Bisexual Married Men Bashing

[void()]

I have only quoted LDD, and the only one who has quoted Tenni is you. Fair enough if you want to completely ignore Tenni, but you'll have to ignore all who dares quote him to accomplish that. Sounds like a lot of work to me and for no gain.

This 'condoning' biz seems to be the core of why some chose to take an aggressive attitude towards members who cheat here. That's a lot of work for no gain too IMO, and does nothing but add to the disrespect that's protested against.
'Condoning' is the same excuse used for all acts of disgust thrown at another, unwanted and uninvited. As I've already said....nobody asks for anybodies condoning or approval of cheating here, least of all the cheaters themselves. YOU put yourself in the position of 'condoner', and inevitably oust yourself from it as an act of 'moral protest': You ignore them.
You have no right to be a 'condoner' in the first place! I'm pretty sick & tired of being accused of taking that position myself, when I've got no interest in it, nor right to be either.

If you don't think that Tenni or cheaters are worthy of your attention, or that simply responding their posts means that you support and condone all that they do in their lives, then ignore them and all who attend to them.
It's very silly IMO, but it's your choice.

I am not suggesting a right to condone. I am suggesting a right to
choose. The cheaters have a right to choose to cheat. I choose not to
cheat. I choose not to pay attention expressly to tenni. That too as you
say is my choice.

I am choosing it to avoid regrets later. See? I understand that it is
my choice, and I am making it. Tenni presents things in such a way as
to appear a victim. He did it over the content of a thread, which was
highly descriptive in its title.

It was his choice to view or not. He viewed but then complained of
being offended. If after reading the title of the thread, he did not
understand what a thread was about he could have asked others to further
elucidate. Instead, he chose to view. That meant he forfeited a right
of being offended. He chose to look, he was given description and still
chose.

But yet it was all a big blow up that he was victimized. And it was not
merely that singular thread. He does this repeatedly and has done so
in the past. No one can harm another without the consent of the other.
Tenni consents then cries out as a victim. He does not stop choosing
to consent and he does not stop even knowing he may take offense, be
harmed/upset.

Then, he insults and tries offending others because oh boo hoo, he's been
"victimized". He ought not consent. He is given choice the same as I am
given choice. I see that continuing discussion with him will result in
regret later. I choose to not have that. Seems some new comers to the
site do as well. That itself is a big regret. Well, I make my choice
too.

[jem_is_bi]

I never bash bisexuals for their choices.They may be good choices, bad choices, or have mixed results.I am totally ok with their choices.Unless I know them personally, I do not know enough to do otherwise.I never put any one on ignore, even if I totally reject their logic. Ignorance is not bliss. I admit to glossing over details if replies are long-winded.Cheating?You have to know more than the raw facts to label someone with that label with all the connotations of what it means to you.Life and relationships are much more than a set of good versus evil choices.

[void()]

Re: Post #61 Strike

I am not suggesting a right to condone.

Replace with: I am not suggesting a right to condemn, or condone, otherwise judge.
Rational: I honestly made an error in writing, saw it but too late to edit the post.

[tenni]

post 61

"I am not suggesting a right to condone. I am suggesting a right to choose. The cheaters have a right to choose to cheat. I choose not to cheat."

Is this Void's first vaguely on thread topic statement? I do condone some actions. I condone the right of people to have sex with other legal aged people regardless of gender. I think that to make these positions valid you need to work on getting and maintaining these rights. That may take some form of societal change regarding assumed monogamy as a default mode for any marriage /relationship (particularly for bisexuals). Maybe, bisexuals should refrain from using the word "cheater" as it seems to have great negative meaning..like "faggot" has?

"But yet it was all a big blow up that he was victimized."

The above statement seems to have little to do with the thread? I will state that I am not a victim nor have I intended to present myself as a victim. If I am anything I prefer to refer to myself as a bisexual activist who supports bisexual activism and bisexual discussion on bi issues. I have no clear idea as to what the poster is specifically referring to and don't care to discuss his opinion on this thread.

[Gearbox]

I see that continuing discussion with him will result in
regret later. I choose to not have that. Seems some new comers to the
site do as well. That itself is a big regret. Well, I make my choice
too.

