Chasing Straight Women

[Long Duck Dong]

post 25 (Gear)
"I've already read the thread, and of course noticed (yet again) that you are extremely biased in your views of people depending on their sexuality. .....In my guesstamate you view ALL gays&lesbians as victims, and you 'defend/excuse' them regardless of what they actually are individually. And you view bisexuals as 'not victims', so you have no qualms saying exactly what you feel like about them regardless of what they actually are individually."

post 27 (LDD)
"I merely posted the article as a alternative view point, as I do with most things..... a point of view other than my own........ and that is what I miss... reading other peoples stories without the * bi phobic, bi erasure, bi invisibility, you're in denial, you are too scared to admit the truth * etc etc..... and no I am not denying the stuff exists.... but christ....its getting to the point that near every thing is going on and on about it......."

LDD didn't post this article. darkeyes did?

I may be wrong but I don't see anyone other than LDD having been accused of being biphobic on this site?

When I read LDD posts I do read a mocking snear/dismissal in his words that communicate a disrespect of the issue of biphobia and Bi Invisibility. His words come across as though he doesn't believe that there is biphobia but there is homophobia. This is similar to Gear's comment about perceiving G&L as victims while bisexuals are not victims. That is biphobic.

A lot of the tension on this site comes from people reacting to the behaviour of LDD attempts at wanting to present an "alternative view". That and his campaign to present himself as a martry makes others run to "protect him". We don't need LDD setting himself up as "teacher" let alone a martyr teacher. It isn't working as he comes across as not fighting Bi Invisibility and appears to be biphobic.

His failure to comprehend that a "Mr Gay World" should/can not represent bisexual men is not only off topic (again) but a example of bisexual politics and Bi Invisibility. Mr. Gay World represents gay men only. The fact that LDD choses to not accept this speaks volumes about his beliefs on Bi Invisibility and indicates his biphobia.

yes darkeyes did, I was distracted and thinking of another thread.......

as for the being called phobic.... its cos you are the one that does most of the claiming I am bi phobic, tenni, thats why you only really see me being called bi phobic.....

I am well aware that bi erasure exists.... it happens when I am told that I am not bisexual by you and other members......

that is why others rush, tenni.... not cos they are trying to protect me... but they are getting sick of you going after me constantly, and then protesting the very same thing that you are doing.... its not only your forum.. and many others have told you time and time again to back the hell off... and you refuse to listen....

as part of my sig says

It isn't that they can't see the solution. It is that they can't see the problem.

[tenni]

Do I think that LDD is a bisexual?

Initially, I couldn't understand why you saw hmself as a bisexual. This is true.

I still have difficulty seeing him that way but if you perceive yourself to be a bisexual that is fine just add your other aspects. I've repeatedly asked or pointed out that LDD is a boutique assemblage of things. Asexual seems to be dominating any sexual aspect of himself. Whether his asexuality is real or not(blurred as he wrote) is up for debate. I've pointed out my friend who is by far closer to a more common form of asexuality. Because I have been a friend of a "full"(quoting LDD) asexual for 20 years, I think that my confusion and disbelief is understandable.

The point that LDD continuously changes his statements about himself doesn't help in presently himself as bisexual. He is an intersexed, person who has romantic emotional attachments to both men, women, transgendered people. Yet, he wants a sexual act of being pegged by a woman? (he has a reason and he will repost it in a minute). This is not the behaviour of an asexual person such as my asexual friend.

A person who wishes to present an alternative view and not be perceived as holding that view, usually makes such an initial statement (devil's advocate etc.)

Now, once again we have had a thread turn to LDD's favourite topic..himself.

There will be at least one more post from LDD adding and clarifying for us. LAST word attitude.

[DuckiesDarling]

Do I think that LDD is a bisexual?

Initially, I couldn't understand why you saw hmself as a bisexual. This is true.

I still have difficulty seeing him that way but if you perceive yourself to be a bisexual that is fine just add your other aspects. I've repeatedly asked or pointed out that LDD is a boutique assemblage of things. Asexual seems to be dominating any sexual aspect of himself. Whether his asexuality is real or not(blurred as he wrote) is up for debate. I've pointed out my friend who is by far closer to a more common form of asexuality. Because I have been a friend of a "full"(quoting LDD) asexual for 20 years, I think that my confusion and disbelief is understandable.

