Need advice - 2 year relationship and bi

[prepster78]

Hi,

Well, I need some advice. I've been with my girlfriend for two years, and we have been living together for slightly over a year. We're quite committed to our relationship, and neither of us has ever cheated on anyone (past or present). When I got into this relationship with her, I admitted that I was bisexual and she was very open to the idea of another couple or male coming into our bedroom once in a while. However, as our relationship progressed, she seemed to shift her stance on the subject. Now, she can't picture seeing me with another woman or man because I mean so much to her now, and "things are different" at this stage of our relationship. Of course she means the world to me, but I am also feeling somewhat sexually frustrated and resentful that her open-minded perspective has so drastically changed. I totally understand that she wants to feel secure with me and know that she's mine; that won't change from my point of view. So now we're at a "sexual crossroads."

She suggested that we get some good, high quality porn that we can both get into (m/m, m/f, m/m/f, etc.). However, her idea of high quality porn is very hard to find (people really getting into the mood and not just banging away at holes). I kind of love it all. Regardless, that's only a bandaid. Does anybody have some good ideas or advice? I could use it.

Thank you all.

[Paddarick69]

your outcome depends on how much each one is willing to sacrifice and how important you two feel the relationship to be... is she willing to win and run the risk of resentment and vice versa? the "stage of relationship" talk leads me to believe she's also wanting you to ask her to marry her... maybe a great thing? is that what she's desiring? is that making her unfair in retaliation for you not moving the relationship forward? might she then be willing to return to the old terms? all stuff ya better bring up... DO NOT expect a woman to NOT change her mind and don't EVER expect it to be fair!! lol... and don't you dare not stick to your guns and let her know, whatever the outcome, your bisexuality IS NOT GOING AWAY... this is either gonna make you or break you guys

[prepster78]

your outcome depends on how much each one is willing to sacrifice and how important you two feel the relationship to be... is she willing to win and run the risk of resentment and vice versa? the "stage of relationship" talk leads me to believe she's also wanting you to ask her to marry her... maybe a great thing? is that what she's desiring? is that making her unfair in retaliation for you not moving the relationship forward? might she then be willing to return to the old terms? all stuff ya better bring up... DO NOT expect a woman to NOT change her mind and don't EVER expect it to be fair!! lol... and don't you dare not stick to your guns and let her know, whatever the outcome, your bisexuality IS NOT GOING AWAY... this is either gonna make you or break you guys

Oiy. That's some tough love! I think you're right about the marriage aspect. She's worried that I would leave her a moment's notice (she's really relied on me for a lot of support over the past year, and it seems like she's scared of losing that) because I might find someone else to be "more attractive" or hotter to be with. However, we all know that being with someone for the long-term truly revolves around emotional chemistry, not just sexual. We've been having some turbulent times because of her job situation and my impending hip surgery; so marriage right now is a bit difficult for me to consider. I have no illusions about either the male or female sexes. I know women can vacillate more than men, and I know what I know about myself. I will always be attracted to both sexes and want to have some interesting bedroom time with another guy or couple (including my girlfriend) once in a blue moon. She's just so unable to be open to the idea now but may be comfortable "in the future," whenever that may be (the year 2150?).

Thanks for your insight.

[Paddarick69]

I feel ya dog... it's maybe the extra sting of being a bi guy who is honest with their woman... ah well, hang in there, man

[The Bisexual Virgin]

You've only been with her for 2 years that's nothing. I would break up with her and start dating or having relationships with men, or date other women who are actually OK with you being bisexual and who actually do want an open relationship unlike this woman who at first says she's OK with it but then in reality is not OK with it at all.

Wow Cowboy you are pretty harsh. But yes I agree with you. I think you should be in relationship with a man because it seems you need the attention of a man.Or you can let her have a partner of her own. I have a question:Why did you enter a relationship with a woman when you know that you are bisexual,and crave the touch of a man? If I was bisexual man I would do the opposite, and just be in a relationship with man instead of a woman because they have two holes, and a cock to play with. I would not be interested in a woman at all.

[prepster78]

Actually, I am not a proponent of just ditching someone. It's too black and white, and we have built a life together in only two years (we're in our early 30s). So, although I appreciate Cowboy's response, I don't want to do that. Bisexual Virgin, thank you as well for your input. The reason I don't want to be in a relationship with a man is because I don't have any real emotional connection with men (I've had sex with men before). So while I love both cock and pussy play, I am emotionally attracted to women and can only see myself dating a woman. I was up front with her and told her that I'd want contact with males and couples (and to find people together as a couple). She was totally cool with it, and now she's not. It's not an easy situation.

