - Islam infected my country and plunged it into the middle ages, and I'm proud to have escaped and now live in a Federal Constitutional Republic).
I'm sorry if any of this is politically incorrect, but it is factually correct. I am also sorry that this puts me in the company of republicans, conservatives and racists. Again, this is coming from a far-left atheist radical, and an active anti-racist of nearly two decades.
Edit: Tehran was once referred to as the "Paris of the Middle East". We used to brag that we were the only middle-eastern country with mini skirts and women at the beach wearing bikinis. Then the Islamic Revolution of '79 took place. This should give you an idea of what Islam is really about.
…an outrage of the worse sort…I pray for the victims…
…another thing we have to think Obama for….
I don't understand how Obama is responsible for these 50 deaths? Expand of your point.
This seems to be a US born person who operated independent of others. I don't think that gays were sought out in Paris?
Questions may be asked about the process that the FBI interviews suspected terrorists imo but again I don't know democratic protocol.
I didn't really want to get back into this but it's called Jihad Tenni. I am constantly amazed how people subject to group think are taken by surprise by events that are predictably obvious. Take your blinders off, look up Jihad, it will help you connect the dots. It is not just US based, it is not about guns, and it is not just about gays. This was not a one off attack by a lone lunatic. It wasn't the first attack and it will not be the last. This is asymmetrical warfare straight out of the manual. Just like Belgium & Brussels, Canada will find out too that they cannot make a deal with the devil. Jihad will come to Canada one day. The Canadian LGBT and Jewish communities are in danger. You can keep your head in the sand and live in your own echo chamber as much as you want but Jihad could care less about what you think and want.
Ok I am done with this subject. I am tired of speaking to people that neither want to see nor hear.
I know what jihad means and what it has been polluted as by radicals. The Canadian experience proved that there was no planned link between what happened in Paris. In one Canadian post today it pointed out that there was something like 10 mass murders in Canada in the past twenty years while in the US there have been ten mass murders since Monday. The reality may not be as extreme but it shows the different cultures.
I agree that our past government was more prone to attracting Islamist extreme radicals. I will not be shocked when it happens in Canada. I blieve that it will. Canada had extremist radicals back in the 60's from Quebec. yep home grown terrorists. Why is it that some people from the US not accept that they have home grown terrorists? However, I am not so bigoted to judge before the facts are in. There is no proof yet to make your statement valid. You are acting like a bigot. There is more evidence that this is an attack by a lone radical who hated GLBT.
All of these judgements are made less than 24 hours after the killings. Aren't we smart.
I still do not see the connection to your president either.
Last edited by tenni; Jun 12, 2016 at 8:50 PM.
I think you're very much on point with your comments here a2.
The Muslim Brotherhood boasted years ago it would destroy America by " infiltration and attacking from within . " Exactly what we're seeing here.
I just watched a live press conference with his ex-wife where she and her fiance kept emphasizing ' mental illness. " Also emphasized was the fact that his driving aspiration was to become a cop ! Mind-boggling.
The guy had an obvious track record . Easy for ISIS to sway & recruit the mentally unbalanced; in fact, it's a deliberate strategy. The organization was quick to claim credit because of his professed allegiance in a 911 call just prior to the attack although his direct connection is still vague. Doesn't matter. The outcome is what they want.
How many more wake-up calls does the world need ?
This is where Trump, despite his unpopularity, is dead on. His get-tough attitude with these evil, deranged bastards has been a relentless emphasis of his platform.
FIRE IN THE BELLY
…He knows the bastards are here…but has taken no effort to protect the American people from them…
I'm not a Trump supporter but I would not be surprised if he wins the election and even has LGBT people vote for him as Killary wants to bring in even more Muslim extremists that nothing is known about, just like 0bama did.
Found on another site:
Islam is a very ugly and dangerous religion. The whole "religion of peace" thing is utter crap. If you open the Quran and read it in it's original Arabic, the word "kill" will appear on nearly every page. I'm not making this up, I know exactly what I'm talking about.Police arrested a Muslim carrying weapons including rifles and explosives to the L.A. Pride fest.