The point that LDD continuously changes his statements about himself doesn't help in presently himself as bisexual. He is an intersexed, person who has romantic emotional attachments to both men, women, transgendered people. Yet, he wants a sexual act of being pegged by a woman? (he has a reason and he will repost it in a minute). This is not the behaviour of an asexual person such as my asexual friend.

A person who wishes to present an alternative view and not be perceived as holding that view, usually makes such an initial statement (devil's advocate etc.)

Now, once again we have had a thread turn to LDD's favourite topic..himself.

There will be at least one more post from LDD adding and clarifying for us. LAST word attitude.

News flash, no one cares if you think he is bisexual or not, we don't care if you are bisexual or an alien from planet Pluto. Stay in your bedroom, we'll take care of what goes on in our bedrooms. Capiche?

[tenni]

Nope DD
LDD admits error why don't you? Once again he has posted a "hanging noun"..""the article". This thread is about an article. If the hanging noun "the article" has any antecedent it is the thread topic article.

[DuckiesDarling]

No he admitted you might think he was talking about what Fran posted, but when you go and actually read the conversation between him and Gear, which you butted into, you will see he talked about the article HE posted. So why don't you find a new past time, because your continual going after someone is harrassment and will be reported to Drew as such. I don't believe there have been more than 3 posts by you in the past few months where you haven't taken a side swipe at someone, usually either LDD or myself. You don't want to read what we post put us on ignore. But your continual snipping and sniping is doing nothing but pissing in the wind upstream, it always lands on you.

[darkeyes]

so she remains single, the huntress, the spider in a web of her own making.... within a cocoon of social defined sexuality..... not bi phobic, but scared to address her own fears in her own writings, by using the term, bisexual.....in case, her own kind turn on her.........

I suspect that this is a truism in respect of the author of the article... not all lesbians would turn on her, but the arrogant, thoughtless, dogmatic, often rather dim ones might.. what she talks about is primarily bisexual women, but perish the thought that she should mention the name...

[darkeyes]

Do I think that LDD is a bisexual?

Initially, I couldn't understand why you saw hmself as a bisexual. This is true.

I still have difficulty seeing him that way but if you perceive yourself to be a bisexual that is fine just add your other aspects. I've repeatedly asked or pointed out that LDD is a boutique assemblage of things. Asexual seems to be dominating any sexual aspect of himself. Whether his asexuality is real or not(blurred as he wrote) is up for debate. I've pointed out my friend who is by far closer to a more common form of asexuality. Because I have been a friend of a "full"(quoting LDD) asexual for 20 years, I think that my confusion and disbelief is understandable.

The point that LDD continuously changes his statements about himself doesn't help in presently himself as bisexual. He is an intersexed, person who has romantic emotional attachments to both men, women, transgendered people. Yet, he wants a sexual act of being pegged by a woman? (he has a reason and he will repost it in a minute). This is not the behaviour of an asexual person such as my asexual friend.

A person who wishes to present an alternative view and not be perceived as holding that view, usually makes such an initial statement (devil's advocate etc.)

Now, once again we have had a thread turn to LDD's favourite topic..himself.

There will be at least one more post from LDD adding and clarifying for us. LAST word attitude.

Can we get off ur favourite topic, Tenni?