[Realist]

Bisexual Virgin: The OP said that he told her when they first got together and she was open to thinking of joining in, then.

Prepster, the rest gave thoughtful advice.

I can't ad any advice, but here's a bad example that I set:

I married three times, thinking I could quell any sexual desire for a MM connection. I did not cheat during two marriages, but a couple of times the temptation was painfully severe.

During a third marriage, this time to a woman I really never loved, I was unable to refrain from cheating. (Or better stated; chose not to be honest) I met someone I thought I couldn't resist. The temptation that time, was too much for me to overcome.

It finally dawned on me that, under certain circumstances even the strongest of us can succumb to our real nature. If I had been honest with myself, from the beginning, I would have never married anyone, who could not accept my bisexuality. I spent a good part of my life, trying to be someone I wasn't, making myself and others unhappy.

I am presently in the best relationship of my life, with a magnifiicent bisexual girl....something I should have done a life-time ago!

I wouldn't think anyone would want to follow my early example!

Whatever you choose to do, best of luck to you.

[prepster78]

If she's NOT OK with you both having an open relationship and seeing other men, and you don't want to cheat on her-which is a good thing! I would either end the relationship, or be prepared to be totally monogamous with her and not have sex with anyone else at all ever. You claim that you don't fall in love, have romance towards men, or have emotional attraction to men. How do you actually know that you can't fall in love with a man? Just because it has not happened yet does not mean that it's impossible or won't ever happen. You just have not met the right man yet. I read another post on this site where someone said how if a man claims he's just sexually attracted to men but not romantically or emotionally attracted this means he's full of internalized biphobia or homophobia about his bisexuality. Have you ever told her or asked her, "You know why aren't we having an open relationship? I thought you said that we were going to?" Or if that opens up a can of worms don't talk about it but realize that if you stay in a relationship with her it's going to be completely monogamous.

You're right about the monogamy choice. I'm a believer in monogamy to a degree, but I always made it clear to her that our monogamy would ideally involve couple or male play (99% monogamy). It will come to a point where she won't be able to pull me along with statements like "maybe in the future." You're also right about not knowing about loving a man without giving it a chance. However, I am more than happy when I'm with a woman, and to be honest, I like having a girlfriend. Just someone very open-minded.

[prepster78]

Bisexual Virgin: The OP said that he told her when they first got together and she was open to thinking of joining in, then.

Prepster, the rest gave thoughtful advice.

I can't ad any advice, but here's a bad example that I set:

I married three times, thinking I could quell any sexual desire for a MM connection. I did not cheat during two marriages, but a couple of times the temptation was painfully severe.

During a third marriage, this time to a woman I really never loved, I was unable to refrain from cheating. (Or better stated; chose not to be honest) I met someone I thought I couldn't resist. The temptation that time, was too much for me to overcome.

It finally dawned on me that, under certain circumstances even the strongest of us can succumb to our real nature. If I had been honest with myself, from the beginning, I would have never married anyone, who could not accept my bisexuality. I spent a good part of my life, trying to be someone I wasn't, making myself and others unhappy.

I am presently in the best relationship of my life, with a magnifiicent bisexual girl....something I should have done a life-time ago!

I wouldn't think anyone would want to follow my early example!

Whatever you choose to do, best of luck to you.

Thanks for your candid and thoughtful message. I originally thought that she was bisexual, which is why I was into her. She admitted to being very turned on by lesbian porn and was interested in sexual relations with other girls. Things somehow changed for her, which is why I'm at the point I am now. If she had maintained that way of thinking, I'd be in a very happy relationship. I love her, but I feel like I have gone through a "bait and switch." We're so invested in each other's lives now (especially because I've been a rock for her during a very difficult time in both of our lives) that breaking up right now seems kind of out there. We need to be able to get through this, but I will make it known to her that I can only get married to someone who accepts me for who I am and can appreciate my needs. Regardless, I am glad you are happy now. That sounds like a long journey!

[ExSailor]

If you stay with this woman it sounds as though you're not going to be happy in the long run. You'll be angry that you can't have sex with men, or years or decades later you'll regret getting involved with this woman and feel as though it was a waste of time. Based on what you have written about her and yourself, and your relationship you are both not a match or compatible. She will use your bisexuality against you or as a way to manipulate you as she's already done with the whole "Bait and switch" mind game she's playing with you. For example if she's mad at you she'll accuse you of looking at or lusting after a man, or even cheating on her with a man even if you did not do these things at all. If she wants to be on your good side she'll do what she already did and claim that she's all for 3 ways and orgies but then in reality when it comes to actually doing them she won't really do them at all. This woman sounds as though she does not know what she wants in a relationship, and she sounds like a manipulator. You've only been together for two years it's not that long of a time and yes you can break up with her. If you stay monogamous with this woman you're not being true to yourself, and you won't be happy with her. Eventually you're going to want to have sex with men. What's worse, breaking up with her now after 2 years, or breaking up and divorcing years or even decades later? As others have written you should get with a different woman who is bisexual and who is fine with you having an open relationship. They are out there. I am partnered to one and we have been together for decades.