Yes there are are choices, there are always reasons for those choices, always some moral code behind those reasons and always some emotional & philosophical frame behind those morals.

Are you really sure that Ja&Ve left the site due to Tenni's posts?

[tenni]

Gear?
I agree that choices do have reasons and some reasons are based in some personal or societal morality . They may not match and frequently do not match for bisexual husbands.

In post 61, 15% was about the thread topic while 85% was a personal attack. Choosing to personally attack another member rather than post about the topic is not a healthy, productive choice imo. There is a difference between challenging another poster's choice of words and personal attack imo. If a poster uses words like "anyone" they are presenting themselves as the speaker for everyone. Debate differs from personal attack. None of this paragraph has much to do with the thread topic but has to do with some poster making accusations and personal attacks.

[Gearbox]

Gear?
What? Are you going further off the thread topic?

In post 61, 15% was about the thread topic while 85% was a personal attack. Choosing to personally attack another member rather than post about the topic is not a healthy, productive choice imo.

I was on topic and not attacking anybody. Was probably a bit vague tho.
I think that Void was just using you as an example too, in the same light as I was using Ja&Ve.

It all boils down to moral codes on the topic of cheating bi's, and a good dose of personal philosophies ending in 'attack' & 'paranoia'.
We either accept the reality of cheating, or we attack it. As we ALL really know - if somebody wants to cheat, there's not one damn thing in the world that can guarantee it's prevention. The efforts to prevent it cause far more stress than the dealing with it happening IMO.
Mainly coz (as brushed upon) the world is targeted for change, rather than the self.

One simple solution would be to set each other free. That's the hardest thing in the world for some, and a myriad of moral's block out one simple concept. In doing so, the strongest of negative emotions rally to fight the strongest of positive ones.
It's all Angels & Demons creating Heaven & Hell.

[void()]

Yes there are are choices, there are always reasons for those choices, always some moral code behind those reasons and always some emotional & philosophical frame behind those morals.

Are you really sure that Ja&Ve left the site due to Tenni's posts?

Choices may also merely reflect preferences. Think of it in sexual
terms.

You may prefer getting blow jobs. That's great and all is lovely for
you.

I may prefer having some cowboy/gal riding my cock all night. That's
great and all is lovely for me.

Life is like a brothel. You and I can show up and each find willing
professionals to service our respective desires. You go off to a room
with the pro you choose. I go off to a room with a pro I choose.

Some people prefer having sex mixed with relationships. We may prefer
having intimacy, love, trust with those we bed.

Other prefer to not mix relationships with sex. They avoid emotional
sensualities and enjoy the purely physical act.

Neither is right or wrong. I am not saying either is. I am saying and
have said, I do not prefer cheating. This is because I prefer having
relationships with those I bed. Yes, I can admit at one point I felt
strongly cheating was worth condemnation.

I understand cheating is a choice. It is one I do not choose. I will not
choose to knowingly help another cheat.

If you choose to cheat, you can choose to do it with someone else. I
do not prefer it, as I prefer relationships in combination with sex.
Thanks.

And that's all I am saying regarding cheating. It is not me judging
beyond what I prefer, or do not prefer.

I have created change in the world, expressly by changing that opinion
and feeling. So yes, some of us do change ourselves. Some of us realize
human beings are not perfect. We realize that choice is an important
aspect of living and one which bears respecting.

We also do not continually present ourselves as victims to troll a
forum. We evaluate our own behavior, we change in order to change our
respective worlds. Now, excuse me but I am going to honor my choice to
ignore you. You chose reposting tenni's commentary.

And the choice in that is to further avoid regrets, drama. It is a web
forum provided freely. Not worth excess regret or drama, in my preference.

Do I think he was responsible for some leaving? I think anything is
possible. To respond honestly, yes, I think his actions and commentary
may have contributed to some choosing to leave. They may also choose by
my contributions. As I said, anything is possible.

[Gearbox]

Now, excuse me but I am going to honor my choice to
ignore you. You chose reposting tenni's commentary.

Quoting Tenni is only a 'crime' coz you created it (Monog - cheating). Now you've passed judgement and execution for something that doesn't even exist in my world.
You honour what you like, but you'll never take away my freedom (*Drama packed running over a mountain with a spear imagery there.lol*).