[BiDaveDtown]

post 25 (Gear) "I've already read the thread, and of course noticed (yet again) that you are extremely biased in your views of people depending on their sexuality. .....In my guesstamate you view ALL gays&lesbians as victims, and you 'defend/excuse' them regardless of what they actually are individually. And you view bisexuals as 'not victims', so you have no qualms saying exactly what you feel like about them regardless of what they actually are individually." post 27 (LDD) "I merely posted the article as a alternative view point, as I do with most things..... a point of view other than my own........ and that is what I miss... reading other peoples stories without the * bi phobic, bi erasure, bi invisibility, you're in denial, you are too scared to admit the truth * etc etc..... and no I am not denying the stuff exists.... but christ....its getting to the point that near every thing is going on and on about it......." LDD didn't post this article. darkeyes did? I may be wrong but I don't see anyone other than LDD having been accused of being biphobic on this site? When I read LDD posts I do read a mocking snear/dismissal in his words that communicate a disrespect of the issue of biphobia and Bi Invisibility. His words come across as though he doesn't believe that there is biphobia but there is homophobia. This is similar to Gear's comment about perceiving G&L as victims while bisexuals are not victims. That is biphobic. A lot of the tension on this site comes from people reacting to the behaviour of LDD attempts at wanting to present an "alternative view". That and his campaign to present himself as a martry makes others run to "protect him". We don't need LDD setting himself up as "teacher" let alone a martyr teacher. It isn't working as he comes across as not fighting Bi Invisibility and appears to be biphobic. His failure to comprehend that a "Mr Gay World" should/can not represent bisexual men is not only off topic (again) but a example of bisexual politics and Bi Invisibility. Mr. Gay World represents gay men only. The fact that LDD choses to not accept this speaks volumes about his beliefs on Bi Invisibility and indicates his biphobia. Do I think that LDD is a bisexual? Initially, I couldn't understand why you saw hmself as a bisexual. This is true. I've repeatedly asked or pointed out that LDD is a boutique assemblage of things. Asexual seems to be dominating any sexual aspect of himself. Whether his asexuality is real or not(blurred as he wrote) is up for debate. I've pointed out my friend who is by far closer to a more common form of asexuality. Because I have been a friend of a "full"(quoting LDD) asexual for 20 years, I think that my confusion and disbelief is understandable. The point that LDD continuously changes his statements about himself doesn't help in presently himself as bisexual. He is an intersexed, person who has romantic emotional attachments to both men, women, transgendered people. Yet, he wants a sexual act of being pegged by a woman? (he has a reason and he will repost it in a minute). This is not the behaviour of an asexual person such as my asexual friend. A person who wishes to present an alternative view and not be perceived as holding that view, usually makes such an initial statement (devil's advocate etc.) Now, once again we have had a thread turn to LDD's favourite topic..himself. There will be at least one more post from LDD adding and clarifying for us. LAST word attitude.

I agree. I've decided to ignore silly asexual people who are faux bisexuals (not to mention faux trans/intersex people) and not sexually attracted to anyone at all and without sexual desire, lust, or enjoyment of sex at all, and their partners who claim bisexuality or heteroflexibility yet are not sexually attracted to the same gender at all. I also agree with what Gearbox wrote about biphobia.

[BiDaveDtown]

I suspect that this is a truism in respect of the author of the article... not all lesbians would turn on her, but the arrogant, thoughtless, dogmatic, often rather dim ones might.. what she talks about is primarily bisexual women, but perish the thought that she should mention the name...

I agree with you there darkeyes. I've noticed the same thing with gay men, how many of them are very biphobic and practice bisexual erasure yet they go on and on about how they've somehow been with "straight" men or they lust after straight men, and some actually need the fantasy that they've had sex with an actual straight/hetero guy.

[BiDaveDtown]

I am well aware that bi erasure exists.... it happens when I am told that I am not bisexual by you and other members......

In this case they would be correct since you are asexual and you are not bisexual.

[BiDaveDtown]

I am well aware that bi erasure exists.... it happens when I am told that I am not bisexual......

It's not bisexual erasure since you're not bisexual at all. Even you yourself have written about and said how you're asexual and do not have sexual attraction to anyone and don't get turned on by people or want sex with them.

[Gearbox]

lol gearbox, you want my honest opinion on the female ??? you can have it.....