[Long Duck Dong]

prepster, you mention that her stance has changed.... do you know WHY ??

I would talk with her openly and honestly..... let her know that its putting you between a rock and a hard place.... and that you both need to sit talk and work out what is going on in the relationship and her, that has changed so much......

you need to be clear on aspects like you were open and honest with her from the start as you wanted a partner that would understand they are your partner, the one you want to be with and stay with, but also a partner that would understand that you have interests that you would like to enjoy.

you also need to make it clear that you will not compromise yourself, you will not cheat and betray her, but also that the relationship has changed from what you entered into to.... so you both need to return to the table and hammer out a working compromise that addresses your needs and her needs.....

you have spent 2 years together, so you both have built a good relationship together and for that time, your interests have been on * hold * while you both have been building that relationship, so there is 2 years that she has been able to see that you are as good as your word when it comes to the way you treat your partner....that is something that will not change on your part, but her change of stance in the relationship is causing issues.....and you need to know why she has suddenly changed....

something tells me that the answer you seek, lays in the way that you have been a bloody brilliant partner and supportive when she needed you the most and now she has realised the value of you as a partner and worried that she may not be able to compete with others.... something that is understandable... but she needs to realise that you are not looking for other people as potential partners on the level of her, but people to share your lives for a brief time and pleasurable experience...

I would look at making her a offer which is that for a limited time ( say 3 other couple encounters ) you try opening the relationship, then sit down afterwards and talk about the issues that have come up, or even sooner IE as soon as any issues come up...... as the alternative is that she becomes so focused on the idea that you may leave, that she will end up driving you out of the relationship or to cheat.... something neither of you want to happen......

[DuckiesDarling]

Prepster,

It sounds like you and your partner need to have a major chat and figure out what changed specifically... Sometimes people grow apart when they are in closer contact daily, it's no one's fault, but if the relationship is going to continue you and she need to decide where you want it to go. Remember what can't be gotten around or over can be gotten through if you actually want to get through it.

[Paddarick69]

honesty, honesty, honesty... communication, communication, communication... oh, and honest communication!

always does a relationship good!

[Gearbox]

Now, she can't picture seeing me with another woman or man because I mean so much to her now, and "things are different" at this stage of our relationship. Of course she means the world to me, but I am also feeling somewhat sexually frustrated and resentful that her open-minded perspective has so drastically changed.

She has become possessive and fears losing you, which ironically is something that ends many relationships. You could try explaining that to her, and also how sex with others won't make you love her less etc.
It might be better if you arrange 1-1 meets discreetly but with her knowledge.

[bityme]

Hi,

Well, I need some advice. I've been with my girlfriend for two years, and we have been living together for slightly over a year. We're quite committed to our relationship, and neither of us has ever cheated on anyone (past or present). When I got into this relationship with her, I admitted that I was bisexual and she was very open to the idea of another couple or male coming into our bedroom once in a while. However, as our relationship progressed, she seemed to shift her stance on the subject. Now, she can't picture seeing me with another woman or man because I mean so much to her now, and "things are different" at this stage of our relationship. Of course she means the world to me, but I am also feeling somewhat sexually frustrated and resentful that her open-minded perspective has so drastically changed. I totally understand that she wants to feel secure with me and know that she's mine; that won't change from my point of view. So now we're at a "sexual crossroads."

She suggested that we get some good, high quality porn that we can both get into (m/m, m/f, m/m/f, etc.). However, her idea of high quality porn is very hard to find (people really getting into the mood and not just banging away at holes). I kind of love it all. Regardless, that's only a bandaid. Does anybody have some good ideas or advice? I could use it.

Thank you all.

I originally thought that she was bisexual, which is why I was into her. She admitted to being very turned on by lesbian porn and was interested in sexual relations with other girls. Things somehow changed for her, which is why I'm at the point I am now. If she had maintained that way of thinking, I'd be in a very happy relationship. I love her, but I feel like I have gone through a "bait and switch." We're so invested in each other's lives now (especially because I've been a rock for her during a very difficult time in both of our lives) that breaking up right now seems kind of out there. We need to be able to get through this, but I will make it known to her that I can only get married to someone who accepts me for who I am and can appreciate my needs.