When the Quran is translated into English, terms like "kill the infidel" are translated into "[God will] punish the sinful". This is all part of an Islamic doctrine which says that it is admissible to lie about your religion if it grants you safety (or stealth) in a country hostile to your religion. Therefore, all English language Qurans found in your home town will not mention the "kill" part, but all the ones written in Arabic do, and the Arabic readers of Arabic Qurans will read it too. And they'll take it as God's word, and may carry it out so they can have their 72 virgins when the get to "paradise". Which also brings me to another important point - look at the religion's founder, Muhammad. He was basically just a warlord who invented his own religion mostly to satisfy his sexual desires by force (he was "god's messenger, after all). His second wife, Aisha, was NINE YEARS OLD when they married and consummated their marriage (i.e. he fucked a prepubescent child). This is the man muslims look towards as a shining example of the ideal muslim human being. It's also the reason why men in their 50's are often married to teenage daughters of someone in their village or city all over the middle east.
There are exactly three kinds of muslims: 1 - the open jihadist // 2 - the closet jihadist (blends into society until his opportunity arises to do what he wants to do) // 3 - the useful idiot who actually buys the "religion of peace" nonsense because they don't actually read from the Quran in its original Arabic, or pick and choose the good stuff and ignore the bad stuff (the same way Christians do out of the Bible - it says "don't eat shrimp" and "don't blend textiles" on the same page it says "don't be gay", but I know most christians eat shrimp and wear polyester/cotton blend fabrics before, while and after they try to "save" their gay friend/family member by attempting to brainwash them into not being gay, which is not possible, because homosexuality is a natural and innate, inborn tendency among a certain % of any population, and it always has been for all of history. The third type is the type you find most commonly in western countries, but even they are not immune to being "flipped".
My family had to flee from Iran in the wake of the '79 Islamic Revolution. Tehran (Iran's capital) was once referred to as the "Paris of the Middle East". After the revolution, females who were once teachers, mayors, librarians, and government bureaucrats, who only months before could wear whatever they wanted (skirts, bikinis at the beach, etc) found themselves suddenly being forced by the religious enforcement police (known as Comitè) to wear hijabs and who would beat them in public if a strand of hair was showing through said hijabs. Now, I should state here that I do not condone monarchism, and the Shah (king) of Iran who ruled previous to the Islamic Republic government was an autocrat, but was certainly the MUCH lesser of two evils.
Just look at the middle east. Violence literally everywhere. Lack of civil infrastructure. Low industrial output (for instance, name a single vehicle manufactured in a mid-east country - there aren't any - the royal Saudi family can afford to buy the nicest luxury cars available, but not a single screw or bolt in the car is manufactured anywhere in a thousand mile radius). Now, granted, the United States played a large role in the stoking of this infernal violence. If you fuck with a bee's nest, the bees will get angry and start swarming, and you very well may get stung. We fucked with the bee's nest. It was politically advantageous for us to do so (in the eyes of the officials who carried it out), just like in Afghanistan when we funded the mujahideen to fight against the Soviets (who were not actually invading the country, but had come to assist the rightwise communist government that was trying to westernize and modernize the country at said rightwise government's request), but that came back to bite us in the ass in the form of Al-Qaeda and 9/11. We also continue to do it now to purposefully destabilize the region ("muddy the waters and the fish can't see") as a pretext to engage militarily and gain control of the vast oil wealth there, establish military bases (we have over a thousand all over the world, many in countries we were previously at war with, such as Japan and South Korea, and now in places like Iraq). Had we left them alone (Iraq and Afghanistan and perhaps all the way back to Mossadeq's government in Iran in the 50's), none of this would be happening (they would still stone women to death and hang people accused of homosexuality in public, but there would be no ISIS at the very least). So, we are in part to blame, and to be fair I must mention that.
But Islam is very certainly at its true core a violent religion. Its built in. It began with violence (Muhammad) and has been violent its entire history (refer to muslim occupation of the Iberian Peninsula for centuries).
Just look at the reaction to Charlie Hebdo depicting Muhammad in a satirical manner in one of their issues. That was enough to encourage a couple "Type I" and "Type II" muslims to murder/attempt to murder Hebdo's staff.
I am still, and always will be, an "SJW" as the fascist white nationalists like to refer to people who believe everyone deserves to be equal in the eyes of justice/the law. I will always believe in human rights, free speech, and the right to do as you please so long as you not infringe on the liberties of others.
But with my background having been born to refugee parents from a muslim theocratic country and my knowledge as an atheist about the ugly truth of ALL organized religions, I have to be honest about the truth of Islam. It is violent in its doctrines and encourages violence among its followers.
Check out MEMRI, which is an organization that operates a website that archives media from muslim countries in which their true doctrines are clearly spelled out. I know MEMRI is an Israeli propaganda operation, and I certainly am NO FRIEND to Israel. For the record, I sympathize with the Palestinians and deeply believe in a two-state solution and a cessation of hostilities between the two parties. But the videos you'll find on MEMRI are real, and the translations are accurate. Check it out, you'll have a field day.