[tenni]

Post 67-I agree that Gear was not attacking anyone but questioning and asking for clarification.

"It all boils down to moral codes".

That statement may be correct and the best rationale for bisexual married men bashing. When there is a bisexual site that permits heterosexuals to post on it I find that heteronormative moral values do not always permit the evolution of bisexual moral values/codes and even self identity in positive ways. Bisexual men sometimes refer semantically as having gay sex rather than same sex play. The bisexual man only perceive the duality of monosexuals and has little support(societal or even bisexual community organizations etc.) to recognize that he is neither hetero nor gay. A bisexual man may have same sex activity but if he identifies as bisexual he is demeaning himself by referring it as gay sex with all the connotations and conflicts that brings to his identity.

Sometimes, a heterosexual makes statements that come across (to me) as authoritarian. This has happened over and over on the site. Some of the heterosexuals have taken the authoritarian position of knowing and judging what is best for married bisexual men but are making this judgement with centuries of heteronormative moral values /codes. When a poster uses terms that are vague such as deeming that "anyone" followed by a moral judgement, I think that that poster is walking on egg shells but believes that they have the moral right to comment. Even when that comment does not condemn, they are not permitting bisexuals to evolve away from heteronormative moral values and codes. Bisexual married men are immersed in heteronormative moral values/codes and may even want to adhere to them. Guilt, shame and fear of rejection weigh heavy on their conscience as they struggle with their bisexual identity. Then we have dominating heterosexuals either condoning or condemning the married bisexual man and he carries that inside himself. Some married bisexual men have preferenced their statements on this thread with either defiance or admittance that they know that they have gone outside of heteronormative values.

Now, as I read my own words, I sense that they come across as condemning the heteronormative moral code about cheating. The moral code regarding sexual activity with someone that you are not in a monogamous relationship with is strong and deeply embedded in all of us. If we look at two bisexuals in a relationship whether cross gender or same gender, do they have greater success at dealing with sexual needs compared to cross gender cross sexual orientations? The two bisexuals seem to be more open to examining their relationship outside of the heteronormative moral codes of monosexuals. Even same gendered cross orientation(ie. men and one is gay and one is bisexual) seem to follow a less rigid moral code than heterosexual women.(possibly heterosexual men but we rarely hear from them on this site). I'm not sure what moral code should exist for bisexuals but like bisexuality itself it may be best that it have grey edges and not as firm and hard moral codes as heteronormative society codes.

This thread is reaching the large numbers of comments by few posters level. This seem to happen when moral codes of sexual orientations comes up.

[pole_smoker]

We're not bashing married bisexual men. It's the cheaters that are being bashed. No one has a problem with who you are. It's how a lot of them act that creates the problem and the bad perception.and to be fair, I hate cheaters of ANY persuasion.

I haven't seen actual bashing of bisexual married men. Or you know, people putting down men who happen to be bisexual, or speaking against bisexuality in men.

I have though seen people get annoyed at people regardless of their gender who cheat on someone who they are married or in a relationship with.

[Maybhere]

We agree with pole_smoker. Being bisexual has nothing to do with the reason people are being bashed. Sexual orientation and cheating are two totally different subjects. It is none of anybodies business how you decide to live and conduct yourself. However, it doesn't go to follow that they agree with it. If someone is cheating they are also telling some lies. Our question would be how do you propose to trust someone who does that? The easiest way is to not associate with them to start with. Let them find their counterpart, live and let live.

[void()]

We agree with pole_smoker. Being bisexual has nothing to do with the reason people are being bashed. Sexual orientation and cheating are two totally different subjects. It is none of anybodies business how you decide to live and conduct yourself. However, it doesn't go to follow that they agree with it. If someone is cheating they are also telling some lies. Our question would be how do you propose to trust someone who does that? The easiest way is to not associate with them to start with. Let them find their counterpart, live and let live.

Thank you, quite a bit more eloquent than I was struggling to say.

[tenni]

We agree with pole_smoker. Being bisexual has nothing to do with the reason people are being bashed. Sexual orientation and cheating are two totally different subjects. It is none of anybodies business how you decide to live and conduct yourself. However, it doesn't go to follow that they agree with it. If someone is cheating they are also telling some lies. Our question would be how do you propose to trust someone who does that? The easiest way is to not associate with them to start with. Let them find their counterpart, live and let live.