Like you, I am an individual who, while bisexual, does not form romantic relationships with men. I've never ruled it out, but have always had a woman as my love interest. I am now in the first year of my third marriage. 38 1/2 years of marriage in total, all to bisexual women. I have been bisexual over 40 years and all of my marriages are open. We do, however, play together (as I did in prior marriages) as opposed to each other having separate liaisons outside of the marriage.

Based on what you have said, I can easily understand your feeling "frustrated and resentful" of her changed attitude and like you have gone through a "bait and switch" experience. I am not in a position to tell you I have had the same experience because I haven't. I can, however, tell you that over the last 40 years of being in the lifestyle I have seen many couples split up because of such changes in attitude by one of them (either the man or the woman). In most cases it was a breakup of straight couples when one of them no longer wanted to continue swinging. Sometimes it was the inability to cope with their mate receiving sexual satisfaction from someone other than themselves. Other times it was that one of the couple had formed an emotional attachment with someone else. (These breakups usually came from situations where the couple played independently.)

When breakups occurred with couples where one was bisexual it followed along the same lines. Two couples broke up because of abusive relationships and the women having found comfort with other women decided they were lesbians. In about six relationships, the women became resentful of the mens' time away with other males. In those cases, the women had initially been supportive of the husbands' bisexuality but were not turned on by it and would not participate with them.

I have not observed any breakups of couples who were both bisexual, or where a straight wife was turned on by and participated with the bisexual husband, where the breakup resulted from sexual issues. Usually these break-ups stemmed from financial or other, similar problems.

Having practiced law for many years, including divorce and family law, it has been my observation that once a marital partner becomes frustrated or resentful about any issue, that frustration and resentment never seemed to resolve, it only became worse, eventually leading to the breakup.

Given the circumstances you relate, I would not anticipate your experiencing another change of heart by your girlfriend. Since you never participated in sexual activities with others, even though she expressed an interest, it certainly does seem unlikely that she would again agree to it and then take the steps to participate. I understand how difficult you feel a breakup would be after all the time you have spent together, yet it appears that her confidence in your relationship is not derived from how much she feels you love her but from you willingness to express that love through monogamy despite her knowledge of your bisexuality and her initial agreement to allow that part of your life to continue.

I know I have personally been extremely fortunate. All my wives were bisexual, they all enjoyed watching and participating with other men, women and couples. We our love-making as being completely different than what we refer to as "recreational sex" with playmates of either gender.

Can you foresee being content with you current status quo after another two years pass? Would her demands for monogamy result in your eventually going behind her back to satisfy you bisexual urges? Those are the hard questions you have to consider.

I hope that whatever decision you make, that it brings you as much happiness and adventure as I have found.

Pappy

[tenni]

As usual Pappy has very insightful words, experience and wisdom. I think that the following statement is very important if not critical for us to pay attention to in our bisexual lives.

"yet it appears that her confidence in your relationship is not derived from how much she feels you love her but from you willingness to express that love through monogamy despite her knowledge of your bisexuality and her initial agreement to allow that part of your life to continue."

Good fortune to the OP.

[Paddarick69]

ultra-wisdom from Pappy!

[gen11]

Nobody's going to like this, but love has NOTHING to do with possessiveness and in fact faces the other way. Love supports what is good and natural, healthy and fulfilling, for the beloved. Need, not love, generates possessiveness and the focus on self, and need and love are antithetical.

If you can accept this concept -- and I think less than 1% can, and that is why divorced and failed relationships are at something like 80% in this culture, make what use of it you deem appropriate.

[tenni]

gen11
I think that you have phrased it slightly differently than I often see it but I agree.

Love is an emotion of strong affection and personal attachment. I agree with you gen11 that love has nothing or little to do with possessiveness. Imo, some use the word love is to mask possessiveness.(ie "If you really love me you will do what I ask for" etc.) Imo, when personal attachment for another becomes exaggerated in relationship to strong affection it may lead to possessiveness. Possessiveness has more to do with feelings of ownership and manifests itself by trying to control others. In that respect the woman says things have changed. Her attachment has moved from a healthy attachment to a controlling disfunctional attachment imo. She didn't have as strong exaggerated attachment when she said that she would be ok with the biguy having sex with people other than her.

[prepster78]

prepster, you mention that her stance has changed.... do you know WHY ??