I have no doubt that the act in the Florida nightclub was performed by a homophobe muslim in service to his god and religion.
I am not an Islamophobe, I am a realist. My commitment to atheism prevents me from viewing religion with rose-tinted glasses. It is what it is.
IN ELEVEN MUSLIM COUNTRIES, STATE EXECUTION OF HOMOSEXUAL/BISEXUAL MEN IS STILL GOVERNMENT POLICY.
A SINGLE MUSLIM JUST MURDERED MORE GAY AND BISEXUAL MEN THAN DOMESTIC GAY AND BI-BASHING HAS HARMED IN THE LAST 50 YEARS.
Well, the latest information on my news source summarizes:
a/ his father said that his behaviour had nothing to do with religion. He became very angry when he saw two men kissing. He hated Gays.
b/ his ex wife stated that he was mentally ill and physically abused her until her family rescued her from him.
c/ radical organizations like ISSIS do promote hatred towards GLBT and say in videos that they should be killed.
There is no evidence that he had any direct contact with ISSIS. This is similar to the mentally ill man who killed a Canadian Honour Guard on Parliament Hill. They spout radical statements but there is no direct link (so far) with ISSIS. There is evidence of mental illness in the killers.
Last edited by tenni; Jun 12, 2016 at 10:24 PM.
Again, you're making up excuses for Islam, and pretending that this is not a hate crime or jihad.He was a part of ISIS, and even so called "moderate" and "liberal" muslims hate bisexual and gay men, and lesbian women. They're actually OK with Trans people as in many Fundamentalist Islamic countries trans people have the entire sex change operation paid for, and get a new ID which shows them as being the opposite sex.
Tenni's got the Canadian version of Obama at the head of his government now. He should be polishing his equivocating, confused, lefty sophistry for the tide of Allah-inspired atrocities headed his way.
Well, if the shooter's father said it had nothing to do with religion, that oughta be good enough for anybody. Don't even need to wait for Imams Kerry and Obama to tell us what to make & not make it. Nothing to see here. Taqiyya? What taqiyya? Move along.
Christian Radical?
Christian Pastor Celebrates Nightclub Massacre: “There’s 50 Less Pedophiles in This World”
Pastor Steven Anderson, whose hate knows no bounds, celebrated the deaths of 50 people at a gay nightclub in Orlando in a 4-minute mini-sermon that cited the Bible as justification for why they needed to die. (And if it didn’t happen via a shooter, it should have happened by way of government execution.)
It’s the most disturbing, hateful response to a mass shooting you’ll ever hear, and it was provoked by Anderson’s complete hatred of LGBT people.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendl...in-this-world/
Last edited by tenni; Jun 13, 2016 at 5:28 PM.
Ah-ha, just how many more gays and pedophiles did other Christian killers like this Orlando guy murder around the world this year? Oh, wait..
I see.. so, on average less than one gay or bi person per year has been harmed before Orlando... even allowing for the fact u r talking only of the US, once again u talk through ur rancid bigoted arse...
Do not think so little of me as to grant me your tolerance. Allow me your acceptance and understanding of who and what I am with the love, respect and dignity with which I do you.
This was certainly a hate crime.. but whether it was Jihad is questionable to say the least.. ur bigotry allows u to think of no reason why a man who hates gays would butcher them other than because of a religion u h8. Simply because a man was Islamic and claims an allegiance to Isil or whatever does not make what u claim true. Wait and see dimwit...Again, you're making up excuses for Islam, and pretending that this is not a hate crime or jihad.
..it is arguable also to say the least that moderate and so called liberal muslims hate gay and bi people.. it is not and has never been my general experience. Some do, just as many of the most militantly anti-gay and bi people in any and all religions and political organisations and none are themselves gay or bi who do great harm to their sexual kin.
Last edited by darkeyes; Jun 14, 2016 at 5:55 AM.
Do not think so little of me as to grant me your tolerance. Allow me your acceptance and understanding of who and what I am with the love, respect and dignity with which I do you.
It looks more similar to what happened on Parliament hill in Canada and possibly Britain's case as far as home grown extremism. His 911 phone calls called for support of differing extremist groups (Hezbola and ISSIS hate each other) This is the wording of a mentally ill guy. The two killers in Canada did not know each other nor have any direct links to the groups that they claim to have been do this for. It becomes clearer that this is more a anti GLBT killings. There are signs that he was a repressed gay man whose family was rigid about homosexuality. More to come.
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