Shes a middle twenties type female that is questioning the world around her and looking for her own sphere of self empowerment. lives in a shared situation with other people and is not as independent as she likes to express in her article, and that comes from a understanding that she is a *outcast * a person on the fringe of society and not somebody that is going to be fully accepted by her own community or any other....

shes putting forward a image in the pic but its false and natural, posed if you like and that is the way that much of her life is, and the reason for that is that she feels trapped, her heads a mess, her thoughts entangled and shes scared.... as for not saying the word bisexual, she is afraid of the word as if its some kind of power word that is like a spiders web...... the way she refers to people, is in the way that people that have internal and sublimal fears, can express themselves, they like to reach out and play with the fire that could burn them and that is ever present in the back of her mind as she plays the games she does....

the lesbian * matriarchal * understanding that lesbians do not have any interest in males, they are a sub species of the human race, the defective gene pool.. is something that she battles with, and it comes out in her writing but as a subtle aspect... she carefully works around talking about the females partners, and focuses on the single female, not the women out for a ladies night out, that may have sex with their female friends, with or with the male partner or the dreaded bisexual.... so she focuses on the single, not so straight female, the one that * longs to change sides but is trapped within the heterosexual chains of society *... and the author wants the freedom of the heterosexual relationship but non of the trappings, like the dreaded male or the OMG bisexual condition that hands around some females like a spectre of impending penis love.....

the author is not bi phobic, its not bisexuals or bisexuality that she has the issue with... its the social trappings and stigma of sexuality that is a key issue with her... and she doesn't want to be seen to be being friendly with the *enemy * the evil bisexual, so she words her article to touch on the bi curious without mentioning the B word directly..... to do so, is to incur the wrath of the lesbian kind as a sexuality traitor for acknowledging bisexuality as a sexuality... and not * those people *

so she reaches out, touches and enjoys the presence of other ladies, in a * safe * way.... the memory of her own connection with a heterosexual female ( not bisexual ) and the way that the female was drawn back to the BF, are things that she feels inside.... and when writing, she fights with her understanding of bisexuality and thinks of the false images about bisexuality... and realises that it may be true.... that bisexuals are trapped in their own circular need and desire for sex and love, but never finding peace and the ability to settle...... cos that makes what she feels inside herself..... she doesn't want to be tied down either... but her issue is that shes not monogamous natured either..... so a way around that, is the bar hunt for the single * white meat *, that will disappear into the night later on, to who knows where........

so she remains single, the huntress, the spider in a web of her own making.... within a cocoon of social defined sexuality..... not bi phobic, but scared to address her own fears in her own writings, by using the term, bisexual.....in case, her own kind turn on her.........

she's Catwoman?
Well she's bloody scary!lol I don't know which part of that is the most worrying or interesting, as it's all a mix of both.

the lesbian * matriarchal * understanding that lesbians do not have any interest in males, they are a sub species of the human race, the defective gene pool.

This is something that I think strikes a chord with some gay men too. It's not good enough that the opposite genders genitals don't 'push your button', but they must make you want to spew too. I've never understood that, and it often seems very staged. As if they are expected to have that extreme reaction, or to prevent themselves from turning bi.LOL!
But some do, and they are out of that 'sub species'. I've always had probs with the 'Born this way'/'victim of genetics' stance of gay pride etc. IMO it gives many a false rigid sexual identity, that undermines freedom. And freedom it SHOULD be all about, but under ONE umbrella inclusive of ALL sexual traits. The LGBT should work on 'fixing' global sexuality, not segregating it into 'sub species' and def NOT needing an excuse for being 'different'. Call it 'Human Sexual Spectrum'.lol

But I'm bi. I use 'bi think', so I would think that.
So is there really a 'sub species' mentality amongst g&l's (and b&t's?), or is it actual? social or genetic?
(this should be good for the Guardian. Double page spread.lol).

[darkeyes]

I agree with you there darkeyes. I've noticed the same thing with gay men, how many of them are very biphobic and practice bisexual erasure yet they go on and on about how they've somehow been with "straight" men or they lust after straight men, and some actually need the fantasy that they've had sex with an actual straight/hetero guy.

Frankly, I would rather that u don't agree with me, because I find anything resembling support from you quite embarrassing.. there are gay men and women who are as you say, but such is your own homophobia that what I think is based on quite a different premise from anything you have to say.

[Long Duck Dong]

she's Catwoman?
Well she's bloody scary!lol I don't know which part of that is the most worrying or interesting, as it's all a mix of both.