I would talk with her openly and honestly..... let her know that its putting you between a rock and a hard place.... and that you both need to sit talk and work out what is going on in the relationship and her, that has changed so much......

you need to be clear on aspects like you were open and honest with her from the start as you wanted a partner that would understand they are your partner, the one you want to be with and stay with, but also a partner that would understand that you have interests that you would like to enjoy.

you also need to make it clear that you will not compromise yourself, you will not cheat and betray her, but also that the relationship has changed from what you entered into to.... so you both need to return to the table and hammer out a working compromise that addresses your needs and her needs.....

you have spent 2 years together, so you both have built a good relationship together and for that time, your interests have been on * hold * while you both have been building that relationship, so there is 2 years that she has been able to see that you are as good as your word when it comes to the way you treat your partner....that is something that will not change on your part, but her change of stance in the relationship is causing issues.....and you need to know why she has suddenly changed....

something tells me that the answer you seek, lays in the way that you have been a bloody brilliant partner and supportive when she needed you the most and now she has realised the value of you as a partner and worried that she may not be able to compete with others.... something that is understandable... but she needs to realise that you are not looking for other people as potential partners on the level of her, but people to share your lives for a brief time and pleasurable experience...

I would look at making her a offer which is that for a limited time ( say 3 other couple encounters ) you try opening the relationship, then sit down afterwards and talk about the issues that have come up, or even sooner IE as soon as any issues come up...... as the alternative is that she becomes so focused on the idea that you may leave, that she will end up driving you out of the relationship or to cheat.... something neither of you want to happen......

LDD,

Thank you for that very insightful message. I have absolutely asked her why things have changed, and her answers have generally been vague. The most specific response I have received thus far is that she is more emotionally attached to me now and can't see me being with someone else at this juncture of our relationship. Herein is the problem because as more time passes, the emotional attachment on her end will only get stronger. Therefore, any possibility of future interactions with other people will be less likely to occur despite her insistance to the contrary. You're one hundred percent correct in your "something tels me . . . pleasurable experience" paragraph. We both have therapists (geez, I don't know anyone who doesn't have one here in the States), and I am going to tell her to talk this over with her therapist so she can try to get at the root of the fear. I'm going to try and speak to mine about how to deal with this, but since he's not from "our world," the odds of him giving me good advice of the likes I've been reading on this forum are slim.

In all, thank you very much. I truly appreciate it.

Regards,
Prep

[prepster78]

Gearbox, thanks for the reply. I'll think about that suggestion.

[prepster78]

Pappy,

Your life experience has so many interesting and useful takeaways. It makes much more sense for me to be with a bisexual woman or a straight woman who is turned on by male on male interaction. I'll respond to the issues/questions you posed at the end of your post. I don't think I could see myself being content with the status quo for another two years. However, I would never go behind her back. That's not the kind of person I am. I would much rather have it out with her, one-on-one, and tell her how I feel about our relationship than sneaking around behind her back. We're already talking about things, but I have not expressed any real anger or extreme disappointment at this point because things are somewhat in transition for us (I'm getting hip surgery for a sports injury in a week), and then we will be moving to LA. I might have a real sit-down to iron this issue out before we move, but I'm playing it by ear until after my surgery. Her suggestion, thus far, is to watch as much bi or gay porn together (that's not sleazy, which is hard to find) so that I at least satisfy some of my urges (but that only makes them stronger). That's why I'm going to insist on her speaking to her therapist about her change of heart. In sum, thanks for the insight and history regarding your experiences. I'll take them to heart.

Regards,
Prep

[prepster78]

Gen11, I am going to think about this today. In all likelihood, I will use this when I talk to her.

THANK YOU.

[BiDaveDtown]

Dude, break up with her. She's the type of person that's into controlling other people who she's in a relationship with and this is not good, and she's not the type of person you should be in a long term relationship with. I'm married to a hetero woman and we're monogamous since we both want this and monogamy works for us. My wife is not turned on by seeing two men have sex but she knows that I'm bisexual and does not care if I look at porn with men in it since it's only porn and I'm not going to cheat on her or have sex with other people. I have never seen a therapist but if you have not done so I'd come out to him as bisexual and talk about how frustrating your relationship with this woman who is into controlling you is. If it was not your sexuality that she was trying to control it would be something else. People like the woman who you're involved with are toxic and should be avoided when it comes to relationships.

[BiPhone]

Wow Cowboy you are pretty harsh. But yes I agree with you. I think you should be in relationship with a man because it seems you need the attention of a man.Or you can let her have a partner of her own. I have a question:Why did you enter a relationship with a woman when you know that you are bisexual,and crave the touch of a man? If I was bisexual man I would do the opposite, and just be in a relationship with man instead of a woman because they have two holes, and a cock to play with. I would not be interested in a woman at all.

Then you would not be bisexual but actually GAY