As I see this, you have made two absolute assumptions. 1/ people should be monogamous as a default position without discussion 2/ If you are not going to be monogamous then we will label you a cheater even if you never agreed to be monogamous.

[jem_is_bi]

As I see this, you have made two absolute assumptions. 1/ people should be monogamous as a default position without discussion 2/ If you are not going to be monogamous then we will label you a cheater even if you never agreed to be monogamous.

3/ Life is a dynamic adventure, not a totally static existence, at least, not for me. Everything changes a little or a lot and you can't expect to have complete control over what changes in your life or others. So why is it fair to judge others based on your life experiences?

[Cutiliae]

I have been with my current wife for about 15 years and she has no idea that I like to suck cock. During our dating period I didn't even think about saying that "I like long walks on the beach, playing golf and oh, yeah, I also like to suck cock." Up to about 8 years ago I was just seeing one person about once per year who lives a great distance away and I wanted to maybe find someone local that I can play with so there wouldn't be such a long gap. I only actively searched because I learned about Craigslist, which made it easy. I should be bashed I guess because I am unable to admit to my wife about my vice. I'm careful on my search and if I get busted I guess the cat is out of the bag. Until then, mums the word. If I would know that she would accept it or even become involved with me that would be great; but I didn't think I would grow more bi over the years.

[Isitfun]

OK truth be told I have NOT read the entire post… But morality police? On a fun kinky sex site? What are that thinking??????

[void()]

I have been with my current wife for about 15 years and she has no idea that I like to suck cock. During our dating period I didn't even think about saying that "I like long walks on the beach, playing golf and oh, yeah, I also like to suck cock." Up to about 8 years ago I was just seeing one person about once per year who lives a great distance away and I wanted to maybe find someone local that I can play with so there wouldn't be such a long gap. I only actively searched because I learned about Craigslist, which made it easy. I should be bashed I guess because I am unable to admit to my wife about my vice. I'm careful on my search and if I get busted I guess the cat is out of the bag. Until then, mums the word. If I would know that she would accept it or even become involved with me that would be great; but I didn't think I would grow more bi over the years.

Not really bashing here. I can to a degree empathize with you. Damn it, I miss cuddling up at night with my boyfriend. He's in PA, I'm in WV. He works in a position that has him being "on call" a great deal. The employer's version of "on call" for him means he gets phoned, told which airport to be at at what time. He shows up, is handed an itinerary and travel package.

I think at present he has some overly well earned "down time" and is visiting family in FL. Yes, I might wish he could have squeezed in a little time for me and him. At the same time, he is often unsure when he is granted "down time" and I am unsure here as to how to "sneak out" as it were. My wife knows, my father-in-law knows. The rest of the family may know but not really concern themselves, or choose to not think of it, not know. So, I would be "sneaking out" from a "traditional" family type of situation in the Bible Belt of America. "Where is B___ going?" "Oh, out with his friend to a motel room, they're um ..."

I could possibly create a story about computing as my boyfriend does computer work, and I have been identified as a hacker, he could be asking me about the dynamics of LISP atoms in regards to databases. *chuckles* Yeah sure right. That would likely not float over well as members of the family are just enough of dim watts to use the Google and deduce something fishy.

I could generally not give a rat's ass about their thoughts, opinions. But they would make life pure misery for my wife without need. I care about that because I love my wife as much as I love my boyfriend. I cannot say I love one over the other, sorry, love them both equally, yes each in their own way, but yes also each equally. That's "how I roll". *chuckles* And if the "family" decided to turn on my wife over something regarding me, I would no doubt not be responsible for causing the family untold grief. I do not desire such a dark result. So, at times it is the better of valor to be discrete.

I will not say I have "grown more bisexual" over the years. I am bisexual, bi-amorous and will ever be so. I am a passionate person. When I love, I love hard and fast, eternally and beyond eternity. So, I empathize with you to that degree.