This is something that I think strikes a chord with some gay men too. It's not good enough that the opposite genders genitals don't 'push your button', but they must make you want to spew too. I've never understood that, and it often seems very staged. As if they are expected to have that extreme reaction, or to prevent themselves from turning bi.LOL!
But some do, and they are out of that 'sub species'. I've always had probs with the 'Born this way'/'victim of genetics' stance of gay pride etc. IMO it gives many a false rigid sexual identity, that undermines freedom. And freedom it SHOULD be all about, but under ONE umbrella inclusive of ALL sexual traits. The LGBT should work on 'fixing' global sexuality, not segregating it into 'sub species' and def NOT needing an excuse for being 'different'. Call it 'Human Sexual Spectrum'.lol

But I'm bi. I use 'bi think', so I would think that.
So is there really a 'sub species' mentality amongst g&l's (and b&t's?), or is it actual? social or genetic?
(this should be good for the Guardian. Double page spread.lol).

I used to live in a shared house with a gay man and a lesbian, years ago.... the gay guy had genitalia aversion... the idea of sex with females was not a issue, but thinking about the female genitalia was something he could not handle..... even tho he has cross platform porn ( lesbian, trans gay, bi etc ) I really wanted to get inside his head but he was bi polar depressive so it was hard to work out what was him and what was the BID

as for the sub species thinking, I have heard it mentioned by some lesbians and they had a real dislike of males... however their lesbian friends that have been raped by males, did not have the same type of thinking..... gay males tend to have more of a genitalia aversion and less of a gender aversion for some reason.......

try as I may, I can not find any studies that deal with this aspect of thinking, in any real in depth manner.... most of the studies I find, refer to phobias and phobic behievour but not the thinking or reasoning behind it.... so i am forced to talk with people and try and get inside their heads in order to see if there is any pattern at all

bi sexuals generally do not have a genitalia aversion, but I have noticed a aspect of sexual activity aversion issue in some bi people, a aversion to same sex contact, with the opposite gender, IE bi females that are not interested in M/M sex and bi males that have no interest in F / F sex.......

I would love to see a study done that focuses on the aspects of gender aversion v's genitalia aversion and if its sexuality or social influence that is one of the main reasonings for the issue.......

[BiDaveDtown]

Frankly, I would rather that u don't agree with me, because I find anything resembling support from you quite embarrassing.. there are gay men and women who are as you say, but such is your own homophobia that what I think is based on quite a different premise from anything you have to say.

Too bad. LOL way to be a hypocrite and completely ignore and disregard your signature/personal philosophy about people: "Do not think so little of me as to grant me your tolerance. Allow me your acceptance and understanding of who and what I am with the love, respect and dignity with which I do you." At least now you're admitting that there actually are biphobic gay men and lesbians unlike how you've denied them before. It's not based on homophobia that I wrote about them and how we do experience biphobia and bisexual erasure from them. Just look at the posts on this site where bisexual men and women will write about experiencing biphobia and bisexual erasure from gay men and lesbians, as well as the G&L/LGBT media and even mainstream media who practice biphobia and bisexual erasure yet should know better.

[BiDaveDtown]

I used to live in a shared house with a gay man and a lesbian, years ago.... the gay guy had genitalia aversion... the idea of sex with females was not a issue, but thinking about the female genitalia was something he could not handle..... even tho he has cross platform porn ( lesbian, trans gay, bi etc ) I really wanted to get inside his head but he was bi polar depressive so it was hard to work out what was him and what was the BID as for the sub species thinking, I have heard it mentioned by some lesbians and they had a real dislike of males... however their lesbian friends that have been raped by males, did not have the same type of thinking..... gay males tend to have more of a genitalia aversion and less of a gender aversion for some reason....... try as I may, I can not find any studies that deal with this aspect of thinking, in any real in depth manner.... most of the studies I find, refer to phobias and phobic behievour but not the thinking or reasoning behind it.... so i am forced to talk with people and try and get inside their heads in order to see if there is any pattern at all bi sexuals generally do not have a genitalia aversion, but I have noticed a aspect of sexual activity aversion issue in some bi people, a aversion to same sex contact, with the opposite gender, IE bi females that are not interested in M/M sex and bi males that have no interest in F / F sex....... I would love to see a study done that focuses on the aspects of gender aversion v's genitalia aversion and if its sexuality or social influence that is one of the main reasonings for the issue.......

Not all gay men are the way you described and they don't all act like the "OMG ewwwwwwwwwwwww! A vagina!" or the "ewwwwwww! A woman!" type. I know gay men who have never had sex with women and even they don't like how some gay men react that way towards women or seeing women's genitals, and they think it's silly and misogynistic. I have some gay male friends who told me how they did have sex with women when they were closeted and trying to be "straight" but how sex with women and seeing a woman naked and in person did not gross them out but they were not turned on by her or sexually attracted to the woman or any women at all.

[Long Duck Dong]

and I never said they did.......dave....... hence the usage of the word SOME.. it is a word that refers to a quantity of a whole, not all, a portion..... a example of the word SOME, can be used in the following statement " dave read some of my post, not all of it " .....

[darkeyes]

Too bad. LOL way to be a hypocrite and completely ignore and disregard your signature/personal philosophy about people: "Do not think so little of me as to grant me your tolerance. Allow me your acceptance and understanding of who and what I am with the love, respect and dignity with which I do you." At least now you're admitting that there actually are biphobic gay men and lesbians unlike how you've denied them before. It's not based on homophobia that I wrote about them and how we do experience biphobia and bisexual erasure from them. Just look at the posts on this site where bisexual men and women will write about experiencing biphobia and bisexual erasure from gay men and lesbians, as well as the G&L/LGBT media and even mainstream media who practice biphobia and bisexual erasure yet should know better.

You will find nowhere a single word of denial written or spoken by me that some gays and lesbians are both bi-phobic and are quite happy to pursue the objective of bi-erasure.. I have always admitted that there are lesbians and gay men who do act just so.. and nothing I have said contradicts my signature..that can be read two ways....I suggest you think about that. However, there are times I will not like what others say and will say so and will say why.. I usually do not like what you say or how you say it and do say so.. I will upset people by saying what I say and if that is the case then please, return it to me in spades if u wish. But what you are sexually? I understand all too well, and accept it and wish u well with it. I do not only tolerate it, I accept it glady, defend it willingly and will fight to the enth degree in defence of your right to be yourself... sexually.. even in the face of any criticism from other lesbians or gay men... I will also defend to the end your right to express what you say, but if I think anyone is talking through their arse then I will say so..none of that is contrary to my signature.. that is a disagreement between two people.. a strong disagreement.. I even accept and defend your right to your homophobia.. but don't expect me to sit back and let you have a free run with it..

[tenni]

Can we get off ur favourite topic, Tenni?

darkeyes
Can we get him from twisting every thread to be about his favourite topic: himself ....LDD the martyr saint teacher to all we dumb bisexuals.

If someone shovels biphobic nonsense under a pretense of taking an alternative (biphobic) view why should other bisexuals let it pass as the truth?

[BiDaveDtown]

You will find nowhere a single word of denial written or spoken by me that some gays and lesbians are both bi-phobic and are quite happy to pursue the objective of bi-erasure.. I have always admitted that there are lesbians and gay men who do act just so.. and nothing I have said contradicts my signature..that can be read two ways....I suggest you think about that. However, there are times I will not like what others say and will say so and will say why.. I usually do not like what you say or how you say it and do say so.. I will upset people by saying what I say and if that is the case then please, return it to me in spades if u wish. But what you are sexually? I understand all too well, and accept it and wish u well with it. I do not only tolerate it, I accept it glady, defend it willingly and will fight to the enth degree in defence of your right to be yourself... sexually.. even in the face of any criticism from other lesbians or gay men... I will also defend to the end your right to express what you say, but if I think anyone is talking through their arse then I will say so..none of that is contrary to my signature.. that is a disagreement between two people.. a strong disagreement.. I even accept and defend your right to your homophobia.. but don't expect me to sit back and let you have a free run with it..