Yes, it makes me a bit disappointed you feel a need to hide yourself from your wife. I want to share a bit of something my wife expressed to me. I told her I hesitated telling her I was bi out of fearing she would think me less a man. "Bullshit, you're more of a man than any straight guy could ever hope to be. You faced me with honesty, give me the naked truth and your soul bared to me. That takes balls that straight guys cannot have." I'm not sure your wife would feel the same. I am sure though that if you continue hiding your true self from her, you will never be sure she won't feel that way. Just food for thought, take it or leave it.

Ultimately, so what if I'm disappointed with you. You see that guy in the mirror? That's the one you worry about. That's about all I have.

[Cutiliae]

I will have to stand with my original post and add that I am pertty certain my wife would not want to stay married to me if I told her I was bi. I have been and will continute to be careful with my encounters which incidentally has been my attempt to find a local FWB, and not just for the sake of promiscuity, but at this time no luck. If anything interesting develops over the course of time I will keep everyone apprised.

[LeeNorCal]

I have been with my current wife for about 15 years and she has no idea that I like to suck cock. During our dating period I didn't even think about saying that "I like long walks on the beach, playing golf and oh, yeah, I also like to suck cock." Up to about 8 years ago I was just seeing one person about once per year who lives a great distance away and I wanted to maybe find someone local that I can play with so there wouldn't be such a long gap. I only actively searched because I learned about Craigslist, which made it easy. I should be bashed I guess because I am unable to admit to my wife about my vice. I'm careful on my search and if I get busted I guess the cat is out of the bag. Until then, mums the word. If I would know that she would accept it or even become involved with me that would be great; but I didn't think I would grow more bi over the years.

Well put Cutiliae! If I had known then (the late 70's) what I know now, I would have been much more open about my sexual proclivities to everyone, especially my future wife (and myself.) But that simply didn't seem to be an option then. For a period during my 40's I scratched my itch for cock through anonymous encounters at theaters/bookstores, but that grew old fast. So for a time I quit having sex all together. Over the last 10 years I've limited myself to only a few well established "buddies" (and one MF couple.) As much as I would like to tell my wife about my preference for sex with men, I don't want to hurt her or my marriage by telling her at this late date. I know she would not be able to handle it.

[pole_smoker]

We are both bisexual and have no secrets. What you do is what you can justify in your mind. We won't put you down but on the other hand we wouldn't care to know you if you are being dishonest.

I feel the same way. When I was single I never had sex with other married women and men who wanted to cheat with me. My partner also never got with other people who were into married and cheating. These people lie and cheat on their spouse/husband, or partner. So you simply can't trust them at all.

People who excuse cheating, and who knowingly have sex with people who are married and cheating, are just as bad as people who are into cheating on their BF/GF/wife/husband. I feel bad for people who cheat, and for the unfortunate people who they are married or in a relationship with.

[Olivia920601]

I agree with that.
Here is a true story that bisexual married men bashing at http://www.bi-sexualdating.com/.

[charles-smythe]

Lately, Ive seen alot of posts that have gone above and beyond to bash married bisexual men. Id just like to say that the gift in our being bisexual is the variety -- we have choices, we have options, we have POSSIBILITIES that others do not understand. I am not going to make someone feel horrible for "cheating" on their wives--we dont know the nature of their relationship, nor do we know what their situation is. Maybe they are indeed in the closet, maybe they are selfish, maybe their wives know, maybe their wives dont care, maybe no one in the relationship gives a damn anymore. Who are we to rip apart someone else's life? I understand that we all have an opinion. But I think it is unfair to call out all bisexual married men and label them as cowards. Some of us are polyamorous; some of us are monogamous, some of us are so many things. We don't fit into the common mold and if you are bisexual and don't know that critical factor by now....you're the one that the rest of us should be feeling sorry for and NOT the other way around. There's more than two choices and I think as a true bisexual, that point alone should transcend every part of your lives. No one has to be one of anything. I support and admire many of our married bisexual men. That is the richness of who we are..the layers and juxtapositions and contradictions.

…well said…I totally agree…

[jem_is_bi]

I agree with sdf123 and Charles.I make no judgments about people and their relationships.What works for them may not work for me, but, that does not justify me to judge them.

[charles-smythe]

I agree with sdf123 and Charles.I make no judgments about people and their relationships.What works for them may not work for me, but, that does not justify me to judge them.

…we need a lot more of that attitude on this board…