Riiiiiight. It's not homophobia to say that a lot of gay men and lesbian women are biphobic and do practice bisexual erasure. I'm not homophobic even if you want to play the victim/martyr and claim that myself and other bisexuals here on this site are. The non specific attacks on anybody here who says one thing about any subject that you don't agree with that you seem to feel or claim you have a tie to when you don't at all. If you think what was said was homophobic or even biphobic, then please point it out. Otherwise you may as well by a 5 year old child just putting your fingers in your ears, throwing a tempter tantrum, and sticking her tongue out, and crying when she doesn't get her way and when people don't agree with her. FYI LDD's post about lesbians starting to not find sex with men or men's genitals to be a major dislike, or having a distrust towards the male gender after they've been raped was not only homophobic and wrong, but it's misogynistic too.

[IanBorthwick]

Point of Order: Being intolerant of others intolerance(ie biphobia/bi-erasure) is not a phobia(homophobia or other) of any kind, it's irritation and righteous indignation. Only the ignorant get those mixed up, and those with an agenda purposely confuse them.

If I had the time or inclination I'd search for the exact quote from King, but I figure mine will suffice. Please stop with the red herrings, it's not just fish that stink when tossed to the deck.

[darkeyes]

Staceyann Chin recently wrote the following in Facebook in response to a discussion over her own question... "After someone engages in a same sex romance, or tryst, do you think they can claim to be heterosexual or straight?" What she wrote is something I have no difficulty with but her rhetoric in Facebook is not matched by her rhetoric in the Guardian...

What she said was "

I get that the individual has the right to self define. So I'm not in any quarrel with that. It does however do not preclude an interrogation of the matter. That said, I wonder why the question always has to be what makes you "less" of a lesbian, or a straight person, or a gay person. I do not privilege any sexual identity over another. These labels mean nothing about our value. They simply denote what one has done, or is wont to do, or not do. So my being a lesbian is really about my wanting to only partner with, and being largely attracted to women who partner with other women. If I found myself dabbling in a little sex with men, I would claim a bisexual identity- simply because it denotes my desire to engage with men in some intimate way- even if it is only about sex. The labels, if they were equally valued by everyone, could really be used to clue people in, and if you needed to change, it wouldn't be problematic. Only indicative of what you are now open to, and what you are closed off from. And I say that last bit, because I absolutely think we all have the ability to move along the continuum of sexuality. The label just tells folks how much movement or how little movement you are willing to allow. And that, I believe, is my motherfucking right!"

[worryman]

I am new here, not sure how or where to post, But my question is about my wife. She had a fantasy about sleeping with a women, I let her fulfill her fantasy with a friend of hers. Do you think it is possible for those 2 to just be friends again. I know both women enjoyed it. But she told me she would not do anything behind my back. As a man I don't think I could be just friends with someone I had sex with, Just wondering how a women would feel.

[elian]

Maybe it is different for women, but I have found over the years that lusting after and "chasing" straight MEN only seems to give me a broken heart.. If you approach a guy who thinks he's "straight" and he likes it, it only seems to create more conflicting feelings for them to be insecure about.

I would like to think that women have an easier time but of course I don't know.

For worryman's question - I could agree to "not have sex" with someone and still keep the friendship but I have to admit that I would have a slightly different impression of my relationship to the person after the fact depending on the circumstances. If there was a strong emotional interest there then you've shared something very intimate and made yourself vulnerable..you may have bonded with that person. If it was just for physical gratification then maybe not so much. There is also the one-night stand sort of thing - which can be very educational for a "curious" person but not really amount to much.

Are you concerned about your own role? My own experience as a bisexual person is that I love people for the whole of who they are, not just what is between their legs..so if she is bisexual, she loves you and is committed to you, she will likely continue to love you very much.

[MelissaPDX]

I'm a bisexual woman, why would I even be interested in a straight woman? They're not going to be interested in me at all, and they're not going to like or want to have sex with me. It reminds me of the biphobia I've heard straight women say how if you're a bisexual woman you somehow want all women who you see.